Northwestern players file petition to form a union

Submitted by UMGoRoss on

Northwestern players have filed a petition with the NLRB to be recognized as a union. It appears that this was in part led by Kain Colter. Will be interesting to see how this plays out, as this, along witht he O'Bannon case, could have huge ramifications.

 

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/10363430/outside-lines-northwest…

 

 

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WolvinLA2

January 28th, 2014 at 6:46 PM ^

Because that's not the way I believe these situations should be run.  The employees (not that I feel that's what a studant athlete is, but as an analogy) don't tell their employer how to run the company.  They are offered a job.  If they like it, they take it.  If they don't, they don't. 

High school football players are given an offer.  If they don't like it, don't accept it.  This is college football.  You can go to play college football and go to college for free, or not do that.  I'm just not sympathetic to this at all. 

Joined: 11/13/2009

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Kilgore Trout

January 28th, 2014 at 10:27 PM ^

I guess we just fundamentally disagree. Employees don't tell their employer how to run their company, but in almost all situatiions, they negotiate the conditions of their employment. In almost all situations, there are competitors who force employers to make an acceptable deal with the employees in order to get them to chose to work for them over the competition. But, since there is no legitimate compeition / other option, the employer in college football is allowed to set its terms and the employees have no other course of action. I think this is fundamentally wrong.

Joined: 02/20/2009

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GoBLUinTX

January 28th, 2014 at 12:38 PM ^

of kids that participated in one type of sport or another are denied the chance to even look at an LOI much less sign one.  Should they also be forming unions as to force universities to compensate them?  

If football players really want compensation they should band together in a class action suit and sue the NFL for the chance to be drafted out of HS.

Joined: 12/02/2013

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JeepinBen

January 28th, 2014 at 12:06 PM ^

For every single person in college athletics a contract is a contract. That's why Bobby Petrino coaches the Falcons, Saban is at LSU, Franklin is at Vandy, RR won the sugar bowl, and every other coach, while making millions of dollars, honors their contract while the school does the same.

 

Joined: 01/22/2010

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FreddieMercuryHayes

January 28th, 2014 at 12:05 PM ^

How is incredibly one sided?  What if Coulter got injured his freshman year of college and couldn't play again?  NW could medical him, and then he still gets his free education without playing anymore.  I don't know if he gets medical expenses covered (I think he should).  But it's only 'one sided' because Coulter became the face of the program.  What about all the other kids who never step on the field and don't bring in money for the program.  NW has invested a lot of education and training into them with little/no return in terms of the game tickets/TV watches/jersey sales that everyone wants to measure these things by.  For every one Coulter there's many more sideline non-money making dude.

Joined: 12/29/2010

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JeepinBen

January 28th, 2014 at 12:12 PM ^

It's one sided for everyone. Not just the play-football-for-education part. It's the "give up all your rights" part. What if Coulter wanted to transfer because he wasn't happy? What if his coach left for a better paying job? What if he, i don't know, for example put out a mix tape? Boom, eligibility gone, no free education for you, sucks for you.

Joined: 01/22/2010

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WolvinLA2

January 28th, 2014 at 12:40 PM ^

Kain Colter is helping pay for the offensive linemen whose names nobody knows but who keep him upright (or try to). Not everyone on a college team brings in the same revenue. If Kain wants a disproportionate amount of it, where is that money coming from? Are his linemen OK with giving up their scholarship so Colter can have double? Or are his softball friends willing to fold ther program so Kain can get paid? Maybe NW just never upgrades their facilities so they afford to keep their athletic department afloat. The money needs to come from somewhere, and everyone who thinks every program is swimming in it is wrong.

Joined: 11/13/2009

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JeepinBen

January 28th, 2014 at 11:12 AM ^

Because, really, the idea of "amature" as opposed to professional athletes is a sham. Pretty much, rich aristocratic british people were tired of getting beat in sports by men who had to work for a living. So they made leagues where you couldn't get paid, so that they wouldn't have to play with the poors.

The NCAA's version of "Student Athlete" rather than "employee" came up after injuries were leading athletes to file for workers compensation. The NCAA (successfully) argued that athletes weren't employees, and therefore the NCAA wasn't responsible for workers comp.

It's all about money, and how to keep it out of the players hands, and in the hands of the people who make the rules.

Joined: 01/22/2010

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FreddieMercuryHayes

January 28th, 2014 at 11:25 AM ^

Maybe it's just me, but the idea of 'amatureism' means a lot to me.   I can relate to the 19 year old who sits next to me in a class.  Thus, I pay money to watch him/her represent the univeristy I love, which allows them to have the free education I am paying for.  I can't relate to a guy who signed a contract for $100 million dollars.  It's the reason I dont' watch (hardley any) professional sports.  If this is the way college sports is going, then whatever, I'll live.  But I don't know if I'll be watching college sports then.  And not being able to cheer for UM would make me sad.

Joined: 12/29/2010

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TheCool

January 28th, 2014 at 11:54 AM ^

You see, I don't get your rationale. At one point many if not most of those $100 million dollar athletes (edit: were) 19 and sat next to someone in class. Now that they are making money for their talents they become unrelatable. It's almost as if they are dehumanized because they are professionals. I feel that people don't want to admit it but they hate these million dollar athletes for making so much money playing a sport they love. Brighter minds could probably go into greater detail, but my class is about over so gotta go!

Joined: 07/13/2011

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FreddieMercuryHayes

January 28th, 2014 at 12:17 PM ^

Way to over extrapolate.  I know most were 19 and a college student at one time.  But they aren't now.  Just like I can't really relate to Donald Trump presently.  I could probably relate to him more when he was younger, but now that he flys around the world in a jet with a gold plated bathroom, our life situations don't find themselves with very much overlap.  It's also why I don't relate to even (most, at least) college coaches. 

But that doesn't mean that I hate them.  Most professional athletes are probably good and decent people like the rest of us.  I don't hate them for being rich, or earning their money, just like I don't hate Bill Gates for being a billionare doing what he loves.  It's just that I don't want to pay my money to watch people who would jump teams and loyalties when someone throws more money at them.  That's my decision as much as it's a professional athlete's decision to jump jobs.

Joined: 12/29/2010

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Indiana Blue

January 28th, 2014 at 1:03 PM ^

as explained by JeepinBen.  Tell that to Oosterbaan and Harmon and Cazzie, who played sports for the love of the sport itself.

If you are trying to represent the "common man" you have failed.  These athletes represent what, .1% of all college students.  The vast majority of college athletes actually USE their degree their entire life by having a career outside of of sports.  Many go on to graduate school and still others then pursue a career in the sport in which they played.  

It's an incredible opportunity to participate for those talented enough to play D1 football.  Everything in life has risks, including football.  Are the risks higher in college than in high school, because a career ending injury can occur in high school too, and those people won't even get the opportunity to play in D1.

Unions have provided great protection in the workplace for occupational injuries for workers everywhere.  Some of their other pursuits are much less justified as "helping" the workers ... and an attempt to re-write the entire concept of collegiate athletics would be a prime example of it.

Go Blue!

Joined: 09/19/2010

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PAproudtoGoBlue

January 28th, 2014 at 10:56 AM ^

After seeing the Over signinig write up I don't blame these kids for wanting a little protection. Don't know that I agree with it but damn if I'm not tired of coaches taking advantage of kids and AD's calling their sports teams part of a brand.

Joined: 07/11/2013

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Wolverine 73

January 28th, 2014 at 11:15 AM ^

Just avoid the schools that over-sign.  Apparently, kids think it is in their self-interest to go to Alabama even though that happens.  That means they are getting bad advice from someone, because the chances of hitting it big in the NFL are miniscule for even the top high school kids, and you can get to the NFL via Stanford or Virginia or even Central Michigan too. 

Joined: 08/03/2009

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PAproudtoGoBlue

January 28th, 2014 at 12:50 PM ^

Look I agree w/ you but coahes should hold themselves to the same standards they hold their student athletes. It's just not a good idea to ask an 18 year old kid that grew up idolizing say Bama to dig deeper than academics and football.  He shouldn't have to do that because these greedy coaches should not put them in a position to do that. 

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Blue Mike

January 28th, 2014 at 10:56 AM ^

This won't go anywhere because the court won't open a Pandora's Box by reversing prior rulings that decided that student-athletes aren't employees.  

Which raises an interesting question:  if college athletes are to be considered employees of their universities, shouldn't they then be forced to pay taxes on their compensation?  

Joined: 12/12/2012

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Needs

January 28th, 2014 at 11:55 AM ^

GSI's at UM receive tuition waivers (essentially scholarships, as the department that employs them pays their tuition to the university) as well as monthly wages. They are taxed only on their wages. I would expect stipends for athletes to fall into the same area of tax law.

Joined: 08/05/2008

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LSAClassOf2000

January 28th, 2014 at 11:01 AM ^

"The NLRA governs only private enterprises and does apply to public universities. As a private university, Northwestern University falls under its jurisdiction. Gerard said that based on labor law, any decision in favor of the players against Northwestern would apply to all private universities across the country in the FBS division."

Hopefully, people see this sentence because it is key for the time being. I don't remember the precise number, but I think something around 15-20 schools are all that this would apply to in the scenario described here.

If it came to this, however, it would be interesting to see what the public equivalent of the same process would be though - if we have anyone here who knows public sector employment law, that could be an interesting discussion. 

Joined: 01/07/2011

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Callahan

January 28th, 2014 at 11:48 AM ^

Think bigger though. The reason the NCAA's system has survived without judicial scrutiny for so long is that the parties that can challenge, the "student athletes," are only in school for four years, thus, they have a hard time maintaining standing throughout the life of the case.

But if there's a union involved, there would be no standing issues. The antitrust fight could finally happen, and that's a fight the NCAA probably can't win. That's how it affects all schools, public or not.

Joined: 06/30/2008

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cclittle

January 28th, 2014 at 11:02 AM ^

As a Michigan grad student I do work for the university, represent the university in public forums, get paid, and am part of a union. No one seems bothered by my lack of amaturism. It has always confused me why athletes should be treated differently.

Joined: 10/04/2009

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FreddieMercuryHayes

January 28th, 2014 at 11:16 AM ^

It has actually always bothered me that grad students get the shaft.  Not only are you representing the university, but you are also teaching; basically doing the jobs of people who make 10 times as much as you. You do this on top of doing your own research.  Research that may make the university bundles of money and/or contribute to their prestige.  And you do this on just a little stipend.  Oh, and the cost of your grad education.  I think you deserve a cut of all the money that your grad school brings in. 

Joined: 12/29/2010

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cp4three2

January 28th, 2014 at 12:01 PM ^

As a former grad student, I can tell you, if you're not treating grad school as work, then you're not approaching it the right way. Football is an extracurricular activity, grad school (and the teaching associated with it) is not. 

Joined: 08/03/2009

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pescadero

January 28th, 2014 at 1:39 PM ^

Yet GSRA's are students admitted to the university, not employees hired by it.

 

So SOME Michigan grad student do work for the university and are employees. Some other  Michigan grad student do work for the university and arenot employees.

 

 

Joined: 03/28/2013

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mGrowOld

January 28th, 2014 at 11:09 AM ^

Wow this could be huge on all sorts of fronts.  One - it certainly indicates that at least some of the Northwestern players are VERY unhappy with their current situation hence the need for the petition.  Two - if granted it opens up all sorts of doors for other teams to follow and could be seen as the first real attempt for active players to work collectively in concert with the O'Bannon litigation.

Last year there were rumors of this sort of thing happening at other schools - even rumors of a team refusing to take the field at one point although it never happened.  But this could be the type of activiity that could spread like wildfire if successfully pulled off.

Joined: 10/04/2010

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Rochester Blue

January 28th, 2014 at 11:09 AM ^

They don't want to represent Walk-Ons/NonSchollies because they aren't compensated.  But they are saying part of the reason they're employees is because the university makes money off their "work".  Hard to see where this lawsuit goes.  But it'll be interesting.

Joined: 12/20/2013

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get-on-my-lawn

January 28th, 2014 at 11:15 AM ^

Is that everyone knows going into playing college football that you aren't going to get paid, youre going to have to work extremely hard, and tbe ncaa and schools will make a lot of $ off you. If you know that going into it, why are you going to bitch about it? Nobody is makimg you play and you CHOSE to be a part of this. Thats the bottom line.

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