Michigan Scrimmage Notes

Submitted by pullin4blue on

I just got back from the scrimmage today and wanted to pass on a little information. The scrimmage was open to suite holders and club seat ticket holders. It started at 3pm and ran until 5:00. It was structured much like the spring game, where they began with special teams, and exchanges, punting, kicking, punt blocks, and punt/kick returns. Lastly, was the Blue against white scrimmage starting at the 30, then the 2, then the 50.

Prior to seeing this scrimmage I was a fan of Tate and would tell anyone who asked, that Tate would be the starter. After watching the scrimmage, D-Rob will be the starter. He was much better in the pocket, made good decisions when faced with getting rid of the ball or being sacked with loss of yards, and his exchanges were very good. Think about some of the ball fakes that Juice Williams had. D-Rob isn't there yet, but he will be. I also think there is NO WAY that Gardner will redshirt. He played very well and almost as good as Tate in every phase of the game. 

With passing, D-Rob led his receivers well and his completion rate was astronomic as compared to last season. Both Tate and Devin had throws that were routinely behind the receivers or not catchable.

The most pleasant surprise for me was Stephen Hopkins. This is a guy who has a chance to be a 1,000 yd rusher. He hit the holes well and was a load to take down. Smith, Cox and Shaw also did well, but in my mind, not as good as Hopkins.

Kelvin Grady played VERY WELL today and was probably responsible for the most yards of any player.

On the defensive side of the ball, M-R0b had a nice pick that he took for 50 yards. I love it when I see someone who can walk the walk and talk the talk. There was solid play by T. Talbott, Ryan, Jones, Gordon, Herron, Hawthorne,Van Bergen, Roh, Avery, Johnson, and Demens. I do not mean to leave anyone out, but they all looked good.

The O-Line was great and it was nice to see that we truly are 2-deep with linemen. The D-line looked good and will definitely cause some problems for teams.

Special teams will be better this year, watching Broekhuizen kick 40 yard field goals on a regular basis. There were no fumbles on kick returns and although there were some turnovers during play. They were few, and not by the "first string". We are going to have a much better team than people think. 

Rich Rod was having fun. He was smiling, meeting with fans and player's families, and didn't appear to be stressed at all. I walked into the stadium with Hagerup and had a nice talk with him. What a great guy. After talking with him it is very clear that this team is out to prove something. I can't wait until the 4th.

I don't think I have revealed anything about the team that would aid scouting by UConn, but if Brian or Tim think so, delete this post. There's no way I want to do anything to hurt the team.

Comments

mattbern

August 21st, 2010 at 6:24 PM ^

Thanks for the update.  I was hoping to see how the QBs were looking coming out of this scrimmage and you gave a pretty in depth look.  Glad to hear that some of the young guys are coming along nicely.  At this point even having this and countdown to kickoff in the same day isn't enough.  I need the real thing.  2 weeks!! Let's GOOO!

 

Edit: Did you happen to take notice of how the starting CBs played or how the secondary looked in general?

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:43 AM ^

It was hard to tell, for me at least.

There weren't many deep balls.  On one deep pass, the throw (from Tate) was good and ultimately a pass interference was called after the breakup.

On the inside and short routes, our receivers were able to get open and catch the ball again and again and again.

bluebyyou

August 21st, 2010 at 6:21 PM ^

Thanks for the update on the scrimmage.

I sit here grinning about your discussion of the QB's.  Hopefully, Tate will close the gap and show incredible improvement, but in my heart of hearts, I don't think that will happen.  My concern about D-Rob is that he has yet to face a game situation, but he is a very good athlete and certainly will be much improved. I still worry about his HS percent completions, but a couple of years of college coaching may be enough to give him reasonable accuracy. He deserves everything good he gets - seems to have really busted his butt..  As for DG, I did not think he would red shirt from the time I saw the spring game.  Something about 6-4, coming in early, and the attitude issues with Tate since then have made me think he will be playing some this year..

Mgobowl

August 21st, 2010 at 6:30 PM ^

D-Rob does have game experience. Maybe not as much as Tate, but he has been in pressure situations before.

As for the high school completion %, I doubt he had a dedicated QB coach or someone with as much knowledge on mechanics as our current coaching staff.

Here's to D-Rob for starter this year.

mgoSk

August 21st, 2010 at 6:44 PM ^

Exactly, it always bothers me when people act like Denard hasn't played. He showed composure leading Michigan on a TD drive that left the team within 2 points of Iowa at Iowa. And as for his INT at the end, I seem to remember hearing that the whole play call or audible didn't get in.

bluebyyou

August 22nd, 2010 at 10:25 AM ^

Regarding most HS coaching, from what I have seen it is rare that there is a dedicated QB coach, yet the best prospects have excellent completion percentages. The type of coaching that Tate had, I suspect, is the exception, not the rule.   So, I am hoping DRob's athleticism is lurking in the background and he will be a 60% passer.  Here are some senior year HS stats:

Denard had a 43% completion rate his senior year of HS.

Tate had a 58.7% completion rate his senior year of HS

Gardner had a 58% completion rate his senior year of HS

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:47 AM ^

I think Devin still has a long way to go.  At some point in the thread, the 50 yard Int return was mentioned -- that was off a DG throw.  I think RR is trying to stay positive with him, but as the reps for the different QBs went on, I think RR was getting frustrated with DG for not knowing the right decision to make.

Make no mistake - DG is a physical specimen.  He dwarfs Denard and Tate and seems to be everything we're looking for.  In a couple of years.

I'll take the game experience of Tate and Denard and hope that the 1-2 punch of a throwing QB that can run and a running QB that can throw are enough to make it tough for any defense to prepare for our offense.

pullin4blue

August 21st, 2010 at 6:22 PM ^

Furman was one I left out, not because I didn't think he played well, just because they all played well and it was much more difficult to single-out a defensive player than the offense. He is a hell of an athlete.

It was not meant as a slight to anyone. Everyone will be pleasantly surprised. I know I was.

turbo cool

August 21st, 2010 at 6:34 PM ^

T. Talbot looked good? I'm going to go ahead and assume for my sake (and so that I will sleep well tonight) that you were referring to Terrence Talbot and he will no doubt be an All-American this season. Oh, and hopefully Terry contributes this year.

pullin4blue

August 21st, 2010 at 6:35 PM ^

I couldn't even guess who will replace T-Wolf. A lot of guys got playing time. No-one was outstanding. It was hard to evaluate the secondary because of play calling. There were probably only 2-3 deep balls per QB for the entire scrimmage. Some were over/under thrown, but nothing like the Gardner pass at the Spring game. Some of this may have been intentional on RR's part. Not many guys (aside from Hopkins and Grady) made it into the secondary. When they did, Hopkins was tough to take down. Otherwise, they really flowed well. If the corner saw the play developing to one side, they were on top of things. I wish I could tell you more in specific. My daughter wouldn't let me take notes like I wanted to.

switch26

August 21st, 2010 at 6:36 PM ^

I like hearing about all these young guys considering we will have them with us for the next 3 to 4 years still..  This team is gonna be one hell of a team to watch in the coming years i think.

 

Awesome to hear about M-Rob with the big interception.  He looks like a fing monster, and I want to see him dish out some pain at some point this year.

BlueGoM

August 21st, 2010 at 6:47 PM ^

"I also think there is NO WAY that Gardner will redshirt."

 

I wasn't at the scrimmage and don't  take it the wrong way, but I really hope to NOT see another freshman at QB for a long while.

I think most people here would admit  that DRob and DG are more athletic than Forcier, but experience matters too.  I'd have Gardener RS this season, let him learn the offense, work with DRob and Tate.  We can with with both of those kids.

Don

August 21st, 2010 at 7:19 PM ^

You and 116 head coaches, none of whom WANTS to start a pure freshman; they only do it if the alternatives are worse. I guarantee Lloyd would have preferred Matt Gutierrez to be the starter in 2004, but injuries happen. We were fortunate to have a freshman as talented as Henne on hand. Gardner may be talented as hell, but I saw him in the spring game, and from what I read about his performance today, it's the same thing: he's a pure freshman who is going to make pure freshman mistakes. RR has had a career's worth of pure freshman (or functional equivalent thereof) mistakes the last two years; running the spread option correctly simply takes a lot of time to learn, and Gardner ain't there yet. If, God forbid, either Tate or Denard go down, then Gardner is likely to play as a backup, but I would be shocked to see him in action if Tate and Denard stay healthy.

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:52 AM ^

Every drill had the 3 QBs going in order at the same time the 1s and 2s (for the rest of the O) alternated.  So, after six sets, each QB had had one chance with the 1s and one chance with the 2s.

It got mixed up a bit later, but I really think they're just trying to get quality reps for all the QBs at this point.

If I had to predict, and if Tate and Denard both stay healthy, I'd say that Denard is your starter and that Denard and Tate share almost equal PT with Devin getting the redshirt.  

(Look to my first post on this topic and remind yourself that I'm just a stupid fan -- I don't really know anything.)

Lil Michigan Man 7

August 21st, 2010 at 6:56 PM ^

I think unless DG wins the QB position and is miles ahead of where tate and denard were last year (which i dont think is the case) DG should redshirt so he has two years to start and dominate. I really dont want to waste a year for him to ride the pine, and three years in a row with a true freshmen starting isn't good.

grumpy130lm

August 21st, 2010 at 7:01 PM ^

Lets hope that Gardner WILL redshirt...give the kid a chance to learn and develop and not implode as it seems Tate is doing. I believe our wideouts will surprise many a defense....but we need to have that time in the pocket to get those throws out

Don

August 21st, 2010 at 7:04 PM ^

If his shoulder is still not 100% (something I suspect might be the case), that might partially explain throwing behind receivers.

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:54 AM ^

...Tate looked pretty good throwing the ball.  I'm not a great judge, but the throws from all 3 looked crisp.   On one scramble near the endzone, Tate had a patented "Tate" play where he made something out of nothing.  I think RR is trying to get him to get back to playing with MOST of the moxie he showed in the first few games last year while demonstrating that he's learned more about the O and is making better decisions.

snowcrash

August 21st, 2010 at 7:12 PM ^

Did both Gordons play well, or just one of them?

Good to hear that Gardner is progressing, but if he's clearly behind Robinson he shouldn't play unless Robinson gets hurt--and in that case, if Forcier and Gardner seem to be at roughly the same level we should play Forcier. True freshman QBs should only play as a last resort. In 2014, we don't want to be watching a bunch of young QBs struggle while thinking, "gee, we sure could have used Gardner about now."

joegeo

August 21st, 2010 at 7:15 PM ^

We have 3 qbs without a redshirt.  I would hope we could manage to reshirt one of these guys this year.  There's really no reason to be tossing 3 qbs onto the field (assuming no injuries).

wolverine1987

August 21st, 2010 at 7:19 PM ^

And thank you. Another poster tweeted that the CB's played very soft and were burned several times. Was that your impression as well? That and any further impressions on pass coverage would be appreciated.

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:57 AM ^

There weren't many deep balls.  I tried to remind myself to watch, watch, watch the corners, but after so few balls were thrown that way, it was much easier to focus on the ball.  Mostly middle runs and possession passes, which the O did very efficiently.

The always present question is: "Is the O this good, or is the D this bad?"  We'll find out soon.

pullin4blue

August 21st, 2010 at 7:18 PM ^

Look, with respect to the QB's I was someone who was firmly in the Tate camp. He has more game experience, has been in some very difficult situations and has been raised to be a QB since age 4. However, the offseason has been very kind to Denard. Maybe it's because Denard worked hard in the offseason and Tate didn't. Maybe, as the Mathlete has discussed, there is a closing of the gap between QB's between year one and year two. 

The refs were calling one-hand touch for the QB's. even with this, Denard had a 49 yd run, just missing the TD (by 1 yd) because he was touched. Anyone who thinks he could have been caught has another thing coming. A touch doesn't equal a tackle.

Tate had a great TD, but it was a reverse to Grady. Grady showed good judgement in open-field and the yards were certainly earned. Tate had several fade routes for TD's that were badly overthrown.

Gardner shows just too much promise to keep him on the sideline. I would like nothing more than to have him redshirt. He made some good decisions with the pocket collapsing and dumped the ball to his back or got outside the tackles and threw it away. Great decision making for a freshman. If we need a spark, I can see him giving it to us. 

Kennedy played one series and looked pretty good, but it was against the 3's and 4's on defense so I wouldn't count it toward much. 

I rode the elevator after the game with Jamie Morris and he was just beaming. He was very happy with the day. 

steve sharik

August 21st, 2010 at 11:15 PM ^

The refs were calling one-hand touch for the QB's. even with this, Denard had a 49 yd run, just missing the TD (by 1 yd) because he was touched. Anyone who thinks he could have been caught has another thing coming. A touch doesn't equal a tackle.

So when did we get Usain Bolt on our defense?

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 1:59 AM ^

It looked like Kennedy was brought in so that the D could try to rush the QB unabated.  He was the only QB without the yellow "no touch" QB jersey on.

As I've said in other parts of the thread, I thought Devin was physically impressive, but as the day wore on, it became more obvious to me that he was further behind Denard and Tate as far as understanding of the offense.

XxNoRemorsExX

August 22nd, 2010 at 12:44 PM ^

Kennedy, poor S.O.B.  How would you like to be that guy?  Go on in son.  You're gonna be our target practice/tackling dummy for a while now.  Now go get 'em.  I realize it's a necessary evil, but you almost have to feel bad for him in a way.

ajscipione

August 21st, 2010 at 7:18 PM ^

great information. I'm a little surprised about Tate not being more improved than he is. I believe the offense will be very strong this year with either Tate or Denard. I worry about the secondary  though, especially in the early part of the season. I think M will win quite a few games this year (8-4) mainly because the offense will be so hard stop.

mvp

August 22nd, 2010 at 2:01 AM ^

As I've said in other parts of the thread, I disagree with this part of the OPs assessment.  I think Tate was making better decisions and showing more grasp of the offense than last year.  

Again and again, all 3 QBs lead the team down the field, but Tate and Denard seemed ahead of Devin to me.

Don't give up on Tate!

MGoLiteral

August 21st, 2010 at 7:34 PM ^

I really hope RR plays DG this year, even if it's only for mop up duty at the end of games. There is a lot riding on this season and I would hope RR pulls out all the stops in order to make this season a successful one. Anything can happen (injuries, transfers) and we need to be prepared for that. The QB position is so critical in this offense that we have to prepare for the worst.  I'd rather not start a QB with ZERO game-time experience if both Tate/D-Rob are unavailable. Give Gardner some opportunities to play this year; break him in a little bit. I think it will pay off in both the short- and long-term and improve competition throughout the year.

Blue-Chip

August 21st, 2010 at 7:53 PM ^

DG wasting a year of eligibility in garbage time is RR "pulling out all the stops"?  The OP stated that DG looked almost as good as Tate.  My math tells me that makes him our third best QB.  That being the case we would have a dynamic starter (assuming OP is correct on D-Rob being the number 1), and an experienced backup.  If this is the case, playing DG in mop up duty is dually problematic.  He loses a year to start at the back end of his time at U of M, and you keep Tate from staying sharp.

snowcrash

August 21st, 2010 at 8:01 PM ^

You could make that argument for literally every team with a true freshman qb. Burning Gardner's redshirt on the off chance that Robinson and Forcier both get hurt at the same time might improve our win expectation in 2010 by about 0.01 games, as I don't think that garbage time experience against UMass' or BG's backups is good prep for Big 10 defenses. In contrast, a 5th year senior Gardner in 2014 might make our win expectation about 3 games higher than a redshirt junior Sousa or some random frosh/soph. (Compare the hypothetical 2001 season with senior Henson to the actual 2001 season with sophomore Navarre.)