Denard Robinson and his throwing
I thought I would bring this to the attention of all those recruits who are "influenced" by message boards like these. Well, you already know that Denard Robinson is a tremendous runner. But the sheer magnitude of this has inadvertently shielded somewhat, the knowledge of what a strong arm he also has. This is akin to the early years of Michael Jordan whereby his supreme offensive skill was blinding the populace from seeing how also good of a defensive player he was. The same goes for Robinson.
Go back to his high school videos... you'll see some very impressive long bomb throws while either on the run or falling back. Robinson can chuck it mega-deep on the run, with the best of them. This is knowledge is soon to reach critical mass.
As Bob Barker would say.... "Sammy and DeAnthony......come on down!!!"
November 9th, 2010 at 2:42 PM ^
The pass where Junior Hemingway rain-danced for a TD... that pass was an absolute laser.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:55 PM ^
Robisnon has flat out floored me with his running ability this year. He has also greatly impressed me with his improvement passing. However, that improvement was from terrible to adequate. He is still inconsistant with his accuracy and doesn't move well through progressions. He has thrown a few nice balls deep, and fit in a few tight throws in coverage, but, realistically, on the whole he is a bottom half of the Big Ten passing QB this year. What gets me excited about this guy, though, is that he seems to have the attitude and work ethic to improve just as much this offseason as he did last. I think he has the intelligence and arm strength needed to be a really good passer eventually, so the future is nothing but brighter with this kid. If he improves as much as I think he will, coupled with getting stronger and the extra experience in the offense, he could be unstoppable in the next two years.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:14 PM ^
realistically, on the whole he is a bottom half of the Big Ten passing QB this year
Because all the metrics show this, right?
Come on now. If not for the shoulder injury he would at least be in the good range, as it is he's certainly aboverage. His decision making and reading skills could still use some work for sure, but to say that he's bottom half of the Big Ten? That's just flat out incorrect.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:28 PM ^
I am excited for what he will be. For now, though, I would say that Cousins, Stanzi, Weber, McGloin, Tolzien, are clearly better passers. That would put him 6th in the league, and some would argue that Pryor or Marve are better passers, too. Hell, I would argue that he isn't even the best passer on his own team. As a total package, though, I rank him as a top two or three QB in the league (with a strong argument for #1) already, and think he will be clearly the best QB over the next two years.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:30 PM ^
1. Stanzi, Ricky.. IOWA SR 9 230 157 3 68.3 2212 20 175.1 2. Pryor, Terrelle OSU JR 9 225 152 7 67.6 1997 20 165.2 3. Persa, Dan..... NU JR 9 259 190 3 73.4 2263 13 161.0 4. Robinson, D.... MICH SO 9 186 118 7 63.4 1814 13 160.9 5. Bauserman, Joe. OSU SR 8 22 16 1 72.7 174 2 160.1 6. Tolzien, Scott. WIS SR 9 193 138 5 71.5 1688 9 155.2 7. Cousins, Kirk.. MSU JR 10 261 171 8 65.5 2277 15 151.6 8. Chappell, Ben.. IND SR 9 378 241 8 63.8 2667 18 134.5 9. Scheelhaasse, N ILL FR 9 191 116 7 60.7 1310 13 133.5 10.Weber, Adam.... MINN SR 10 307 172 9 56.0 2290 18 132.2
November 9th, 2010 at 3:57 PM ^
Denard Robinson's numbers are helped by the fact that he is a ridiculous runner. His play action opens up receivers for easy pitcha nd catch plays that don's require accurate throws or reads. That is why I said he is the best OVERALL QB, in my opinion, with the possible exception of, gulp, Cousins. Show me his statistics in drop back passing situations, such as the Michigan State game. That is why I was pissed about the play calling that game, because they didn't help him out with play action but kept dropping him straight back and playing him like a pro style QB. You can neg me all you want for disagreeing with you (boo f'ing hoo, btw), but I am not saying Robinson is not a good QB or cannot be a good passer. I just think he has a ways to go.
- look at those numbers again. If you are going to stand by them, look me in the eye, and say that Cousins is the seventh best passing QB in the league then I am done discussing this with you because you are hopeless.
November 9th, 2010 at 5:02 PM ^
Very good against NW. But did you see the Iowa game? I actually only saw highlights (who watches MSU), but the pick the Hawkeyes played lateral with was ridiculous. Receiver was covered by both guys. He's made plays like this before
And to be fair, though it's true Denard's passing is helped tremendously by his running, so is Cousins/Tolzein/StanziAmerica by his team's RB rushing. Guys are open in any offense with a working ground game, b/c of play action. It's just that our running right now comes primarily from the QB. If Shaw/Smith/Hop get it right and give us a consistent RB threat, this O is going to be lights out. Amazingly, amazingly lights out
Both TE's and WR will be open all over the field. And RB's out of the backfield
November 9th, 2010 at 9:23 PM ^
That is a good point about the role of running backs loosening up the D for other qbs. DRob has had to play both roles for the better part of this year.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:36 PM ^
November 9th, 2010 at 3:55 PM ^
Seems like the point is that even though Denard has solid passing stats and has made some great throws he has the ability to get even better. Based on his attitude I would bet that he would like to have the highest passer efficiency in the Big Ten if not the country and not for personal glory but because it will result in more wins. Go Blue - Go Denard.
November 10th, 2010 at 12:01 PM ^
about his upbringing, his failures in highschool and how he worked even harder after that as well as his strong family backround added to a strong M football family i see him improving at least as much as we saw from last year to the spring game to opening weedend! not only will he improve but he will improve Tate by competition push and others by being a leader whose actions are louder than his words! Go Blue beat purdue!
November 9th, 2010 at 4:18 PM ^
I don't think that anyone could legitimately argue that Denard is a better pure passer than Cousins, Chappell or Tolzien right now. He's certainly a greater overall weapon because of his running ability, which opens up some wide open passes that other QBs will never have the luxury of. But if we're discussing his passing ability in a vacuum, which I understand is the topic at hand, you simply can't rate him higher than those three guys.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:32 PM ^
There is more and more touch each week. This is what makes his potential ridiculous
He's still rushed b/c he doesn't understand everything yet and he doesn't want to make mistakes. But when he has time and reads the D correctly, he's putting more balls in the air with some loft.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:56 PM ^
He is getting better each week, but I actually don't think he has been that bad on the touch passes. He does tend to overthrow a little, but his main mistakes have been throwing behind runners on the slants and outs and locking on a little too much on his first read. Navarre had a similar problem and he ended up pretty high on the all time passing stats, so maybe there are worst problems to have, though. I think as he gets more comfortable reading through progressions, he won't try to force so many throws and his accuracy will improve vastly. He seems like the type of kid who will be able to improve on all phases of his game each year.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:17 PM ^
Robert Marve has never done ANYTHING to show he is even a remotely decent passer. I really don't think that Adam Weber is a better passer, either. He's been mediocre his entire career.
November 9th, 2010 at 5:10 PM ^
How is he a bottom half Big Ten passer when he's 4th in passer rating? He's also first in yards per attempt. He's thrown it the least, sure, but he'll be throwing more in the years to come. He's going to beat easily all of Tate's stats from last year, with about as much game experience starting.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:57 PM ^
I agree! To put this into the context of the thread, for all you recruits looking at playing with Denard, you better start strengthening your hands now because he throws frozen ropes.
The only "knock" on Denard is that he needs a little more work on his touch passing but I'm sure he's working on it and I've seen some fruits from that labor already.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:06 PM ^
Agreed. The 2 deep passes to Roundtree were right on target and beautifully laid out there for him. Showing marked improvement in touch. The second long one to Roundtree easily could have been his 4th TD pass if Roy didn't get tracked down from behind. Still, great play by both guys.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:07 PM ^
Yeah, I can't believe he decided to throw it in the first place. But damn, if you can get it there, by all means, put it there.
I mean when they say 'he can make all the throws' about an NFL prospect, I don't even think this is considered one you can ask a guy to make.
November 10th, 2010 at 12:34 PM ^
ya he throw the ball hard.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:44 PM ^
i watched the video on you tube
November 9th, 2010 at 5:29 PM ^
Thanks for letting us know where you watched the video. I'll have to give you a +1 for this important information.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:45 PM ^
And by that I mean messages from Tom, I believe we may have a chance.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:47 PM ^
I have long wondered how many recruits are actually influenced by boards like this. Between academics, the current state of the program, coaches, location of the school, etc. it seems there are hundred other things they are more worried about (and should be for that matter).
I tend to think that this or any other blog plays a minimal role in recruiting, if at all.
Does anybody have any links that show recruits talking about message boards and if/how it effects their decisions?
November 9th, 2010 at 2:50 PM ^
but I know that I pray to god that none of MICH's recruits read this board after a loss.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:55 PM ^
Just laid out for everyone to see until the internets finally break. We all know what is working and what was an epic disaster. I actually think this board is decent from the fact that the personal attacks are kept (can't control all in an open model) to a minimum.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:02 PM ^
last weeks episode, Kovacs does indeed read "blogs"
'sup Kovacs!
November 9th, 2010 at 3:15 PM ^
I know that I pray to god that none of MICH's recruits read this board after a loss.
Yes, because this is obviously the only board in the country where people vent after a loss. If only someone would make some kind of weekly compilation of fan venting across the country...
November 9th, 2010 at 4:11 PM ^
I've seen personal attacks on not only players and coaches, but also guys that we are recruiting. Do you really want these kids reading that shit? I don't. But hey to each his own.
November 9th, 2010 at 8:45 PM ^
However, this board can't compare with the horrors that are Facebook, MLive, Rivals, and so forth. The increased point threshold to post/comment following a loss is also a great gesture to limit the damage.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:52 PM ^
Never underestimate the power of repetition. It is brainwashing. Case in point... the are alot of morons out there who believe that Rodriguez has been 'arrogant' in overlooking the in-state talent... this crap has been put out by Dantonio and his henchmen, as his modus operandi to get an upper hand in the state. Said often enough, and even people here have believed it... it is brainwashing.
November 9th, 2010 at 5:40 PM ^
I'm sure that many, many recruits are picking a school based on the total number of snarky comments that they read on a blog about themselves. They probably use a formula to determine a school's average douchebag quotient and then multiply it by the number of times they are mentioned. Yep, I'm sure that's it.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:52 PM ^
I agree, Robinson's throwing is pretty damn good:
He currently has a 63.4% competion rate and a #11 ranked QB rating.
Bottom line is, and this is stating the obvioius, he is a monster threat.
November 9th, 2010 at 2:56 PM ^
Seriously fellas... go look at his high school clips... a few of his bombs on the run or falling backward, went 60 yards ON A ROPE. this has not entered the national collective mind YET.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:25 PM ^
November 9th, 2010 at 5:43 PM ^
Throwing it on a rope is over-rated. I'd rather he learn to throw it over the defenders head and drop it in with a little touch.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:06 PM ^
denard has the strongest arm any of us will ever see in a Michigan uni.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:10 PM ^
As Lee Corso says . . . "Not so fast." Denard may be my favorite Wolverine ever (I grew up with Desmond, Wheatley, Woodson, etc.), but that is a pretty bold statement. You'll have to explain your metrics - does "strongest" mean that he can throw the farthest? throws the hardest?
November 9th, 2010 at 3:16 PM ^
To me the prettiest ball I've ever seen in person was a Ryan Mallett deep ball (even though they were few and far between his frosh year). There was just something about watching it fly through the air that left me speechless.
As long as we are dissecting Denard's throwing motion...it looks a lot like Mike Vick's.
November 9th, 2010 at 5:02 PM ^
let me repeat...dr has the strongest arm ,yes mallett included, any of us have ever seen in a Michigan uni.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:16 PM ^
Denard has a stronger arm than Tate - but wait 'til you see Gardner. The kid has an absolute cannon.
November 9th, 2010 at 3:08 PM ^
1st of all your comparison to Jordan and his defense is a little off. He was criticized for not being as good at defense as he was on offense early in his career. He then spent an entire off season practicing his defensive skills and won defensive player of the year the following year. That being said you could tell last season that he had a stronger arm then Tate did, just needed to refine that skill so to speak. He sort of reminds of me Henne who thought a pass out to flat had to be thrown as hard as a bomb to Edwards in his freshman year. He developed some touch later in his career and you can definitely expect the same for Denard. His throwing is only going to get better which leaves you salivating for the next two years. Lets hope Bengals fire Marvin Lewis and by some sheer awesomeness miracle he signs up to be our D coordinator. Special
November 9th, 2010 at 3:14 PM ^
Arm strength is very good.
Passing is good, but can get a lot better with experience.
Future looks even brighter for him!
November 9th, 2010 at 3:23 PM ^
That roll out throw to Hemmingway had to leave a mark, that thing was a fucking laser. In all reality the reason why Junior turned that into a TD was to get off the field and seek medical attention to his 3 broken fingers, shattered sternum and bruised lungs.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:22 PM ^
admired that throw and its result, it wasn't the smart play in that situation. Denard needs to learn to take first downs when the defense gives them, all he had to do was tuck it and run and keep the drive moving. All part of being a gifted Soph QB in his 9th start.
For every great great laser throw, the probability of him trying to force one in when he shouldn't and throwing a pick is greatly increased.
November 9th, 2010 at 4:24 PM ^
I'll take a little less accuracy along with top percentile QB running ability any day........every time I watch Arkansas and Mallett, I laugh at how "un-mobile" he is......he can throw, but he's one dimensional......they are in 11th place in terms of total yard (4,342).
We're in 7th place in terms of total yardage and the difference between #1 and #7 is less than 300 yards (Oregon = 5,105 vs. Michigan = 4,823).........with better defensive play and better kicking to come next year, the offense will have even more opportunities to put up points.
The spread works, Denard can throw, Michigan will continue to get better, etc............
November 9th, 2010 at 4:50 PM ^
I recall the difference between Henne's freshmen and sophmore years when he lost the Edwards security blanket. I think UM's fine Oline play plus DR's run threat gives him a constant security blanket. Considering we will have an excellent Oline next year, DR should be able to put up ridiculous numbers without being the best pure passing talent. And that is perfectly fine with me. If the running threat reduces the opposing defenses choices, it is the same as a lead foot QB who just happens to make a lightning read and put a ball in a 3 inch window against an all out blitz and great cover corners.
hfhmilkman
November 9th, 2010 at 5:33 PM ^
youtube proof on a wet field from his own 11 yard line to the opponent's 35, he back foots a throw between 55 and 60 yards. starts at 2:30