Notre Dame Snowflakes: The Coaching

Submitted by LSAClassOf2000 on

This will be the thread for thoughts and hot takes regarding the overall coaching performance for this game. 

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stephenrjking

September 1st, 2018 at 11:50 PM ^

Harbaugh needs to shoulder responsibility, but a big chunk of that goes to player development. QB is part of that last year, and tackle is, as well.

People are acting like this is the same team as last year; I disagree. The defense got burned a couple of times (nobody talks about that garbage PI call on Hill on the first drive, but that was suuuuch a pushoff; also that second TD was kinda lucky, but those plays happen) but they stiffened quite well the rest of the game. The offense got punched repeatedly, but Shea still drove them down the field for one TD and had a chance to do it again. 

Last year's Michigan team doesn't do anything like that. Not even close. 

Some guy on this board said that he ran into Jay Harbaugh during the offseason and asked about the team. Jay said it was going to be a really good team late in the season, but getting it to be good at ND in the first game would be tough. Well, it was tough, and the problem was the OL. The question is, (and it's kind of a hail mary question at this point) can the tackles, especially the young guys supposedly pushing for jobs, develop during the season? Some believe that the staff wanted Runyan and JBB in for this game because of the challenge of the environment, and then try out the younger guys.

If that's the case (we have no idea) I would expect to see Runyan on the bench next week and either Hudson or Mayfield out there. Because you may as well try them out. Get them some reps, more experience with the calls, and see if they can hack it. Mayfield, allegedly, can pass block fine, and his run blocking is bad. Maybe they need to give it a shot.

But who knows. We've had some bad luck (no RS for Cole, Newsome's medical) but we were ready to land two blue-chip tackles in Hamilton and Wilson and bombed both times. Either one of them on the field today and this is probably a win.

Joined: 03/15/2012

MGoPoints: 20143976

rindyn

September 2nd, 2018 at 12:52 AM ^

Well the statement you made about talking to Jay and saying how this will be a really good team late made me feel a little better.  Quite honestly, I thought we looked how I envisioned this off-season.  What I think surprised ALL of us was how good ND looked.  If we're looking at ND as objectively as possible, they look like a legit top 10, maybe top 6 team.

Their OL looked just as good as last year's when they had 2 top 10 picks.  Wimbush looked like an even more athletic version of JT Barrett, with better accuracy to boot.  Their defense would likely be top 3 in the BIG and they'll most likely finish top 10 nationally.  Plus looking at their schedule, they should be favored in every game AND that's having to play VT, FSU, Stanford and USC.

The fact of the matter is, we got punched in the mouth early, made too many stupid mistakes(Winovich personal foul, Ross PI, botched FG, head up our asses on THIRD AND 18!) and lastly we just haven't learned how to mitigate our horrible tackle play, if it IS possible.

People will gloom and doom bc of the expectations they had of this season but we all need to keep things in perspective.  No one wants to hear it but peoples shitty attitudes aren't going to help at all.  We have 2 what should be gimme games coming up and a soft Nebraska team after that.  Get the interior d-line to where it needs to be, learn how to play with our weaknesses offensively and for the love of god whatever we did in the red zone in 2016, just run those plays!

Joined: 05/28/2016

MGoPoints: 550

brad

September 2nd, 2018 at 12:20 AM ^

This is exactly what happened last year.  Both times the backup came in unplanned (Purdue and Rutgers), the offense instantly simplified and moved well, like they all started breathing oxygen after being poisoned or something.

 

It's Pep.  All the specific flaws acknowledged, it's still Pep.  If this is still happening this year, it's a pattern with only two possible sources: Harbaugh or Pep.  

Joined: 06/30/2008

MGoPoints: 15805

SkyPanther

September 2nd, 2018 at 7:07 AM ^

"Anyone who thinks"

You are that sure of yourself?

The offensive line was better when Jedd Fisch was coaching with Tim Drevno coaching the O line?

If so, then you are saying Tim Drevno was not the problem last year. If Tim Drevno was not the problem last year, then who was?

Joined: 03/17/2018

MGoPoints: 1439

huffstet

September 2nd, 2018 at 8:35 AM ^

You can gameplan to mask the glaring OT issues, which we clearly didn't do. I was excited for the season because All offseason we were hearing quick pass, RPO, more shotgun being implemented. I was thinking that would be great to mask our terrible OTs, however, that didn't happen last night. Shea had no pocket, looked jittery in the pocket as a result, coaches didn't do anything to make life easier for him to make a throw throughout the game.

 

I agree with the OT takeaway, however, the coaching staff is clearly to blame for not coming up with a gameplan to mask what had to be an obvious weakness coming in, nor did they make any meaningful adjustments to stop/slow down the pass rush during the game.

Defensive gameplan was also piss poor. You can say it was piss poor to start the game and they made the adjustments, but I'm not buying that....it was painfully obvious what they needed to do to stop this ND offense coming into the game, yet it somehow took 3 scores for them to make the necessary adjustments.

what a waste of an immensely talented team, the disappointment level is through the roof. 

Joined: 09/08/2008

MGoPoints: 291

HAIL-YEA

September 2nd, 2018 at 1:34 PM ^

This is bullcrap, our defensive ends were killing their tackles but they designed plays where the qb got rid of it quick. Most of the sacks came when the qb held the ball too long, if nobody was open they should have been throwing it away much sooner. This is coaching and scheme, also 2nd and goal from like the 2 and were dropping back and getting sacked at the 10, that is horseshit playcalling.

Joined: 07/15/2009

MGoPoints: 10810

CLord

September 3rd, 2018 at 3:32 AM ^

Gotta disagree.  Tired of people putting the blame on our players.  If anything, John O'Korn deserves an apology because at several times, our #1 QB recruit in the country a couple years ago appeared very O'Kornish. 

The bottom line is Pep (and Harbaugh) expects pro level play out of college level quarterbacks.  His system requires pro progressions and reads that other programs just do not have.  If you watch Ohio State's well oiled machine, the job of the QB is almost always simple - one or two reads and go, period.  This is how you can plug in your third string college kid and win an NC.  Further, our QBs rarely try to fit tight windows.  Take that Wimbush TD heave in the end zone.  Our QBs, for years now, have rarely tried such throws, instead tentatively holding the ball and getting sacked.

In the second half especially, the offensive line gave our QBs plenty of time, and our QBs did a fine job of getting the ball out to their check downs, but how many downfield passes were thrown?  2 or 3 the whole game?  

After this game, where Michigan had the #1 ranked QB from 2 years ago on offense, and the #1 ranked player on D from 2 years ago on defense, and came up with 10 points, I got off the bandwagon.  Harbaugh's and Pep's offense is a dinosaur that has been substantially surpassed by systems deployed by other elite programs.  9 months to renovate after last year's disaster and literally no change at all.  

The offense may tune up and dominate it's way to 9 wins this season but I saw enough yesterday to be thoroughly convinced this offensive system will not get us to a Big Ten championship or playoff victory.

I'd love nothing more than to be 100% wrong, but better reality than pie in the sky bullshit.

Joined: 09/11/2011

MGoPoints: -6341

stephenrjking

September 2nd, 2018 at 1:10 AM ^

It's amazing how people think they know what's going on inside the room.

The Amazon show reaction was astonishing, because people left and right were amazed at Pep.

It's not that he's not a smart guy. It's that people thought he was a mindless buffoon until they actually saw him working and realized that he knows a lot. All coaches know a lot. That might not make them good, but there's not a coach at a D-1, D-2, or D-3 program in the country that couldn't absolutely school any commentator on this thread about football. They know sooo much more than we do.

Harbaugh fields the offense he wants. He always has. He has guys that help him with things like calling plays, because he is at field level and he needs someone just to focus on the gameplan and watching what the players are doing on both sides while he makes game management decisions. But when they put together the gameplan, it's the one Harbaugh wants. He has a say over every package, over every play that will be available to choose from in every situation, every formation. 

It's him. I think it can still work well this year, but it's not Pep, it's Harbaugh. 

Joined: 03/15/2012

MGoPoints: 20143976

SkyPanther

September 2nd, 2018 at 12:11 PM ^

I want Pep Hamilton replaced. And I think Jim McElwain would be a great one for the job.

I don't care what Pep Hamilton looked like in a tv show. What I see on the field does not match what he sounds like when he talks on camera. That's all that matters.

Joined: 03/17/2018

MGoPoints: 1439

Michwolve21

September 1st, 2018 at 11:08 PM ^

All the Don Brown apologists are an embarrassment. There’s no defense that gives up more third and long plays than his over aggressive, undisciplined defense

Joined: 08/14/2016

MGoPoints: 2932

CompleteLunacy

September 2nd, 2018 at 2:15 AM ^

Well gee they sure did a great job of not trying because they gave their opponent the ball with 2 minutes left to tie the game.

I mean do you people hear yourselves? Sure there's a natural tendency to let off the gas when you're up big...but it was an 11 to 14 point game for the entirety of the 2nd half. That's not a lead you want to go ultra-Carr-conservative with for an entire half. 

But yes, Brian Kelly is the evil mastermind who knew that we'd have a fumble to end the game so NO WORRIES OFFENSE! JUST STOP TRYING YOU GUYS! PACK IT IN!

 

Joined: 11/13/2010

MGoPoints: 12910

Mr. Elbel

September 2nd, 2018 at 7:07 AM ^

You, um, know we lead the nation in 3rd down D last year? Just bc they have a qb that's an rb and we lost contain on the first game of the year with a great gameplan to exploit our speed doesn't mean don brown can't get a stop on 3rd and long all of the sudden.

Joined: 03/02/2014

MGoPoints: 21402

CLord

September 3rd, 2018 at 3:38 AM ^

Very true.  Nothing more excruciating than watching this D crush on 1st and 2nd and suddenly turn into jello on third down over and over and over....  Frustration level 10.  

Also, ND stepped off the gas in a big way after half time  Were this game remotely competitive our D doesn't show as it did in the second half when ND milked clock two downs every series.

Joined: 09/11/2011

MGoPoints: -6341

Yabadabablue

September 1st, 2018 at 11:08 PM ^

Idk why people rip on Brian Kelly. We got out coached on offense and defense. We did not look like a team that returned as many starters as we did. Poor discipline and execution. It starts with the coaching. Very disappointing.

Joined: 11/16/2016

MGoPoints: 11266

MayOhioEatTurds

September 1st, 2018 at 11:38 PM ^

Tomorrow the Harbaugh apologists and true believers will be out in full force again, no doubt assisted by a few fake Mod accounts.

The fact remains:  If you can't close on elite tackle prospects, you get what we got tonight.  No offensive scheme or coaching prowess or quarterback can mitigate a consistently collapsing pocket with a 3 or 4 man rush. 

Joined: 06/29/2013

MGoPoints: 5893

newtopos

September 2nd, 2018 at 2:00 AM ^

Penn State, with Moorhead, had an elite offense, despite having poor offensive line play.  It's like some people do not want to admit that our passing coordinator has anything to do with our passing game.  If that is the case, why are we paying him $1MM/year?  For his recruiting prowess?  Is he the grandson of a Michigan legend?

Joined: 09/26/2009

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