tTP/tOSU NCAA obligations
Looking for some guideance from the Board:
Unlike Maurice Clarrett who lied and protected his teammates, then got kicked out, the Terrelle Pryor is going to pre-emptively remove himself. If the Terrelle Pryor has no obligation to cooperate with the NCAA in the investigation, what are the implications of his lack of cooperation for the OSU. Can and will the NCAA increase the punishment if he fails to cooperate or is less than fully forthcoming? If they can't force him to cooperate and cannot penalize tOSU for his lack of cooperation, I would think this strategy would be repeated by anyone under investigation moving forward i.e. 'convince' your improper benefit using player to quit to protect the institution.
Great point...I don't know...I would believe it would hurt tOSU efforts, but removing the problem gives the school an out
I'm worried it gives the NCAA an out, too. If they are looking for a way to be toothless, can't they justify leniency by saying "your worst offenders were drummed out of the program; good job on that; let's look forward"?
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<br>I'm just pessimistic. I fear the NCAA will look for any way they can to let OSU off lightly.
No, because that sets the precedent that schools can do anything they want as long as whoever gets caught leaves (leaving those who didn't get caught behind).
Be interesting to see if he sells out the other players on the team.
snitches get stitches type of thing
With USC and Reggie Bush, it hurt them. Problem was that Bush had to testify in court too, right? Pryor can keep his mouth shut, and likely will never have to speak about this again. That probably helps OSu.
Bush reached an out-of-court settlement with one of the parties who was paying his family which included a clause so the other party couldn't discuss specifics with the NCAA. THe other guy (Lloyd Lake?) told the NCAA everything he could - one of the things that lead the the DB coaches show cause.
WIth OSU, there aren't any jilted external parties - the tattoo guy isn't owed money and the feds won't reduce his sentence for cooperating with the NCAA, the car guy will probably go to all possible lengths to protect tOSU, without lying to the IRS.
What I don't recall is if Bush met with the NCAA and if he did, whether he was found to be cooperating and forthcoming?
I wouldn't be shocked if part of a plea deal includes giving a deposition to the NCAA. That said, it would be a pretty minor part...
As for jilted parties, Pryor could very well consider himself jilted. He's a little off and the virulent reaction of the OSU fan base to him may convince him to turn on the school.
Of course, Pryor may end up with legal troubles himself if he really has 40k+ in unreported income. That could work out to OSU's (further) disadvantage ultimately.
I mean, I am from Canada so I don't know for sure, but you are talking about 40,000 dollars spread over 3 years which is little more than 10,000 per year. Are the IRS really going to go digging for that? In Canada every person has a personal exemption of around 11,000 dollars per year so you don't even pay taxes if you make below that. If our systems are anywhere near the same, I can't see the IRS making much noise over this IMHE.
that 20-40k was over ONE year (or maybe 2 tax years). it's stated rather subltly in the ESPN article, but it's there.
If they think the deterrent effect will be tangible to go hard after them, they will do it. The payoff might not be huge in $, but the IRS is also about trying to prevent others from committing tax fraud.
In addition to the $20-$40,000 for one year, the car loans would have to be reported as income. The IRS might be interested in the activities of car dealerships in Columbus.
if Pryor can keep his mouth shut. So far he hasn't shown an ability to contain himself one wit.
I think it's a double-edged sword. The NCAA won't be able to use him to find other violations, but there will be no leniency on any violations that are found.
There is also the possibility that Pryor opens up his mouth even more now that he is done. Maybe he will feel wronged by the school not protecting him more and give all sorts of good information.
What, I can hope right?
You know his major was "Exploring", right?
you spelled "Exploiting" wrong
From OSU's perspective, I think the only drawback to having Pryor keep his mouth shut from here on out is that if Pryor did have a legitimate explanation for any of the apparent violations, we may never hear it. But since the truth is probably that Kiffen's dealership was giving TP (and probably many other players) the hook-up on sweet rides, Pryor's silence will probably help them stop the bleeding.
Tatgate came to light just before the Sugar Bowl. When the Tat 5 received their 5 game suspension, it should have started immediately and included the Sugar Bowl game as one of the suspensions. The Tat 5 were allowed to participate in the Sugar Bowl when they gave their word that they would return to school and serve their suspensions. By leaving before this season, Pryor is essentially avoiding the punishment that he gave his word that he would accept. I would not think that the NCAA is amused by this, or will want to do any favors for him or Ohio State at this point. Pryor's being removed from the school will not turn out to be the NCAA boon that OSU hopes for it to be.
To be frank, leaving OSU is his punishment. He needed to succeed this year and convince NFL scouts that he is a mature, hardworking, bright QB. He's going to have a much tougher time proving that now. If he had a great season, he could have convinced Al Davis or some other team to take him way too high, so this whole episode may have cost him millions.
I'll guarantee that's what his lawya would say.
True, but if half of these allegations are true, then he would have never been allowed to play again and leaving now simplifies things for him, like his obligations to the NCAA.
I read on twitter than the NCAA met with Pryor and his mom for 4 hours last week. So what they got then is probably all they are going to get. It really irks me that Tressel can "resign" and Pryor "move on to the NFL". They are getting away with infraction-murder and OSU and now both aren't obligated to talk to the NCAA.
May the wrath of the NCAA come on them even harder for trying to cover it up even more.
Unless Tressel wants a lifetime show cause order, he has to talk to the NCAA. Maybe he doesn't care, but it would surprise me if he didn't testify.
If Tressel doesn't come clean now, we will surely know for a fact what we currently suspect: He is an unethical, cheating phoney who parades around acting like a saint, but is really a wolf in sheeps clothing.
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May the wrath of the NCAA come on them even harder for trying to cover it up even more."
Then I started thinking...it sux that the two most guilty parties (Cheaty McSweatervest, or whatever the name was) and TP walk away while all the other players and new recruits pay the penalty.
Don't get me wrong, OSU needs a bitch-slappin', but other than the dozen or so other remaining cheaters, the (presumably) innocent suffer the most. If on the other hand you respond with "screw 'em, they shouldn't have chosen OSU", well I can live with that logic too.
"I mean, everyone kills people, murders people, steals from you, steals from me, whatever."
I'm not sure how much the NCAA care about that "promise." From what I remember, that promise was from the players to Tressel, and was sort of his excuse for playing them. The justification for allowing them to play in the bowl game had something to do with OSU essentially claiming that the players weren't properly informed of the rules, and should therefore not be prevented from participating in the bowl. The promise came later, to Tressel, and didn't have anything to do with the NCAA decision.
Edit: my bad, meant as a reply to Rockydude.
If the truth cannot be obtained, with the high profile nature of this case, I would guess the NCAA will be brutal in the interpretation of the facts they do have. If not, its giving the college football world the green light for all kinds of benefits. SMU will become a power again....
Tattoos or cars goes to a state or federal court, there is a chance that he will have it take the stand to testify, which could be used by the NCAA.
Hopefully, there is a paper trail for some of this (see the comped seats from a player to Jay Talbott, aka the signed memorabilia for cash guy ), that eyewitness evidence will be admissable for the NCAA, that they will interview everyone and that, with all the investigative reporters, the NCAA and TSIO compliance (*ha*) all looking into it, they will be able to corroborate as much of this as possible. I hope the floodgates open up and drown these cheaters.
The NCAA has checks from Talbott to Pryor. Is that "paper trail" enough??
We may all fret that tOSU may get away with murder, but if this was UM we would be freaking out. Buckeye fans have to be freaking out. The likelihood is that the NCAA is going to absolutely hammer them with everything they can muster. All this has to tick off the NCAA royally and they probably already have enough to inflict punishment. Couldn't happen to nicer guys.
I'm on my phone so I can't link it but sports by Brooks is reporting that NCAA has info that Pryor has been getting paid by a memorabilia dealer for signed items. Osu has apparently known about this for a long time as well... Can someone link? It was on sbb's twitter page
and we did not self report the vbolation. We tried to stop it internally and hide it."
Smoking gun. Everyone at OSU can have their larnyx removed at this point. That is all but proof that OSU knew what was gong down and tried to hide it. Why does this not have its own thread?
It's being discussed on the ESPN OTL TP thread but yeah I agree it could absolutely get its own thread. OSU knew, or should have known, about the checks and asked the dealer to stay away from the program. This is different, and much worse, than TP discreetly making money off his autographs.
Dude took a check?? Are you freaking kidding me?? Uh....someone needs to post the double facepalm pic like right now.
Everyone knows you take cash only, duh
Another way to get information would be if there is civil litigtation filed over one or more of the issues that have come to the forefront. As part of the discovery process, you have to answer all questions pertaining to the litigation. Should you give false answers, you have perjured yourself and what was heretofore a civil matter can end up being criminal.
Can someone buy a signed TP item and then file a civil suit against this guy claiming it's a fake? Would be one way to force this guy to go on record about how he sourced this stuff. Of course you'd need to buy something expensive enough that it didn't go strait to small claims court.
Of course this would take a decent amount of time and money and it may be a really bad idea to knowingly bring a lawsuit that has no merits.
$40K in undisclosed income (allegedly) can be pretty serious. If the IRS investigates more could come out. Feds from multiple agencies fact-checking with subpoena powers could shine some much-needed light.