"Faith, Football and the Fervent Religious Culture at Dabo Swinney's Clemson" (SI article)
SI looks at Dabo's Clemson culture:
https://www.si.com/college-football/2019/09/04/clemson-dabo-swinney-religion-culture
Mods, if this is too "political" please remove it (thanks). I thought it might be interesting to many in MGoBlog's readership.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:42 AM ^
I absolutely love the persecution complex of members of the dominant religion of the dominant nation in modern history. It is absolutely hilarious.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:53 AM ^
I was curious about what the religious makeup of the UM student body is, I found a survey:
https://diversity.umich.edu/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/DEI-STUDENT-REPORT-FINAL.pdf
Religion answers are on page 17. Summary:
Christian of one denomination or another: ~42%
Athestic/Agnostic/"None": ~38%
Jewish: 8%
Hindu: 4.6%
Muslim: 2.7%
So Christians may not be the majority on campus but they're not exactly a tiny subculture either.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:58 AM ^
It's a plurality.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:24 AM ^
Dabo missed his true calling as a televangelist.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:29 AM ^
He took a vow of poverty so he chose football coach instead.
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September 5th, 2019 at 9:33 AM ^
Jesus loved PED's apparently.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:47 AM ^
I mean, He did rise from the dead.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:23 AM ^
According to the book of Clemson, when He rose He was super swole and still ran a 4.1 forty.
September 5th, 2019 at 3:52 PM ^
Would turning water into wine be considered an impermissible benefit?
September 5th, 2019 at 9:42 AM ^
"And Jesus handed unto him, he who was a bad ass coming off the end to sacketh thine enemy, a large bag of gold coins. And He said, "Go unto the field, and kicketh ass so that we may celebrate a plethora of national championships." And he did. And it was good."
September 5th, 2019 at 9:52 AM ^
LOL Mo, and give us our daily PED!
September 5th, 2019 at 9:43 AM ^
There is no such thing as a good Christian. If you are a Christian, you are admitting that you are a sinner that is saved by Christ. I am a Christian, but I do not claim to be good. I strive to live a good life and be Christ like, but I am far from being that.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:45 AM ^
Yes Boner, thanks for letting us know you are not above sin, Boner...
September 5th, 2019 at 9:57 AM ^
I don't think that's how 'good' works. Consider: good criminals are people that are good at crime.
September 5th, 2019 at 12:39 PM ^
I think a lot of the tension in our society is because it *is* very heavily informed by Christianity, and being Christian is often conflated with being a generically "good" person. The problem with that is that it carries baked-in assumptions that go both ways - shitty non-believers are ready to pounce on Christians when they inevitably fuck up, and shitty Christians look down on non-believers for their moral and spiritual turpitude - it's because of the latter that I don't feel comfortable being openly agnostic, but the former happens as well.
In my experience, most people regardless of spiritual belief (or lack thereof, as in my case) are decent enough regarding tolerance of others, but just as with most things, the one shitbag tends to wield an outsize influence...
September 5th, 2019 at 9:44 AM ^
He’s just using Christianity as a recruiting tool, which is some shady stuff.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:44 AM ^
Unless it's ohio state, then throw fucking boulders.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:09 AM ^
Michigan State and Penn State deserve meteors.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:49 AM ^
Thanks for posting OP, I thought it was an interesting article. If Clemson was a private school I would have zero problem with this. Even as a public school as long as the religious aspects aren't mandatory and Clemson is transparent about the team culture with recruits I think it is ok.
September 5th, 2019 at 4:01 PM ^
So, by way of comparison, are you okay with Michigan hosting a hijab day on state property?
September 5th, 2019 at 4:43 PM ^
A day where people who wear hijabs are recognized and get together/socialize, or something of that nature? Sure, I'm 100% ok with that. As long as they aren't forcing people to wear one I don't see what the problem would be.
September 6th, 2019 at 11:51 AM ^
As long as they aren't forcing people to wear one I don't see what the problem would be.
Promoting a religious artifact on state property. That's the problem.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:50 AM ^
I never have any quibble with anyone's choice to follow any organized religion, or not. As long as it's not extremist, fundamentalist, or evangelical.
As for Dabo Swinney I have a very cynical outlook on what he's doing. Let's just say it is working very well.
September 5th, 2019 at 10:02 AM ^
What do you mean by not evangelical? Most religions are inherently evangelical.
September 5th, 2019 at 10:44 AM ^
I think a lot of americans use 'evangelical' to generally identify protestant christians, often the 'religious right' because that's what the religious right calls itself. You are right that christianity is inherently evangelical (Jesus commanded to tell other people) but that gets confused with the political group that identifies themselves as 'evangelicals'. Understandably so
September 5th, 2019 at 9:52 AM ^
I ceased being religious decades ago, and am only now realizing that I’m getting myself more comfortable saying that I no longer believe in a god. Because lifelong belief systems are hard to overcome. I have no problem with religion, or the religious. My problem is with hypocrites, and those that hide behind religion to gain acceptance (or resolution) for the shitty things they’ve done.
Ive no doubt that religion instills a better sense of moral high ground. But that can, and often does, easily transfer to bigotism - do what I say, regardless of whatever you think, because Bible.
I think Dabo has crossed that line. I have no problem with him leading prayers, or prayer study. But if he really said that he’ll make sure that all players receive the Gospel, he needs to go away. That’s not allowing a free choice that players can freely decide on.
Besides, everything about him screams smarmy, slimy fuck.
September 5th, 2019 at 10:40 AM ^
I think it depends on what your definition of receive is. I'm assuming he means that every player "will hear about the gospel and the love that Jesus has to offer", what the players choose to do with that is their own deal. I can receive fast food, but it's my choice whether or not to eat it. As highlighted in the article, I think he cares about winning more than faith, because a player who was not Christian started on the team for four years. I don't think there is anything wrong with offering players the opportunity to come to the Lord, so long as players that don't accept are not mistreated or ostracized.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:41 AM ^
We will have to agree to disagree. Dabo is in a power position and kids may find that it’s to their professional benefit to follow Dabo. That’s misuse of power in my opinion.
September 5th, 2019 at 4:00 PM ^
Every HR department in the world will agree with you...
Say it's customary to chest bump and slap ass when someone has a good idea in a business meeting. Is it okay for men to slap some woman's ass, just because the boss decided it would be a good team building exercise? LOL!! You go ahead and try that. Tell us how it sorts out...
September 6th, 2019 at 11:12 AM ^
and there is always one person who has to take things to the extreme. I think it's hysterical that you used this as an example. Not even close to the same thing.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:57 AM ^
Please delete
September 5th, 2019 at 10:52 AM ^
Probably should have posted this on the first page of comments......shruggie.gif
September 5th, 2019 at 11:07 AM ^
Or in the mods sticky, although I imagine mods can easily see the thread title which isn't subtle.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:42 AM ^
Thus far down the thread, the comments have been admirable. A lot of different perspectives shared without going into the gutter in either direction. A respectful dialogue about the role of Christianity within a major college football program is edifying and important. No reason to delete this type of exchange because you’re uncomfortable with the topic. I don’t see any proselytizing happening here - just a really good exchange of ideas among a lot of intelligent and free-thinking people. That’s a good thing in my book.
September 5th, 2019 at 12:46 PM ^
I agree. Free thinking and exchange of other ideas and expressions even if you do not agree with them are healthy and should be encouraged on blogs like this. Thank you. I want to give 50 thumb ups on this.
September 5th, 2019 at 12:52 PM ^
Because you disagree with the topic of discussion? I say delete you from this blog.
September 6th, 2019 at 11:54 AM ^
Because you disagree with the topic of discussion?
That's the MGoGroupThink in action right there.
The other posts are correct... the comments thus far have been thoroughly enjoyable. And not everyone is 100% agreeing with one another. But somehow, it has worked out.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:59 AM ^
Obviously unconstitutional but good for them, I guess.
September 5th, 2019 at 10:15 AM ^
Were steroids mentioned in Leviticus?
September 5th, 2019 at 10:26 AM ^
Atheist here...
Willing to convert to whatever wins championships.
September 5th, 2019 at 10:40 AM ^
I'm a Christian. My experience with encountering so many skeezeballs and fakes in the american Christian / religious right world is to not trust the guys who appear to use christianity as a front or as a public persona. Guys like Hugh Freeze or Dabo or any number of prosperity gospel preachers, numerous politicians, etc etc. Hard to put into words exactly what sets off the warning lights but Dabo is one of those guys too.
September 5th, 2019 at 12:46 PM ^
actions speak louder than words.
walk the walk of Christ and you'll never need to talk the talk.
those who speak loudest are usually the most fake.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:01 AM ^
He's full of it. Just give it time.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:10 AM ^
Outside of the religious portion of this story and despite the preaching currently going on with the comments on this website, let's clearly understand how Clemson has won two national championships recently and its not from going to church every Sunday. The sudden retirement of Steve Spurrier at South Carolina had a HUGE impact on this. Spurrier DOMINATED the recruiting in the state of SC and this marginalized Clemson under BOTH Bowden and Swinney. Also, Dabo changed his leadership philosophy when it came to hiring coaches in 2011. He fired his buddy Kevin Steele after being blown out by West Virginia in Orange Bowl and he began surrounding himself with coaches like Brent Venables and Clemson's athletic administration was willing to pay the money to keep them in place. Since then, Clemson is 87-11 with 2 National Championships. Also, the ACC as you know is not very daunting. Georgia Tech stinks, FSU is horrible and Miami is not the Miami that many of us are old enough to remember. As far as paying players!!! if anyone on this website is naive enough to believe that ANY program at that level does not have alumni or some system that PAYS or BUYS items like cars or homes for top recruits is simply living in a fantasy world of arrogance and ignorance of the system. Yes, this also includes our beloved Wolverines. This has ALWAYS been the case in big time collegiate sports across the entire nation even in the Big 10. Of course Clemson does those things just as much as they did in the 70's, 80's, 90's and since 2000. Had they not won a national championship then they would not even be a topic on here now. I love to hear. Just wait? They'll get it! Get what? Another national championship? That was the same crap I heard about OSU in 2007 when Tressel left an electronic trail. How exactly did that cripple OSU? They hired Meyer and won another national championship. What did Michigan do? Pretended they have a higher standard which is a joke and they hired Rich Rod and Hoke while thumbing their nose at Harbaugh. Harbaugh even complained about Michigan getting those marginal academic guys into their program. If Michigan does make it to playoffs this year, then who will expose their bagmen?
September 5th, 2019 at 2:54 PM ^
Michigan absolutely does have a “higher” standard of not paying players. After hearing many insiders, and knowing a handful of players, I’m confident UofM is not systematically paying players. Of course players do get benefits the rules don’t allow, and some do straight up get paid.
September 5th, 2019 at 9:19 PM ^
Yeah Right!!!! The Fab Five has a higher standard as well. Whatever your smoking could make you millions
September 5th, 2019 at 11:06 PM ^
Well the current NFL defensive lineman I know wasn’t getting paid at UofM. So that’s seems pretty decent evidence right there. How many Harbaugh era players do you know ?
September 5th, 2019 at 11:27 AM ^
Stuff like this is exactly why I'm glad the world is becoming more secular.
September 5th, 2019 at 11:33 AM ^
It's true, faith is a powerful tool; he kept the fans' long enough to turn Clemson around and is using it to solidify the players belief in themselves.
Of course, the strongest faith never attracts attention to itself but focuses the spotlight on the power of belief.