Griffin Korican Time? He played last year against MTSU so not the wildest name. [Bryan Fuller]

Fall Football Bits Has Some Shiny New Toys Comment Count

Seth September 15th, 2020 at 3:15 PM

What we want to hear: They think it's gonna happen.

What we're hearing:

b1gfootballishappening

What it means: We should do the football bits.

Quick Note on Paywalled Info

This goes for the recruiting stuff too: Please do not share insider information from the paid sites on our message board or in the threads from these articles. I share bits and a link in the roundups but there's a lot more behind the jump because Sam Webb, Steve Lorenz, EJ Holland and the rest do this for a living and are very good at it. Rivals has a promo code (Blue60) going on right now. That will get you 60 days free, more than enough to get you through fall camp and beyond, as well as the recruiting dope EJ's been getting since all the recruits' parents seem intent on feeding him.

Quarterback

What we want to hear: Speculation that the loser of the QB battle will transfer for 2021 because Michigan has two or three guys who will be among the best in the country, followed by both QBs shutting that down emphatically with a promise that none of them is leaving Michigan for anything short of the NFL. Hard to see much because the cornerbacks are so good.

What we're hearing: Joe Milton's improvement has been obvious($) and he's maintaining his lead as QB1 via everybody according to Sam Webb, who made the QB battle the topic of his morning dish($) this week. That article also says McCaffrey's improved and one of their best dudes. One person said "you'd have to be blind" not to put Milton out in front right now, and contextually that his bad days are better than most of Shea Patterson's good ones. The article also says Joe's being a bit robotic.

Devin Gardner worked with Milton over the summer and Sam interviewed young 98 about it:

Sam Webb:  One of the ways in which you [and Gallon] established that chemistry is you guys worked a lot outside of practice… Did you see Joe doing any of that with his guys from Michigan?

Devin Gardner: “Ronnie Bell came out a bunch of times while we were working as well. And I had that conversation with both those guys. Like, 'man, me and Gallon weren't as talented as you two guys, but we left no stone unturned. We worked every single day. There's never a time where we didn't know where he's gonna be.

Shaw and Lorenz discussed it at length on their podcast this week. Lorenz notes Milton had his workouts with Gardner and Ronnie Bell (and associated people covering such) while McCaffery's always kept a low profile. They also recounted the excitement from the staff after they got Milton; it was up there with Rashan Gary. But don't underrate McCaffrey—it's a battle that the coaches think is going to be neck-and-neck. Tie should go to the guy with a higher ceiling.

As for Cade, one observer said he's played better, maybe even better than McCaffery($). Most however talk about a two-horse race that Milton shot ahead in with his offseason work and talent.

What it means: The #2 question I got during the HTTV book events this summer was about QB1 and if Sam is doing interviews about Milton I'm ready to believe the coaches are ready to have us believe it's Joe.

Milton seems to be at the point now where he knows the offense but not at the point yet where he can go off-script. That is absolutely fine, says this person who was shaped by the Lloyd Carr era. You have to do things in practice to do them on the field, but you also need to get into live situations to get that kind of comfort.

It's also a long way to go. At the earliest the season will start in mid-October, which places us at the beginning of fall camp right now, with no pads.

Projected Depth Chart: Milton 1A, McCaffrey 1B, McNamara

[After THE JUMP: the positions you didn't ask me about]

Running Back

What we want to hear: Chris Evans is BACK-back. Charbonnet is taking his game to the next level. Everyone's freaking out and coming up with comps for Blake Corum. They had to stop using Hassan Haskins against the smaller linebackers or they wouldn't have any. Some of the cornerbacks are getting carries just because they're so talented Michigan wants to get them on the field.

What we're hearing: There was a depth chart floating around recently that went 1) Chris Evans, 2) Blake Corum, 3) Zach Charbonnet but I agree with Balas($) that this is probably a day-by-day motivational thing. The RB depth chart is what it is. Chris Evans is definitely back, not just with the team but in his place with the team. You can infer this from the fact that he was the offensive player made available to the media this week, which WolverinesWire editor/our good friend Isaiah Hole transcribed:

“I don’t know, we haven’t played any games yet, so I honestly don’t know. Everybody’s just repping the offense out and finding their niche. I don’t really know what my role is exactly because we haven’t prepared for a game yet.”

They asked him about Hassan and Zach but Chris was suspended last year so he told them the things we saw about Charbonnet's pass pro and Haskins' workmanship. On the in-house podcast Jansen thought Evans was set to have a huge year. Kept himself engaged and in shape during his long time off and surprisingly stepped right back in.

That's not to say Corum hasn't been extremely impressive, enough so that that everybody is making their comps. Rivals EJ Holland doubled down on Phillip Lindsay($) and thinks Corum will be in the rotation this year. Steve Lorenz, who'd clearly just seen the KC Chiefs versus the the Texas, said on their podcast that Michigan's coaches see a Clyde Edwards-Helaire. This is because everybody's too young to say Jamie Morris.

Sam Webb is hearing the 2019 duo have had injuries($):

Simply put, Charbonnet has been a different back from the one we saw most of last season. He has asserted himself in a big way while Hassan Haskins had some down time working through an ailment, and there’s a clear reason why. “Zach got that offseason surgery and ever since he has come back from it, he has been like a different man,” one well placed source told me. “Zach is a totally different player right now.”

What it means: The program really respects what Chris Evans went through to come back and are doing what they can to make that known, but until there are pads and practices you can't really tell how much rust there is—years off are notoriously difficult to come back from. The lack of Haskins talk makes sense if he's been injured this fall. Other than that everything's as expected: Corum is going to be sweet, Charbonnet is Anthony Thomas 2.0, yada yada.

Projected depth chart: Committee situation. Zach Charbonnet/Hassan Haskins for every-down, Chris Evans/Blake Corum in the rotation.

Wide Receiver

What we want to hear: Fall football means NICO NICO NICO WOOOOOO! More good stuff on the youngsters but a strong idea of the depth chart that shows there are no whiffs. Something about Giles Jackson and Mike Sainristil to prove they're still in everybody's plans, and Cornelius Johnson did something stupid awesome. There's only one cornerback in the country who could possibly keep up with Roman Wilson or AJ Henning, and that's DJ Turner II.

What we're hearing: The freshmen are impressing. EJ Holland is close with this class from covering them as recruits and I'm going to share a bit more of his recent ITF($) than usual 

Fellow freshman AJ Henning is another skill player that could get on the field early. He has been getting work with the twos at the 'H' position behind Giles Jackson. Obviously, both Corum and Henning were highly rated coming out of high school and were expected to make noise right away. Speedster Roman Wilson is also making a big impact in his first year at U-M. Wilson has been running with the twos behind Ronnie Bell as of late and will get on the field almost immediately as well.

Roman Wilson looks like a guy who ran a 4.37 says Shaw on the podcast and Balas in Friday's ITF($). He's got a Ronnie Bell frame, but isn't coming for Ronnie Bell's job quite yet. Unfortunately the 247 article I got this from is redirecting to the defense side but Shaw wrote in his depth chart projections article last week that Bell is really popping.

What it means: Still waiting on Nico's decision re: NFL but an October season seems more likely to be one he sticks around for, and he's stuck around so far, so the needle's pointing to yes. A lack of Johnson/Sainristil/Jackson talk is natural given Henning and Wilson are the new toys. This is a point that Lorenz has been making too: people are naturally going to focus on the freshmen when they arrive because it's the first time you can evaluate them on this level and in this environment, but usually this hype matters for the distant, not immediate future. We'll come back to that in the OL section with Zinter, but Lorenz used Chris Evans in 2016 and Josh Uche in 2017 as examples of guys who were "standing out" in practice, and they indeed ascended to big roles down the line, but didn't displace established starters right away.

Depth chart projection: Nico-Bell-Jackson/Sainristil first team, freshmen and Johnson second team.

Tight End

What we want to hear: Something.

What we're hearing: <crickets>

What it means: Nothing.

Depth chart projection: Eubanks, Schoonmaker, All.

Offensive Line

What we want to hear: The new line is starting to come together. Great players were blocked by great seniors and they're ready to plug and play. Need to work on edge blocking still but that might just be an effect of having to play against Michigan's cornerbacks, who are all Marlin Jackson clones.

What we're hearing: A ton about young players, save some puff stuff on Andrew Stueber, including a long segment about his road back with Jon Jansen on the official pod.

The 247 guys discussed Jalen Mayfield's spot on the aforelinked pod: Ryan Hayes was entrenched at left tackle but they might move him to right if Trente Jones is one of their best five. Andrew Stueber was in a battle with Mayfield and is probably going to win one spot. The guys at Rivals had the same conversation in a free article:

It makes perfect sense for Barnhart to slide into the starting spot at right tackle following Mayfield’s decision to head to the NFL Draft.

Just last week, Stueber revealed who’s been working in with the ones, and said Barnhart was at that spot. In addition, we had heard this offseason that while Mayfield was out with an injury, Barnhart was impressing at the spot. Keep in mind they’re not in pads yet, but we’ve received further word recently that if the season were to start now, he’d be the guy at right tackle. … Other tackles such as redshirt junior Joel Honigford and redshirt freshman Trente Jones will be in the mix, but will likely back up Barnhart whenever the ‘2020 season’ kicks off

The Zak Zinter hype continues though now with properly measured expectations. Holland was in on the Zinter buzz($) with an important caveat (emphasis mine):

It's not often that offensive linemen make impacts as true freshmen, but Zinter doesn't exactly look like a true freshman. I mentioned when I saw him in Boston before he left to Ann Arbor that he looked extremely impressive from a physical standpoint. … I've heard he's getting a lot of action with the twos at right guard.

That tracks with comments from Sam on WTKA that Zinter is pushing but not actually winning a job, at which point I think they would get a four-game redshirt on him. Lorenz said on the podcast it's more like how they felt about Karsen Barnhart last year. It's not an impossibility that Zinter plays this season but treat him like a 6th or 7th OL, the difference being they feel comfortable with Barnhart outside or inside while Zinter's a guard.

That out of the way we're ready to hear some talk on the Barnharts, Carpenters, and upperclassmen who are winning jobs, or, you know, true freshman Reece Atteberry ($):

His effort and maturity are traits that have caught the attention of the coaches, but even more so him having no fear and not getting overwhelmed, which can happen a lot to young guys especially up front.

Atteberry weighed in at 315 and is a real 6'5". He's also, you know, a true freshman. Maybe a better way to do this is track who's been Ed Warinner's totally-not-stolen-from-Don-Brown Dude of the Day. That would be, in order: Griffin KoricanRyan Hayes, Trente Jones, Andrew Vastardis, Joel Honigford, Korican again, Stueber, Atteberry, and a depth chart preview that has Vastardis and Hayes:

What it means: Let's pencil in Vastardis at 1st team center for now and keep an eye on Korican, who was a preferred walk-on more in the Glasgow mold (he chose M over a scholarship at Oregon State). I'm not worried about Barnhart and Trevor Keegan has been mentioned enough in their discussions for roster battles that he's also marked safe. It's not THAT big a thing that Carpenter, another redshirt freshman, would fall behind Vastardis, though it does irk that Spanellis left if that's the case. The name you haven't heard is Chuck Filiaga, and as a redshirt junior who was a rotational player last year you'd think he'd be getting at least some buzz now.

Projected depth chart: First team (left to right): Hayes-BATTLE-Vastardis-Stueber-Barnhart; second team: Jones-BATTLE-Carpenter-Filiaga-Keegan where BATTLE is Korican, Filiaga, Honigford, and the entire second team.

--------------------------------

Defense next time.

Comments

The Deer Hunter

September 15th, 2020 at 3:28 PM ^

I was hoping the Milton news earlier wasn't just hype and that he was practicing like a stud. I will feel bad for Dylan if he does not get the starter job, but Milton's talent is just waiting to be unleashed. Great news on Evans as well. 

schreibee

September 16th, 2020 at 2:03 PM ^

What I liked to hear in the QB battle was the guy who worked the hardest is winning, not the guy with the lowest golf handicap!

Mix in that guy is very likely more durable, leading to a better chance at consistency of reps with the many talented pass catchers M is accumulating, I'm here for it!

I really like DMac's speed in the option game, but 2 major injuries in very limited snaps did not bode well for that wrinkle lasting past the first 2 games...

AZBlue

September 15th, 2020 at 3:33 PM ^

Can wait to hear how great the rest of the defense is since the CBs are all basically Year-3 Charles Woodson (but more athletic!) clones................Yup, totally NOT worried about cornerback....

Great stuff Seth!  Let's get some (safe) football!!

lsjtre

September 15th, 2020 at 3:39 PM ^

We all wondered what it would be like if Harbaugh got a year or two with Gardner, now we may just find out about as well as we possibly can what that would have been like, it's exciting to anticipate, hopefully this season happens even if it's as late as it's gonna be

RockinLoud

September 15th, 2020 at 3:44 PM ^

Damn, guess DCaff is transferring. I guess there's a chance Milton just lights it up and goes pro and DCaff is starter next year (assuming we have a season this year), but I'd say that's highly unlikely. At least CMac is apparently performing well, so depth isn't a complete cluster if there is a transfer. 

Benoit Balls

September 15th, 2020 at 3:45 PM ^

Someone I know who follows things closely from a local perspective told me that Milton is "easily" the best QB Harbaugh has had since coming to Michigan. However, this was also the guy who convinced me when i was young that if I wiped pee on my upper lip it'd help me grow a mustache faster, so take it FWIW.

Cousins, man (realtives, not Kork)

readyourguard

September 15th, 2020 at 4:11 PM ^

Not to disrepekt the insider, but he put out similar stories and tweets how James Hudson had the lead for starting OT.  I respectfully disagreed with him, stating JBB had the lead and would start at Tackle.

Joe's clearly got the arm, but there's a hell of a lot more to QBing than a live arm.  What kind of reading comprehension does he have when faced with a pressured pocket?  It's impossible to know that without live, padded action.

Champeen

September 15th, 2020 at 4:33 PM ^

I swear this fan base does this every year with a player or 6.  If Milton beats out D-Caff for the entire year, then ill pay my dues and buy this board a black n tan.  It's not going to happen.  He is a practice warrior.

If you go by arm strength, he would start for 95% of NCAA football programs.  QB position is way way more to it than that.

goblue2121

September 15th, 2020 at 5:49 PM ^

I'm in the same boat. I would be thrilled to see that Milton has progressed that much, but it's hard to fathom. I have no feel on McCaffrey either. Don't think he's seen enough live action to have any kind of read on his potential as a player. Both have the ideal arm, size and mobility you'd like, but the game speed at that level is a different animal. Look forward to seeing how it plays out.

UofM Die Hard …

September 15th, 2020 at 5:14 PM ^

I think Milton is a Jr, Dylan a Sr yeah?  

My hunch on your question is that JH didnt want to break Milton mentally.  Team was good, not great last year, if you throw a Soph Milton out there  and gets wrecked (like Dylan did), maybe he doesnt look like he does today?  Which seems like he is elevating rather quickly if the rumors are true

 

FOOTBALL TALK... so nice. 

JonnyHintz

September 15th, 2020 at 7:48 PM ^

QBs also come in at varying developmental stages. Some are ready to play young and others need time. The knock on Milton was that he was extremely raw and inconsistent. He needed time. But if he was developed right and given that time, he had all the raw tools to be a stud. 
 

At some point you have to realize not every 18 year old kid has reached his potential and is ready to play right away. Last year he wasn’t. It’s sounding more and more like he’s hit that corner and is now ready. Players often see the biggest developmental jump between their sophomore and junior season. Which is the EXACT transition Milton is making right now. 

JonnyHintz

September 15th, 2020 at 7:44 PM ^

Milton probably wasn’t ready to take over last year. What we’re reading on Milton is that he’s made major improvements since last season. That doesn’t necessarily mean just arm wise. It could also mean he’s worked on his playbook knowledge. He’s more confident. He’s improved his mechanics. He’s improved his awareness.

People do that ya know... get better over time. Guys can be not ready one year and take off the next. Take a look at Joe Burrow’s junior stats compared to his senior stats. Two completely different players. We’re looking at 9+ months since our bowl game at this point in time. Almost a full year since McCaffrey went down against Wisconsin. Maybe, just MAYBE, Milton has gotten better in that time.