turd ferguson

April 12th, 2017 at 3:02 PM ^

Okay, I'll ask you the exact same question I asked ldd10 above, because I just looked at your past posts and it definitely applies...

 

Could you clarify whether you're (a) an MSU fan who pretends to be a UM fan or (b) an MSU fan who acknowledges that he's an MSU fan while posting on a UM board?  

I'm fine with (b), but your posting history suggests (a).

Brianj25

April 12th, 2017 at 6:47 PM ^

Davis is a good reference as to why a pure center who's only 6-foot-9 and isn't a consensus Top-25 recruit shouldn't go pro after a mediocre freshman season. You could argue that Izzo playing Davis in limited bursts allowed him to showcase only his strengths and hide his weaknesses, which is one of the primary reasons he got drafted in the first place. And you could also argue that Davis would have been drafted higher had he stayed and developed under Izzo longer.  

Ty Butterfield

April 12th, 2017 at 2:16 PM ^

Bridges will stay and Wagner and Wilson will leave. This is where the lack of being able to land instant impact recruits comes back to haunt Beilein. No way Izzo isn't paying Bridges to stay.

Jimmyisgod

April 12th, 2017 at 2:18 PM ^

MSU will be loaded next year with him.  That Jaren Jackson they already have signed just got bumped to the #6 player in the country, he's going to be really good and a potential 1 and done.

All my MSU peeps at work have been sayng Bridges will be back, this is the 1st concrete sign as Wojarnowski is as solid of a source as it gets.  With Bridges back MSU should be pre season top 3.

And yeah, with our luck we'll lose one of Wagner and Wilson, or both.

Jimmyisgod

April 12th, 2017 at 2:49 PM ^

Jackson is insanely young.  He's 17 and won't be 18 until late this year.  That could keep him in school along with the fact that his parents are wealthy.

I watched that Nike Hoops Summit game because I wanted to see Bamba play.  Jackson way outplayed Bamba.  Jackson is a better version of Deyonta Davis.

Stringer Bell

April 12th, 2017 at 2:21 PM ^

You'd think Gary Harris would be a cautionary tale. Guy was a lottery pick after his freshman year, came back, got worse, and fell out of the lottery. Oh well, Bridges is a good player but it's hard to see them improving from a 15 loss team to a national title contender in one year.

Stringer Bell

April 12th, 2017 at 2:28 PM ^

No its not. He had a worse sophomore year than freshman year, got drafted lower than he would have after his freshman year, did squat in the NBA his first couple of seasons and is having a breakout year now because he improved by playing against the best.

ijohnb

April 12th, 2017 at 2:34 PM ^

on this.  If they were like a Sweet 16 team this year that finished the year strong and showed amazing promise going forward I would be concerned.  Fact is, they fizzled late, should not even have made the tournament and were way overseated.  They were given a gift to 1) get in the tournament, and 2) get out of the first round.

04Sparty

April 12th, 2017 at 5:24 PM ^

I just want to point out that Gary Harris averaged more points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks his sophomore year than he did as a freshman. He was also first team All-Big as a soph compared to second team as a freshman. I'm not quite sure how you can come to the conclusion that Harris was better as a freshman than he was as a sophomore. 

And most draft projections had Harris as a late first rounder after his freshman year, roughly between 20-25, not a lottery pick. I'm not sure where you got that impression either.

That is all. 

04Sparty

April 13th, 2017 at 1:26 PM ^

Again, I'm not sure how you have come to that conclusion. His offensive rating dropped from 117.2 to 116.9 from his freshman to sophomore years, but his offensive win share increased from 2.9 to 3.3, and his offensive +/- increased from 6.4 to 6.9. Hell, his PER increased from 19.2 to 22.5. 

To say he was "significantly less efficient" is bizarre. 

4yearsofhoke

April 12th, 2017 at 2:23 PM ^

Tom Izzo = Talent Obliterator KU, UNC, UK, Duke and probably UMICH would have bridges as an easy lottery pick. No idea why these players play for izzo, he's costing them like 5 million dollars or something for every year they stay and with the time value of money it is even worse.

Bubba

April 12th, 2017 at 2:29 PM ^

We are jealous of their basketball program much like they are jealous of our football program. The fact that players WANT to stay there when they could go pro early is a sign of a good environment. Not everyone feels that way, just look at Davis going pro early last year.

4yearsofhoke

April 12th, 2017 at 2:36 PM ^

No doubt. I have respect for the big MI prospects wanting to play for their state, come back, and play for MSU. I just don't comprehend why they do given that izzo hasn't sniffed a championship in a long time and that they are giving up a lot of money and incurring a lot of risk (to most likely not finish a degree as well). And please don't say getting to a final four is close to a championship. MSU hasn't played a competitive title game in a looooong time. I think it will be good for the B1G of bridges come back.

Bubba

April 12th, 2017 at 2:37 PM ^

There's a lot of reasons players go to certain programs outside of winning championships (and bag men). If you follow the McDonalds AA list ever year the majority are Blueblood programs but for some reason obscure programs that make no sense are continually listed. The develent of Draymond Green is recent enough to offset the decades of poor development in the minds of kids today.

uncle leo

April 12th, 2017 at 2:35 PM ^

They haven't recruited good enough players to make the jump after year 1?

I don't find players staying longer at MSU as some connection to being a nice place to play. I would imagine every university where you are a big time star is pretty cushy.

ijohnb

April 12th, 2017 at 2:41 PM ^

Jealous of their basketball program?

Michigan - 2011 Second Round NCAA, 2012 First Round NCAA, 2013 NCAA Championship Game, 2014 NCAA Elite 8 (BIG champs), 2015 Missed tournament, 2016 NCAA First Round, 2017 NCAA Sweet 16 (BIg tourney champs).

Michigan State - 2011 NCAA Second Round, 2012 NCAA Sweet 16 (BIG champs), 2013 NCAA Sweet 16, 2014 NCAA Elite 8, 2015 NCAA Final Four, 2016 NCAA First Round (BIG tourney champs), 2017 NCAA Second Round.

We have two players deciding whether to go to the NBA, they have one.  What exactly are we jealous of?

In reply to by ijohnb

Bubba

April 12th, 2017 at 3:03 PM ^

Read comments in this thread. It smells of insecurity like a RCMB post about Michigan. We beat their ass last year , but I doubt many here truly believe that we have a brighter future. Last year we had a team led by mostly upper class men, they had 4 freshmen and a sophomore walk on. MSU will be top 3 next year and Izzo is recruiting at a level he has never done before.

ijohnb

April 12th, 2017 at 3:22 PM ^

and Wilson didn't hire agents man, I expect them to come back.  My man:

Simpson, Robinson, MAAR, Wilson, Wagner, Matthews, Poole, Livers, Brooks.  Teske, a legit 7 footer developing.  One of three teams still in on Bamba.  Combo guards from coast to coast showing interest. 

I will take our future head to head against Michigan State. 

BigBlue02

April 12th, 2017 at 3:26 PM ^

The trolling part comes where you make excuses as to why we kicked their ass, but somehow those excuses are why it won't happen anymore (i.e. MSU had young guys and Michigan had old guys and MSU's recruiting is awesome). You don't just care about a rival, you are a fan of that rival.

Blue In NC

April 12th, 2017 at 3:31 PM ^

Agree to a point.  Certainly MSU's program is on a more solid footing and is recruiting better than Michigan's.  That said, Beilen is a better developer of talent hands down than Izzo and IMO a better in game coach (although that's debatable).

This past year, Michigan overachieved while MSU significantly underachieved.  Michigans fans just wish we were not usually starting with such a talent/recruiting deficit.  And it would be nice to see some of the development guys stay and not be injured or not go pro at the first possible time.  But it's hard to fault the players for going.  It just seems like many of the 4 and 5 star players that MSU gets end up staying longer than expected (often because they didn't develop as quickly as expected).

Qmatic

April 12th, 2017 at 2:42 PM ^

If Mo and DJ come back we will still beat them again next year. Ward is a homeless man's Swanigan. Langford and Winston will be better than our 1 and 2 but I still don't think they will be where the Sparty faithful think they should be.

I Love Lamp

April 12th, 2017 at 2:47 PM ^

When you're on the floor at the same time your teammate blows his knee out, that would just seal the deal. I'd take that $ and run, but hey, it's his life. To me, and I'm sure many others, he looks like he's beyond the college game. He can work on his deficiencies at the next level. Hope he stays healthy, and we still beat them by 30.

EastCoast Esq.

April 12th, 2017 at 2:59 PM ^

Tom Izzo is widely considered a great coach, but looking at his record.....do the results really back it up?

He hasn't won the Tournament since 2000 and he hasn't won the Big Ten regular season championship since 2012.

With all the talent he has recruited, is he really getting the results one would expect?

doggdetroit

April 12th, 2017 at 4:18 PM ^

Not sure if you're serious but Izzo has a winning percentage of .712 overall (12th among active coaches) and .683 in the B1G (1st among active B1G coaches). In 22 years, his teams have finished in the top 4 of the B1G 16 times. He's won 7 B1G titles (4th all time). He's advanced to at least the Sweet Sixteen 13 times, the Elite Eight 9 times, the Final Four 5 times, and to the NC game twice, winning it once. He's made the tournament 20 straight years. He is #2 among active coaches in terms of tournament wins. Before he arrived Michigan State basketball was a distant second to Michigan, for the vast majority of his tenure they have been far superior. He essentially made MSU into a near elite program.

His best days are probably behind him but he's a hall of famer.