CC: Bacon: Hoke likely to stay until December, Brandon's status less certain
After talking with knowledgeable people, I am more convinced that Brady Hoke will survive the season, and less convinced Dave Brandon will.
— John U. Bacon (@Johnubacon) October 1, 2014
Of course, there's always the Brandon Exception: He might decide to depart on his own. Still more questions than answers, however. We'll see
— John U. Bacon (@Johnubacon) October 1, 2014
To clarify, as things now stand, I believe UM's Hoke will remain and be evaluated in December. Brandon's future less certain.
— John U. Bacon (@Johnubacon) October 1, 2014October 1st, 2014 at 5:46 PM ^
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October 1st, 2014 at 5:58 PM ^
I think you are taking a gamble either way....if we fire him, there is a chance some players and recruits jump ship. If he stays and we continue to get pounded, probably the same outcome.
So, I lean towards the one I think will give us a better chance of saving the season and, at this point, I believe it is anyone but Hoke as HC.
There is no good choice, unfortunately.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:54 PM ^
With an interim coach, all the coaches know they are gonzo after the year. They're going to be more worried about looking good and lining up jobs for next then in keeping the committed recruits on board.
October 1st, 2014 at 6:05 PM ^
Wouldn't the same generally be true if the HC is a dead man walking?
October 1st, 2014 at 6:09 PM ^
yeah, it's probably similiar. I'm sure the sharks (coaches at other schools) are circling around the UM recruits.
At this point, I'm not really sure what to think. I guess if there's a sliver lining this is projected to be a pretty small recruiting class.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:25 PM ^
Brady Hoke -- for his faults -- is one of the most effective sales man of the University. I think anyone can agree with that. And, as evidenced at least by some comments from commits (Newsome, etc.), some kids commit to the school, not just the coach. To be clear -- I've got no problem with kids commiting to the coach, but just because Brandon is running a clusterfuck here, let's not forgot that U of M is a dream school for many high schoolers. Some of those high schoolers just happen to play football.
So, will the instability of having Hoke remain mean kids won't be lining up? Sure, of course. But the same is true of an interim, and at least with a full-fledged "head coach" who is working his ass to turn things around, at least there's a chance that the U of M message will get out there to some kids...
With that, Brandon needs to be fired yesterday, and Hoke should be given his pink slip after OSU. I hope like hell the kids can Earle Bruce it for Hoke.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:27 PM ^
At least with an Interim coach there is the chance they turn things around and stay. So, in a hypothetical example where Nuss is the interim, the kids might at least believe he could stay in some capacity even if it isn't as HC.
And the flip side is how much time is Brady going to dedicate to recruitig if it looks like he is on the way out?
And what if we land a sexy name who is willing to jump into this mess mid way through the season? Total pipe dream I know but what if?
October 1st, 2014 at 5:41 PM ^
All reasonable points, but
(1) I don't think anyone on this staff has earned the right to be considered (Mattison, but age and Hoke loyalty make this a nonstarter). I suppose you could roll the dice with Nuss, but that'd have to be a helluva turnaround.
(2) One thing I'd say about Hoke -- for his many, many faults, I don't think he'd undermine the program. Then again... I thought the same about Coach Car..., so maybe you have a point here.
(3) I don't regard this as a realistic concern. This rarely -- never? -- happens.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:51 PM ^
Thanks for the reasoned response.
#3 is my (faint) hope a Harbaugh comes to save the day, after being fed up with the NFL, mid season.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:21 PM ^
(1) If you don't want Brandon running the search for a new HC, best to get rid of him first and find an AD whom you will trust to run things before you deal with the HC position. The new AD should decide whether to retain Hoke or not.
(2) You don't want to get into a situation where you fire Hoke mid-season and then you're left holding the bag in the winter as (say) the Harbaughs say no thanks, Mullen goes to Florida, and then you end up hiring someone who's not a long-term solution. You want to know what the probable outcome will be before you fire Hoke.
(3) The current players support Hoke and the current coaching staff and you want to do right by them.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:41 PM ^
I agree, especially with (1). If I were a prospective AD, I'd be apprehensive about stepping into a situation with an interim coach, partly because it restricts my decision-making (basically forcing a choice ASAP) but mostly because it signals that someone in the university doesn't think that's the AD's call.
And as a bonus (4), if Hoke somehow manages to turn this season around despite the insane odds against it and obstacles to doing so, then the guy really should be the coach next season.
October 1st, 2014 at 7:48 PM ^
October 1st, 2014 at 5:48 PM ^
I agree with what you said, I'm just hoping, unrealistically, that (1) & (2) don't take until December to accomplish. I'm hoping a lot of things are happening behind the scenes to expedite the changes that are coming.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:41 PM ^
October 1st, 2014 at 5:52 PM ^
LOL. i promise you, it was actually Bacari's World who made that thread. I did encourage it in the first response however.
I was actually quoted in the MLive article on the rally organizing!
October 1st, 2014 at 6:40 PM ^
They quoted "Carlos Spicyweiner" on MLive?
Or did they quote you by your boring real name, George Spicyweiner?
October 1st, 2014 at 8:53 PM ^
I find it entirely reasonable that the handling of Morris and the suqsequent aftermath is finally a bridge too far for some people.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:10 PM ^
I read all that as bye Brandon. Have a new AD installed by season end who evaluates Hoke which surely ends in his dismissal as well. Fine.
October 1st, 2014 at 6:41 PM ^
You broke the code.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:11 PM ^
Very general and safe statement to make.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:17 PM ^
I agree. I thought I was the only one reading this as "Brandon might be gone but he might not, and Hoke will be evaluated later on and may or may not be let go at some point in the future."
October 1st, 2014 at 5:25 PM ^
...you may or may not be accurate in your perception (assuming for the moment that you exist, are capable of perceiving, and are perceiving - all realities I'm willing to accept for the sake of argument to the extent that there is an argument, though I do not concede that there is one).
October 1st, 2014 at 5:36 PM ^
lets not go that far buddy!
October 1st, 2014 at 6:05 PM ^
October 1st, 2014 at 5:26 PM ^
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October 1st, 2014 at 5:11 PM ^
DOWN WITH BRANDON!!
October 1st, 2014 at 5:12 PM ^
This is essentially how I saw it playing out anyhow. It's a bad idea to fracture the lockerroom like that anyhow. Brandon can go without much of a ripple. Let Hoke try to scrape together wins and save his job if it's possible (can still win 10 games!), but Brandon has been an issue since the beginning.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:13 PM ^
Think how up in arms the fan base is with 3 losses. If we are 2-6 or 3-5 (with a pounding by MSU), how bad will it be then? Our meltdowns will be having meltdowns.
I thought Brandon was a goner too, but after seeing his contract, I'm less certain. He may leave b/c it can't be much fun anymore, but only if UM pays him a big settlement (which would be politically dicey for all involved) and/or he has a sweet gig lined up elsewhere (which certainly won't be as an AD somewhere; perhaps Ross will hire him as "Director of Marketing and Pizza for the Miami Dolphins" or something).
October 1st, 2014 at 5:51 PM ^
Being a Lions fan for decades I will be the devil's advocate. After about 2 more losses you will see the meltdowns dissipate into more of an acceptance and belief a 3-9, or 4-8 season is ahead. It is one thing when you still have hope and denial. That is how people were after ND (maybe ND is a playoff team! we won on the stat sheet!) and Utah (just change to Morris! Utah might be a top 4 team in the Pac 12). Now after Minnesota you have turned all but a few holdouts.
So as you go through these 3-13 Lions seasons there is not that much emotion. It is just it is what it is and we wait to see who gets swept away at the end of the season, if anyone (depending what year of a regime it was). I believe you will see the same here.
I dont see much difference between 3-5 UM and 2-6 UM in the Hoke scenario a month fron now, so one or the other is not going to get him fired. He just suffered through a blowout loss at home plus a national discussion of his competency. That didnt get him fired. So fuure blow out losses - whats the big deal anymore.
October 1st, 2014 at 6:25 PM ^
I don't agree with you--I think people will find a 38-3 loss to MSU a big deal and/or a bad loss to Penn State at home a big deal--but anything is possible at this point.
But all should note you just compared U of M football ("the winningest program in college football history") with the Detroit Lions, who are without a doubt the worst US pro franchise (in terms of on the field performance), in any of the four major sports, in the last 50 years. The absolute worst out of ~120 teams. The only one in the discussion is the Cubs.
We are in dark, dark times.
October 1st, 2014 at 6:44 PM ^
(Minnesota may win the B1G West!)
(We can still win the B1G East!)
October 1st, 2014 at 5:13 PM ^
I'd still like to see Hoke gone midway through the season but I can't complain too much if this turns out to be true.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:13 PM ^
WOOOOOOOOOOO. Finally, solid insight from a reputable source.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:14 PM ^
That's fine. Either way, both will be gone by time January rolls around.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:14 PM ^
Definitely the order and combo I want. At this point I'm not sure there is any downside to firing both of them. We'd still have Stephen Ross. It's not like he didn't donate before Brandon. Also, Al Glick donated a buttload for our state of the art indoor practice facility when we had Martin and the Wilpons donated for the baseball/softball complex.
October 1st, 2014 at 6:45 PM ^
I think as long as Hoke still has the support of the team he should remain until the season's over. I think the players deserve that.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:14 PM ^
I'd rather it be this than vice versa.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:15 PM ^
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October 1st, 2014 at 5:19 PM ^
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October 1st, 2014 at 5:21 PM ^
They can do worse than they already are?
October 1st, 2014 at 5:43 PM ^
Anytime we say or think things can't get worse...they do. I thought things couldn't get much worse after the ND loss...and then Utah happened. That game felt like things couldn't get worse, what with a monsoon and an offense that couldn't get out of its own way...and then Minnesota happened and the offense looked even worse.
So let's dispel the notion that things can't get worse. They can. And they definitely can with an interim coach too.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:52 PM ^
and emotion on Saturday or the week before or against ND? Twice this year our QB has taken a cheap shot and not a damn thing has been done about it.
I was the type of coach that didn't believe in yelling and one day we were having a very bad practice and I blasted the team. Boy did things change immediately. They had never heard me yell at them before and it sure woke the team up. Maybe Brady needs to stop clapping and start chewing some a**.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:43 PM ^
October 1st, 2014 at 5:44 PM ^
thing that might keep that from happening is MSU coming in complacent. At this point though, it's really hard to imagine us scoring an offensive point against them. I hate saying that.. :( Hopefully the D can hold them down a bit.
Rob
October 1st, 2014 at 7:42 PM ^
Dantonio and Narduzzi won't allow them to -- they smell blood and they're gonna go for the jugular, especially at home. They probably won't run up the score but man is it going to be ugly.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:16 PM ^
There's just no upside to firing a head coach halfway through the season. It would be a free for all for our recruits and you wouldn't gain anything. You won't be able to hire a HC until December anyways. As for AD, it should happen pretty soon to control the damage and get ready for the huge hire of the head coach.
October 1st, 2014 at 5:26 PM ^
There's plenty of upside; it shows someone, anyone, actually gives a shit. And hell, who knows how the players might rally around Nuss as interim? I'd prefer not to go 2-10 this year, so something has to change...
October 1st, 2014 at 5:29 PM ^
and if we go 2-10 with Nuss, players quit, all of our recruits decommit. Then we've just built ourselves a bigger hole for the next guy.