Hoke on 97.1: "I tried to buy [Gardner] back into the game with a time out"
Interview ongoing right now.
Says the ref didn't let him call a timeout, until the head ref overruled. Says by then it was too late and Morris was on the fied.
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My commentary:
1. Blatant lie.
2. The refs know that basic rule - there aren't times when you can't grant a timeout.
3. There was no "too late." He could have called a timeout up until the snap. For 20 seconds had the chance to fix it and didn't.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:10 AM ^
Wait, he's waited 5 days to reveal this? He's lying. He is lying right to our faces. I want video proof. There's always a camera pointed at the coach. Let's see it. I want proof. Short of that, he's lying about this and if he is caught in this lie he should be fired immediately. Just admit you screwed up because you did. I am forgiving of people that make mistakes, you know, being human and all, but all these cover ups and denials are just unacceptable. This is as low as Michigan has ever been in my lifetime and it's not even the wins-losses. All this nonsense is far worse than Rich's 3-9 season.
Man, if only Rich Rod had a real defensive scheme and coach. We'd be talking Football Final Four by now.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:11 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:27 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:21 AM ^
Who cares about these details? The only thing that matters is Hoke has continually revealed himself to be unable to manage this football program at a competitive and professional level. He needs to go. And I think he needs to be fired now, an interim coach installed in his stead, and the search initiated. Follow the recent process USC went through.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:31 AM ^
But he's said the same things over and over, and none of the things people claim "it's on video, he clearly lied", support their claims that he clearly lied.
You're upset about the record? Fine, that's enough reason to fire him. You're upset about the protocal on the sideline for evaluating concussions? Fine, that is likely enough for Hoke to end up being fired as well, he's ultimately in charge of the people on his sideline to do the things they need to do.
But people want more, they want him to be a liar to. People keep looking for more things to make him an incompetent villain. If he says enough things enough times, maybe he'll slip up a little bit and we can nitpick a word here or a word there and show that he is a complete liar, idiot, and evil person. I don't know why people keep wanting more, keep digging for me, why they need for Hoke to be a bad person once the pressure got to high. It seems to be the same people jumping on it over and over again, which makes me think they have ulterior motives. But Hoke didn't lie, as much as people want to believe that. A mistake was made with concussion protocal, that's serious. The rest that people are reaching for are just that, reaches, to make Hoke look like a safety hazard that is off the sideline because he's so clueless. Quit reaching.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:35 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:42 AM ^
And you just want to treat this like its a scenario out of your coaching textbook.
So, Shane Morris gets pulled, coincidentally, one play after he takes a cheap shot to the head and nearly passes out. For Hoke, its suddenly imperative that Morris is on the bench. Then, when Gardner has to come out, he suddenly is okay with Morris being in the game. Maybe he's not a liar, but again, the inability to make the right decision is staggering.
Finally Hoke is a liar. He claimed that Morris would be good to go to practice if his ankle weren't hurt and didn't mention that Morris had a concussion in his press conference. He also says he spoke to Brandon about the situation on several occassions. Then the medical report comes out and states that Morris indeed did have a concussion. So yeah, people have a reason to believe he's not telling the truth.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:58 AM ^
He thought Morris had a hurt ankle, so after his final play he had him pulled to be evaluated.
Morris is then evaluated for the ankle injury and is cleared to play. Hoke is sticking with DG because he feels DG gives him a better opportunity to be successful.
DG loses his helmet. Bellomy can't find a helmet to fit. Hoke tried to call a TO so that DG could come back into the game. There was some confusion between him and the Line Judge. Hoke got clarification, but at that point Morris was back in the game and was capable of running a play. Morris is medically cleared to play. Morris goes in and runs one play before DG goes back in.
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Those are the sequence of events. I know you love to look at things as if it's out of some "textbook" and that's what I and other coaches pull from. Right. In this very dynamic situation, that happened live and fast, and the available evidence shows Hoke utilized the quickly changing dynamics and made a decision based on those. I guess that's "textbook". I assume in Westward's unwritten rules there is somethign about a coach saying "I know the medical staff cleared to play him, but I just pulled this guy because in my medical opinion he was unfit to play because of an injury, so I guess I can't play him anymore". If Morris was cleared to play by his medical staff, Hoke was alright with allowing Morris run one play before reinserting Gardner and once again pulling Morris, not exactly difficult to follow for those without an agenda.
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Now, for the press conferences. Hoke didn't know Morris had a concussion. All inside sources are saying Hoke did think Morris could practice Sunday except for the ankle situation. Hoke was left in the dark.
Then, after Hoke had his Monday press conference, supposedly he then talked to Brandon. In a later interview, after Brandon finally released his statement, someone asked if Hoke had talked to Brandon in the past 48 hours (about 24 hours after Hoke's Monday press conference), and Hoke said yes. Again, not lying.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:15 AM ^
Spinmaster!
So right after Shane Morris takes a cheap shot to the head, Hoke decides that his ankle injury is serious enough for him to be pulled, despite the fact he's been limping around on it well before that? Really?
Has anyone actually confirmed that the medical staff said he was good to go, other than fellow spinmasters Hoke and Brandon? If Shane was good to go, why was Bellomy the one scrambling for his helmet?
I know Hoke was okay with allowing Morris to run one play. We've established this. Its because he's clueless and didn't have the ability to recognize that the player who nearly passed out a few plays ago shouldn't be in the game.
And really, if we're going down the road that Hoke had no idea what was going to be in that statement, then all signs point to him being as hapless as they come. So maybe you're right, maybe he's not a liar (I'm trying to give his intelligence a little credit), but if that's the case, the guy has no business being anywhere near a division one football program if he's going to get worked over like a speed bag like this.
You're just looking at this from, "Well, I'm a high school football coach, so this makes sense because he's an explanation in a vacuum where coaches always do the right thing" rather than looking at how Brady Hoke has actually handled the past two seasons and the evidence of the moment.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:42 AM ^
I didn't spin anything, I said what happened or what has claimed happened from inside sources. Morris takes a big hit that Hoke didn't see and the staff wants him to go down so they can take him out. Morris says he's fine, and the staff, assuming it's the ankle injury that had been a problem for a quarter, are alright with him continuing to play but get DG ready to go in the game. After the next play they determine he needs to come out and they are better served with Gardner in the game. Not difficult to understand, not spin, simple logic you aren't capable of understanding.
You would think if the staff thought he needed to come out for a head injury that someone would evaluate him for a head injury right? I mean, that makes sense, if you suspect a head injury you evaluate for one. They didn't because they thought it was an ankle injury. I've stated that's a problem that they didn't feel there needed to be an evaluation for a head injury. But if they didn't feel there was reason to, why would they? You can't understand that.
The medical staff tells the coaches when someone is not allowed to go back in the game and they take their helmet if they aren't. Morris had his helmet, was on the bench no longer being evaluated, and was cleared to go back in the game. Many on the team thought Morris was being evaluated, so Bellomy was searching for a helmet to go in the game. Morris wasn't still being evaluated so he got up and went in the game. You can't call that spin when all facts point to that being the case, I would call it some level of spin to claim "well all the facts show he was cleared to go back in the game but I don't think he was because..." That's spin. You are going against what has been said by insiders and the people that were actually there and called them liars because you believe differently because... That's spin.
Then, again, you bring up my coaching as a slight against me. Really? What vacuum am I speaking in? In what vacuum do all these things happen? What things have I not taken into account in my argument? You're speaking out of your ass with little catch phrases to try to appear like you aren't a one-sided imbecile that can't empathize any viewpoint but his own. I'm done talking to you because your head is so far up your Hoke-Hating ass and your way of debate is to make personal attacks, strawman arguments, and stupid namecalling like "Spinmaster" because your argument sucks. And you have the audacity to use experience that you don't have to try to prop up your argument. Somehow your smarter because you don't know shit about football, right, got it.
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:03 PM ^
". They didn't because they thought it was an ankle injury. I've stated that's a problem that they didn't feel there needed to be an evaluation for a head injury. "
So like the head coach, our medical staff saw a player take a direct hit to the head with a helmet, nearly pass out and decided an ankle injury was to blame?
So after that hit, they need one play to see Morris perform a very basic hand off and then decide that he can no longer continue?
What "facts" show he was cleared to go back in the game? Brady Hoke saying so? That's your source?
So we're to believe that in the space of time from the game to his press conference DB and BH never discussed anything that would be in the medical statement?
So from Brandon on down, the entire staff is just as terrible at their job as Brady Hoke?
Again: Either everyone is lying or everyone is so incompetent that they are a danger to the palyers and they all need to be fired.
So you very well could be right: Brady Hoke is not a liar. He's just an awful coach.
And I bring up your coaching because you post with this air of superiority, as if being a high school head coach somehow qualifies you to speak as an authority at what goes on at the Univeristy of Michigan football program. As if because you're a coach, you somehow get exactly what happened on the sideline at Michigan.
Which is what I mean when you say, you're evaluating this from the standpoint that Brady Hoke and staff would do what your coaching textbook says a coach and staff should do and if its not right there must be a logical explanation for it, rather than act like the mediocre, confused coach he has actually proven to be.
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:05 PM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:16 PM ^
is just lazy. I mean how do you not know these things? I don't think he's lying, he's just lazy and hands-off. Sort of a "well, the medical stuff does their thing and I just coach."
October 2nd, 2014 at 3:48 PM ^
SpaceCoyote, I appreciate your views and this is "harder than it looks"
I'm a coach, as well and understand things happen fast and you often wish you could go back and do things differently. There's two things that condemn Hoke's ability to run the show that are on display in this:
1. First, he did not know about his QB's health. That's unacceptable. It appears he didn't talk to any trainers or anything after his QB came out of the game due to injury. How do you not know whether or not Morris is injured? His response has basically been "Shane's a competitor and he went onto the field, so he must have been fine."
2. How do you not have control of your sideline? How does the QB who was just pulled take it on himself to re-insert himself into the game and then you're all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I really hope we win this week. Hoke deserves it as he's taken some personal heat and his integrity and concern over players has been wrongly called out. But his ineptness has been on display and that's what will cost him his job.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:57 AM ^
...just incompetent. I think that it is a reasonable expectation for a head football coach to know the rules of the game he is coaching.
This helmet rule is not new. They've been playing with it for 2-3 years now. Everyone sitting at home knew that. The announcers knew that. The head ref knew that. Brady Hoke didn't. And he should have. It is his job to know the rules. I mean, he doesn't have any trouble with the offsides rule, does he? This is just another rule that he needs to know.
But seriously, Brady Hoke is paid piles of money to do a bunch of things. Mold young men, manage his team, build a game plan, recruit new players, ..., and know the rules.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:01 AM ^
That's why he's trying to call a TO to keep DG in the game. There is miscommunication between him and the Line Judge and so he gets clarification from the Umpire that he can call a TO. At that point Morris is back in the game, cleared to play. With this new information, Hoke doesn't feel the need to call a TO because he has a QB that to his knowledge is capable of taking a snap and running a play. That's when the Umpire asked "do you want to call a TO" and Hoke says no, run the clock.
He knows the rules, the situation changed to make him feel it was unnecessary to call a TO. That's it. From his POV, that really isn't that difficult to understand.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:32 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 1:23 PM ^
This is such a non-issue, when there are real reasons to criticize the Hoke/Brandon clownshow we've seen this week. Hoke's explanation on this has been consistent -- go read, for example, the transcript of his Monday press conference, where he says exactly the same thing in his opening remarks -- and Space Coyote's interpretation is correct, I think. Granted, I don't know why Hoke doesn't just call the TO to achieve the desired result (keeping Gardner in without missing a play), rather than having a discussion with the line judge to explain why he's calling the TO. But for whatever reason, he has this discussion, thinks the line judge is telling him the TO won't work for that purpose, and by the time that's straightened out, Morris is in the game and Hoke figures, the heck with it. Pretty straightforward -- that is, against the backdrop that the coaches/trainers/medical staff haven't figured out that Morris should be evaluated for a possible concussion. That's the real problem, of course.
October 2nd, 2014 at 1:08 PM ^
This makes a ton of sense and si very plausible. But there are two problems 1) Hoke has never said this as well as you have and 2) very few will ever entertain this idea as their minds are already made up. Public perception, being what it is, is very difficult to persuade. We would need uncut video and audio of the scenario occurring exactly as you described to sway many, but there would still be tons of folk screaming cover up.
October 2nd, 2014 at 1:18 PM ^
Also, I feel like this should be a topic of its own. It's a plausible theory that hasn't had enough consideration.
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:42 AM ^
This is incompetence on the order of this: http://deadspin.com/5962888/jim-schwartzs-illegal-challenge-doubled-the…
KNOW THE RULES!!!
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:45 AM ^
watched the play in slow motion. First, Nuss is shown speaking with the referee. Then a Michigan coach goes deep into the sideline and calls Shane's name, after which Bellomy yells Shane's name twice. The camera then zooms to Shane who gets up with the trainer by his side and slowly and gingerly places his helmet on his head and slowly proceeds to the field.
Because it took so long for Shane to react, Bellomy starts to try on two helmets, one from a lineman. Neither fits. By this time Shane is on the field. With the play clock stopped at 25 seconds, the umpire yells twice to the sidelines asking if they want a timeout. The play clock is still not running.
Next, Hoke is shown, with arm extended, waiving his pointed finger in a circular motion to begin the play clock. In otherwords, he decided against a timeout.
After the play, Shane is shown wobbling back to the sidelines and is assisted off the field by players on the sideline.
After Belomy retreats, a kid is shown placing the correct helmet on his head.
During this and other views of Morris, there is no doctor performing tests, other than on the ankle.
It looked like a confused sideline. Hoke absolutely should have called a time out to protect his player. He used poor judgment, not only on the field, but later in his press conferences that called his honesty and sincerety into question. However, where were the medical staff and why didn't the trainer stop Shane from entering the game?
October 2nd, 2014 at 10:47 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:02 AM ^
I think it would be best for everyone if Hoke just stopped talking to the media. Its an ugly excercise all around that has only seemed to get him into more trouble.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:16 AM ^
put a different QB in the game?
I'm thinking what Hoke is meaning to say is that the ref told him that even if he did call a time-out, then DG would still have to sit a play...which is completely wrong, but there you go.
Thing is, there are about 5 QB's on the roster. Any one of them could've run out there and did a hand-off or you could run a direct snap to the RB. I mean, if you're just wasting a play, then go ahead and waste it.
Then once he found out that he could call a time-out, but Morris was already out there, then...call a time-out. There's some more dumn logic right there, "Well, the ref finally told me i could call a timeout and get DG back in the game, but I looked out there and saw Morris ready to go and said, screw it." Is that what an intelligent football coach sounds like these days?
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:18 AM ^
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October 2nd, 2014 at 11:22 AM ^
From now on, any questions for Mr. Hoke should be directed to his counsel, Nathan Thurm.
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:24 AM ^
We now know it wasn't Hoke that called for Morris to be sent back out on the field. He allowed it to happen, but people that were interacting more closely with Shane made that call. Was that the trainer or somebody else?
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:11 PM ^
anyone ever saying that "Hoke called for Morris".
[now, given the thousands of comments posted on this Board the past 5 days, it is possible that a stray comment or two suggested that--but, if so, those were most certainly outliers.]
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:25 AM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 11:39 AM ^
Does it really matter? If he doesn't have any clue what's going on and is on Team Stupid, he should be fired. If he's lying he's awful and on Team Evil, he should be fired.
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:11 PM ^
Bull fucking shit. There's a video of a ref asking Hoke if he wants a timeout while Shane is starting the huddle, with 25 seconds remaining on the play clock.
We called a timeout in either the App St. or ND game when Devin Gardner's helmet came off so that he wouldn't have to miss a play. The coaches KNOW this is an option.
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:12 PM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 12:52 PM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 1:24 PM ^
October 2nd, 2014 at 1:47 PM ^
Hoke is flat out lying. The tape shows the official asking if he wants a TO and Hoke refusing.
Its over now and history...but Hoke is full of shit.
October 2nd, 2014 at 3:17 PM ^
My guess for the reason that Brady Hoke continues to flat out and blatently lie about this particular point is that he has to stick by his story in the event of future litigation over this incident, as well as to protect his career interests.
Even though the video evidence clearly shows the official asking Hoke if he wants a TO and Hoke refusing, he feels that me must continue to lie about it.
That is disgusting, but he probably has been advised by his legal team to continue the charade.