Shea Patterson vs. Jolton O'Peters, for the record. . .

Submitted by dragonchild on October 24th, 2018 at 10:03 AM

This isn't any sort of Earth-shaking revelation, but I felt this needed to be said.

As observed by Brian, stephenrjking and others around here, Shea is risk averse, especially against zone coverage.  If he doesn't like what he sees, he won't throw it, and if he feels uncomfortable he'll bug out of the pocket.  This has been frustrating to watch, I ain't refuting that.  I get it; we have a conservative QB.

However, I don't think enough, if anything at all, has been made of the upside.  I apologize for the not-safe-for-lunch image but here's the stat line from Jolton O'Peters, last year's three-headed monster at QB:

185/346, 53.5%, 6.4YPA, 9TD, 10 INT

DSRs were 70, 64, 64, 63, 75, 60, 44, 65, 77, 75, 69, 50.  (Average: 64.7)

This is Shea so far:

123/183, 67.2%, 8.3YPA, 12TD, 3 INT

DSRs (pre-MSU UFR) - 77, 77, 74, 79, 68, 87, 68 (Average: 75.7)

The ones he throws are more often sure things, and the YPA is way up, but these are sort of expected with his approach.  We're also missing some of the nuances, such as the fact that last year's QBs were hardly fearless.  Nevertheless, the takeaway is the TD:INT going from 50-50 to 4:1.  Shea's thrown only one pick in conference play and that was off a deflection.  He's on pace to finish around 18:4 or so.  Also, while it hardly needs to be said that he's an upgrade, "not throwing" is arguably a Bad Read yet Shea's DSR average of 75.7 is comparable to the best QB performances of last season.  He's tentative but he'll pass up opportunities to avoid disasters, and that shows in his grades.

I get the feeling Harbaugh has been relying on Shea as little as possible while he works on getting him more comfortable instead of trying to re-write his instincts.  If that means leaving some of his potential on the shelf for now, so be it, as long as the ball doesn't go back to the other team.  The only thing I'd change in the short term is adding a "two outs" baseball mentality.  I for one don't want to see Shea go all gunslinger and start torching possessions, but if it's third and long, as Brian says that's basically a make-it-or-punt situation so that's when he should turn his limiter off and throw it up for grabs -- especially since we apparently aren't converting those anyway.

Still, we should give credit where credit's due; Shea's conservative play has more often than not kept the offense on the field.  Just, Poor Damn Donovan Peoples-Jones (JPDDPJ) is something we're going to have to live with, but yay palindromes.

Hab

October 24th, 2018 at 10:35 AM ^

I'm wondering if he's under orders to keep the lid on things while the offense develops and focuses upon a grind down clock approach through the run game, thus keeping your defense fresh (which has been an issue in prior years).  It feels like this offense is more about controlling the game through time of possession and grinding out first downs and controlling field position than it is putting up points on the board and giving the opponent a chance to do the same.  The opportunities are there, for sure, which is great.  But sacrificing those opportunities for the sake of controlling your opponent's possessions, there is a long-term gain over a less-likely short-term gain.

dragonchild

October 24th, 2018 at 11:23 AM ^

I don't think so.  If it's there, no one's going to say no to an 80-yard touchdown just because it puts the defense back on the field.

What I see is a Rudockening where Harbaugh told Shea to only throw it if he's 100% sure, which for a good part of the season meant living with him holding onto the ball too long.  The run game was brought along as much as possible to avoid putting Shea in a "you have to win this game for us" situation, methinks.  And also, because it turns out they were up to the task.  ND just happened too early.

Hab

October 24th, 2018 at 12:29 PM ^

I think we're saying the same thing.  If there is a guaranteed score out there, take it.  But unless we're playing Florida in a bowl game, those throws tend not to be there.  So my assumption is that there is at least reasonable coverage that would greatly increase the risk of either killing the drive through incompletion or pick.  By suggesting that the coach was putting the lid on Shea is that he was being coached to avoid the high-risk/high-reward situations in favor of lower return, lower risk options that ultimately serve the same goals.

JC06Z33

October 24th, 2018 at 10:52 AM ^

Is there any chance he stays though, assuming his numbers and play stays at the level he's been at so far?  I have yet to see him be a first round pick in any mock draft, unless I've missed something.  I'm not familiar with what next year's QB class will look like, but he definitely projects behind 4-5 other QBs for the '19 draft.

JPC

October 24th, 2018 at 11:03 AM ^

I don't know what he should do, but it's pretty clear that he would be poised to have a MONSTER season if he stayed another year. The OL should be better (or at least not worse at the start of the season). The WRs should be much better. He should be better based on time in the system.

Maybe this year's TE1 goes to the NFL, but even that seems unlikely.  

 

Mr Miggle

October 24th, 2018 at 11:01 AM ^

Any chance he leaves, you mean?

I know his plan was to leave after one season, but the major part of that plan involved Shea being a first round pick. Given that he's improving and expanding his game during the season, he's either going to boost his stock enough to go or he's going to see a lot of benefit in returning.

dragonchild

October 24th, 2018 at 11:34 AM ^

If I'm an NFL scout, his difficulties with reading zone coverage are absolutely a concern.  He's got oodles of physical talent and already a good college player, but he's not winning NFL games the way he is now.  The big question is whether or not he sees that himself.

I don't say this as a homer but he really could use another year under Harbaugh's wing.  If he fixes this one weakness and shows he's ready, he's a top-10 pick, maybe even a #1 pick.  If he leaves this year he'll be drafted, but he could be a mid-rounder who's out in a couple seasons.  Might be a late 1st-rounder if Michigan makes the CFP, but riding the team's coattails would be ominous for his long-term prospects.  That's not to say there's no QB coaching in the NFL but they're not going to spend a lot of time on "I can't figure out zone coverage".

Mongo

October 24th, 2018 at 1:48 PM ^

Shea has a shot at being a first round draft choice if he stays another year in Harbaugh's system.  Not sure Shea has shown enough yet to get highly drafted.  Now if he really takes that next step in performance and leads UM to the CFP title game?  That could be enough to catapult him to first round money.

To beat elite teams like Alabama and Clemson, UM would need to be less conservative and score on more explosive plays.  If Shea is ready to deliver at that level, his draft stock will be high.

ChiBlueBoy

October 24th, 2018 at 10:44 AM ^

I agree with the above and a lot of the comments. I don't know that it's just a question of being "conservative," however. It's more about making smart reads and accurate throws. I can think of a few instances (including against MSU) where we were damn lucky not to have a pick. I think the biggest issue is Shea getting comfortable with both our system and, especially, zone defenses in a system that relies much more on him making sophisticated reads. At Ol Miss, as I understand it, he had much simpler reads and a simpler offense. I think the off week, and more "time on task" as Harbaugh likes to say, will work wonders.

MercuryHayesIn…

October 24th, 2018 at 10:53 AM ^

Patterson v whatever that was is not even debatable.  We are 8 games in.... surely there are things he can improve upon, but he has been heads and shoulders better from what we had last year... and that is evident from day 1. 

EastCoast_Wolv…

October 24th, 2018 at 10:54 AM ^

Maybe I'm reading between the lines too much here, but it feels like you (and others on this board) are assuming that Shea is the one who is risk averse and Harbaugh is not trying to "re-write [Shea's] instincts". I actually take the opposite perspective. Shea WAS a gunslinger at Ole Miss, as evidenced by his higher INT:TD ratio and willingness to lob the ball up to covered WRs at Ole Miss (see Brian's preseason UFR of Ole Miss-Bama). So he's clearly capable of filling that role. My guess is that Harbaugh is coaching Shea to be more of a game manager, and may have over-corrected slightly.

dragonchild

October 24th, 2018 at 12:01 PM ^

It's sounding like that is indeed quite likely the story, but I went off of how Shea is now, which is risk-averse any way you slice it.  I am now getting the impression that it's not instinctual though.

If I was to revise my point, it's that I doubt Harbaugh considers his current shyness an "overcorrection".  I think making him hyperconservative and then working his way back up was all design.

Naked Bootlegger

October 24th, 2018 at 11:02 AM ^

I absolutely love that we're mildly grumbling about Shea not taking some chances on throws versus the combined QB and O-Line clustercuss that defined last year.    We're in a much better place this year.  

AC1997

October 24th, 2018 at 11:04 AM ^

A couple of quick thoughts:

  • Might be worth adding QBR or something to the piece to add more color.  Conclusion will be the same, but more data couldn't hurt.  Also the rushing yards and sack avoidance are part of the benefit of having Shea back there beyond just the stats you mentioned.
     
  • The other point that can't be undervalued is the fact that we have a top-5 defense and thus playing field position and turnover avoidance will benefit us more.  We don't need a gunslinger because about the only way our D is going to give up more than 14 points is if we hand them free field position or scores.  

That being said, I think there are still 2-4 times per game we need to see Shea just take a shot that one of his big, tall, athletic pass catchers will win a 50-50 ball.  

J.

October 24th, 2018 at 11:42 AM ^

If Shea threw 4 50/50 balls a game, he’d have 16 INTs through 8 games.  Or, perhaps more realsitically, 10 INTs, because the DBs probably drop a good chunk of their half of the 50/50.

While, yes, many of those are downfield and the equivalent of a 40-yard net punt, (a) Hart is averaging about 50 yards net and (b) you lose the opportunity to make a play at the sticks and keep possession.

This is a style thing with Harbaugh.  He’s willing to take risks when he feels his team has a talent disadvantage, but he’s extremely risk-averse when he feels he has the better team on paper.  The continued complaints about playcalling aren’t likely to subside, because Michigan is not suddenly going to turn into a high risk / high reward team.  It’s clear that Harbaugh’s plan is to win a battle of attrition at the line of scrimmage each week.

MSU’s only chance to win last week’s game was by winning the turnover battle decisively.  (That’s how they won last year, too).  I believe that’s PSU’s only chance too.  Harbaugh is doing his best to make that impossible.

Bb011

October 24th, 2018 at 11:06 AM ^

Truly night and day from last year. I do agree he needs to launch it up deep to a tall receiver on 3rd and long about once a game more, but at this point I’m nit picking. Shea has been exactly what we need this year.

andidklein

October 24th, 2018 at 11:07 AM ^

I have these visions of next year with Patterson still here, thoroughly understanding the offense and Harbaugh trusting him that this could be a juggernaut of a team.

Or it could just be the mushrooms 

Communist Football

October 24th, 2018 at 11:08 AM ^

Shea has had at least a half-dozen near-interceptions, including three against MSU (the two tipped balls plus the Grant Perry PBU). So I think his TD-INT ratio favors him superficially. The UFR rating is more accurate.

Bodogblog

October 24th, 2018 at 11:10 AM ^

This is all context.  The strength of the team is the defense, full stop (especially early in the season).  They are going to protect that defense by 1) running the ball, keeping the defense off the field, 2) not turning it over and putting the defense in a bad spot, 3) playing field position like this: take risks as you move across the 50, or when they see an alignment or defense the staff believes provides an opportunity worth that risk.  It's been that way all season, and it's not going to change.  A lot of the frustration on playcalling can be relieved if you see the season in this light. 

I think Shea can take more shots downfield, meaning deep balls, but that's it.  Everything else I'm OK with.  Remember the near pick that Perry poked out?  All of the "route combos/need slants/high-low them/etc" is an accumulation of opportunities on some plays that people disparately see, and they are probably there, but continually taking those shots are too risky for the staff.  Maybe Patterson throws some picks in practice, so they've put the regulator on pretty tight.  And he may be growing now and gaining more trust - that slant to Collins into the teeth of the Sparty defense was the best pass all day -, so we may see more of it.  But the offense will be based on the above unless Michigan gets behind. 

Ty Butterfield

October 24th, 2018 at 11:11 AM ^

I feel like the two biggest plays of the season Shea has made with his feet. The first play of the second quarter against Wisconsin and the 4th and 2 vs Staee. He made the correct read on both plays and it was so pretty. If Shea was a little more confident throwing the ball Michigan would be a match up nightmare. If Michigan can get better at finishing drives.....look out. 

VintageBlue

October 24th, 2018 at 11:12 AM ^

This is good stuff here.  

I rewatched most of the MSU game in 60 minute form on BTN and I feel like a little shine is going to come off the tackles, in particular Runyan, who seemed to have trouble getting a handle on Willekes.  Credit to MSU as they incited a number of throwaways due to quick pressure.  Credit to Patterson for safely throwing those balls away instead of winging a ball out over the middle with a guy in his grill.

1VaBlue1

October 24th, 2018 at 11:13 AM ^

My thoughts on this are that Harbaugh is teaching him how to be a QB at a pace Shae is comfortable with.  He ran the simplest of simple offenses at Ole Miss - I mean, DCaff's HS offense was more complex!  He's still learning to read defenses, and probably still learning some of the variable route structures built into the offense.  It's possible that he never knew to look for DPJ down that sideline because that was never covered in drills. 

Seriously - if Harbaugh thinks a reeled in Shae is enough to win the game, okay.  Bring him along at whatever pace he's comfy with, rather than overloading him.  But, IMO, he's going to be ready to pick apart a zone when it's necessary to do so.  Hasn't really been necessary, yet...  And I think it's fairly easy for Harbaugh to see when his team can ToP an opponent to death, and not need to go deep when caution can sort things out just fine.

LandryHD

October 24th, 2018 at 11:16 AM ^

Hes done great and the team is lucky to have him but my 1 and only complaint is when Collins, DPJ or a number of our TEs draw 1 on 1 down the field we don't often take the shot. Its a low risk high reward considering how large we are at those positions.

Fieldy'sNuts

October 24th, 2018 at 11:18 AM ^

While its not apparent from the time stamp, following the MSU game Shea retweeted this tweet that Chris Frey posted right after the Notre Dame game:

shea.png

Lawyer12

October 24th, 2018 at 11:58 AM ^

I think this is a bad post. Period. Shea is not “risk averse” or “conservative.”  Watch the tape, he has made a bunch of tough throws and taken some chances. He’s always been know as an aggressive player. The fact is, he has missed some open receivers and that’s different than being conservative. He has also not been given a whole lot of attempts. Further, he’s very likely been asked to pay close attention to caring for the ball.  I see Harbaugh asking him to reign. It in is different than him being conservative. I like how he’s played this far. 

taistreetsmyhero

October 24th, 2018 at 12:22 PM ^

Exactly. A "conservative" qb decides to throw the ball away on 2nd down instead of throw it deep into double coverage, or take a sack on 3rd down in his own side of the field instead of try to fit a tight ball into double coverage.

Coming off of reads too early or taking a sack on 3rd and medium in the red zone is not conservative play. That's just a blown read.

Shea has tremendous potential, and if he takes the Rudddock leap in terms of understanding the offense, then this could be a national championship team.

Mongo

October 24th, 2018 at 12:02 PM ^

And his legs get critical first downs ... combination of conservative passer and effective runner is a winner given our defense.  Time of possession is the goal to keep Don's dudes fresh and at their elite level for all 60 minutes.

gbdub

October 24th, 2018 at 12:17 PM ^

Last year we lost the OSU game because O’Korn wouldn’t make downfield throws that were available, and instead did a lot of scrambling around and taking bad sacks. Which was weird because his reputation was definitely on the “gunslinger” side  

Obviously, Shea is more talented and more successful than O’Korn, but the fact that he’s showing some of that hesitancy is still worthy of some critique. 

It’s not that I want him to sling the ball all over the place from his own 20, it’s that I want to see smart caution, recognizing high upside situations where it’s good to gamble. On the offensive 35 with a great defense and DPJ running downfield? You’ve got a great D, it’s 3rd down, an interception isn’t the end of the world. Take a shot!

And besides that, not throwing to a guy that’s open isn’t “caution” it’s a bad read.  

I’d be curious to see what the breakdown of Shea’s unsuccessful DSR plays to Jolton. I suspect we’d see a much lower rate of “IN”, because when he throws he’s usually accurate. And a lower rate of BRX, which is usually “ill advised throw that gets picked off”. But maybe a similar or higher rate of “TA” (throwaway). One thing DSR doesn’t show very well is if he throws a catchable ball on a dumpoff, improv, or other play where a better read was open but he held on too long. I think those are the plays Shea can improve on the most. 

kyeblue

October 24th, 2018 at 12:29 PM ^

With a #1 defense, running a risk averse offense is not a bad strategy at all, especially against the teams that you supposedly to beat. I just hope that when play against teams that requires certain level of risk taking, Shea will take what it is given to him. 

On the other end, you should give your five-star WR a chance any time he is covered one-on-one in the end-zone.

dragonchild

October 24th, 2018 at 12:47 PM ^

I'm a bit taken aback by some eagerness to throw weight around saying, "Shea's mistakes aren't conservative; they're just bad reads."

First off. . . that they're bad reads is right there in the OP.  That's the whole point about pulling up the DSRs -- they count his sacks as reads whereas his raw stats don't.  The point doesn't need to be made.

Second, there are bad reads and then there are bad reads.  Unleashing the dragon on first down from the UM 20 and throwing a pick-six is a bad read.  Not throwing to an open receiver at all, eating the ball and going down is also a bad read.  Shea has not been doing one in favor of the other.  If there's a difference, I guess I don't know what to call it because apparently there's no such thing as a "conservative" bad read.  But if there was, Shea's BRs are more in the form of taking bad sacks than throwing picks, whatever folks want to call that.

Clarence Beeks

October 24th, 2018 at 12:48 PM ^

“I get the feeling Harbaugh has been relying on Shea as little as possible while he works on getting him more comfortable instead of trying to re-write his instincts.”

I’m pretty confident it’s actually the exact opposite and that he IS trying to re-write his instincts. What we are seeing is the product of Harbaugh’s coaching to make him MORE patient and less of a “gunslinger” type QB. If you compare his play this year to his play at Ole Miss it is like watching a completely different QB.

Nickel

October 24th, 2018 at 12:55 PM ^

Definitely feel a ton more relief this year each time M drops back to pass as compared to where we were a year ago.

Only worry is that he seems to get a little careless with the ball being away from his body and in a single hand when he's scrambling.

CalifExile

October 24th, 2018 at 12:57 PM ^

Your comparison is ridiculous in the absence of a comparison between last year's OL and this year's. There's a good chance that Patterson would have been out for the year after ND if he had been working behind last year's line.

Flying Dutchman

October 24th, 2018 at 1:03 PM ^

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