WolvinLA2

December 11th, 2021 at 1:10 PM ^

A. That's certainly not the only career where that's common.

B. Not all coaches move around that much, only the ones intent on moving up. You see coaches all the time who pass on promotions to stay in one place (Fred Jackson).

C. They make a lot of money. Many high paying jobs come with some sort of quality of life drawback.

MichAtl85

December 11th, 2021 at 10:33 AM ^

Dear God. 
 

I was so wrong about Harbaugh. All my takes were bad and incredibly lucky to have him. I can only imagine if we had Frames on a 10 year billion dollar contract. ? 

RedRum

December 11th, 2021 at 10:55 AM ^

I think it might be helpful to delineate “fair weather fandom” versus wanting to make a coaching change. The people that wanted a coaching change probably breathed Michigan football. I wanted to keep him. You can look back at last years MSU game thread and I called out sherif rob for saying Harbs should be fired. That said, I think most of us on here posting, though opinions differ, are really far from fair weather fans. 
that is all from red rum

MGoStrength

December 11th, 2021 at 11:22 AM ^

I think like most things life, time will tell. I loved the JH hire in 2015. By 2020 I was ready to move on. I'm so happy for him and the program that he finally reached this level of beating OSU and winning a B1G title that we've been searching for going on 3 HCs now. But, I'm also not a fool. I'm not gonna assume this one special year is the new norm. Maybe we're "back" and maybe we'll go 8-4 and OSU will kick the shit out of us next year. JH by all measures has fixed several issues. He's still the same guy we get annoyed at. He hasn't changed. It's just that his schtick worked this year. Time will tell if it keeps working or reverts back.

BlueInGreenville

December 11th, 2021 at 12:32 PM ^

Not sure if Harbaugh is the same guy or not but he had the guts to completely change his coaching staff, and apparently get every hire 100% right.  If those new and young coaches leave and the play on the field starts deteriorating, then I'll worry, but right now as a Michigan fan I can't see any reason to be anything but optimistic about next year and the next several years.

AlbanyBlue

December 11th, 2021 at 1:13 PM ^

RE: Still the same guy we get annoyed at. 

I'm going to disagree somewhat. One can debate if the success of his coaching moves is luck or not. One can debate if a lot of this has to do with generational players.

But it's totally clear that the coaches he has in place (new or moved to another position group) have 100% worked out. Every position group is better than a couple years ago. Also, it's clear that his in-game coaching has improved. Whether that's due to Weiss or not, who knows, but there is some semblance of tempo and reasonable two-minute drills are happening. More needs to be done in this area, but there is improvement. Also, the team culture has vastly improved, and I'm sure Jim seeing more energized has something to do with it. 

I agree with you that time will tell, but I was a firm "fire Harbaugh" guy until I saw these improvements. It's clear to me that things are better.

snarling wolverine

December 11th, 2021 at 12:55 PM ^

We've had a faction of posters who were relentlessly negative all the time, spinning every bit of news into a reason to bash Harbaugh, complaining about him during other teams' games ("Harbaugh would never have called that play"), complaining about him during basketball/hockey threads ("Why can't Harbaugh win games like this?") and ridiculing posters who dared to be happy or optimistic ("You think we're winning next week, LMAO").   Whether you choose to think their heart was in the right place or not, they made this board absolutely toxic at times.

However you feel about a Michigan coach, don't let it turn you into the toxic negative guy.

tybert

December 11th, 2021 at 1:15 PM ^

You're not a fair-weather fan if you sat through the 2008 NW game for a 3-7 UM team coached by a guy who's on his 4th job since then and at a Div-1AA school. That was horrific weather (rain, sleet, wind) but I'm sure a lot of us on this board went to that game. QB-ed by two stiffs, with a team that later ratted on him for extra stretching.

I was also wrong about JH at the end of Covid year - but was not in favor of firing him - he just looked so burned out that I hoped he would do something like Joel Klatt (I think) said about JH at the end of last year - that JH should just take a year off and travel the country with his wife and kids in an RV. Then come back refreshed somewhere else.

My take on last year is we got hit by a combination of external issues (breaking in a new QB and OL without spring practice) and internal bad karma in the locker room. The players this year talked a lot about changing the culture. As for the bad karma, perhaps we had a divide on the staff and also between certain coaches and players and also player cliques. The two original QBs may not have liked each other and it didn't help that Dylan first wanted to have the season un-canceled only to opt out and play a crappy season for his dad on a crappy team. 

I believe it was Vincent Gray that made some kind of comments in the summer about the coaching playing more to the players strengths and not sticking with what was not working vs. MSU and Rocky, etc. 

We've all been wrong before - if this message board had existed when I was a junior at UM in 1984 when Bo had his worst ever season (6-6) it would have blown up with calls for Bo to retire since the game had passed him by. But then the 1985 team finished 10-1-1 and #2 with JH having an incredible season. 

My sense going forward is we won't need 10 more years to beat Ohio - JH was coaching tight in the past few years because of the pressure on him to beat OSU and also make the playoffs. The weight of the world has been lifted off him and I expect more great years ahead. We have to make up some of the talent gap on OSU but the portal should help.

GO BLUE!

YoOoBoMoLloRoHo

December 11th, 2021 at 10:50 AM ^

PSU gets to visit A2 next year in early Oct when the UM offense should be flitting on all cylinders with CM, JJ, BC, DE, RB, RW, CJ, and others.

Although Clifford is back for a 6th season, their O will likely struggle again and they won’t have Dotson.

S.G. Rice

December 11th, 2021 at 10:54 AM ^

I have always had the impression that Diaz is a pretty smart guy, a solid recruiter and he had some success (and, in fairness, some failure) as  DC.

I sure like this hire more than Oklahoma hiring Ted Roof, but then again Venables will presumably be keeping a close eye on the defense.

tragictones

December 11th, 2021 at 11:03 AM ^

It wasn't particularly good.  Mixed track record for Diaz.

Diaz's defenses ranking, rank within conference (using yards/play)

2010 (Miss St.)  6th

2011-2013 (Texas)  1st, 7th, 7th

2014- (La Tech) 2nd

2015- (Miss St.) 9th

2016-2018 (Miami) 3rd, 3rd, 2nd

2019-2020 (Miami, as HC) 3rd, 5th

2021- (Miami as HC and DC at same time) 6th

While I am not a huge fan of Diaz, he is a career LB coach.  Since Pry was also coaching linebackers, Diaz does fill both the DC and LB coaching roles, which is a positive.

sammylittle

December 11th, 2021 at 2:18 PM ^

I had some interaction with Manny when he was in Starkville. He is a charismatic guy and was well liked by the players (and the women in town - many crushes were announced). At that time Manny had a gimmick where he would bring a sword to team meetings and use it as a metaphor for team unity (the coaches were the handle, the bench players the length of the blade, and the players on the field the sharp edge or something like that).

He wasn't here long enough either time to be responsible for much player development. He was hired as DC prior to the 2010 season and stayed only one year. That team was pretty stacked with Pernell McPhee and Fletcher Cox on the D-line and Benerdrick McKinney at MLB but the on-field results were middling. Manny had the opportunity to leave for Texas and wore out his welcome there in 3 years.

He came back to Mississippi State in 2015 for one year and had Chris Jones in the center of that D-line. Results, again, did match expectations, especially later in the season. Maybe because his mind was already in Miami.

Overall, he had the reputation of being a good self-promoter and hard worker who created adequate results but always had his eyes on something better.

bronxblue

December 11th, 2021 at 11:05 AM ^

I saw some Miami fans say he builds great defenses for 2010, and watching Miami the past couple of years I have to agree.  His teams are incredibly sloppy and undisciplined, and I don't see Franklin being the type of guy to change that.

PSU has talent so they'll be solid but this feels like a step down.

mfan_in_ohio

December 11th, 2021 at 11:13 AM ^

I’m sure this is a fine hire, but I’d be more impressed if they pulled in an OL coach that could give them a semblance if a run game and/or not get their QB obliterated.

Grog

December 11th, 2021 at 11:18 AM ^

I expect more teams to take a page from Harbaugh and get an up and coming NFL guy

i like what a pro coach brings to the table

i like that PSU went for this low hanging fruit hire

I have a theory about Frames: he’s all about the glamour of the gig. Recruiting is what he likes l. Get the Starz.

The rest? Yawn

LabattsBleu

December 11th, 2021 at 11:33 AM ^

tough to say... Once he was a great DC, but it didn't really carry through to Miami, so I am not sure.

Obviously a lot falls on the DC, whom he hires, but even more, if the defense is doing poorly the head coach would/should step in and make adjustments

it will be interesting to compare the OSU and PSU DC hires

LSAClassOf2000

December 11th, 2021 at 11:38 AM ^

A decent hire for them.

Hopefully, Penn State at least let him know that this was their decision. Even with that small gesture, he would have been treated better than at the end in Miami. 

swalburn

December 11th, 2021 at 11:55 AM ^

It seems like a pretty good hire for PSU.  I wonder when their fans become restless.  I think they are 1-9 vs OSU in their last 10.  Franklin has a losing record against Harbaugh.  They have lost a lot of games the last two seasons and Franklin is sort of living off that 2016 season.  They are recruiting pretty well but seems like they should win more.

Edit - They did win 11 games 3 times in 4 years from 2016-2019 so they are better than I remember.  

tybert

December 11th, 2021 at 12:55 PM ^

Because of the mad dash to lock up coaches like Tucker, PSU's AD couldn't wait and try to pull what Warde did for JH at the end of the season with a smaller deal and lower buyout. Franklin was going somewhere else if they had waited on a deal (also, the talks about the deal started before the Iowa loss when Franklin had a lot of bargaining power - and PSU couldn't easily shelve the talks when the losses started happening).