Warde hate seems to be everywhere right now
I see a lot of comments all over the place about Warde but many of these comments make me think that the commentors have no exposure to how hiring and retention works at a high level in large organizations. Two things about losing Bakich, Beilein and Harbaugh:
-
All three of those coaches clearly wanted to coach at what they perceived as the next level, southern college baseball, NBA, and NFL, respectively. You can not make people stay when they don't want to - it is a free country. Money and how you treat people is not always enough to get people to stay if they have a strong desire to do something else. Sometimes it is simply not possible to offer someone what they want - even if you wish you could.
-
Warde does not have full control over decisions about what he can offer these guys. Possibly he did with Bakich but it's incredibly unlikely he did with higher profile basketball and football. He for sure had to get approval from Schlissel with Beilein and from Santa and the regents for Jim in particular. You can also be sure that the university chief counsel weighed in heavily about the immunity stuff that Jim was supposedly requesting. We simply do not know exactly what happened. Neither does JUB, for that matter, who seems to be as connected as possible.
Jim could have been asking for a fully guaranteed contract with full immunity for everything: historical and future, which the university simply should not agree to. Especially with the NCAA seemingly hellbent to do something to Jim (probably because of his paying the players stance). You simply can't take that risk - for moral hazard reasons, if nothing else. Jim (or his agent) could have been demanding these things knowing that we can't say yes, in part, to set negotiations from an advantageous point for Jim but also to give Jim time to explore NFL options. He easily could have dropped some/all of those demands if the NFL hadn't worked out. He literally had all leverage on his side at that point. We obviously couldn't have fired him and moved on - he just won the national championship.
Could more have been done to make Jim 'feel the love' from the university. Probably. There is almost always something more that could be done. Would that have made a difference? Hard to definitively say but given that Harbaugh constantly tried to get an NFL job for the last few off-seasons and very rarely publicly committed to Michigan in the future makes it look like he always wanted to go back to the NFL. That sucks for us fans, but making it seem like Warde absolutely had it in his power to prevent him from leaving simply does not make sense.
That said, Warde has been a mixed bag. Lots of great stuff with the Olympic sports and he did retain Jim in 2020 when momentum was against him. Hiring Juwan, at the time, looked like a great move and I don't think you can blame him for hiring him (if you are disposed to do). Dropping the ball/being slow on Pearson was not so great and maybe we should have moved on from Juwan after the second 'incident'. Now, it's pretty hard to fire a guy just recovering from heart surgery so we have to see how things play out this year, which admittedly doesn't look good.
I don't know, maybe it's time to move on from Warde, that's for Santa and the regents to say. I just don't think we have enough information and I'm not convinced that Warde could have done anything that would have changed Jim's mind. Sometimes great employees just leave no matter what you do - that's just how the workplace is sometimes. Personally, I'd be inclined to take a look at what other other potential ADs are out there and think about how Warde stacks up vs the other options, but the 'fire Warde into the sun' crowd seems off-base at this point.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:19 AM ^
I know what we should do....make another thread about it.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:56 AM ^
Shoot… the Diaries board is right there.
For people hesitant to use that function, just try it. Especially if you have a longer-ish snowflake-y type post. You’ll find that the responses you’re looking for are much more focused and open to discussion.
So many OPs wonder why their thread posts of an 1,000+ words are rebuked with snark and negs. If you write a chapter book on an unpopular topic or opinion, expect the Wrath of Khan.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:09 AM ^
It’s not all Warde’s fault. If people want to leave they are allowed to do that. I’m not a Warde apologist, but Harbaugh was more interested in leaving than staying - and I don’t begrudge him one bit. Wish it would have happened sooner, but it is what it is now.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:38 AM ^
Everyone here posting that JH wanted to go to the NFL so there is nothing Manuel/Michgan could have done, needs to fall back.
JH did not begin to seek an NFL job until AFTER Warde Manuel gave him a 'take it or leave it huge pay cut' deal. That created valid and predictable resentment. Employers the create resentment in their employees...usually find that their employees do not forget about it, but instead start to look for greener pastures. As JH said 'Harbaughs don't forget.'
So you have no clue whether JH would have so diligently sought out NFL offers had Manuel not mishandled it and created valid resentments. You have no clue WHY JH tried to get an NFL offer every year after that pay cut. Was it only and exclusively BC he just wanted to return to the NFL? Or was it also substantially because Manuel fostered valid resentments? It is highly unlikely that those valid resentments were irrelevant to JH's preferences and actions.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:03 AM ^
I'm just glad Harbaugh is finally gone and we don't have to deal with his self absorbed NFL searches ever again. I was always the biggest Harbaugh supporter but my loyalties are with Michigan.
Honestly, I only wish he'd taken the Broncos job and his side kick had went with him for obvious reasons. Moore would've had an excellent team to start with too.
Harbaugh took all the thunder we should've gotten from winning a natty and parlayed that into his dream job.
People can neg away but this is how I feel.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:25 AM ^
Be glad we are not Washington. I can't remember a time when both Natty participants had coaches take the credit for that game and split, leaving both programs more or less desperate to figure out how to retain any gains that should have come from making it that far.
This is where Ohio and Bama and others succeed so well. Their cultures consolidate their positions at the top and stay at the crest year after year. The ride never ends.
With DeBoer bolting, Washington's roster going to the NFL or splitting off with the portal I cannot remember a program so disadvantaged as Washington who only gets to attempt to salvage next year as they join a new conference well after the portal moves were already completed. They are staring down the face of a six and six season and losing all the gains playing for a Natty should have realized.
Meanwhile, at M the worry is a culture slip as Ohio throws all the monies and inducements it can at the problem showing they don't know how to relent and accept failure. That's a compliment. The worry becomes, will M back down now that they won the Natty? Do they go into Columbus and play with a vibe of "we had our little three game streak and won a Natty so it's ok to lose again"? And this can't be a repeat of '98 starting the next season off like a bust. In this day, successful programs don't shoot the moon. They find ways to ascend the mountaintop and to consolidate those gains and stay there.
2024 is not a relaxing ride. It is a quest to prove M has ascended to the ranks of the truly elite and can sustain that level.. especially against Ohio and especially when their head coach just walked out the door after winning it all (you don't see that anywhere else).
January 25th, 2024 at 11:11 AM ^
Your timeline is broken. Harbaugh got a new contract in January 2022 and apparently pledged that the Vikings interview was a one-time thing. He obviously continued to look after that.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:22 AM ^
Nope. My timeline is correct.
Pay cut was negotiated in late 2020 with the contract signed in January 2021. JH never tried for an NFL job before that date, and in fact did fish around for an NFL job every year since that date.
Link: https://www.si.com/college/2021/01/08/jim-harbaugh-michigan-wolverines-contract-extension
January 25th, 2024 at 12:01 PM ^
He literally signed a new contract in January 2022. Your timeline is broken because it's missing this detail.
January 25th, 2024 at 12:24 PM ^
Do I have to spell it out for you? O.k., I will.
The '22 contract is IRREVELANT to the point.
Manuel created predictable and valid resentment in Dec. 2000 with the massive pay cut. And different contract from '22 did not make that disappear. So, what are you even talking about?
January 25th, 2024 at 12:42 PM ^
It's hilarious that you're chiding others for adopting the simplest explanation (that Harbaugh always wanted to return to the NFL when he was in position to do so) when your preferred theory depends on some wild psychological projection on the man (that the 2020 contract created such strong resentment that he remained in his job for three more seasons before leaving for one of the worse NFL coaching jobs available, choosing to reel off three incredible seasons to ... prove to Warde that he could?).
January 25th, 2024 at 1:04 PM ^
Harbaugh could have gone back to the NFL during any of his first few years with Michigan; yet, he made no effort to do so. He was at his least hirable point after 2020, so he probably could not have done so then. Suppose you're in Harbaugh's cleats after the salary cut. You probably don't quit right then, because your options wouldn't be as good. You therefore accept the contract you have (at a place which, BTW, you love except for the one humiliating event) and you start thinking about alternatives. That's what he did.
To me, that is the simplest explanation. A super-competitive guy that craves respect gets dealt a humiliating blow. Do you really think he's just going to let that go? In this case, because of the National Championship team, the support of a new president, and the overwhelming fan support, he probably thought seriously about doing just that. But in the end, he's still have to work for the guy that did that to him in public.
January 25th, 2024 at 5:52 PM ^
This is the fanbase that is decrying Warde to do something about Juwan, namely fire him because his teams are not performing. Hindsight for Harbaugh is very blurry. We're now talking about that horrible no good nasty pay cut. But at the time, we had gone 2-4 in 2020. We hadn't beaten Ohio State and our record against Michigan State between 2015 - 2021 was 3-4. In Harbaugh's first year, he got a good bowl win, then L, L, L, L. At the time, many thought Harbaugh just wasn't the guy and should be fired. I'm not sure what else Warde should've done. The only other option would've been to heed the call to fire him.
January 26th, 2024 at 12:12 AM ^
At that moment there were two options: Fire him, or keep him at the same salary. Keep him but with a giant pay cut was the worst possible choice.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:11 AM ^
Warde and the powers that be were smart to retain Harbaugh. It was also reasonable to set some parameters regarding expectations and to tie financial rewards to success.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:55 AM ^
This is exactly right and isn't getting enough discussion. Harbaugh had shown zero interest in returning to the NFL until that point. He accepted the pay cut and subsequent contract without any public protest, but he had to be seething. And like many people do when they feel under appreciated at work, he started looking.
I think the decision became very hard along the way because he loves Michigan and his team more than nearly anything, and it hopefully was very obvious to him that Michigan fans loved him, but he wasn't going to forget that the AD didn't and wouldn't have his back.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:10 AM ^
I do begrudge him one bit. Maybe not four bits or a byte, but at least one bit.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:39 AM ^
5 things we know.
- Michigan didn't have to mess with Harbaugh with the pay cut and incentives replacement after the Covid year. It wasn't necessary.
- Michigan didn't have to suspend Harbaugh for 3 games at the beginning of the season for somewhat edible cheeseburgers.
- Michigan didn't fight the end of the season 3 game suspension.
- Our NIL efforts are less than sufficient.
- Michigan beat Ohio 3 years in a row, won the conference 3 times and the National Championship this year.
The first 4 soured Jim on remaining our coach. The last one cemented his legacy here. He could remain coach at Michigan and never win the National Championship again.
Michigan controlled/controls how points 1-4 happened/happen. Warde played/plays a major role in all 4. Michigan failed with those.
I don't blame Jim for leaving.
January 26th, 2024 at 11:13 AM ^
Exactly, why else would JH be negotiating for a contract clause addressing items 2-3? He wanted to fight, the university backed down. He wanted to know they were not going to back down going forward, and were prepared and had acknowledged they would fight.
January 25th, 2024 at 5:57 PM ^
Jim has wanted the NFL for the last three years and he found the situation in LA to be exactly what he wanted. UM was always his back up plan. It's time to realize he wanted that more then staying here. Good luck to him and time to move on with Moore.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:10 AM ^
I considered it and probably should have done so but it didn't feel as substantial as I thought it maybe should have been.
I've been on here for 13 years but rarely post and I think this might have been the first time I actually created a topic. I don't mind if people neg - I didn't post to farm MGoBlog points.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:16 AM ^
well good. the mgopoint/dogecoin exchange rate is pretty bad right now, so the joke would've been on you, man.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:57 AM ^
I get it, man. Most OPs feel like people will actually read their threads if they’re on the board vs the diaries. And I’m not the board police and mods do a fine job already removing the chaff from the wheat from the MGoFarm community.
I just feel like the diaries deserve some love and decent posts like this that are pretty long often have people replying to the replies but not the actual OP.
Food for thought.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:23 AM ^
C'mon. Don't exaggerate. It's only 679 words.
January 25th, 2024 at 12:31 PM ^
Does anyone read the diaries?
I feel like we can just go ahead and delete that. I haven't clicked over there in years.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:57 AM ^
The only logical solution
January 25th, 2024 at 10:20 AM ^
Good point, but I upvoted the OP regardless because it’s a sound argument.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:24 AM ^
This is a good post. We needed a post with a thoughtful perspective instead of by someone trying to start a riot
January 25th, 2024 at 11:38 AM ^
It was a good post, and some rational thinking was needed.
UM alum Charlie Munger once said: Show me the incentives, and I will show you the results.
I have known Warde for more than 15 years. No AD, including Warde, has any incentive to let a successful coach go. The search process is not fun, and the chances of screwing up the search are not zero (See our BB coach and Ice Hockey coaches who are not setting the world on fire). Warde had zero incentive to let Jim leave.
So, why did Jim leave? We do not know. Maybe he wanted to return to the right NFL team, regardless of the circumstances. His demands may have been unreasonable and set a bad precedent for other coaches. We simply do not know. This does not have to be someone's fault.
We have lost good coaches at my institution. The AD was never happy to see them go. We tried to keep them, but for various reasons, it just did not work. It was nobody's fault.
I am sure Troy Danned (UW's AD) and Scott Barnes (OSU's AD) did everything they could to keep their football coaches. They left for better opportunities, and it was nobody's fault.
January 25th, 2024 at 12:08 PM ^
Good for you. Nobody is saying Warde didn’t try—people can INTEND all they want, but they are still in a business that involves people. People have egos. Good people can make missteps. The anger isn’t at the person—it is at his performance. The deflections to whataboutisms when complaints are lodged about the CEO of the athletics department are sad. Warde never should have cut Harbaugh’s salary for one bad season that came during pandemic. That was a huge misstep—intended or not.
Either fire the person you don’t think will do well in future or HONOR the contract they already had. Warde’s actions towards Harbaugh were all about putting “the university above the coach.” Sounds great for the university until you realize that the employee gets the message that they’re expendable and not as well appreciated.
January 25th, 2024 at 6:19 PM ^
It's such bizarre revisionist history on that salary cut. That was a loyalty move. Many many people wanted Harbaugh gone and Warde kept him - that didn't run him off or he'd have been gone that same offseason. Then Warde played a part in keeping Jim around for the next two off seasons when he could have had an NFL job. and then we won a National Championship (still just two weeks ago lol). Warde was a part of that, the contract moves with Harbaugh are part of what led to that. This is a time to be happy not mad. Try to take a page from Harbaugh's post championship press conference and "just enjoy this"
January 25th, 2024 at 4:30 PM ^
Warde was above Jim in the Athletic Department hierarchy, but well below him in actual clout. Bureaucrats like Warde don’t like it when their subordinates are TOO successful, because it accentuates where the value is actually generated. Warde cut Jim’s pay to “show him who’s boss” because Warde is insecure. Incentives abound.
January 25th, 2024 at 6:28 PM ^
This is maybe the dumbest fucking take I've seen, and that's saying a lot considering the posts we've gotten on Harbaugh leaving.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:20 AM ^
Everybody is just in their feels trying to make themselves feel better.
We convinced a top flight NFL coach to come back to college for a decade and he leaves after winning a title.
This is not a weird thing.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:27 AM ^
FWIW I hated Warde before it was cool when he left Jim on an island after the screw job in Columbus in 2016 and when he let the B1G try and fuck us over by not moving our tournament game time after our God Damn basketball plane crashed.
That being said anybody blaming Warde for Jim leaving is simply looking for somebody to scapegoat. The dude does not possess unlimited authority on contract negotiations in regards to both terms and dollars and he definitely does not a freaking time machine to go back and change the results of the 2013 Super Bowl.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:32 AM ^
Death by a thousand paper cuts with warde. I, personally, think a lot of his actions (or in-actions) have been fireable. But for the layman, it seems that they have an excuse for each situation, and since none were truly terrible, people will continue to excuse his mediocrity.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:00 AM ^
His major credential for being AD seems to be "those things weren't totally my fault"
January 25th, 2024 at 10:26 AM ^
Is winning a football national championship (and a bunch of others in less visible sports) not a credential?
January 25th, 2024 at 10:58 AM ^
You might as well credit the water boy. Or claim Alabama AD Greg Byrne (hired in 2017) was responsible for Bama's 2017 and 2020 titles.
Warde didn't hire Harbaugh. He gets a tiny iota of credit for retaining Harbaugh in 2020, but the pay cut was a slap in the face and should never have been implemented. And if there's one thing we know about Warde, it's that he'll take the path of least resistance. Retaining Harbaugh in 2020 was the path of least resistance. You don't fire the prodigal son who is clearly a great coach just because he had some bad luck vs. OSU.
Head coaches have always been the linchpin of college football programs. It is the job of athletic directors to hire great head coaches, retain them, and give those coaches the resources to win. At Michigan, the resources flow freely, so it's really the former two that are most relevant. And Warde has seemingly been bad at doing them, allowing our greatest basketball coach and football coach of the modern era (arguably ever) to slip away. He bungled the Mel Pearson situation too. Now the basketball program is in the dumps and won't even make the NIT. I know people around here liked the Howard hire because he's a homegrown hero, but unlike Harbaugh, Howard had zero track record as a head coach at any level. Harbaugh had a better track record in 2007.
I have confidence in Sherrone because he worked for Harbaugh for 6 years and led the team to wins against PSU and OSU. I don't have any confidence in Warde though.
January 25th, 2024 at 11:17 AM ^
"He gets a tiny iota of credit for retaining Harbaugh in 2020,"
I think you undersell this. Most of this board was ready to hire some dipshit like Campbell. Warde made it work, and the results speak for themselves. You have to give credit where credit is due.
January 26th, 2024 at 11:20 AM ^
And you have to also note the longer term consequences of Warde’s actions. The better choice was to retain Harbaugh at his current contract and give him 1 more year due to COVID and his record of rebuilding teams at every one of his head coaching stops both College & Pro.
January 26th, 2024 at 12:24 AM ^
The bigger problem then Warde are the regents or whoever that support him. Why is it so hard for UM leadership to do anything about an AD? It took a protest to fire Brandon. The REAL problem are the people hiding who continually bottleneck doing anything productive when it comes to athletics. They are either too stupid about sports, don’t care, or genuinely have the wrong priorities. THOSE people are the problem and need to be outed to the public.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:27 AM ^
A thousand paper cuts, indeed... I don't believe any of those paper cuts, by themselves, are fire-able. But they all add up over time. If we isolate them to just the cuts with Harbaugh attached, I think they push him towards the door, if not out of it.
Did Warde have the power to keep him today? No. And he's not solely at fault for Jim leaving, either. But the totality of his differences with Jim's view has certainly pushed Jim in that direction (right or wrong, either way). The only time Warde ever publicly supported Jim was when Speight's neck was broken (to upgrade onsite medical facilities in each stadium) - and Harbaugh led that effort from the front. Just as importantly, Warde made him apologize after 2016 and pay his fine; and he also made Jim apologize to other's because he defended his program from their unprovoked attacks (on multiple occasions). The one tweet people point to about the signgate 'support' was four weeks after it broke and AFTER he was suspended on a plane ride and ESPN was informed first, and AFTER Santa's anti-NCAA letter.
There is no doubt whatsoever that they don't like each other, and paper cuts add up over time...
January 25th, 2024 at 1:38 PM ^
Harbaugh didn’t leave because of 2020. He left because his work here was done. However, everyone thinking this was Warde’s fault probably is a sweet little side benefit.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:34 AM ^
If Harbaugh wins the Super Bowl, he likely never leaves the 49ers/NFL, at least not at a time where it helps Michigan (i.e., we have an opening and he's available). I know he didn't have a great relationship with the 49ers front office, but winning cures a lot.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:46 AM ^
This is definitely not true, at least for the 49ers. During Harbaugh's last season in SF, Jed York said he wasn't going to keep Harbaugh as coach even if the Niners won the Super Bowl.
January 25th, 2024 at 10:07 AM ^
Bill Walsh disagrees.
January 25th, 2024 at 9:36 AM ^
This ^^
He has been a failure for a long time. It has always been too big for him. Unless donors draw in resources he likely isn’t leaving, however. Santa is a better controller of the narrative but has not shown anything to suggest he could make this move with the regents. The whole communication after he left was an overture to $$. They cannot lose the cash cow of donors.
January 26th, 2024 at 12:27 AM ^
Maybe it’s the regents’ fault Warde isn’t fired. You think that Santa really wants Warde around with how much he had to do for him?
Even if Michigan all the sudden fired Warde and started being proactive (gasp!) with athletics, no move will ever compensate losing the best coach we ever had due to reasons that were 100% controllable. Harbaugh did only start looking after the pay cut
January 25th, 2024 at 9:39 AM ^
he definitely does not a freaking time machine to go back and change the results of the 2013 Super Bowl.
That is interesting to think about.
How much different are these past 3 post-seasons if Harbaugh is already a Super Bowl winning head coach?