CNN: Is Notre Dame 'relevant'? And, is Lou nuts?
So there's this, over on CNN.com -- that Notre Dame is still relevant to college football.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/28/opinion/dont-dismiss-the-fighting-irish/index.html?hpt=hp_abar
There's a quote in there by Lou Holtz: ""For anybody to say that Notre Dame can't win again is the most ridiculous, asinine comment I've ever heard, because they've got more going for them now than they've ever had before in the history of the school."
Open for discussion...? (I guess, not to ridicule Lou specifically, that's been beaten to death. Nor why a "journalist" would use Lou as his sole support for an article. But the substance of the article -- can Notre Dame be relevant again?)
October 28th, 2011 at 4:52 PM ^
And yes.
October 28th, 2011 at 4:52 PM ^
ND is relevant. Of course. They are relevant as being the annual winner for most overrated team. They are relevant as being the most arrogant and delusional fan base. They are relevant because they are usually in the top 5 among most disappointing teams yearly. And they are relevant as being one of the most hated teams in America.
October 28th, 2011 at 4:55 PM ^
Yeah, uh, I don't think that's what the author of the article meant by "relevant." But, points well taken. /tryingtocontainmylaughter
October 28th, 2011 at 6:32 PM ^
Like Nortre Lame better
October 29th, 2011 at 12:10 AM ^
Unlike 'lame', which is an adjective, 'shame' is a noun and actually makes sense in the phrase. 'Our lady' becomes 'our shame'.
October 28th, 2011 at 10:13 PM ^
Its kinda scary that a lot of this post applies to michigan too....
October 28th, 2011 at 4:58 PM ^
ND is always relevent in that they're always talked about whether they win or lose. They are not relevant when talking about top teams in college football however. ND is a gold mine ala Alabama pre-Saban though. As soon as someone pulls that mess together, they'll recruit and play with the best in the country
October 28th, 2011 at 5:20 PM ^
National Championship winning coach and recruit all of the best talent in the country then they'll win more games? Yeah, I guess I can see that.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:18 PM ^
When someone figures out how to make Notre Dame really good (like top 10 good) for a year or two, it'll be easily sustainable because top kids already want to go to Notre Dame. Notre Dame already recruits with the best of them, but when someone settles that program down, gets them to stop turning the ball over all the time, throwing the ball backwards and generally being a gaping black-hole for 5 star quarterbacks then they're going to be awesome.
The lamborghini is sitting in the driveway. It's just waiting for someone to show up in South Bend who knows how to drive
October 28th, 2011 at 7:05 PM ^
I just pointed out that the ND situation you described isn't unique. About 20 or so schools could be in that same boat. Not too long ago Alabama, and Oklahoma were irrelevant programs and Miami, Florida State, and the ACC were the dominant forces in football.
October 28th, 2011 at 4:58 PM ^
On the field: not really.
In checkbooks, ratings etc: absolutely
Lou Holtz: bonkers
October 28th, 2011 at 4:58 PM ^
What does "relevant" mean in this context? I guess, by my definition, Notre Dame will probably always be relevant (and always has been in my lifetime). I mean, they still get good recruits, still fill stadiums, still win more than they lose generally, and will always be a great university. So, sure, they're relevant.
Now, as to being more relevant now than ever, Lou Holtz is a lunatic and I rarely know what he is saying. He would be hard-pressed to argue that they are more relevant football-wise than they were back in the early 1990s, for example. With respect to conference realignment and television revenue, sure they're relevant - they're the prize of realignment right now. But that's only because the other marquee schools aren't going anywhere.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:10 PM ^
It depends how you define "relevance."
Notre Dame, regardless of record will always be relevant. They'll get plenty of attention, plenty of quality recruits, and plenty of fans. They will be an opponent circled on plenty of teams' calendars. It's the same way Michigan was relevant in '09 and '10. Win or lose, people will notice.
Now, as far as being relevant in a purely competitive sense, that's a tough argument. From 1990 thru 2010, Notre Dame has the 24th best win percentage in the country. From 2003 thru 2010, they were 52nd best... one spot below MSU.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:55 PM ^
Exactly. You guys nailed it. People have no merit when they say "ND is not relevant". It's the wrong word to use. A lot of people care about Notre Dame (hate it or love it.) And that in and of itself makes Notre Dame relevant.
October 28th, 2011 at 4:58 PM ^
Why is Holtz such a homer for the school that pushed him out the door, anyway? Is he trying to mend fences so his son eventually gets the job?
October 28th, 2011 at 5:16 PM ^
I think that answers the question "is Lou nuts"?
October 28th, 2011 at 5:27 PM ^
But as long as he keeps saying "There's no reason ND should lose a game this season.", I'll support his being on ESPN. I won't watch him for any longer than it takes me to find the remote, but I'll support his being on ESPN. He's a major factor in the hype machine that is ND.
October 28th, 2011 at 9:38 PM ^
Or he could be saying that every year to benefit himself. By having a constant source of overhyping from the Media, ND is set to fail just about every year. And with every coach that comes in and gets pushed out....well it only makes Lou look that much better.
October 28th, 2011 at 4:59 PM ^
ND still recruits great athletes. With the right coach they will be very good. They are obviously more relevant than most teams.
The questions is really relevant in what way?
To us...uber CFB fans....they are relevant in recruiting, ranking and in the amount of discussion about them. Maybe not as relevant lately on the field.
To the general public they are relevant because they are one of THE big name programs. Most non-uber fans do not pay much attention to programs that have a couple good years because it is fleeting for most of those programs.
So, they are relevant to everybody, just in different ways.
On a side note....why did everyone pass on Kelly?
Notre Dame’s football program is on the verge of a mutiny before Saturday’s game against Navy. Yesterday’s post-practice comments to the media by head coach Brian Kelly have likely divided the team into Kelly’s guys and former head coach Charlie Weis’ guys, unnecessarily. Kelly said:
You can see the players I recruited here, you know who they are. We’ve had one recruiting class here that I’ve had my hand on. The other guys here are coming along, but it’s a process.
It’s one thing to scold your team behind closed doors or on the sidelines. It’s another thing to scold your team in a divisive manner in front of the national media. Instead of being one Irish football team, Notre Dame could fracture into two competing cultures, internally.
Tweets from current Irish upperclassmen were posted last night in apparent reference to Kelly’s comments, and they aren’t encouraging.
Mteo_5: Playin for my bros and that's it!!!! @dflem45 @RobJob293 @Carlo44Cal @KLM_89 @Freekey_Zekey17 @stadium20status @J_Slaughter26 #theoriginals
-Manti Te’o
BraxtonCave52: Disgusted…
-Braxton Cave
KLM_89: @JGolic88 @trobinson78 awful man.. im sure we talking about the same thing
-Kapron Lewis-Moore
October 28th, 2011 at 5:06 PM ^
It has taken him almost no time at all since he joined ND to convince everyone that he is a jackass. I do believe he may have accomplished this more quickly than Dantonio did at State, although I could be wrong about that.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:02 PM ^
I would argue that Kelly is a bigger asshole than Dantonio. Dantonio is definitely an asshole, but he's smart enough not to alienate his players. Kelly treats his players like insolent little children.
The downside is that because Kelly is too arrogant and dense to realize the damage that he's doing to his team, we'll have to deal with Dantonio much longer than we'll have to deal with Kelly.
As an aside: why do all Notre Dame coaches end up being such unlikeable people?
October 28th, 2011 at 5:43 PM ^
" Instead of being one Irish football team, Notre Dame could fracture into two competing cultures, internally."
Hoo dogie I'd sure hate to support a team that has to deal with something like THAT..........I can't even imagine how hard it would be to win in an environment that divided against itself.
We can sure laugh at them.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:19 PM ^
1. It's Bleacher Report -- so, basically, it's not worth the photons your monitor is using to deliver the content to your eyes.
2. IMMEDIATELY SHOW THIS TO JORDAN PAYTON IMMEDIATELY!!!!!
October 28th, 2011 at 5:00 PM ^
They've had a bad recent history, probably because their athletic department just might be more screwed up than our department was revealed to be in the Bacon book.
But like us, I think they can and will rise from the ashes and turn out to be relevant again. We'll do it sooner for a variety of reasons.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:01 PM ^
Lou Holtz has put a curse on Notre Dame that won't be broke until 10 years after he dies or Skip is hired as head coach.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:39 PM ^
Isn't ND cursed cause they fired Lou cause he was getting to close to the all time wins list at their school? Thats how I have always been told by my ND friends as the reason they suck.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:03 PM ^
When major media outlets begin writing stories explaining why your football program is still relevant, that is not a good sign.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:04 PM ^
Agreed they are irrelevant but strange how the ACC, Big 10 and Big 12 would all cut off their own arm/leg/nut to have an irrelevant program join their conference.
October 28th, 2011 at 8:17 PM ^
I'm not sure that is true, now that the Big Ten is at twelve members.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:09 PM ^
The last two years of Michigan football would have been far more dreary without the late beatings of the Irish--not to mention this year's spectacular. But beyond that, the hell with ND.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:10 PM ^
He was the bass player for The Doors before they became famous.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:17 PM ^
He was Ray's left hand???
October 28th, 2011 at 5:23 PM ^
Lou played a bass guitar. He quit because the band wasn't psychedelic enough for him.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:38 PM ^
I heard that there were some recordings circulating with him singing lead when Jim was too drunk. I think they were supposed to be Riderth on the Thtorm, Thtrange Dayth and Touch Me.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:14 PM ^
Lou is crazy. I was watching a game earlier this week, I think it was the Pitt UCONN game and Lou, Mark May and someother guy were commentating. They were asking Lou about the candy he gives out for Halloween and then Lou started talking about Christmas?!?! He is going crazy.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:17 PM ^
People don't write articles like this about irrelevant teams. Because they are not relevant.
Opposing teams blogs don't post threads about them either. I like the ND rivalry and would like to see them back at the top of CFB, right underneath us.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:17 PM ^
We'll see what happens when their tv deal expires... but for now, since they are on tv every weekend they are de facto relevant whether they win or not.
When the contract expires, we'll see what Comcast does -- to me, that will determine more than anything whether or not they are still relevant. And if the contract is not renewed, as I suspect it may not be, then they could be scrambling real fast to find a conference... otherwise they will become irrelevant in a heartbeat.
And, yes, Holtz is nuts.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:31 PM ^
When their tv contract expires and is not renewed, they will be asking to join a conference. Right now they don't need a conference, but just wait.....$$$$$ will force them to come begging.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:37 PM ^
Why wouldn't their contract be renewed? You don't have to be good to be on tv (please see: Jersey Shore). ND has legions of followers, including an astonishing number of non-alumni all over the place. As long as people are watching the games - which they are - that contract will be renewed.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:25 PM ^
Here's another question: why isn't Notre Dame good? We all have a very good idea of why Michigan isn't very good right now: massive attrition, particularly on defense, changing offensive scheme, inferior defensive coaching (until recently), coaching transition. However, you would think that a Brian Kelly offense that involved five-star quarterback Dayne Crist, tailback Cierre Wood, and Michael Floyd would be pretty darned effective.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:26 PM ^
Lou is not crazy (at least not on this issue). He just loves screwing with ND coaches who aren't him. Every year he picks ND to play for the championship. Every year, he talks about how good the team is, how much talent is there. Every year, he raises Irish expectations to levels that even we, the Michigan fan base, think are nuts. His not so subtle point is that he would easliy wake up the echoes and return ND to a NC and that if Coach (insert name hear) doesn't he sucks because he is not Lou.
I actually hope they do eventually hire Skip so I can watch Lou talk about how the team needs rebuilding and Skip will have to be brilliant to win one or two games a year.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:46 PM ^
ND will remain in the national spotlight because of that past that many people seem to revere so much. Are they REALLY relevant, as in, a top-notch program nationally? Probably not, but because of who they are, they look relevant and will always get a standard amount of attention and love, as well as a steady stream of above average recruits and they'll be on schedules everywhere.
Is Lou Holtz crazy? For a long time now. Anyone who can leave the ESPN studios - an otherwise arid place - that moist must be crazy....or brilliant. No, Lou isn't brilliant.
October 28th, 2011 at 5:59 PM ^
Notre Dame still has good talent, but if they can't perform on the field all that talent means nothing. I would love for Brian Kelly to stay at Notre Dame because I believe he is turning into less and less of a good fit there. Lou has always been nuts and I can't wait for the day that ESPN BEGS him to retire. I think Notre Dame has three things that keep them relevant:
1. Lou Holtshzhsh ramming Notre Dame down everyone's throats on a national scale.
2. They keep getting pretty good talent through recruiting.
3. They still have a contract with CNN.
As much as I love beating Notre Dame and continuing to hate them...those three things will keep them relevant. We have beaten them with less talent the past three years and owning our second rival looks better for us when they are relevant.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:02 PM ^
here is this thread discussing ND and relevance.
and this is a michigan blog
i mean.
just sayin?
October 28th, 2011 at 6:12 PM ^
why dont you post something of interest.
just sayin'
October 28th, 2011 at 6:21 PM ^
Simple probability would suggest that they may be relevant some year in the future with respect to the title game.
October 28th, 2011 at 6:48 PM ^
I'm 17 and they haven't been relevant in my lifetime.
October 28th, 2011 at 7:11 PM ^
You were just here then (or very nearly) for the Remy Hamilton FG FTW over ND that year. They were #3 to start the season that year, so you very nearly missed it, yes.
Let's not speak of the game on the next Saturday.
October 29th, 2011 at 12:21 PM ^
Both in your lifetime. Back to back BCS games. Beat #3 Michigan in '05. #2 preseason team in '06 (laughably overrated...) but were a top 10 team for almost the whole season.
Michigan hasn't been in a BCS game since '04 and '06... that's incredibly comparable to Notre Dame. Both games they lost, just like Notre Dame. Would you say Michigan is irrelevant? Of course not.
Relevance = filling stadium, still attracting good recruits, still pulling good TV ratings. The Under the Lights game this year showed just how relevant Michigan and Notre Dame still are... did you see the ratings for that game? Anyone arguing that Notre Dame is "irrelevant" either doesn't understand the word or is a hater. It's that simple.
Competitive? Hell no. Notre Dame absolutely sucks this year and hasn't been in the BCS picture for 5 straight seasons now. Don't confuse that with relevant.