You should though because its not right.
that is nice bonus change
You should though because its not right.
Not right? Are we talking about the accuracy of the assertion or are we talking about the fact that the assertion is being made? I'd say that one of those two is not right, yes.
Well said Brownbear. Also, when is up and downvoting going to return? I think this would lessen some of the vitriolic mob mentality.
I couldn't get past "well said, turd."
I'll be honest, my original post was just going to be that. Three powerful words.
You are the king of the short and spot on post.
Look, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. We cannot have an insane coach. He was terrible in his 4-1 call with denard 2 years ago against staee and he is still guilty of the same Huberus today. It is not his work ethic, it is the lack or adaptation and his pride that is why Borges should be fired.
Urgh. No it isn't. That's just a cute little saying, ffs, not the real definition of insanity. Furthermore, it seems pretty clear that of all Borges' faults, the inability to change what he's doing isn't one of them. He's revamped his entire offense like 3 times this season (and there's a reason coaches generally don't do that). Have you been paying attention, like, at all?
Yes, that definition was just something coined by Albert Einstein, so likely it is full of shit. And speaking of full of shit, if you think that Borges is nothing but the worst OC in FBS, well, fill in the rest.
It's commonly attributed to him, but that's not necessarily the truth. It's truthiness, though.
You're just moving the goalposts after being called out on your ignorance. And do you actually think that Einstein of all people had any authority in the definition of mental illnesses? Seriously how ignorant are you?
was of the 'last straw variety'; with high powered Indiana coming to town would you have attempted to continue running the stalled offense which lost the Penn State game, and nearly lost the Akron and UConn games the previous few weeks? The revamping you speak of was not innovation, it was desperation.
I don't think it's OK to publicly call for firing coaches, especially over and over and over again. It seems like it would be better for the program and perception of the fan base if some of these negative topics were discussed with family, friends, or addressed to the AD rather than on the blog(s), Twitter, etc.
Sadly, I'm actually used to reading the rude comments about Borges by now, but I still cringe when I read similar posts about Fred. He coached some of Michigan's greatest RBs, and deserves better than what has been said/written by a few fans. And people seem to think Fred will retire at the end of the season, so I'm really not sure why it's necessary to make negative comments about his coaching skills at this point.
Anyway, I, too, agree that some posts are downright mean-spirited when it comes to Borges. And I felt evil just reading the comments about Funk when his father died.
I agree that the bored has got a little crazy but these are crazy times... Crazy times indeed.
I do not agree that we as a fan base cannot discuss a coach being let go. Why should I ignore the obviously and pretend all is right with program and only talk about it behind closed doors? Just seems silly to me.
But I'm not suggesting that the fan base should ignore the obvious or pretend things are great, but the way some issues are discussed repeatedly is making the board/blog a bit hard to read. And I don't see how it's helping the program to continue to post all reckless about Michigan football. I just think there are more effective ways to influence change.
Brandon needs to earn his paycheck, too. Let him deal with the unsatisfied fans instead of the mods. I certainly don't need to read another comment bashing the coaches or about how medicore the football team has been for years. We all know that most fans feel the product on the field isn't up to standards, but now what? Start another "Fire Borges" thread? That seems pointless and silly to me.
Never worded better.
This board is full of a lot of great posters with avariety of opinions. Unfortunately, a vast majority are just plain mean and jerkish.
Granted, sometimes it feels like a vast majority are mean and jerky, but I really don't think that is the case.
We have got to get moderation back. The old neg bang moderation, not that +1 insightful /-1 trolling abberation too.
Once people feel like there are consequences for what they say, they modify how they say it.
I'm with turd.
Maybe you need to grap the paper and head for the bathroom ...
For me it's just hangover from the Lloyd Carr era. Toward the end he got so abrasive with the media when things were not going well and his attitude seemed to be: Screw you. You don't know what your talking about I'm running this program my way. I don't know how to embed:
with Al in this presser, you don't get that sense. And this made me feel for the guy a little bit.
He's very self-aware.
Hoke may seem just fine with everything, but Borges is not. He knows his offense has been historically bad and that won't fly around these parts.
Trouble is, I'm not sure he knows what to do about it. He keeps blaming it on inexperience and execution. That may be true, but it's his job to develop the players and come up with a game plan they can execute. In late November, nobody is a freshman any more.
His predictable yet simultaneously erratic play calling has not helped his players. They can never get in any kind of rhythm. Honest to God, I believe that if they could just string 2 or 3 good drives together, they would catch fire.
I have tried to make sure in my dissatisfaction with AB that I dodn't let things get personal. I don't know the guy so it isn't really fair to have any feelings toward of a personal nature. I just don't like him coaching my favorite team, it's as simple as that.
Actually (and I've said this many times) from reading the presser transcripts he seems like a pretty darn likeable guy. I have hoped throughout the season that he would turn things around and get things on the right track so we could have a coach and amusing as Al. Alas, that hasn't happened so I just want him replaced. Nothing personal against him and I don't wish him ill in any way. I just want someone more competent at their job. Hopefully he can find some success somewhere else.
I do think we need to change direction there, I only meant that I wish he were a worse person, that's all.
I love listening to him talk. Love him as a person. That doesn't really make it easier.
I hope he buckles and quits. He's average at the very best and way overcompensated.
He has failed at his job. I don't care if he's broken down looking, you don't do your job, you lose it.
He's repeatively failed, has continued to throw his players under the bus...get him out of here.
to see a man that knows he's done but he tried and cared. He just wasn't good enough. Trying isn't good enough in this business.
It's not good enough in most if not all business's. Successful businesses at least.
I feel a little bad for him. He's in a situation he doesn't know how to fix. I can relate to being just above average. I work hard, I can do well if given the right circumstances, but I also probably struggle if I don't have the tools I need at my disposal. I'm no genius, I'm not a creative master. I'll probably never create something that has never been done before. But, I can work persistantly at something when I have a clear goal and a clear plan. Unlike Borges however, I don't make $700,000 a year. With that salary comes an expectation of being much better than slightly above average. Our fans, the team, and his position require much more than slightly above average. His body of work is not deserving of his position or his salary.
Ah, he knows how to fix it, h is just too prideful to do what it takes.
but just won't "do what it takes?" It must be pretty obvious then, right? Please tell me, how do you fix it?
Why did hoke have to reshape the offense in the first place? When he got the job the defense was a tirefire and badly needed an overhaul, but the offense? he tried to stick with the spread because of Denard and actually IIRC he got more points than in 2010, why change something that has been improving the last 4 years? honestly in hindsight of course I feel that it was a bad desicion to turn 180 degrees from something that actually worked...
Because to run a spread offense makes your defense weak minded ninnies.
You coach what you know and compensate for what you don't. Now obviously it's not impossible as a coach to attack from a different style that you're normally not comfortable with or unfamiliar with, because it's been done. And of course it's easy to look back now and say "Well, our offense was much better when we ran spread, so we should have stuck with that the whole time." But it's not surprising that Hoke would try to steer the team towards his vision.
Look at the type of offense he ran there. Oh, and for a bonus, look at the defense he was running at SDSU.
"Because that's not what he knew"
Ummm... he's a DL coach who has shown he knows little to nothing about offense - spread OR Manball.
This is an ideological/dogmatic thing for Hoke, not a "what he knows" thing.
"Nothing is more dangerous than a dogmatic worldview - nothing more constraining, more blinding to innovation, more destructive of openness to novelty."
- Stephen Jay Gould
It's not that simple. First of all, it was a big part of why he was hired in the first place, and why RR never was accepted. There is a vocal faction in the fan base that never accepted the spread at Michigan. In other words, we hired Hoke because of the offensive philosophy he had, he didn't decide on an offense after the fact.
Second, a big part of the success in recruiting had to do with the fact that Michigan was going back to pro style. The RBs, the linemen, the QB all were interested because it fit their style and gave them a shot of making it to the pros. There are real and tangible benefits with running pro style, especially when it differentiates you from many of the teams you compete with in recruiting.
And really, there's really nothing wrong with one style or the other once you have the right people to run it. It just takes times to implement.
But as to your first point, I think Hoke's directive was "do whatever you want on offense but OH MY GOD TACKLE SOMEONE FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THINGS HOLY"
Michigan will get better recruits running prostyle. The prostyle I was hoping for though was the Cap One Bowl sort, not the let teams catch you from behind sort.
We ran a full-on passing spread in the Cap1 bowl.
than 10 points versus OSU. MSU also manhandled it as did PSU. People are forgetting just how lame that offense was against good teams when it mattered.
This isn't a defense of Borges at all, but a corrective on the myth of the "All Powerful" spread that seems to permeate this board.
IMO, than what we have right now. even against OSU we moved the ball better than we do now.even though we had 10 pts. Much better. Denard was a better QB then. We ran the ball better with less talent at RB. Turnovers killed many potential scoring drives. We moved the ball more consistently in 2008 with talent free QB's and a bad o-line than we have the last four games.
Yes, against the best teams we struggled to score--most teams do, especially when they have less talent than the team they are playing against, which we did in those days. Now we have comparable talent to the defenses we play, and are WORSE.
In 2011 we ran mostly the spread and put 40+ points on OSU... just saying.
With Al calling the plays. Seems like a lesson that offensive success isn't soley based on scheme or one coach alone, but on a great many factors that are all related.
He was just runnin' Rich Rod's offense!
we had an offensive pulse in 2011. If you need reminded ...go look at the stats. How many of those ytards came from improvisation ? .... probably about 50% of them. Denard covered up the incompetentcy of Borges as a play caller. But it is truly exposed now. There is ENOUGH data to prosecute Borges for the crime of ruining the 2013 season. His play calling has LOST 3 B1G games, and I don't think he's that far removed form the debacles of Akron and UConn.
He has failed, and unless removed, will be the ultimate cause for Hoke to lose his job as head coach. Sad ... but true.