OT: MSU Xavier Tillman to return for senior year via Dickie V
https://twitter.com/DickieV/status/1283395346291400705
I know there has always been the rumor/idea that Izzo convinces his players to come back and doesn't have their best interests at heart, but this confirms it for me. Tillman has two kids and right now is projected as a late 1st or early 2nd round pick in the draft. You can't convince me that Tillman decided to go back to MSU during a pandemic when the season is in question on his own
Not sure the NBA on real solid footing either for the next several months. That Orlando "Bubble Thing" already has a bad vibe...
And I am sure MSU and Izzo are "helping" in other aspects...if ya know what I mean.
$$$
/s
/maybe
no need to speculate unsavory characteristics of msu and izzo that aren't particularly likely to be true (see: izzo and chicago kids) when there are plenty of established horrible behaviors (see: sexual assault cover ups)
But it's 100x more likely to produce an actual season than what college basketball is facing.
This would be a monumentally poor decision by Tillman, assuming he'd have a guaranteed contract. If he's not getting that feedback....mayyybe it's understandable, but still not really.
I understand any young person making the decision to go pro. But I also applaud one's decision to play and earn their degree. I hope he does well and has a long career.
Tillman already graduated
He had his first 3 years spotted. If a player can’t finish a degree after a couple years of making pro money, it was never meant to be. Guys can always go back to college.
Seems premature at this point with no one else reporting.
It's only July - still a long time until the real decision is made.
don’t they have to decide next month?
August 3rd by 5 PM EST.
Ive seen Tillman in the lottery on some mocks. He is pretty universally slotted in the 1st round. So obviously hes coming back and fringe 2nd rounder Livers will declare.
I see you know this rivalry well.
Seriously though if you’re a first round pick you have to go. What if he gets injured? What if he’s just not as good with Winston gone? Too much could go wrong.
Apparently NBA GMs told him he's a mid 2nd rounder. The mocks are usually ignored by NBA prospects now that they can talk directly to NBA GMs and scouts.
is "him" livers or tilman?
What can he do to improve his stock. I don't see the advantage, and injury concerns always loom.
He can improve his jump shot. He's too short to play center in the NBA and he hasn't shot consistently enough to play anywhere else. He hit a few threes last season but only attempted 1.6 per game and only made 26% of them. He hit 37% of his threes in home games which is actually pretty good for a big man, but only 13% on the road. If he can shoot more consistently, he'll definitely improve his draft stock and possibly lock up a first round pick.
Kind of a dumb, tinfoil hate take. Maybe the dude just likes college.
Also maybe COVID actually makes it more logical to stay in school with a young family...at least he knows where he'd be for next year. Who knows what college and/or pro hoops looks like. I don't know.
When I remember having a young family, I remember lots and lots of bills and expenses. I don't even get how someone could make that work on a college budget.
It would be unimaginable to me that he could turn down a guaranteed multi-million contract which would give his family financial stability and security. Maybe he gets the contract next year anyway, sure, but it is a huge risk given the well known aversion of NBA GMs to draft a 22 year old, 4 year college player (not to mention the risk of injury / bad season)...
Bizarre.
There is some money in Xavier's family. The everyday bills are not likely an issue.
I saw a report somewhere that he would stay in the draft if he was sure to be drafted in the first round, since first round picks come with a 2-year contract guarantee. He would definitely have been drafted but wasn't a lock to go in the first round, and evidently he wasn't satisfied with his first round odds.
Edit: also worth noting that this hasn't been confirmed yet, so he could end up staying in the draft after all
Like the poster above said....that doesn't get better after your 4th yr of college.
Any NBA draftniks on the board? Tillman spending another year at MSU makes little sense ... unless next year's draft is projected to be weaker than this year's.
Remind me again, was Tillman a 4-star or 5-star coming out of HS? Good player, it's just a bit shocking how late some of these highly rated guys go to the NBA after attending MSU.
Michigan pitches the "40-year plan" but apparently MSU pitches the 4 or 5 year plan.
Four star, #112 overall... not particularly highly rated. He's improved and transformed his body at MSU.
He definitely worked his ass off once he got to MSU and polished his game after having a head coach in high school who had no idea what he was doing or how to run an offense.
Thanks. I would have guessed top 50 or 60 so memory was off. So I will concede here that he developed his game at MSU and they deserve some credit for that.
He was a 4-star, #112 in the 247 Composite
Edit: what ldd10 said
Mid 4 star, similar in ranking to Livers. 112th in the country, Livers was 133rd.
I recall people in the know here saying Beilien chose Livers over Tillman. And that Tillman would have come to AA.
Of course he is, because of course...
Dickie V is 81 years old... it has nothing to do with the OP, but I just find his energy level for someone of that age amazing. He was coaching U of D and the Pistons in the 70s.
Also, Hubie Brown is 86 and still doing NBA games. He is also incapable of talking about anything other than basketball. Again, nothing to do with the OP.
Dickie V needs to become a studio personality similar to what ESPN is doing with Lee Corso. Hubie on the other hand is still one of the best broadcasters around and quite sharp.
If this turns out to be true.....it is totally baffling. I'm a big proponent of "stay in school" and have been frustrated (irrationally) at times when guys like Jordan Poole, Iggy, Darius Morris, etc. leave before they have maximized their potential. But with Tillman, I cannot think of a single reason why it would make sense to stay at MSU another year unless he just really, really likes living in East Lansing.
- He already has a degree
- He's married with two young kids
- He is losing arguably the best college PG who has been his partner in crime these past few years
- The season is in question with the NCAA more than the NBA (though both are at risk)
- He's an older player with less of the valuable "potential" that NBA teams look for when drafting lottery picks
- The NBA salary cap or roster limits are likely to be more at risk of a fundamental change due to the Covid-economy next season than this season
- He's already being projected as a late-first or early-second pick right now (the sweet spot for those 2-year deals)
- MSU may be a conference favorite (if there's a season) but they are still replacing several critical pieces with unproven ones
Maybe he wants to win a National Championship in a year there is no clear favorite? Watts, Henry, Brown, Hauser, and Tillman is a HELL of a team.
There are many certainties in life. The sun rising in the east and setting in the west. The sky being blue. Water being wet. Taxes. And Tom Izzo continuing to find ways to convince kids to come back to school who have no business coming back.
There's no point in being upset or in awe over it. At this point, it just is. Its how the universe works. And the world just keeps on a spinnin'.
There's not a coach in this country who has stunted NBA careers more than Tom Izzo.
What a joke. Fuck 2020
It's definitely weird how Izzo's guys consistently turn down the pros. I'm sure they "enjoy the college experience" but that's true for most people. That doesn't prevent guys elsewhere from leaving when they have a chance.
I don't think it's necessarily about MSU giving them cash under the table either. They might be doing that, but we see players at the known dirty schools (Duke, Kansas etc.) going pro regularly, so that wouldn't seem to explain it either.
It seems like Izzo somehow manages to guilt-trip his players into staying. He seems like a complete asshole of a coach but his guys develop Stockholm syndrome. I'd love to be a fly on the wall hearing Izzo have these conversations about the NBA.
Don't you listen to Brian, he has their grandmothers in his basement.
Ah fuck. He good.
Might not even be an NCAA season. Seems pretty stupid to not take the money.
I think they both identify as he “him” his.
Honest question:
How on earth does Izzo manage to get his best players (obviously not EVERY time) to stick around for their senior year time after time after time after time after time??
And yet we can barely get our good players to stay for more than 2 years. I just don't get it...MSU players must want to earn big money in the NBA as much as others, wouldn't they?
except there wont be a season
Seems like college basketball season has to be up in the air. I would think college basketball would not start before January. Probably conference games only if it happens. Obligatory fuck Izzo. Izzo fosters and promotes a culture of sexual assault against women.
There is a screenshot of Tillman's snapchat saying "Who's the source!!!" with a picture of his kid. Saw it on Ant's Twitter. Not sure if its accurate or not, take it for what it's worth.
https://twitter.com/Graham_Couch/status/1283428255865999366
Graham Couch via Twitter: I’ve been told the rumor about Xavier Tillman returning to MSU for his senior year is, at this point, only that.
Feels like he's been around for 9 years.
Looks like he's in his mid 30's too.