A public service announcement about sexual violence awareness
[Ed: I pushed this back to the top]
The circumstance with Mel Tucker and Brenda Tracy is an awful one on many levels. It's also an opportunity for education and awareness. FWIW, I'm a former domestic violence prosecutor, and my ex runs the Special Victims Division for our county.
Without casting aspersions on or making assumptions about anyone on this board: if a person hasn't had the opportunity to learn about sexual violence and its effects--for example, if a person doesn't yet appreciate why a victim of sexual violence would find it difficult to hang up a phone when confronted with a non-consensual sex act, similar to how a veteran can still freeze up at the sounds of fireworks or wake up screaming years after returning from war--I'd encourage that person to seek out and read about the science related to such trauma, for example, here:
https://bestcare.org/news/understanding-ptsd-sexual-assault-survivors
Sexual violence occurs in every walk of life, in every demographic group, in every religious and cultural background--in fact, at about the same rates of frequency, which are in all cases shockingly high (it's only the rates of reporting that differ based on socioeconomic status). Abuse affects not just women but also men and is particularly under-reported in abuse of the elderly.
The chances are excellent that someone you know is being abused--and that person hasn't yet reached out for help, and may not even know how. Breaking the cycle of violence and abuse begins with being alert to the signs, and being able to listen without judgment.
Here are some facts to consider about sexual assault from the CDC, including suggested practices to help prevent sexual violence:
- Over half of women and almost 1 in 3 men have experienced sexual violence involving physical contact during their lifetimes. One in 4 women and about 1 in 26 men have experienced completed or attempted rape. About 1 in 9 men were made to penetrate someone during his lifetime. Additionally, 1 in 3 women and about 1 in 9 men experienced sexual harassment in a public place.
- Survivors may suffer from post-traumatic stress disorder and experience re-occurring reproductive, gastrointestinal, cardiovascular, and sexual health problems.... Additionally, sexual violence is connected to other forms of violence. For example, girls who have been sexually abused are more likely to experience additional sexual violence and violence types and become victims of intimate partner violence in adulthood.
I'd ask each person to consider: if it were your sister ... your daughter ... your son ... your mother ... your friend ... if it were you ... What would you want done? How would you want things to change?
This is our chance to learn, to grow, and to be part of the solution. As a sexual violence awareness advocate might say, this is our chance to Set the Expectation.
September 14th, 2023 at 10:39 AM ^
Excellent message!
September 14th, 2023 at 10:44 AM ^
Awesome! Thank you for posting
September 14th, 2023 at 10:46 AM ^
Thanks for the information. Good to know.
September 14th, 2023 at 10:51 AM ^
Hey y'all, I'm one of the 1 in 3 males...
It's super common and often it goes so underreported because even hearing that it happened is traumatic and jarring.
You never want it to be real, as a survivor, as a family member, as a parent, etc.
My own father still won't acknowledge what happened because of the self-imposed shame that would break him if he did. The thought of "I allowed someone to rape my own child."
I used to hate him for it but after a near decade of therapy into adulthood, I just understand that he can't handle it. That's okay.
If you are afraid of this topic, if you have trouble acknowledging it, keep in mind many people around you lived it. Ask them earnest questions. Be brave. Shine a flashlight onto the shadows - and ignore anyone who fights you on that crusade - even so called family.
September 14th, 2023 at 10:54 AM ^
Thanks for posting, Dennis.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:23 AM ^
Thank you, Dennis.
As the father of a child to whom something happened, you spend the rest of your life thinking "I had one job to do..."
No, you never forgive yourself for it.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:29 AM ^
I'm so sorry you were forced to be in a role like that that you didn't choose to take on.
But it isn't your fault, brother. You are a survivor as well - view it as the honor it is.
You've been given the blessing of the opportunity to be perhaps the SOLE person in their life who truly "gets it." That can mean the difference between a life filled with possibilities and joy, and ending your own life bc of the shame.
I can't tell you how to parent, but be fearless and open your heart to hearing their experience. There will come a day when you know it's the right time to discuss it - if you're brave and center them and their feelings, and table your own, they will never forget it. Being "seen" is one of life's rarest gifts, which is what makes our loved ones so special to us.
Parents aren't meant to protect us from all the worlds evils - they're meant to give us the tools to endure them.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:33 AM ^
Thank you, brother.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:47 AM ^
Hugs to you, I'm sorry that happened, but as long as you keep on being a father to your child you're doing the right thing, and I think you know that.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:38 AM ^
glad to hear you were able to participate in therapy on a long-term basis.
i'm a huge advocate of therapy / counseling for every person.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:49 AM ^
If you have the privilege of access to therapy and aren't going, it's more courageous to step into that room and unpack your own shit than anything I've mentioned here, IMO.
Go guys, even if you think you don't have any problems. You do, and it's nothing to be ashamed of.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:42 AM ^
I admire you for posting this, Dennis. It's a courageous act.
September 14th, 2023 at 2:34 PM ^
Dennis - thank you for sharing this. My brother-in-law was sexually assaulted when he was 12. He did finally share the event with his family when he was well into adulthood. It took a lot of strength to do that. I hope it ultimately helped him. It definitely helped his family understand him better, as well as his struggle with alcoholism.
September 15th, 2023 at 8:55 PM ^
I am not a victim of sexual violence, but I was assaulted when I was young by a school administrator with physical abuse. I was severely beaten several times as a young kid in a Christian pre school in North Carolina and completely blanked it out for many years.
i can say things are weird about it. I can now remember it like it was yesterday but absolutely blocked it from my mind for most of my life. I can surely say that traumatic experiences can disappear and reappear. It’s crazy that something that happens to you when you are 4 years old can be blanked out for 30 years and just show up and you are back in the moment. Because of this experience I completely understand why someone might just not shut down the camera.
September 14th, 2023 at 10:57 AM ^
I think this post should be taken down. I don't disagree with the message, but it gets ahead of itself on labels and conclusions being made regarding Mel Tucker's conduct to an uncomfortable degree and I don't think it should be up here.
One person's opinion.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:05 AM ^
I disagree, and I think the OP makes that clear in the first two sentences of the post.
No matter what the facts end up being, the reality is that the topic of sexual assault and harassment is getting attention. And if anything, the prevalence of campus-based sexual violence still continues unabated - despite the work Brenda Tracy and others are doing to mitigate it.
I would also argue that the crude dismissal of these allegations by certain voices at best - and an open call to threaten, harass, and doxx the accuser at worst - suggests that this is exactly why we need to keep talking about it.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:06 AM ^
This post gave me answers to questions that I wanted to know but did not want to ask. I appreciate the information provided and did not know how to get the information. In addition, I do not see the conclusions you refer to.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:08 AM ^
I think the post on the whole is excellent and informative. I think it would better serve its purpose without the last sentence but maybe that's just me.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:08 AM ^
Nope. OP's message provides extremely relevant information without passing judgement.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:21 AM ^
I'd argue that information exchanges centering on sports, an overwhelmingly male distraction hole, is a great place to provide information - we're the audience that needs it, frankly.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:30 AM ^
Perhaps we do. But I just think it is important not to make assumptions regarding people when you do not have all relevant information. Mel Tucker has not even been subjected to a full school investigation yet, and from the information released thus far there are not even pursuable criminal charges. It is clear that this post has been spawned from the situation with Tucker at MSU but I think its inherent characterization of that issue is not entirely accurate and/or is simply premature.
I think this post will go poorly and I think the mods should get out in front of it.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:40 AM ^
The only reason it's going poorly is because of you and a few others who are unable or unwilling to understand what the OP is saying...and to take the post for what it is.
September 14th, 2023 at 1:04 PM ^
Virtually the entire post history seems to be "really good information and thanks for sharing" while a couple of people are saying "man, this post could get gross if we start reading it as an attack on Mel Tucker and other men who like to jerk off on the phone while talking to a woman." Yes, we all know this came about because of the Tucker situation but it really hasn't gone sideways except for people who are trying to defend Tucker or somehow frame this as something that could get "political", as apparently there are side for and against sexaul harassment?
Again, maybe Mel Tucker does turn out to be a victim of some elaborate attempt to undermine him but in this moment it makes sense to, as a PSA, talk about the very real issues around sexual harassment of all genders and identities and provide some numbers and context to what has happened in the past and will undoubtedly happen in the future.
September 14th, 2023 at 1:23 PM ^
I think the post was sufficiently clear in its intent. OP's relevant experience is worth paying attention to.
I think it could have done better in saying unequivocally that Mel is presumed INNOCENT until proven....wrong I guess (no crime was committed or even alleged). We don't know the details and colleges have a really bad reputation with these kind of cases nowadays. Lot of kangaroo court type shenanigans like Mel has hinted at in his statement.
MSU will fire him, he will sue and get 50mill+ back. Ishiba will pay it and everyone in MSU land will happily move on.
September 14th, 2023 at 2:00 PM ^
Mel is presumed INNOCENT until proven....wrong I guess (no crime was committed or even alleged).
The presumption of innocence only applies in a criminal trial, so no there's no reason for me as an outside observer to presume he's innocent at this point. Especially given his actions after the fact (like alleging that Tracy was being investigated by ESPN for fabricating her initial rape allegation, which was blatantly false).
September 14th, 2023 at 3:36 PM ^
and from the information released thus far there are not even pursuable criminal charges
This misses the point entirely. All problematic behavior is not criminal. Nor should it be.
September 14th, 2023 at 6:02 PM ^
It's also worth mentioning that the "presumption of innocence" is also problematic in the case of sexual assault and harassment accusations.The vast majority of sexual harassment or assault cases are "he said/she said" discussions where accusers don't have evidence because this type of thing doesn't often happen with witnesses.
We forget how little autonomy women had when the framers wrote our constitution, especially given that marital rape wasn't even considered criminal until the 1970s. This type of thinking is a side effect of that.
It's also why the word of survivors needs to be considered true until PROVEN demonstrably false in order to constitute reasonable doubt in court. And since the false reports of rape and sexual harassment only account for less than 10% of claims, flipping this on its head would actually make JUSTICE the goal.
September 15th, 2023 at 12:07 PM ^
The presumption of innocence is never “problematic.” I have decades of experience in dealing with crime, criminals and victims, which has taught me that automatically believing anyone you don’t know well, based on their word alone, is naive. Even if the overwhelming majority of sexual harassment claims are true, automatically believing everyone who makes such a claim gives those who are dishonest the power to destroy the lives of others with a lie, and there have been numerous highly publicized examples. Each situation is unique, and should be treated that way. In Tucker’s case, there are legitimate reasons to question whether the accuser’s version of events is 100% accurate.
September 15th, 2023 at 5:29 PM ^
I'm not discussing Tucker's case.
But sexual assault is one of the only crimes where it is possible for a crime to have taken place where the only way to know it happened is the complainant's word.
The presumption of innocence is problematic in this instance because it allows defendants to deny that a crime even took place. If a rape is reported, it should be treated as though it DID occur, and defendants should only be allowed to argue that an allegation is false if they can prove it. Additionally, this should be in every judge's jury instructions regarding reasonable doubt in sexual assault cases.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:33 AM ^
it gets ahead of itself on labels and conclusions being made regarding Mel Tucker's conduct to an uncomfortable degree
Did you even read the post? lmao
September 14th, 2023 at 11:40 AM ^
This was an excellent post. I think everyone learned something and this was very relevant. Thanks for sharing your experience
September 14th, 2023 at 11:45 AM ^
As I said in another post: learn to detect sophistry.
This ain’t it. Mel’s statement is a case study in it. Figure it out. Until you do, expect the thoughtful and engaged people of the world to move on from bad faith credulity.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:05 PM ^
More of the judgment in the post is directed toward some of the comments on this board which lack sympathy for those who have undergone sexual harassment/assault/violence. Those attitudes prevail, even not in the context of Mel's incredulously hurtful behavior.
The PSA is fine, warranted, and has very little posturing towards Tucker.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:28 PM ^
I take your suggestion seriously but I think this is a good post. It's from an expert, and provides a good resource for how to talk about something most Michigan fans are going to be talking about. It's topical, hits the right tone, and the OP certainly knows their subject.
I do appreciate the opinion. You'll get jumped on a bit because it's a message board, but I'd rather these kinds of objections be voiced and responded to than left unsaid.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:38 PM ^
Got it, that is fair.
Yeah, so far I've been labeled a "bug" and a "jackass" and it will probably get worse. Wait until they find out I eat instant grits.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:48 PM ^
FWIW I hope you didn't take my response as a personal attack. I don't think your opinion is misinformed by any stretch, just one I disagree with (can't speak for others, however).
September 14th, 2023 at 12:56 PM ^
instant grits?
INSTANT FUCKING GRITS!?!?!
September 14th, 2023 at 11:11 AM ^
Good post and use of people's attention on Mel to make a bigger and more important point. As with most things, education leads to empathy, which is always a good thing.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:45 AM ^
A long time ago, I was driving some friends west on I-94 to Chicago in the dead of winter. Somewhere along the route, my car hit a patch of ice and it went spinning like a top. Thankfully we careened against a marker pole that arrested our momentum and brought us to a dead stop and we continued on, without even any damage to my car.
I mostly remember that my defensive instincts didn't kick in. I recall thinking "well, gee golly, this doesn't seem right"
There are any number of measures I could probably have done both reactively and proactively to avoid this situation, like pumping my breaks while spinning, but it happened so fast that I think part of me literally didn't comprehend the situation.
This is obviously trivial compared to sexual assault, but the point is that I froze up, no pun intended, and didn't employ optimal anti-spinning on ice measures, both before and during the incident. And obviously I have no problem talking about it since no one is going to shame me for my response, or lack thereof. If that can happen for my situation, then you shouldn't have to imagine what it might be like for someone who goes through something far more traumatic like sexual assualt, even where no touching is involved
September 14th, 2023 at 2:41 PM ^
Reminds me of one icy morning in high school, driving to swim practice in the early morning. Took a bend in the road a bit too fast and my car did a 540. Didn't hit anything, no damage, no other cars. Turned around and continued my drive.
A full minute after the spin was when my body dumped the adrenaline. I had to pull over because of the heart pounding and heavy breathing. People's reactions to stress can and are completely different from one another.
September 15th, 2023 at 12:09 PM ^
That something could happen and does happen doesn’t automatically mean it happened in any particular case.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:48 AM ^
Great post.
September 14th, 2023 at 11:58 AM ^
We could spirit MSU entirely out of this conversation to make a few jackasses happy and this is still a conversation that needs to be had.
Consider how pervasive and fearlessly enabled sexual assault, abuse, and violence are just within FBS football programs, to say nothing of all levels and sports. I wonder if there's a program that hasn't had a major ethical crisis in my lifetime and I'm growing pretty darn sure the answer is "no". We just haven't heard of it yet, because it's still clawing its way out.
This is a massive cultural problem, it takes decades of hard fighting to fix, and you have to start by shining a very bright light on it. Make the bugs squirm. Make it so bright, the jackasses complain about it. Too fucking bad, we're doing this.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:03 PM ^
Thank you!
September 14th, 2023 at 12:26 PM ^
Well done.
With an (ex-)wife and 2 daughters, I remember my utter dismay at hearing that, decades ago now, 1 in 3 women will be sexually assaulted.
Abused males are even more reluctant to report offenders than females. We see more of the teacher/priest/minister stuff coming out now, so, good.
Sweeping this under the rug as an unpleasant topic does not help the victims.
Another point (talking to myself here) the PTSD in women abused as children sometimes manifests in obesity, a subconscious reaction, to create a physical barrier to offenders. So I try not to judge morbidly obese people.
Childhood abuse victims frequently repress memories because horrible realities cannot be processed by immature brains. Over my pay grade here, this is probably a good survival technique at the time.
Dealing with repressed memories is best dealt with through qualified therapists.
Though I did have one of my own.
September 14th, 2023 at 6:56 PM ^
In my youth I was very indirectly involved with events well after a violent rape. With no knowledge at all of what had transpired I asked what happened to a vehicle and had the short version of the crime related to me. I know this is vague, and it's that way very deliberately. That happened over 40 years ago and I still shudder when something brings it to mind.
I am not sure how a rape victim ever truly recovers.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:30 PM ^
This is interesting and helpful information.
Too often it’s easy to try to speculate on what we don’t know because rational does not always fit into our perspectives with something so ugly.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:58 PM ^
User name checks out! (Trying to add a little comedic relief here)
Thanks for posting, OP - and thanks for others that have shared their stories here. Even on an anonymous message board, it takes some real guts to open up about these things.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:53 PM ^
Great message - thanks for sharing.
September 14th, 2023 at 12:53 PM ^
I have 4 daughters and a wife. I know for sure that my wife is a member of some of these stats, and live in fear that my daughters will become one.
About 1 in 9 men were made to penetrate someone during his lifetime.
This is me. It took a long time for me to come to terms that it wasn't consensual. This shit is real and affects many people you know, even if you don't know it. Be kind, be patient, be understanding. It is okay to not lead the way on this, to just let victims' voices be heard.