Lehman Brothers Comment Count

Brian

10/30/2010 – Michigan 31, Penn State 41 – 5-3, 1-3 Big Ten

greg-robinson-fail greg-robinson-fail2 greg-robinson-fail3
these were the same pictures used in the very first Greg Robinson post and were named –fail1, –fail2, –fail3.

A few years back my fiancée (then girlfriend) and I had one of those conversations that draw out over two weeks. You have them when the other person's position is so bizarre and unbelievable that unlocking the reasoning behind it is important if you're going to hang around this person for a long time—because it's possible the reasoning goes something like "I'm a stabby person who stabs you in the stab places."

The argument was about the narrative of overarching, capital-P Progress that the world is or is not making. I, the engineer, pointed to various statistics that all point in the right direction. She regarded all of it as different paths to the same thing: misery for all but a few. A Foxconn factory is just a handy place to jump off, and they take even that away from you.

I don't think we ever came to a satisfactory conclusion despite the lingering threat of stabbing, but I don't think we have to anymore. Since that conversation the world's financial system exploded, the economy fell into a deep and lingering malaise that figures to last most of a decade, and Greg Robinson was hired to coordinate Michigan's defense.

-------------------------------------

The worst part has been the illusion. Actually, the worst part has been the actual progress. The worst part has been a combination of the illusion and the progress. The worst part has been a combination of the illusion and the progress and the relentless losing.

The illusion: two straight years Michigan has leapt out to a hot start only to see all the supposedly quality wins evaporate. A thrilling win over Notre Dame devalued as the Irish collapse into a heap of laughable crap. UConn goes from team on the verge of a Big East championship to a team that can't even keep its head above water in a horrible conference. Indiana is still not a surprisingly good, competitive version of Indiana. It's just Indiana. Then there is losing, and not competitively.

The actual progress: Michigan has the #1 yardage offense in the Big Ten by a huge margin. The gap between Michigan and #2 Ohio State is considerably bigger than the gap between Ohio State and #7 Iowa. The prophesied Rodriguez Leap, which did happen last year, happened again this year. Rodriguez is what he was sold as.

That progress looked like enough to get Rodriguez through 2010 into a prove-it 2011 until some walk-on shredded Michigan for 28 first-half points. If Progress means not being Minnesota, Michigan is failing. At some point last night the extremely depressing score was 31-10 and the ticker scrolled to the OSU-Minnesota game, which was also 31-10. The Gophers managed to hold Penn State to a mere 33 points and caused them to punt an astounding six times. Michigan did it twice. A comprehensive description of the ways in which Michigan's defense failed last night is impossible, but here's an attempt: Penn State scored 24 points against Kent State, 22 against Temple, 13 against Illinois, and 44 against Youngstown State… with their starting quarterback.

Youngstown State is a 3-6 I-AA team ranked 94th in total defense. They are the closest comparison to Michigan's D amongst Penn State's opponents to date.

So.

Greg Robinson should be fired. Tomorrow, yesterday, bring in Gary Moeller, bring in anyone, don't care. He should never have been hired, just like Jay Hopson and apparently Scott Shafer. At the time of his hiring he was a decade removed from his last sustained success, fresh off driving a respectable Syracuse program into Washington State territory. As a head coach, he sounded like an idiot. His team played like he was an idiot. Michigan hired him and has gotten exactly what they deserved.

The worst part other than the illusion and the actual progress and the relentless losing is that this was obvious at the time:

Anyway: being a stunningly incompetent head coach does not necessarily mean one is a stunningly incompetent coordinator. Numbers will have to make that case. Go, numbers, go!

Year Team PassEff Rush Scoring Total
2008 Syracuse 101 101 101 101
2007 Syracuse 109 108 104 111
2006 Syracuse 81 110 72 107
2005 Syracuse 37 97 67 57
2004 Texas 31 16 18 23

Er.

tweek-aargh_1440

I'm a little stressed out by that. Robinson walked into a good situation at Texas* and managed not to screw that up, then went to Syracuse, where he had an average defense on a horrid team (1-10), which he then proceeded to crater for the next three years. Before his brief, star-making turn at Texas—again, for doing nothing more than treading water—he presided over one of the worst defenses in the NFL, getting fired after three years. The last actual success you can plausibly attribute to Greg Robinson came during his tenure as the Denver Broncos' DC, when his defenses were top ten in the NFL and a significant aid in Denver's back-to-back championships. Since then it's been abject failure save the one year in Texas.

Now it's even more blitheringly obvious. Syracuse is 6-2 despite Doug Marrone having R-U-N-N-O-F-T huge swathes of Robinson's leftover pack of unmotivated jackaninnies and while Scott Shafer's defense has gotten bombed in a couple games and is severely overrated because of games against two terrible I-AA schools and the worst I-A school (0-9 Akron, 56-10 losers to WMU and everyone else), the last two weeks they've allowed 7 and 14 points in road games against West Virginia and Cincinnati. Neither of those teams is good at offense, but neither is Penn State.

Greg Robinson is a terrible football coach. Hiring him was literally the dumbest thing Rich Rodriguez could have done, and he did it. Hiring Jay Hopson to see him leave two years later was a terrible decision, as was whatever the fiasco was with Shafer. The rot on defense goes deeper than Robinson, though—Michigan has insisted on being "multiple" this year, to what purpose is unknown. Week after week Michigan plays teams that sit in a 4-3 with a two-deep shell and play defense adequately enough for this Michigan team to be headed for a New Year's Day Bowl; Michigan has not maintained the same system year-to-year during the Rodriguez era, largely because the leftover guys on the staff are all 3-3-5 guys and they keep insisting that these DCs who have never run the system become One of Us. Braves and Birds nailed this problem when he compared it to Tommy Tuberville's zombie offensive assistants submarining Tony Franklin and eventually Tuberville himself.

Michigan's addiction to the 3-3-5 is causing them to do the exact same thing Rodriguez rejected as dumb his first year when he installed the spread because that's what he knew how to coach—they're shoehorning a coach into a system when that coach doesn't even know how to properly align his middle linebacker. At left, Michigan's horrible defense. At right, West Virginia's excellent 2007 D:

ezeh-nt-right-1wvu-2007-inside-zone

Kenny Demens finally moved further from the LOS in the second half of the Penn State game. The supposedly attacking, slanting, different-front-making defense has been a passive heap of quivering goo coached by someone who clearly doesn't understand what the system he is running is supposed to accomplish. Robinson's been put in a terrible position, but he has no track record save blithering idiocy and there is no reason to retain him.

As for Rodriguez, well, hell. The are four games left, for one. Michigan is #4 in total yardage nationally and isn't scoring at an insane pace only because the special teams and defense have been beyond terrible. The special teams were not a problem before this year and really the only problem this year has been the kicker*, which is a thing that just happens sometimes in college. If they overhaul the defensive coaching by either bringing in an actual 3-3-5 guy like Jeff Casteel—who may be in need of a job after the season—or toss the Tuberville saboteurs overboard and bring in a Serious Man, I'd be willing to see where the Denard Robinson era ends up.

*(Willing to bet that by year's end Michigan isn't giving up any yards on an average exchange of punts; kickoff returns have been bad but that's an incredibly minor facet of the game—an average team is gaining one more yard per attempt than M.)

Bullets

Change please. How many terrible decisions does Jeremy Gallon have to make before he loses his job at returning things?

Also: gararagagagargh Vincent Smith third and two. Hopkins's fumble was not his fault; Robinson put the ball in his shoulder. (I'm surprised he handed the ball off high—if Smith was in the game Robinson's handoff would have been in Smith's facemask.) Shaw can't be healthy, Cox is not healthy, Toussaint is not healthy… it's actually possible that Angry Michigan Running Back Hating God has been more wroth than Angry Iowa Running Back Hating God this year. The tailback situation is so bad that even Fred Jackson has gone no sugarcoat:

“We have to play better,” Jackson said. “Let’s call a spade a spade. We’ve got to play better. We’ve got plays there to be made and we’re not making them, I’m talking from the running back position.

“We have to play better.”

This is different from Jackson's usual approach of calling a spade a fantastical thousand-story casino in the clouds.

DerpBord. The circumstances behind hiring Greg Robinson are eerily similar to those behind the re-hire of Mike DeBord after his "no mas" faceplant at Central Michigan, down to the seemingly more competent guy being pushed out due to unconfirmed but widely speculated conflict. One dollar Robinson is assistant (to the) linebackers coach in the NFL next year.

The Ron English Effect. The next defensive coordinator (or next head coach, depending) is in line for a mega Ron English Effect, wherein some guy takes over a crew of players returning a ton of starters and looks like a genius for improving them when all he really did is not prevent his players from aging normally. In 2006, Ron English inherited Alan Branch, Lamarr Woodley, David Harris, Prescott Burgess, Shawn Crable, and Leon Hall and looked like a genius. The next year absent all those guys save Crable he was bombed into oblivion during The Horror and Post-Apocalyptic Oregon Game.

Anyway, next year's DC gets every starter back save Mouton, Rogers, and Banks, adds Troy Woolfolk, and should have a healthy Mike Martin. He could pick his teeth and look SMRT.

Martin doom. It's clear by now that Martin's injury is the dreaded high ankle sprain and we probably won't see him play effectively the rest of the season. Hurray.

Elsewhere

Aw, hell, it's just variations of this with either equal or slightly less tolerance for Rodriguez's terrible choices on the defensive side of the ball. I do like the Hoover Street Rag saying the "shields are down." That's about right. Zook is loading his photon torpedoes.

Comments

Yostal

November 1st, 2010 at 1:17 PM ^

was "On the plus side, at least we're not going through redshirts like it's the first time the landing party beams down to a new planet."

Well, maybe Devin Gardner's, but he was just wounded by the vicious alien of the week.

MGoRob

November 1st, 2010 at 1:19 PM ^

My guess about Gallon is that the only other options are starters who are at particular positions of needs and the coaches don't want to risk injurying them in special teams as the PR/KR.

pullin4blue

November 1st, 2010 at 1:21 PM ^

RR has to realize that GERG is nothing but an anchor around his neck. If he sticks with Robinson, both of them are looking for a job in a few months. If he cans Robinson, he at least has a chance of still having a job next season. At what point does Brandon step in and say that someone's head has to roll for this. Can Brandon force RR to change his DC?

I have to imagine Brandon has already been putting out feelers to guys who he thinks could run this program. Michigan has a very expensive stadium and they need to keep butts in the seats. If the club seat holders and suite holders decide that $2,500 and up per ticket is too much, they will bail. Suiteholders have 3-5 year contracts (I feel kinda sorry for them). When this becomes a financial issue, which it soon will, Brandon will be forced to do something.

Shop Smart Sho…

November 1st, 2010 at 1:31 PM ^

I am so tired of this argument.  There is not a coach out there that is going to go into a prevent defense against this offense with the halftime scores of the last few games.  You wouldn't see a prevent unless the opponent was up by 4 TDs at the half.  Prevent works fine against passing teams, but even when Michigan is down, they are going to keep running the ball.

wile_e8

November 1st, 2010 at 1:39 PM ^

The offense isn't a problem.  The only time Michigan has scored more points in Happy Valley was the glorious 1997 game.  They are top-ten in total offense while being led by a true sophomore.  The biggest problem with the offense is that they have the audacity to not score every single drive, which is only a problem because the defense is so bad that they need to offense to score every drive.

They aren't Oregon just yet.  But neither is anyone else but Oregon.  But since Oregon has the only offense in the country that could win with this defense, people want to blame the offense for not being Oregon.  The offense is great if you don't use the defense's failings to raise the standards to a nearly impossible level.

champswest

November 1st, 2010 at 5:52 PM ^

is the offense gets even more opportunities to score (due to more defensive stops and not letting the other team control the ball) and forces the opponet out of their game plan.  We have a top offense without the benefit of defensive help.

Can't we all agree that the offense is fine and once (if ) we get the defense fixed we will be fine.

Greg McMurtry

November 1st, 2010 at 1:25 PM ^

I don't care who the coach is next year. I trust Dave Brandon will make an informed decision. However, if it is someone other than RR, then I would hope that the new coach runs an offense or hires an OC who runs the same or similar spread style O. The hope would be to keep Hart committed and not fall into another rebuilding phase. And of course I would like to see a new DC whoever that may be.

BeantownBlue

November 1st, 2010 at 1:33 PM ^

My first inclination was to disagree with you.  I've always felt that if the RR experiment didn't work, I'd like to see a return to the Brady/Henne/Mallett throwing to Marquise/Braylon/Mario offensive approach.  I miss those long bombs and clearly Harbaugh would be the perfect guy to return them to the pro style. 

But your post got me to thinking...what if we were able to hire Chip Kelly?  Would he never consider it?

 

Greg McMurtry

November 1st, 2010 at 1:47 PM ^

Until recently, however, UM's strength is now with the spread offense. I would like any potential coach to keep those aspects intact, at least partially, because that part of the team is fine. The defense needs an overhaul, but an overhaul in philosophy. I'm going with "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." I really do not want to see a switch back to pro-style offense in the near future.

zlionsfan

November 1st, 2010 at 2:12 PM ^

and the new coach doesn't run the same offense, how would we not end up in the same situation next year? The change in scheme will result in some players transferring, the players who stay will struggle to pick up new concepts, etc. etc. If the defense does improve, it may be hard to see if the offense is not performing at its current level (or better).

I would rather keep RR, if only to keep the offense constant while the defense is being fixed. If the defense blows chunks next year, Denard and/or Tate won't be hanging around for a fourth year, so they might as well blow up both sides of the ball at that point.

chitownblue2

November 1st, 2010 at 1:27 PM ^

I don't disagree with what you say about Robinson, but it seems like it's a way of shielding Rodriguez from blame?

Isn't Rodriguez responsible for the hires of Robinson, Shafer, and Hopson?

Isn't Rodriguez responsible for hiring a DC who either runs the scheme he wants, or to allow the DC to run his own scheme?

Isn't Rodriguez responsible for their inability to retain 6 DB's that could be playing (Warren, Cissoko, Chambers, Turner, Smith. Emilien)?

Isn't Rodriguez responsible for making sure his DC isn't underminded by the WVU hombres?

You point to the genuine offensive improvement and say that "RR has done his job". Well, that would be true if Rodriguez was an offensive coordinator. But he's the head coach - the hiring decision, schematic decision, and collegiality of the defensive staff is his responsibility as well.

And look - if RR is so offensively focused, what is Calvin McGee for? Maybe we can get another defensive coach?

I'm not tossing Rodriguez out yet - there are still ways this year can be redeemed. I think we're looking at what sort of results that "losing to a shitty PSU team QB'd by a walk-on" likely forecast, and seeing those redemptive scenarios as remote possibilties.

M-Wolverine

November 1st, 2010 at 2:16 PM ^

We have to stop judging on preconceived notions of who's good or not, and judge them on their body of work. That body of work isn't completed yet. I mean, I'm not going to say "fire anybody", because if we beat Ohio State to end the season, then what..."nevermind"? But that idea sounds so laughable after last Saturday, it certainly opens it up for discussion.

Brian

November 1st, 2010 at 2:35 PM ^

what about that post comes off as "ringing endorsement"? I basically said it's clear out the entire defensive coaching staff, pick up a guy who's proven he can work with these guys in the past to good effect, and then grudingingly year four.

hypomodern

November 1st, 2010 at 2:37 PM ^

Scapegoating Robinson is fairly low-brow considering everything else that is wrong with the defense, and in any case the fact remains that RR will have dishonorably discharged every outside coach he's brought in at that point. That is on him entirely.

I don't even think our offense is all that impressive. It's lightyears ahead of 2008, but come on, people: sans the Denard Magic and a frantic Forcier comeback, its an offense that has dug itself into a deep hole in the first half of every Big 10 game its been in and it was only able to dig itself out against Indiana. The rushing attack is inexplicable: Vincent Smith up the gut and a lot of single-wing power with Denard. We don't even run our vaunted screen series, nor do we mix it up much in the ZR game. Remember that whole series of runs with our mauling TEs as H-Backs? The wolverine heavy? A veer? Midline option? Where's the ZR-Bubble option? That's all been out the window, as far as I can tell. Heck, we don't even roll Denard out much. Denard is so awesome that we're sitting at #2 in yards but it's an ugly, ugly #2.

This is a desperate team, and I'm confused as heck about what the coaches are doing about it. I hope it gets better, since I love these young men and I loved the schemes on both sides of the ball when I understood what was happening.

msoccer10

November 1st, 2010 at 4:41 PM ^

The defense is a disaster and it is mostly due to the lack of player experience and talent. The fact that Rodriguez hasn't been able to recruit elite defensive players and/or retain some guys is all on him. To the extent that poor coaching is the problem, that can also be laid at Rodriguez's feet.

And I have been frustrated by the lack of scoring by the offense in the last three games because I feel like we could have scored a lot more. But realize that, due to injuries, our starting rb is a 5'6" 3 star coming off an acl tear and our second string is a 3* true freshman moose who should probably be a fullback. Despite that, we have a top ten offense. We scored more points on PSU than Alabama, Iowa or any other PSU opponent other than Illinois, which put up 33.

And I am not sure how you can have an ugly # 2 rushing offense. The only thing negative is that we don't have a running back to complement Robinson and lessen the hits he takes.

jackw8542

November 1st, 2010 at 10:30 PM ^

Do you truly think RR had any say over Warren's decision to leave?  Or Cissoko's decision to go to jail?  (Cissoko was a Lloyd recruit, by the way.)  He didn't cause Emilien's injury and lack of full recovery did he?  Is it his fault Turner was not willing to put in the necessary level of work?  I don't recall much about Smith or Chambers, but I doubt RR would have forced them out the door if he thought they could help.  This team seems to have quality human beings that are all in for each other, for RR and for Michigan.  And, I think that once there is an acceptable level of experience on D, we will be all right there, too.

BeantownBlue

November 1st, 2010 at 1:26 PM ^

Greg Robinson is a terrible football coach. Hiring him was literally the dumbest thing Rich Rodriguez could have done, and he did it.

There you go.  Blame GERG all you want but Rodriguez has to be held accountable for hiring him. 

If we win 3 of the next 4 (unlikely, I know, but vaguely possible), I say give RR another year.  Otherwise, he's gotta go.

 

mejunglechop

November 1st, 2010 at 1:27 PM ^

Either get Casteel or we need to hire a guy who will bring in his own staff. If we don't win 7 games and Rodriguez gets fired, I'd be fine with that too.

Blue2000

November 1st, 2010 at 1:37 PM ^

Hiring Casteel suggests that RR gets a say in the matter.  I don't think he deserves one at this point.  I think Brandon should make the call, and require that the DC be allowed to run his own scheme, with his own staff.  RR has made nothing but poor personnel choices w/r/t to his defensive hires up until this point, and apparently he's undermined those hires by making them run a scheme they aren't comfortable with. 

Given the improvement the offense has shown, I think RR deserves another year, and bringing in someone new would be a terrible setback.  But I think he should be completely hands-off with the defense. 

TTUwolverine

November 1st, 2010 at 3:51 PM ^

The head coach should be allowed to choose who his coordinators are, and at the end of the day, ultimately be responsible for them.  Forcing a coordinator on a head coach undermines his position as head coach, and if you're going to do that, you might as well start from scratch.  This will not make us better.  It will make us the Dallas Cowboys. 

BornInAA

November 1st, 2010 at 1:28 PM ^

that PSU was like, 3rd and 15, and I told my wife that they were going to make it - just watch.

And they did.

And then I realized there is no other defense I have ever watched pro or college that you can be sure that the opposition will convert 3 and 15. 

They can bench the whole secondary, play freshmen next year and hire a new DC and it can't get any worse than this defense.

Stewart52

November 1st, 2010 at 1:31 PM ^

I really think the only DC who can make this defense work is Jeff Casteel. These are all Casteel's assistants from when RR was at West Virginia right? So we are trying to run Jeff Casteel's defense with a different man in charge? That makes no sense, how is someone supposed to run somebody else's defense? The way I see it is there is only three legitimate options for Michigan:

1) Hire Jeff Casteel

2) Hire a new DC and let him bring all his coordinators (aka let him run his own defense)

3) Fire Rodriguez

I love this offense and I really really really wanna see it work, but we need a defensive coordinator who's not running somebody else's scheme. It's clear that regular DC's can't run the 3-3-5. Therefore we either need Casteel or a whole new defensive staff. If Rodriguez isn't willing/can't do that, then I think it's Rodriguez that needs to go.

FrankMurphy

November 1st, 2010 at 1:32 PM ^

You're right, the defensive coaching staff since Rodriguez arrived has been nothing short of dysfunctional. But Rodriguez hired all of those guys. So where does that leave him? If you take a step back and look at the picture as a whole, it seems as if Rodriguez is every bit as clueless on defense as he is a genius on offense. Since Rodriguez left WVU, we've seen how integral Casteel has been to WVU's success. Casteel masked Rodriguez' cluelessness when it comes to 'that other thing that we do when we're not passing, running, or kicking the ball', and exposed it when he made the decision not to join Rodriguez at Michigan.

The success of this endeavor depends on Rodriguez coming to terms with his own weaknesses and hiring a DC who has free reign over the scheme and the authority to hire his own assistants. Rodriguez may be an offensive guru, but he simply does not know how to manage a defense. And that's fine if you hire the right assistants and just let them do their thing, but thus far, he hasn't been that kind of head coach. Rodriguez can shuffle assistants all he wants, but the most important change that needs to be made is the change in his own mindset. 

Glen Masons Hot Wife

November 1st, 2010 at 1:32 PM ^

It's about time someone called out Robinson for what he is... You can make the argument Rodriguez deserves to see another day... I guess.

But if he's made such egregious decisions up to this point, who's to stay he won't repeat such stupidity in the future?  I think the option of a new HC needs to be at least considered.... A lot of it maybe should depend on who would be willing/available at the end of this year.

And another question I have... you mentioned this:

"The special teams were not a problem before this year and really the only problem this year has been the kicker*, which is a thing that just happens sometimes in college."

They seemed to be a major problem in Rodriguez' first year, when our return men couldn't catch punts/KO's to save their lives. It seemed to happen a bit last year also.

Hail-Storm

November 1st, 2010 at 1:33 PM ^

The professor made the point that before you perform any engineering calculation, you should first make an engineering estimate as to what you think the answer should be.  Otherwise you get an engineer stating that, based on his calculations, a carboard box is capable of holding a load of 20,000 lbs, when any other person could guess that the box can only hold 40-50 lbs. Guess who's more correct.

I guess all the stats and data can tell me why or how this is supposed to be, yet I know what a defense sort of looks like, and as a layman of the game, can tell you it wasn't what we saw on Saturday.

I still want RR back next year no matter what.  If you wonder why, please refer to Notre Dame. As to if Gerg gets another year, I guess I am somewhat indifferent.  I do believe he has had a bad hand in injuries and transfers and schemes, but on Saturday, it was RR who came over and got the D fired up, not Gerg.

All I know for sure is that after 2008 I told myself it can't get worse right? and then in 2009 I told myself, it can't get worse right? I now refuse to ask this question, because there is no way I can handle one of the answers.

p.s. to Brian- please have mersy on yourself this week and refrain from the defensive UFR. I equate that to an english teacher grading grammar on mlive. We all know it is bad, and forcing yourself to grade each play will drive you nuts.  And for my sanity, I need you and Mgoblog for the rest of the year, as I'm afraid to venture into the rest of the internets.

myantoniobass …

November 1st, 2010 at 1:34 PM ^

"dream/yearn/pine for Harbaugh for next 4 games" prediction if we lose to PSU?  Was that sarcasm?  Or do you think Harbaugh would apply for DC position?  Joking aside, I am curious to hear you expand more on the Harbaugh comment.  

I commend you on your 3-3-5 shackling analysis.  I said in other comments this D effort compares to @ Purdue 2 years ago when clearly Schafer was a puppet DC.  To remain in 3-3-5 against run heavy/walk-on qb PSU was maddening.  

Don

November 1st, 2010 at 2:45 PM ^

If Jim Harbaugh is ever hired as Michigan's head football coach, I will buy dinner for Brian Cook and his fiancee/gf/whatever she is at the Chop House in Ann Arbor, from appetizers to cigars and brandy. This is not a bet; Brian owes me nothing if it doesn't happen. There is no expiration date; if it happens five years from now, the offer is still valid. The only stipulation is that I get to accompany Brian and his woman. I know three's a crowd, but I can be a decent conversationalist for an hour.

I think the chances of my paying up on this are even less than us beating Illinois next weekend.