December 10th, 2018 at 9:30 AM ^
One game does not change that.
I have to be honest, one game did change that for me.
It unveiled some "existential" issues that have defined us to this point.
Does Don Brown's defense really work against elite QBs that you would see in the CFP? Did it look as good as it did only because it feasted on some really poor Big Ten offenses? What elite, healthy QB behind a good OL has it ever actually beaten?
Does Harbaugh's "body blow" offense really work when the other team refuses to cooperate and is scoring TDs while you are coming away with empty possessions in the hope of a big 4th quarter?
That game caused me to have some questions that I didn't have before.
My prior thoughts were that we just needed to tweak a few things here and there.
That if you couple Don Brown's defense with just an average B+ offense, you will make the CFP and win games. I made the statement several times: "If your offense gives Don Brown 20 points, he will give you a win."
Now I'm not so sure.
December 10th, 2018 at 1:16 PM ^
A few caveats:
1) Ohio DID play their best game of the year
2) I think they did because Urban gave his win one for me because I am retiring speech.
3) They also did because they saved up a lot more for us than they have most years.
4) I truly believe Don Brown will evolve from this, like he did from the PSU shellacking two years ago. I think Harbaugh may actually evolve from this. Maybe you can't just rely on a running game, time of possession, and a great defense. Maybe sometimes you just need to outscore your opponent.
Time will tell, but things will look better before we play Ohio again.
December 10th, 2018 at 4:52 PM ^
1. It's not clear OSU played their best game. Michigan may very well have scored 63 points and won the game if they had made any effort to exploit OSU's glaring weaknesses. Literally the only thing OSU's linebackers are capable of doing well is running straight forward into a gap right in front of them and tackling a running back. No other team on OSU's schedule made running the ball straight ahead part of their game plan. Michigan was the only team to do that. They stubbornly kept give up down after down after down that could have been 70+ yard TDs or 15 yard chunk plays in order to "wear down" the OSU defense for the 4th quarter.
So, while it's undeniable that OSU's defense *looked* better in The Game than it did in any other game, I do not believe there is any evidence that they actually *played* any better. I think it was 100% due to Michigan's game plan.
2. Urban did not tell the team he was retiring. It would have been simply impossible for over 100 18-22 year old kids to (1) not say anything about it for days afterward, and (2) so convincingly express shock and surprise when informed of it days later. This simply did not happen.
3. This is a very strange claim. What, exactly, did Ohio State save all year? They were succeeding on the exact same plays they had used all year. The only wrinke that I am aware of is that they used the route where the wide receiver starts running what looks like a crossing route, but stops early and heads back the way he came. It wasn't a new play, but it hadn't been called a lot until the Michigan game. That's it. Part of what made Michigan's defensive performance so puzzlinng was that OSU was just being OSU, so Michigan should have been prepared for everything they saw. You are the first person I can remember claiming that OSU unveiled stuff they had been saving, so I'm curious what you had in mind?
4. In what way did Don Brown evolve from the Penn State game? Coming into this year, Don Brown's defenses at UM had averaged giving up 35 points per game to teams that finished the year with top 5 offenses. After the OSU game, that's now worse. Penn State had an injured QB who isn't that great at throwing the ball this year; I don't know why anyone would have expected anything other than Michigan's defense holding them down-- I see no reason to attribute this year's game as being due to any change or improvement.
Until I see Michigan hold a great offense to a score in the low twenties, I will assume that Brown's defenses will continue to dominate against average offenses, and give up lots of points to great offenses. This is not necessarily even a fault; it may be that in today's game, holding a great offense to 35 points is all you can hope for, and you just need to make sure your own offense is great so you can win a shoot out.
December 9th, 2018 at 9:40 PM ^
There is only one way this is going to change - Ryan Day turning into a big flop. Here is the good news: the chances are he will not be as good as Urban Meyer.
December 9th, 2018 at 9:45 PM ^
Cool, fuck Ohio State.
December 9th, 2018 at 9:57 PM ^
Anybody else want to join me in making a kickstarter campaign? I figure if we can get enough people to contribute we can start paying players to come here. If UM won't facilitate a bagman we sure as hell can.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:06 PM ^
With Dax Hill flipping his commitment to Bama, I will not be surprised one iota at all if Zach Harrison leans back to O$U.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:07 PM ^
58-50-6
M Lifetime vs osu
as don brown says,
hopefully i won't be around this much longer.
December 9th, 2018 at 11:39 PM ^
Zeke, I admit that I take way too much solace in this stat as well. I love having more wins, higher winning percentage, more B1G championship, more national championships, and a better head to head record. While I hate the last 18 years, I always look back at the last 100+ with a smile. If we lose 9 more in a row... well at least there’s basketball, academics, and integrity.
December 10th, 2018 at 10:57 AM ^
You can actually smile at the first 30. Over the last 71 games, it's OSU 39-29-3 (Stassen).
Even when we had their number during the 90's, we were spoiling their national championship aspirations, stumbling in with nothing to lose (except 1997), usually having already lost 2-3 games.
As for academics and integrity, the message board guys love that shit and no one else cares.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:09 PM ^
UM's cred took a huge blow on that November afternoon. It set the program back. Drop the bowl game and they are barely ahead of the 8-5 outcome last season. Opposing coaches are licking their chops to negative recruit UM and it works. JH and Co. have a lot of work to do. Good luck.
December 10th, 2018 at 9:07 AM ^
Barely ahead? 10-3 is notably better than 8-5.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:12 PM ^
We might have lost by a lot, but we out hit them?!?!?
December 9th, 2018 at 10:12 PM ^
Hammer in another one.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:15 PM ^
Was never going anywhere but OSU. Another Sam Webb hoodwink special.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:31 PM ^
Serious question: when can we ban this guy from starting threads?
December 9th, 2018 at 10:49 PM ^
at least he has been hiding on the basketball threads for most of the past two years
December 10th, 2018 at 7:15 AM ^
I'm wondering how he's doing it with 0 points.
Probably increases site traffic, though ... :)
December 9th, 2018 at 10:42 PM ^
This time of the year is Christmas to Maizen/Diagonal Blue.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:50 PM ^
When M loses key recruits like this, you know what pisses me off all over again?
A few years ago our new head coach decides to hustle and outwork every other program out there and conduct a bunch of summer camps ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, giving kids who couldn’t otherwise afford to travel to far away camps to get invaluable exposure. It was an unqualified POSITIVE for the kids.
And then Mark Fucking Emmert caves in to the SEC and ACC and bans the camps FOR NO GOOD REASON.
Just so the handful of power programs can continue to monopolize the sport.
Yeah I’m still fucking salty about it.
December 9th, 2018 at 11:16 PM ^
Totally agree. Again, protecting SEC interests.
December 10th, 2018 at 12:59 AM ^
This ^^^ 100%
I think the change we saw in Harbaugh’s demeanor is a direct result of having powerful forces come after him and despite being in the right — whether it be satellite camps, or biased officiating — he lost.
Harbaugh strikes me as a guy who believes deeply that righteousness will always prevail. He burst onto the scene in the Pac12 and with lowly Stanford defeated the evil empire of USC. He knew how much they cheated, but he did it right, and won. The NFL is a far more level playing field, and he took the lowly 49’s and did well too. He then came back to Michigan more energized and creative, only to be smacked down and the NCAA for no reason other than SEC bullshit, and cheated the B10 who was protecting their CFP interests.
That has to take a toll on a guy, I feel he’s become jaded, and it shows in his demeanor.
December 10th, 2018 at 10:56 AM ^
" Harbaugh strikes me as a guy who believes deeply that righteousness will always prevail "
So he is completely and utterly delusional, and ignorant of all human history?
Doesn't seem like an especially useful set of qualities for a football coach.
December 9th, 2018 at 10:57 PM ^
You mean after OSU fans trashed him for being a project?
December 9th, 2018 at 11:12 PM ^
To be honest, Harrison's game film doesn't match up to his lofty ratings. Hutchinson, Paye and Uche look like equal or better college football prospects for the next 3 years. Harrison is very slight and totally blockable by a typical college OL. Looks more like he should be a basketball recruit - too lanky to be a SDE and too tall to be a WDE (no rush leverage). Not sure where he fits on the DL compared to what we already have.
December 9th, 2018 at 11:18 PM ^
I respect this take, but anticipate people will call you out for pre-emptively rationalizing losing him. Zach is an awesome athlete oozing with potential, but he does have a ways to go. I do hope badly to land him!
I got flack for saying I thought Harrison Bailey did not appear that dynamic and had a slow release on his film before his commitment went down - and was falsely accused of the same. So, I am proactively giving you the benefit of the doubt before you get torn down by obvious trolls like Ger S, B1G or bust, etc.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:02 AM ^
Lighten up man. You don't know what you're doing.
December 10th, 2018 at 9:09 AM ^
Lots of people have this take about Harrison, including me. He's a great athlete who is just a good football player right now.
December 10th, 2018 at 7:07 AM ^
Stop.
December 9th, 2018 at 11:19 PM ^
Good ole Chris carter say this?
December 9th, 2018 at 11:44 PM ^
Of course he will. He had reservations about Meyer.
Meyer is no longer there, hence Zach will be.
December 10th, 2018 at 1:28 AM ^
I mean the kid was wearing a block O hat at his official visit to the big house. Let’s not act all surprised when this happens.
December 10th, 2018 at 9:09 AM ^
Is this true? Was he really wearing an OSU hat during his official to Michigan? If true, that is some serious bullshit.
I fear he might be that certain type of OSU recruit (like Terrelle Pryor) who is secretly a Buckeye the whole time but just wants to lead Michigan on, so that there can be another well advertised loss for the Wolverines on signing day.
December 10th, 2018 at 1:23 PM ^
Bullshit!
December 10th, 2018 at 2:29 AM ^
CNN would have a BREAKING NEWS scroll on screen for this kinda solid stuff.
December 10th, 2018 at 7:27 AM ^
Yes, as someone stated above "TOOO MANY RIVALS" OSU has one ,MSU has one , and we know who that is . Get rid of ND on our schedule
.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:25 AM ^
So pathetic
December 10th, 2018 at 7:54 AM ^
This is not shocking and won’t be when it happens either. Michigan’s D got there arses handed to them in the game this year. You have to start winning that game if you want this to change
December 10th, 2018 at 8:05 AM ^
I agree with you. I think you're right.
But there's commenters on here that could mob you for saying that.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:17 AM ^
Win the game and everything else falls into place, lose badly, embarrassingly on national TV and well, lose all your recruits and go to the Peach bowl.
December 10th, 2018 at 7:59 AM ^
Harrison committing to OSU should not be a surprise to anybody.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:15 AM ^
Gotta win The Game.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:30 AM ^
There is little doubt at this point he is going to Ohio State. This is what Michigan does -- finish out recruiting classes in a lackluster fashion after a lackluster finish to the season. We will complete the class with a couple of "underrated" three stars that end up 0-4 against Ohio State.
WASH, RINSE, REPEAT.
December 10th, 2018 at 8:41 AM ^
How you gonna hold those corners with this kind of attitude?
December 11th, 2018 at 12:12 AM ^
such an under-rated comment.
December 10th, 2018 at 9:09 AM ^
We still get Harrison as the kid has stated several times that he wants to leave home and get away on his own. Not your typical Ohio HS recruit as he moved to Ohio before high school. I believe he's originally from Chicago. Greene is full of crap. I will say this though, the Don Brown reputation sure took a big time hit in Columbus. Just need to get 2019 rolling and forget that nightmare
December 10th, 2018 at 9:11 AM ^
I hope you are right.
December 10th, 2018 at 10:01 AM ^
I really believe we're putting too much emphasis on Harrison. I think most of it has to do with it being a head to head battle with OSU. I read their boards quite a bit and most of them gave up on getting Harrison and have moved on to others. I'd love to see a class average player rating of 90 + (247 Composite). Give me a class full of solid 4 stars and OSU can have Harrison. Heck, the kid is not a sure fire "can't miss" prospect as he has ton of development to do when he hits a college campus. He had so-so outings in many of the camps this summer. But he is an athletic freak. Just give me a top 8 to 10 class in the 247 Composite and I'll be happy.
With that said, I still think we're the favorites for the kid. Go get him JH
December 10th, 2018 at 9:33 AM ^
What next, is Urban Meyer going to march into Michigan Stadium and take a giant shit on the block M?
December 10th, 2018 at 10:03 AM ^
Nothing would surprise me after the Hill decommit...
Harrison is a recruit, OSU has a good a shot as Michigan does... same with PSU.
the performance in the Game has an effect on kids; this would not be a thread if Michigan won and was going to the playoffs.