January 6th, 2011 at 2:13 PM ^
built him his own Thunderdome probably means they'd be happy to keep him long-term
January 6th, 2011 at 10:22 AM ^
Brian, along with 85% of people on this board, are being freaking ridiculous.
First, the complaints that Brandon "botched" the process are way premature, until we see what happens. As others have said, the job needs to be officially posted for a week -- perhaps Brandon already has a coach lined up but is not revealing it until the required time period has passed. We know the man plays his cards close to his vest -- why don't we wait a week and see who our new coach is before ranting.
In any case, what could the man have done differently? Harbaugh said no -- that's not for lack of effort on Brandon's part. The only other option was to fire Rodriguez before the bowl game, so we would have had more time for a search. Is that what you people wanted? If Brandon had fired Rodriguez in December, only to wind up not landing Harbaugh anyway, Brian and everyone else would have been freaking out that Brandon is the biggest idiot ever, if we had done well in the game Rodriguez could have come back, etc. If you're going to complain about the process, offer a feasible solution.
Second, the comments about Hoke are ridiculous. Over the past few years I seem to recall annoying lectures from Rodriguez supporters every time somewhere dared criticize his performance, to the effect that "recruits read these boards, you're making them not want to come to Michigan," etc. Yet these same people now feel comfortable lambasting the state of the program, ripping a potential new coach as UNACCEPTABLE, effect on recruiting be damned. Funny how criticism is OK when you're the one unhappy about the state of things.
That's not to say that criticism can't be countenanced -- more pointing out hypocrisy -- but the level of criticism being thrown at Hoke as a potential higher is irrational and idiotic. Most people saying "anyone but Hoke!" know absolutely nothing about him beyond the fact that he looks a little goofy and doesn't have a tough-sounding name. The man is extremely respected by his peers, knows defense (!), has turned around two joke programs in his last two jobs, and has a reputation as a good receiver. Is he the most exciting hire every -- no (I, for one, and clinging to hope that Brandon will shock us by announcing Bill Cowher - j/k). But below the radar coaches have succeeded in the past and will succeed in the future, and the crazed chicken littled crying about the sky falling before even hearing the man speak need to take a fucking xanax.
End rant.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:31 AM ^
Boom plus 1'd (in my heart)
January 6th, 2011 at 10:41 AM ^
No, no, no -- I meant that he's "higher" on Brandon's wish list than . . . ah fuck it. I also called him a good "receiver" rather than recruiter. These are the things that happen when you rant.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:01 AM ^
I totally understand- hopefully you weren't offended. I only meant it as good-natured ribbing...nothing more.
I needed something to focus on other than doom- even if that something was an e-misunderstanding on the internetz.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:13 AM ^
No, I got you -- just playing along.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:35 AM ^
make MGoBoard... something something.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:36 AM ^
a thousand times yes
January 6th, 2011 at 10:58 AM ^
I think you're missing the basic point. It's not a good idea to "start" a coaching search in January, unless you have to. I know he probably has a list of names, and probably has sent out feelers, but in the eyes of casual fans, and more importantly, in the eyes of recruits, he has basically just started.
The decision should have been made on Dec. 1st. Give the program optimal chance for success. I also believe that Brandon endorsed Rodriguez for next season, the bowl game wouldn't have been such a disaster.
What has people upset is the belief that if we hire Hoke, it's only because we couldn't target anyone else at this point in the game. An idea that is very reasonable. Brandon may surprise us, and I agree, Hoke may turn out great (all coaching searches are essentially a crap shoot, in my opinion), but I think it's fine to be upset at how things have been handled.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:11 AM ^
I think you're missing the basic point. It's not a good idea to "start" a coaching search in January, unless you have to. I know he probably has a list of names, and probably has sent out feelers, but in the eyes of casual fans, and more importantly, in the eyes of recruits, he has basically just started. The decision should have been made on Dec. 1st.
No, you're missing the point. If he had made the decision to fire Rodriguez on December 1st, and still didn't get Harbaugh, 95% of Michigan fans would have been even more outraged than they are now, and rightfully so. He gave Rodriguez a chance to earn another year -- Rodriguez failed. And there is virtually no difference in the potential coaches available to us now from those that would have been available on December 1 -- maybe the Temple guy, that's it. And we wouldn't have offered another coach until Harbaugh turned us down in any event, which wouldn't have happened until after the bowl game.
Firing Rodriguez in December would have been stupid, wouldn't have put us in a better position, and the Rodriguez supporters would still be whining about how he should have gotten another year.
Give the program optimal chance for success. I also believe that Brandon endorsed Rodriguez for next season, the bowl game wouldn't have been such a disaster.
That's convenient wishful thinking with no evidentiary basis in reality. Brandon gives Rodriguez a shot to keep his job, Rodriguez screws the pooch, and now its Brandon's fault that he didn't just give Rodriguez the extension before the game in which he screwed the pooch. Makes sense to me.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 AM ^
We obviously aren't going to agree on this. But you honestly don't believe there was a better chance of hiring a coach not named Harbaugh that the fan base could be happy with in December than right now?
You don't have to just look at the guys we could have hired who took other jobs, but also guys that don't want to leave their current jobs in January but may have considered it in December. That month is a huge difference, both in recruiting and vile that will be heaped upon a coach for leaving at that time. It's why Tennessee, a program with just about as much prestige as ours, had to settle for Derek freaking Dooley, coming off a 4-8 year at Louisiana Tech.
Handling a potential coaching change, especially when the fan base only seems interested in one replacement, is never easy. Some people will always be upset. But there's a reason these things are usually handled in December and not January. To say that Brandon has handled the situation well is to be willfully ignorant.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:01 AM ^
January 6th, 2011 at 11:12 AM ^
OK, feasible solution: KEEP RODRIGUEZ.
That was probably Brandon's plan before a 38 point loss to the 5th place SEC West team. After the bowl game, keeping Rodriguez was no longer feasible. That's on Rodriguez himself.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:15 AM ^
January 6th, 2011 at 11:23 AM ^
I find it hard to believe that the bowl loss was the determinative factor after having 3 years of history to base the decision on. I agree - we did not see anything different in the bowl game than we saw in the second half of the regular season. Michigan lost terribly to a better team and looked very bad doing so. I would be dismayed to learn that loss was the determinative factor. It may have been "comforting" to Brandon in making the move, but I would lost respect for Brandon if he hadn't already made up most of his mind as to how to proceed before the bowl game.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:40 AM ^
is that Brandon had determined prior to the bowl game that a) he wasn't excited about keeping Rodriguez, but b) with a relatively small number of names being tossed about as available candidates and the best one not available until very late in the hiring cycle, the best option would be to keep RR and force defensive changes (new coordinator, etc.) for the coming season. A 9- or 10-win season in 2011 would have put doubts to rest for a while, and anything less would have removed all doubt.
But after the bowl, another season with RR would have been disastrous if it ended similarly ... Brandon went from "there isn't an easily-obtainable upgrade" to "here's the door." (I actually wondered briefly if Brandon would actually keep RR around for another year just to spite ESPN and company, but the fallout from another bad season would probably take him down too.)
Maybe that's just projection. I'd have preferred one more chance, seeing if it would work with a solid DC (assuming one were available and interested), but hell, I didn't even watch the bowl all the way through. I can't defend that.
January 6th, 2011 at 1:33 PM ^
I don't think we saw any new problems in the bowl game
No, we didn't. We saw the exact same problems as in the regular season, even though RR & Co. had 15 practices to get his guys ready to play one game. The team mailed it in in the second half and got destroyed, and there were rumblings that players were no longer buying in. Meanwhile, the parents of players were coming to Brandon and complaining about RR. Given all this, I don't think he had much alternative. If you still believed in RR, great. But a lot of members of the program (not to mention a huge number of fans), it seems, did not.
January 6th, 2011 at 3:04 PM ^
I think people were expecting to see improvement after weeks to prepare for one opponent and to get healthy. The defense being awful wasn't a surprise, and we knew we couldn't kick, but the offense falling off the face of the earth (again) was bitterly disappointing.
Had we lost 52-35 or something like that, I would have continued believing RR deserved another year. A 38 point margin of defeat though, was atrocious. I've looked through past seasons a couple of times, and 38 points appears to be our largest margin of defeat since the end of the 1935 season.
I was hoping we'd see new wrinkles and better execution and...something to make me believe the offense really was on its way to becoming a juggernaut. Instead, it was a few moments of brilliance coupled with mistakes, poor execution, and lack of scoring.
In short, I expected to see a team which was motivated and seemingly well prepared to put its best foot forward. I didn't feel at all like that's what was on display. For me personally, that was what prompted me to throw my hands up and say "I give up. This just isn't working."
January 6th, 2011 at 12:26 PM ^
Not that losing by 38 to anyone is ok, but Mississippi St. is/was a good team. The SEC West is the best division in football. Being 5th isn't so bad when you're sitting behind Auburn, Alabama, LSU, and Arkansas
January 6th, 2011 at 12:07 PM ^
Fuzz (if I may call you that), I like most of your post. Really, I do. But I think you went off the rails a bit on Hoke.
He's far from the worst option and I'd never take an "Anyone but Brady" stance, but I'd be very disappointed if he got hired here.
Please watch some interviews of the guy and let me know if you see presence / intelligence / intangibles anywhere near a successful BCS coach. I just don't see any of those with Hoke.
For what it's worth, I never saw them in satisfying amounts with Rodriguez, either. I had hopes that his "football IQ" would be enough. Alas ...
January 6th, 2011 at 2:45 PM ^
I agree that it's much better for us all to chill out a bit and wait for the denouement before we freak out. But as I said on another thread, that does not mean that the criticisms of Brandon aren't valid to a large extent.
I wouldn't think it would be necessary to enumerate the reasons why a January coaching search is undesirable, but here goes:
- Recruiting. Having your program be coachless, and unable to take visits, right when some of your best prospects are making up their minds, is obviously a recipe for a poor recruiting class. Check out the interview with Webb in the DFP today - we're almost certain to lose out on some top defensive prospects as a result of this. A new coach will have enough challenges meeting expectations for near-immediate success without having to drag along a bad recruiting class.
- Any candidate we bring along now will be creating an identical headache for the program he is leaving, increasing the chances of the kind of public spectacle we saw with RichRod/WVU or Kiffin/Tennessee. For a coach making the jump from a mid-major, like Hoke, this is less of a problem. But for people like Fitzgerald, Mullen, Pelini, Gundy, it has to be a significant consideration.
- Dumping RichRod in January made it a great deal more difficult for his assistants to get jobs for the coming year. A prospective new coach who is trying to figure out what kind of guy DB is has to notice this. And a corollary to this is that it will be more difficult for the new guy to find assistants right now.
- Coaches are, in general, less physically and mentally available right now as they hit the road closing out their recruiting classes. I'm sure Hoke will be thrilled to get the call whenever, but for a number of other prospects, I'm sure they'll be thinking "why the F didn't we have this conversation a month ago?"
- Edit: And by far the most obvious, you give yourself much less time to get it right. A several week process started in early December is no big deal. Now, the closer you get to NSD, the more the impression of a program in chaos takes hold - exactly what DB said he was trying to change. So you can't really afford to spend much time wooing or negotiating with any one candidate, even if you think he's the best choice.
So yes, Brandon absolutely should have fired RR in early December. Listen to that presser again: every reason DB listed for making the change was as true then as it was yesterday. As I said on the other thread, I think DB fell victim to the executive's tendency to stick to the decision process, and ignore current circumstances. But sometimes, it's a bad assumption that tactical circumstances don't affect long-term outcomes. DB absolutely can still pull this out, but he made it far riskier and more difficult for everyone involved by waiting.
As to Hoke, I really don't have the qualifications to assess how good a football coach he is. He may well be very good, and if he's the pick, I'm going to support him because the alternative is to stop being a Michigan fan. But his resume is not very impressive, and his personality is hardly scintillating. These things would matter a lot less if he were chosen over a bunch of other top names after an extended search process. As it is, a Hoke hire would almost unavoidably be seen by many as a second-tier choice forced on us by a rushed January search process, fairly or not. And that's hardly the way to generate unity in the Michigan base.
An aside, OT to your post: I'm not impressed by the argument that the mid-January Tressel hire worked so well. I suspect that Tressel is, in fact, the exception to the rule, and that there just aren't many or even any other examples of successes like it.
January 6th, 2011 at 3:10 PM ^
Consider yourself virtually "+1"-d.
January 6th, 2011 at 2:14 PM ^
As Ed McMahon used to occasionally say to Johnny, "You are correct, sir." I'd give you a satchel full of points if I could. Alas, I can only quote Ed McMahon.
DB's doing a fine job and his presser did nothing to change my mind. It's not DB's job to puke out every detail of every contact he had with everyone just so we can squeal like a bunch of chimps about the good and the bad of it--I don't want Chatty Cathy as our AD. You'd have to be an idiot to think that the search began yesterday. DB even discounted that by stating that having a "Plan B" is something that has always been contemplated.
As for the Brady Hoke angle, I've got no problem with the guy. The guy we just let go had a monstrously good run in the few years prior to his hire--and he failed here. The stories of wierd coaching hires that turn out special (Pete Carrol at USC, Bill Belichek with the Pats) are legion. Lets all relax and trust our AD. I think he's earned as much.
There's also something to be said about a guy who adores M as much as Hoke does...a guy who has the balls and moral honesty to tell his current employer that his career goal is to coach someplace else. To me, that's refreshing. It's the fabric of a guy who will clearly communicate the singular importance of beating OSU and MSU rather than just "awe shucks"-ing through a muddled remark about how all of the games are important. Does his M love make him a better coach. At the very least it makes him a much better recruiter. And yes, the guy can coach. That said, he's among many qualified candidates. Perhaps he won't be "the one" but damnit, he's not a steaming pile of coaching crap either. Yeesh.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:27 AM ^
When "Brian on WTKA" gets over 100 posts...
January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 AM ^
so, how was everyone's christmas? Did everyone get what they wanted for kwanza? Do you even get anything for Kwanza? I really have no idea and no I am not going to look it up.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:38 AM ^
We LiveBlogged a press conference yesterday.
I think we've jumped that particular shark...
EDIT: Video evidence:
January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 AM ^
than to Hoke. Clearly not the brightest spark that ever came down the wire, from the interview posted above, but probably wouldn't destroy the program. Brian's going to need to cool it in his antagonism--which borders on rudeness--or cement his status on the outside, increasingly isolated--not through a principled response to this complete cock-up, but hot-headedness.
I've got news for people, too. We have stopped being an elite program. As I said when Lloyd quit, unreasonable expectations were going to be the death of UM football. Now we try to make Michigan a contender once again, period.
And the search for someone who is a Michigan man is the stupidest, most corrosive bullshit ever, the Hanta virus of Ann Arbor. Martin went out of his way to get someone who wasn't one, now we're going for one? Unmitigated horse-pucky. First time I ever agreed with that mediocrity Henning--that horse ain't going back into the stable. Stupid people never knew how good they had it with Lloyd, and we'll never know how it might have been with RichRod. BUT that truly worthy goal of competing and being in the 9-10 win range was within our grasp WITH him for next year, when he could finally have his players on the field, no excuses. With NO VIABLE REPLACEMENT in sight firing him was a disaster. BOTTOM LINE: Firing Rich Rod in November would have meant the possibility of preserving the recruiting class and team and possibly winning next year. Now we are ABSOLUTELY assured of another long hard transition.
Fielding some good competing teams and being in the big games with kids who graduate should be the goal now, down the road. This is a massive rebuilding job, and not just of a football team.
I don't care if the fans thought Brandon acquited himself well yesterday; he looked like a scared guy who knew he had f'd up.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:15 AM ^
it seems like everyone wants this person that doesn't exist. If JH doesn't come, then who? Not Hoke, not this guy, not that guy. Miles is probably the most viable candidate. Does 10 wins consistently at LSU mean anything? End of story. Quit your whinning.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 AM ^
Can't upvote, but +1 to you sir.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:43 AM ^
Miles wins because he (over) stocks his program with regional recruits and has an open checkbook to hire assistants. He may be able to grab assistants when he's here, but the recruiting situation - and the academic standards - will be far, far different at Michigan. There's no guarantee he'd win here.
Beyond all that, dude's an absolutely shady, unscrupulous character. I want Michigan to win, but I'm not willing to trade having a head coach who lies to his players before cutting their scholarships or runs the type of shitshow that was going on at Okie State before Gundy took over. Just like last coaching search, there will be people like you who don't give a shit about all that and would become The U North for more wins. I hope you never become the majority of the fan base (or that you haven't already.)
January 6th, 2011 at 11:39 AM ^
The general consensus in Baton Rouge is that LSU has won in spite of its coach. If Miles could recruit LSU-level talent to Ann Arbor and still bumble his way to 10 wins most years and an occassional national championship, well then I say let er rip.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:47 AM ^
a corndog fool and a prick to boot. You think people made fun of RichRod's accent? Stop--through the prejudice--and listen he was a bright, bright guy. Miles can't string two sentences even to finish his third-grader's homework; the discontent would begin two seconds after the celebrations that he was coming. And--what's more--he ain't coming.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:37 AM ^
January 6th, 2011 at 10:47 AM ^
brian the more i think he is a whiny d-bag of epic proportions. get a hair cut and try using a sentence without the word 'like' in it.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:57 AM ^
That's way over the top and frankly, disrespectful to the gut that runs this amazing site. If you want to disagree with Brian, or think that he is being WAY overly dramatic, fine. Maybe he is. Maybe his hate of Hoke is over the top.
But, this is his blog. He created it, runs and and keeps it as the best forum for UM football. It is downright disrespectful to come on to his blog and personally attack him.
You, my friend, are very lucky that the + / - feature of this blog is broken, or you would be seeing the inside of a Bolivian jail from many members of this fine community.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:09 AM ^
he hates lloyd carr and anyone associated with him, that's why he doesn't like hoke. he doesn't want les miles because of scholarship numbers but he wants mullen after the entire cam newton saga? and his infatuation with age is idiotic. ok, lets hire fitzgerald over miles because he's younger but nowhere near as good a coach. it's moronic.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:17 AM ^
Brian hates Lloyd Carr? That's the stupidest fucking thing I ever read. Seriously. That's the MGoPosting equivalent of Two Girls One Cup combined with the giant distended anus picture.
Oh, and in case you didn't notice, Mississippi State didn't pay the two hundred grand for Newton, because Newton's not at Mississippi State.January 6th, 2011 at 11:50 AM ^
from his take on Lloyd. He criticized Lloyd's gamesmanship and thought he was ready to go (and he was). Snarky, maybe, but I never saw Brian being cruel about Lloyd. And my criticism of Brian now is an appeal to think carefully. . . because I admire him and what he has created here.
P.S. As soon as I hear someone say "get a haircut"--well, Nixon is well and truly dead, man. Move forward a few decades, if you freakin can.
January 6th, 2011 at 12:10 PM ^
You Were Killed By a Bear and I Am Sad." Brian's feelings on Lloyd and the end of his era are complicated and not as you present them.
January 6th, 2011 at 12:48 PM ^
When Two Girls One Cup gets thrown into a coaching discussion. +50 to you
January 6th, 2011 at 11:28 AM ^
the whole don't hire Miles thing is getting on my nerves. So sick of people
January 6th, 2011 at 11:19 AM ^
Plenty of other Michigan blogs out there. Why exactly are you here then if you can't stand the person who runs the site?
January 6th, 2011 at 11:33 AM ^
Brian doesn't need you to run to his rescue, seriously. People can disagree with him, it's fine. This guy took it over the top for sure though. Just because he's here doesn't mean he can't express his opinions about how Brian is acting (in a more constructive manner, of course), which, is kind of childish.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:51 AM ^
Here is my case for considering him.
1. Great defensive minded coach
2. Runs a clean program (at Miami of all places)
3. Student athletes excell academically on his teams
4. Strong southern recruiting ties
5. Prefers a pro-style offense
Pair him with an offensive coordinator worth his salt, and add in the fact that he won't be recruiting against instate rivals such as UF or FSU, and I think he could be successful here. It's at least as plausible as thinking that Chris Peterson would work in AA. Stop me if you've heard this before:
1. Offense focused, spread oriented head coach
2. Successful in a league much less competitive than the Big 10
Hmmmm......where might that end up?
January 6th, 2011 at 11:21 AM ^
I think he would be a great fit. He didn't succeed at Miami, but I think he fits a lot better at Michigan.
January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 AM ^
As Desmond put it, he did all the right things at Miami, but he didn't win. I would prefer a coach with a weaker resume and apparently stronger morals ... no complimentary cars or oversigning here, please.
I guess the problem is that he's got a resume like Fitzgerald's, but at an elite-ish school. (Hanging around .500 in the ACC seems easier than doing so in the Big Ten.) So then you'd have to make the case that there are factors here that would help him do what he couldn't in Coral Gables.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:55 AM ^
Mullen would be a great candidate it available. First he kicked our ass. Second, living here in FL I can say that Florida has not been the same since he left. Also, he is young, a great recruiter and it wouldn't take years of change to compete. He could basically be up and running next year with Denard.
January 6th, 2011 at 10:59 AM ^
Bo Pelini - I absolutely love this guy. Fiery, defensive focused, can recruit, resurrected a completely moribund Nebraska team. Brandon should be on speed dial with Pelini like yesterday.
I'm not sure he wants to leave Nebraska but dear lord that would be a great save.
KC Keeler - Delaware - great coach, great record, can recruit the areas we want to recruit and I personally believe would come to Michigan if offered. Also very young and hungry. Plus I am a big fan of the no huddle in college. It is harder to prepare for than even the pros.
Mike Belloti - I don't think we can get him but he would have the offense humming and taking the next step. Chip Kelly is a great coach but a lot of those recruits were Mike Belloti's.
Everyone else is a pipe dream or an unmitigated nightmare. As weird as this sounds Bo Pelini is your best bet. Minimal disruption to the current team and has the ability to get the defense churning again.