PurpleStuff

September 13th, 2010 at 12:43 PM ^

Are you really arguing that Alabama has limited attrition?  They have been begging guys to transfer.  USC is down under 80 scholarship players and has a long history of guys leaving for more playing time even before the sanctions (Emmanuel Moody, Broderick Green, Aaron Corp, etc.). 

This is not new or unique to Michigan.  The coaching staff isn't doing anything to make guys like Vlad and Lalota (who were behind true freshmen and walk-ons in addition to the guys at the top of the depth chart) realize they probably have a limited chance of seeing the field at Michigan.  3rd and 4th string guys transferring (especially when those guys feel they are as good as their 4-star reputations) happens everywhere and is not a big deal at all.

Joined: 04/21/2009

MGoPoints: 15969

bluebrains98

September 13th, 2010 at 12:55 PM ^

We also need to realize that the mgoblogosphere has only been around for a few years. There are maybe 5 people on this website who could name every player in a given recruiting class pre-2005 (that is, at the time they were recruited--we can recite previous classes now). So, attrition of guys who didn't play often likely has gone unnoticed until the relatively recent future. While we know our attrition numbers are high (as reflected by the reduced APR), it may not be as catastrophic as we all believe. And, there is the added bonus of opening up new scholarships. And, there is the added added bonus of the coaches maybe learning a thing or two about the types of people they recruit and potentially identify red flags in recruits before giving offers.

Joined: 01/14/2009

MGoPoints: 7068

bluebrains98

September 13th, 2010 at 1:16 PM ^

But, it wasn't as if the entire fanbase got instantaneous word every time someone who was third or fourth on the depth chart decided to transfer. And, the number of people who subscribe (i.e., pay) for those services is much lower than the mgoblog members. I have been a diehard UM fan since I was 5 years old (lots of years), and only within the last four or so years have these types of issues been apparent to me. Not necessarily because there are more issues, but because the information is just easy to acquire.

Joined: 01/14/2009

MGoPoints: 7068

M-Wolverine

September 13th, 2010 at 2:47 PM ^

But it's not like people didn't know.  They just didn't get to have the instant, or group, freak out we all do here.  But it was in the newspapers, just like it will be in the newspapers tomorrow. The way it became public was a press release. They did those before. It was just a lot slower trickle. I think YOU just pay more attention, so it seems like a lot more.  Addicting, isn't it?

Joined: 10/04/2009

MGoPoints: 42190

WolvinLA2

September 13th, 2010 at 3:35 PM ^

Those things existed, but they didn't have the readership that this blog has.  And it's not exactly a big story when a RS freshman who never sniffed the depth chart takes off. 

5 years ago I never would have known a guy like Anthony LaLota existed, let alone discussed his leaving with anyone or cared at all if I saw he transferred.

Joined: 11/13/2009

MGoPoints: 58191

COB

September 13th, 2010 at 1:23 PM ^

Really?  Moody transfered because there were 10, (TEN!) RB's on the roster at USC in 07.  We are talking multiple 5 stars (Johnson, McKnight to name just two!).  Alabama begging for transfers is also a bad example.  They are begging for transfers because Saban is replacing their spots with higher recruited guys or in better position to play (health).  It is dirty as hell but call a spade a spade, it is more "addition by replacement" than attrition. 

Joined: 11/17/2008

MGoPoints: 869

Jivas

September 13th, 2010 at 12:33 PM ^

Can we seriously not throw this kid under the bus when we have no idea what the circumstances are?

As a fan, this is sad news, and the level of attrition is worrisome on numerous fronts.  But we have no information about the determinants of this decision, and we're talking about a 19-year old; how about the benefit of the doubt?

(NOTE: Any and all personal attacks on Justin Boren are totally kosher; my rules, live with it).

Joined: 07/06/2008

MGoPoints: 2396

Sopwith

September 13th, 2010 at 12:36 PM ^

What advantage is there in transferring during the season instead of waiting it out and transferring after the season's done?  If you wait, you get the benefit of

i) access to the facilities, weights, Barwis, training staff, etc,

ii) practice

iii) film study

iv) the possibility that a Catastrophic Series of Events moves you from 3rd or 4th to 1st on the depth chart in one week.  This being Michigan, "catastrophic" does not equal "uncommon". 

You're going to have to sit out a year anyway to play elsewhere in I-A, so what is the rush?  Is there an NCAA deadline to beat?  Spring transfers happen all the time, so I feel like I'm missing something.

Joined: 06/29/2010

MGoPoints: 61103

IanO

September 13th, 2010 at 1:22 PM ^

It's really easy to sit here browsing the web, sipping a latte, and forget just how demanding being a football player at Michigan really is. I only participated in athletics through high school, but even at that level, I remember it being hard f'ing work! Get up while it's still dark, go to school all day, work out until you think you're going to die, go home and study a few hours, eat dinner. Start all over the next day. I can only imagine how much harder it would be in a top-tier athletic program at a top-tier university. It's not too hard to imagine wanting to leave, even after week two, if I thought I'd never see the field. The kids who gut this out are incredibly tough. They're way tougher than I'll ever be, and tougher than 99% of you reading this. The kids who gut it out are going to make one hell of a football team. You're just a fan. These kids are working their asses off. Step back, find some perspective, and relax.

Joined: 11/21/2008

MGoPoints: 455

Trepps

September 13th, 2010 at 12:38 PM ^

most of them seem related to depth chart and playing time issues (B. Smith, Turner, White, Vlad, Lalota).  We are mostly losing guys buried on the depth chart which on an isolated basis is ok, but at some point we have to keep players if our depth is ever going to build.  At some point this will become a problem even though we haven't really lost any impact players.

Joined: 02/24/2010

MGoPoints: -9711

chitownblue2

September 13th, 2010 at 12:42 PM ^

I don't know if LaLota was one of them (Vlad definitely was), but I recall a ton of kids being told that they would "have the opportunity for early playing time". I'm not suggesting they were lied to at all, but if the prospect of playing early was a determining factor in them coming here over another school, and they found themselves sitting 3rd string...they may just want to go to that other school. Hopefully, as our ranks fill up, we'll have to dangle that "playing time" carrott a little less.

Joined: 06/03/2009

MGoPoints: 7178

Bodogblog

September 13th, 2010 at 1:00 PM ^

Vlad could have taken the FS job last year (look at Carvin Johnson).  LaLota could be second string and on the field (look at J. Black). 

One of the most genuine sales pitches RR has is this: work hard and compete, and if you're the best you'll play.  He's made good on that over and over.  Hell he replaced a 12-game starter at QB and dropped him the 3rd string based on it.  Kovacs has one of the most secure positions on the D, a walk-on.  Work, compete, earn it, Play. 

Joined: 06/08/2010

MGoPoints: 26674

Farnn

September 13th, 2010 at 12:44 PM ^

I wonder if our draw over the last few years of early playing time isn't a double edged sword.  We get players who we might not get because of the opportunity to start early, but then if they don't make it they bolt for another early playing opportunity.

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 12788

CincyBlue

September 13th, 2010 at 12:46 PM ^

knowing he had to grow into being a D1 football player. Right?  That he would reshirt and earn playing time after that. 

He didn't give himself a chance to earn that playing time.  I hate to hear things like this after a great weekend. 

Joined: 06/30/2008

MGoPoints: 6718

Magnus

September 14th, 2010 at 12:46 AM ^

I'm not saying we don't need Lalota (it would be nice to have him for depth, although I was never a big fan of his abilities).

However, he's behind a true freshman (Black) and a converted tight end (Steve Watson), not to mention the starter (Van Bergen).  I don't think it's too far out of line for some fans to not really care about Lalota's departure.

Joined: 07/17/2008

MGoPoints: 166007

shootingblue

September 13th, 2010 at 1:21 PM ^

of a guy working hard for 3 years and emerging as a RS Junior is over.   I'd like to see a survey of transfers across the BCS conferences to validate this.  I hope to god this isn't UM-centric.  I imagine it's a blow to the ego to be "the man" throughout your prep career and then have Barwis, et al scream at you every day for a couple years to work harder and not see the field, but damn, this is disheartening to me.

Joined: 01/04/2010

MGoPoints: 11

AlbanyBlue

September 13th, 2010 at 6:25 PM ^

shootingblue opined: " I imagine it's a blow to the ego to be "the man" throughout your prep career and then have Barwis, et al scream at you every day for a couple years to work harder and not see the field."

This is probably the closest to the actual reason, whatever that is, that I've seen.

Joined: 09/11/2010

MGoPoints: 22040

bronxblue

September 13th, 2010 at 1:35 PM ^

Sad to see him leave, and wish him the best.  If it really is about PT, then that is sad because he always had a chance to compete.  Ah well, time to move on.  Yet another hit to the APR - I have a sinking suspicion that we'll fall into the penalty region this year.

Joined: 11/22/2008

MGoPoints: 171742

zerocool

September 13th, 2010 at 1:51 PM ^

Big Will has found a way to contribute (i.e. lead blocking on goal line offense) while he is getting better at his primary position.  I think the coaching staff has sent a message to the players that they have to compete (and show it in practice) to play.  It sucks that the transfers impact APR, but (in my opinion) it is better to free up the scholarship for an athlete that will compete than to have it sitting on the shelve for 4-5 years.  I wish him luck at his next stop.  Hopefully this will be the last defection of the year.

Joined: 06/07/2010

MGoPoints: 115

Yooper

September 13th, 2010 at 2:44 PM ^

Transfers matter because you win with upperclassmen in the Big Ten.  To win you have to run the ball and stop the run.  You do that with upperclassmen and depth.  We have neither and having these guys wash out means that stopping the run will be a problem.  Wait until we have to stop Wisc, PSU, Iowa, OSU, and MSU when it matters.

Joined: 09/01/2009

MGoPoints: 11269

tenerson

September 13th, 2010 at 2:54 PM ^

whole thread is pretty disappointing. People talking about how he didn't want to work hard and indicating he was a quitter. Here's what I see: I see some kids transferring early in the season. Weird right? Yeah, it is. I don't think there is something wrong with the staff. If there was, people would have left after last year. I think in the cases or Turner and Lalota, they pictured themselves higher on the depth chart and being able to contribute more. They turned out to get passed by guys younger than hem and read the writing on the wall. I can't blame them. In Vlads case, all indication point to him not being the same since the injury and he was passed right before he transferred. Could the staff be looking out for both entities here and helping these kids get somewhere where it looks like they will have a better chance to succeed? I hope so. That would be ideal for both parties. No one likes transfers. The guys who have transferred likely all high higher expectations in term of playing time. I don't think this is a problem with the staff. Like I said, if it were, we would have seen a bunch of transfers at the end of last season and last spring. I think this is purely about PT.

Joined: 10/04/2009

MGoPoints: 2371

jmblue

September 13th, 2010 at 3:00 PM ^

Even though it's officially against the rules, coaches do recruit players on other rosters when they think they see an opening.  (Brian Kelly was notorious for doing this when he coached at GVSU and CMU.)  Opposing coaches are telling our third-stringers "Look, Rodriguez is going to be gone, so you may as well plan ahead."  It's extremely irritating, but the only thing we can do is keep winning and put the "RR on the hot seat" crap to bed.

Joined: 11/07/2008

MGoPoints: 102810

Steve Lorenz

September 13th, 2010 at 3:43 PM ^

In St. Louis, the Cardinals' Colby Rasmus is one of the most talented young players in the league but has been a headache and has said multiple times he wanted out. King Pujols's response? If he doesn't want to play here, we don't want him. Not saying LaLota has been a headache by any means or that he doesn't have a legit reason for leaving. Either way, if he doesn't want to play here, we don't want him or need him. We'll move on and be fine. 

Joined: 01/26/2010

MGoPoints: 6841

StephenRKass

September 13th, 2010 at 3:51 PM ^

I hate transfers, but between Barwis and RR, I'm sure it isn't a stroll in the park for players. It is hard to be on the sidelines, but I'd rather clear the way for guys who are a better fit for Michigan.

Joined: 07/15/2008

MGoPoints: 23001

TheOracle6

September 13th, 2010 at 4:54 PM ^

The fact that Lalota was passed immediately by a true freshman obviously points to him not being as good as he was thought to be.  He came in slower, and smaller then expected and the writing was on the wall the second J.Black was placed ahead of him on the depth chart.  I wish Anthony well going forward, thank you for representing the Universiy of Michigan with class.

Joined: 09/02/2010

MGoPoints: 1636