The only thing that stopped our offense in 2010 was the lack of an offense capable of scoring when in the red zone. We couldn't make field goals and we couldn't operate within a shortened field. Rich Rod was not a spread "throw it around" guy. He liked to run the ball from spread formations. It just never worked for us. We were better off never getting inside the 20 yard line. It was by no means on Denard's arm that we were unsuccessful. Turnovers never helped us that year either, or a defense that was about the worst in Michigan history.
Michigan coaches in their 3rd year: from Eleven Warriors
Defend =/= prepare
Yes, the playbook may be less dynamic...but trying to defend it on gameday is another story...especially once we have the personnel.
I'm not sure it makes that much sense. With a more reliable passer who looks like he can drop back, see over defenders/scramble and make throws, a better running attack and a QB who is a threat to run it would seem to be much more for a defense to consider.
It was sarcasm. I didn't think the /s was necessary.
"That means a lot more Hoke guys and far fewer RichRod ones stolen from Bowling Green or Purdue."
But...it got me thinking. Do you know the history of old OSU coaches, other than Woody? Do you care?
They are obsessed down there, aren't they?
Woody- 1951-1978.Fired for punching player and not apologizing. Reading "BO" I gathered he would of keep his job but said he "didn't do it "(possible diabetes according to Bo)
Bruce- 1979-1987. Fired for not being Woody.
Cooper- 1988-200. Fired for losing to Michigan.
Tressel- 2001-2010. Fired for getting caught (still got full retirement).
Looking at the site they don’t have a long history of coaching legacy. Only a handful of coaches lasted over five years. J. Ryder(1892-1898/5yrs) J. Wilce (1913-1928/16yrs), s. Willaman (1929-1933/5yrs) F. Schmidt(1934-1940/7yrs) other than that...?
Jeez, they seem to spend a lot more time writing about us than we spend writing about them.
Sounds to me like 11 Warriors is quietly becoming a quality "MgoBlog" rival in many ways. Despite our mocking of their fan base the posters there (by Ohio standards) are fairly intellegent and usally reasoned in their thinking. Recently they scored the Brandon interview and now this excellent analysis.
Could this be the start of the second "10 Year War"? Only this time we're fighting it on the Blogosphere.......
Yes, and it will rage until one of the 11W bloggers punches a Clemson blogger. It will be an ending fit for a Shakespeare piece.
Read the comment section, it's awful. The post may be well thought out but the responses are far from it.
On 11 warriors, this is the case 100% of the time. They have a handful of decent commenters but the majority of them would fit right in on RCMB.
Not like our commenters here, who are awesome.
Typical MGoBlog comment:
"Keep in mind that over half of those yards were on a play where he got lit up by 2 guys 8 yards downfield and the equalization of their force enabled him to stay up. While it otherwise was a nice half, we werent exactly steamrolling them on a consistent basis. "
Relatively typical 11 Warriors comment:
"Thanks Ramzy for making my computer screen throw up!"
Also this one just for fun:
"The arrogance/self-righteousness on the MGoBlog thread is unbearable..."
We are not arrogant. We are just all around better human beings than they are.
The comment before that has an 11W staff member (!?) posting a blockquoted comment from here with "LOLOLOLOL Delusional scUM fan is delusional." added as analysis. Can anyone remember Ace, Heiko, Seth, or any of their predecessors writing like that? That's mildly embarrassing for a professional writing on the site he apparently gets paid to write for.
I'd still add that most of the actual writers for the site are good/very good, and I've read a few of their diary equivalents and came away impressed.
I agree it is hard to generalize because most of the stuff is decent, but that reminds me of when one of their writers basically called Kalis and Strobel fags, or something to that effect in a front page recruiting update. Tim called them out on Twitter for it.
So the answer is no, I cannot see a single staff member of MGoBlog writing like that.
For anyone who didn't look, Ramzy did post an actual reply to YoBoMoLloRoHo's post on this thread, and did it on MGoBlog in a way I'd hope to see MGoBlog staff reply on another site, if they do at all.
I comment here 100x more than I comment there.
This is very interesting. May I ask why, Jon? Just curious.
I did say "by Ohio standards".
And I'm sure they had a good laugh at our expense if they happened to read much of what was written during and immediately after last Tuesday's debacle.
You can hate me for it, but I did kind of laugh at this:
Hoke back for thirds.
That statement has likely been used before.
I accidently upvoted you, meant to downvote. Seriously, a Hoke fat joke? Super creative!
I'm ready for the second Ten Year War.
Me too, especially if it begins this coming season and we go 10-0.
11W had to insert this barb, although unfounded, in an attempt to avoid the clear differentiation with Urban.
Hoke has steadily rebuilt our foundation while Urban torched a group of non-performers over the last 15 months to open spots. He has always driven for short-term results over program solidification.
Hoke has steadily rebuilt our foundation while Urban torched a group of non-performers over the last 15 months to open spots.
Can you explain, give names and/or quantify the non performers over the last 15 months that Urban has torched as to open spots on OSU roster? Just curious...
"Roster management" wasn't intended to be a barb. New coach/philosophy accelerates normal attrition. Torched is too strong of a word.
It's so funny that you only have 3 points on here. I mean I doubt you comment often and thus it makes sense. Just makes me chuckle to have more points than you.
Clarke, Gambrell, Klein, Williams and Crowell were pushed out.
Undoubtedly they had imperfect behavioral records, but expendable compared to starters like Mewhart and Stoneburner. The pattern of rehabbing starters and booting subs was in effect at UF.
I have zero issue with dismissing kids for serious issues or not renewing kids for a 5th year, and Hoke might give too many chances, but OSU seems to dismiss only non-starters.
I wouldn't exactly say that they all had imperfect behavioral records because that wasn't the case with Conner Crowell. Also, I wouldn't use the term "non performeres" to described the listed student-athletes performances. Do you mean to say players on the depth chart? Maybe one, Tyrone Williams, could fit in that catergory but not all. Lastly, if you don't have an issue for dismissing kids for serious issues then this list of names should probably be shrunk down to a few names because they have problems not because they are "non performeres" getting torched/pushed.
- DerJuan Gambrell- Dismissed after misdermeanor charges of assult, menacing and unlawful restraint after campus police responded to an incident at an on-campus dormitory and violation of team rules as a freshman.
- Dominic Clarke- Dismissed after drinking and driving only to be followed up by shooting a BB gun at students from Neil Ave tower. (You mess with the students you deserved to be kicked off the team)
- Klein- Once released, was allowed back on the team. Buried in the depth chart at LB then injured himself following the Purdue game. As far as I know he's still on the team but if Meyer torched/pushed him off the team this would be new to me. Personally I don't think he should be allowed on the team but my judgement and Meyer don't coincide...
- Tyrone Williams- Played at WR, got two helmet stickers then pushed off the team due to violation of team rules. Not sure what rules were broken but I think you could make an argument for Meyer pushing him off the team.
- Conner Crowell- Injured himself coming into Ohio State. "Crowell was in Columbus for two seasons and following an injury in high school, he never really had a chance to show the type of player he was." So should the school keep an open spot for someone who may never get a chance to play because he wasn't cleared by the trainers? Or would you rather they keep an open spot that could go to someone else? In all fairness, use the open spot for another player but honor the scholarship for the injured student athlete.
Not looking for an arguement, just wanted understanding.
Edit: Klein graduates this summer...
Do you have any examples of starters who deserve to have been dismissed? Mewhort and Stoneburner peed in an alley and then ran when the cops turned a flashlight on them.
Stupid? Yes. Worthy of dismissal from the team? Well I would say a DUI would be about 100 times worse and I do believe Fitz remained on the team following his punishment.
The pair were suspended from team activities over the summer, were fined (their scholarships for their summer classes were pulled) and I'm sure ran until the never wanted to see another alley in their lives.
I know that supposedly it's always only about the money, but that's the only reason Montgomery would make a lateral move.
It was a great read until you find yourself trailing into the comments... or more appropriately, the common denominator of human intelligence. I felt dirty giving the site another hit, and subsequently their advertisers another reason to sponsor that filthy dirty site.
I reiterate that it was a well written article, grammatically sound in the modern American english lexicon, and foreshadowing better days ahead for this prized rivalry.
You're kind of displaying the the same LCD trait when you call it "that filthy dirty site". They do a decent job, and a lot of our comments aren't really worthy of the Pulitzer. The goal of this site is not to enlighten, neither is theirs.
Cats / Kate Upton / Jersey sales in Ohio / Freep / Lloyd Brady / etc.
How DARE you bad-mouth Lloyd Brady! Is nothing sacred anymore?
Here is the combined record of Michigan coaches who stayed 3 or more years prior to Hoke - one table goes back to Ferbert, and the other merely back to Kipke:
|TREND SINCE FERBERT|
|TREND SINCE KIPKE|
The cumulative shift from the second to third year is definitely upward, and particularly in more recent times, it has meant about +1 in the win column on average (with as high as +3 in individual cases). Interestingly, there is a slight dip in the 4th year and some resurgence in the fifth, for those who could be included in that, or at least that's the typical trend, it seems.
The cumulative shift from the second to third year is definitely upward, and particularly in more recent times, it has meant about +1 in the win column on average (with as high as +3 in individual cases).
I count +4 in one case:
1996: 8 wins
1997: 12 wins
That's the one I meant and I muffed the math, as I realized when I did specific differentials just now. My fail.
Interestingly, going back to Kipke, that is the biggest improvement. Schembechler and Rodriguez both were +2, and Crisler and Elliott were +1 from the second to third year.
Good 'ol Dutch Ferbert doesn't get enough credit IMO. He should have at least something named after him at Michigan. He won the first ever conference championship here and had a great record.
Both 11W and the Ozone have some good pieces covering Ohio football and basketball. I couldn't say definitively, but generally, the head writers / proprietors of many of the major college sports blogs are reasonable, although they're fully fans of their home school. If you think about it, the same is generally the case for Brian, Matt Hinton, Dylan over at umhoops, TomVH, etc., along with Ramzy at 11W & Gerdeman at the Ozone. I used to link to Gerdeman's posts about Michigan every week during the season.
There is one comment in the 11W piece by "M Man" which could have a huge impact next year: Michigan has an extremely favorable schedule:
Date Opponent [home games in CAPS]
Aug. 31 CENTRAL MICHIGAN
Sept. 7 NOTRE DAME
Sept. 14 AKRON
Sept. 21 at Connecticut
Sept. 28 Bye Week
Oct. 5 MINNESOTA* (HC)
Oct. 12 at Penn State*
Oct. 19 INDIANA*
Oct. 26 Bye Week
Nov. 2 at Michigan State*
Nov. 9 NEBRASKA*
Nov. 16 at Northwestern*
Nov. 23 at Iowa*
Nov. 30 OHIO STATE*
As I look at this, and consider how ND should be worse than last year, MSU should be worse than last year, and Nebraska and Ohio are at home, I wonder if Michigan can win all of their games all the way through Iowa. This would give Michigan the entire season to improve, including:
- Gardner getting things down, especially timing with the WR corp.
- Green the time to develop at RB
- OL & DL time to develop
- LB time to solidify
- the Secondary time to develop,
I actually could see Hoke having the luxury of holding certain plays back for Ohio, and really doing a certain amount of game planning for Ohio. I just don't know how good Ohio will really be next year.
I really am looking forward to the season next year.
"I actually could see Hoke having the luxury of holding certain plays back for Ohio"
Nope. You will see the full power of our offense unleashed during the 38-7 victory over Iowa the week before. And, now convinced that all the gadgets, trick plays and formation wrinkiles practiced relentlessly all year DO work, Borges will promptly put them back away for another year; content he has screwed up yet another Michigan practice week for Ohio.
You had to remind me. Although, I'm not sure how much of a difference it would have made.
Is there actual weight for Hoke leaving for the NFL or is that just bullshit Meyer is throwing around at recruits ?
Disclaimer: I love Hoke and how much he knows and respects our traditions and lifted us from the ashes. However, while he undestands the defensive line, his head coaching abilities and thus his success, revolve purely around putting great coaches around him, developing upstanding young men and attracting recruits with his passion and charisma. These attributes ain't really what your average NFL owner cares about. Brady Hoke is not an x's and o's guy and you need to know how to wear a headset and take control in the NFL. I don't think he'd want to leave, but if he did, I'm not sure any smart pro team would take him.
As a general rule, if you're looking for inside info on Michigan's head coach, you'd get it at a Michigan site, not an OSU site. If they're the only ones reporting it . . . you get the point.
Does anyone have a link for an OSU site reporting Hoke to the NFL? The first I heard of this rumor is here, where a recruit mentioned it and then it was instantly assumed that Urban was spreading dirty lies.
The only Hoke to the NFL topic I've seen on 11W was one linking to mgoblog and asking why it was being taken as fact that Urban has been spreading such a rumor.
I do not believe any reputable OSU site has had a word to say on the matter.
And this was definitely an interesting read.
However, here's something I found odd. Most of what he bases his hypothesis on is how Michigan coaches do in Year Three, and the whole article seems to lead up to an OH SNAP moment where he says Michigan coach Year Three will conflict with Urban Meyer Year Two.
Interesting that he's looking at Urban Meyer Year Two's, and not OSU coach Year Two's.
If he's going to apply the line of thinking about how Michigan coaches do in Year Three, shouldn't he look at how OSU coaches do in Year Two to draw a more logical conclusion?
Probably. Urban's success in year two is probably a more compelling read for Ohio State fans, though.
Well yeah, you write to your audience. But also OSU coaches' 2nd year doesn't really have a consistent pattern and Hoke's 3rd year isn't a large sample size.
Exactly. I don't have a problem with comparing the two, even if they don't follow the exact same line of reasoning. And you do write to your audience. Ohio State fans want to hear why Urban will have success against Michigan next season.