Ray Jackson: Fab 5 would've won NCAA title w/Beilein as coach
Subs fever is nationwide.
"No disrespect to Steve Fisher, but I think the Fab Five would have actually won a title if we had Coach Beilein." - Ray Jackson
You are disrespecting.
But he's entitled to his own opinion!
It's the same thing as "no offense, but..."
I may or may not have been guilty of using this "I totally intend to offend" wind-up in the past.
"I may be wrong, but....."
I was at a dinner last month and had a chance to speak to Gene Keady for about ten minutes. We talked Michigan basketball as much as Purdue basketball. I had to laugh when he said, "Can you believe what Fisher is doing at San Diego State? He must have hired some good assistants because when I coached against him he had tons of talent but didn't have a clue what he was doing."
he learned a little as his career went on.
I really don't think Gene Keady can talk much here. He had the best player in the country for two years and a pretty impressive supporting cast and did not make a Final Four. Pot v. Kettle.
And no Final Fours to show. I think Fisher did pretty good with two Final Fours and an Elite Eight in his first five years as HC. I don't even think it's Pot v. Kettle. Fish is a good coach. And I doubt any coach outside of Dean Smith could have handled all that talent and attitude.
I concur..I think...Only because that Duke team was very good and could beat anyone on any given night and i tend to think Fisher also could have won that game but we just didnt play our best game.. And the same for the UNC loss, just didnt play our best game and im not sure the coach was to blame
actually coached his ass off in the UNC National Title Game. He went to Pelinka really early when it was clear that the team was not in a grove and also designed some really good plays late to get us back in it, two of them involving Ray Jackson actually. If Ray Jackson gets his left football behind the 3 point line with about a minute to go that ball game is tied. He also switched Jimmy onto Donald Williams and quited him down after he went ham for a good portion of the first half. Kentucky was a coaching gem as well against a legend.
I was thinking the same thing watching the game. He really got off the hook because of the timeout. Fisher coached well that entire tournament, especially in the Final Four.
Even though Fisher's dad gets credit for the suggestion, he ultimately was the one who decided to start the Fab Five together.
People never give Fisher credit for that 1989 team, but I think Fisher did more coaching on that team than he gets credit. Frieder was known for putting the team together and letting his assistant handle much of the coaching. His substitution pattern in the Sweet 16 against UNC was masterful. He substituted regularly and used his TO's to keep the team fresh and prevent any UNC runs...something they did not do the two previous years they got bounced from the tourney by that school. End result was we had a fresher team that closed out the game.
Fisher is perfect for SDSU. He did a good job here. That said, I think Ray is right. When the Fab 5 were here, as I recall, Fisher mostly rolled out the ball and let them play. It wasn't a bad strategy given the talent they had, but Beilein has shown that he can get the most out of his players--whether or not highly athletic.
The real question is, "How would mini-Beilein do against the Jordan/Pipkins Bulls?"
there isn't anyone better than Beilein. You're right about Fisher. . . he let them play and allowed the chemistry to take over. . .
Since when is Pipkins a two sport athlete, let alone the time traveling?
I wholeheartedly agree.
I think Beilein is a better coach than Fisher (and that's not to say Fish isn't good), but to hear him say it . . . wow.
Jackson got better every year he was here, although perhaps he could have become a more consistent 3-point shooter under Beilein. But the guy who I think could have really benefitted from Beilein was Jimmy King, who had the raw talent but didn't become the complete player he could have.
They're both mammals...
A (non-false) killer whale is a type of dolphin.
always thought i was the only one checking out the wikipedia "hybrid animal" page
worst kind of mammal there is.
worst kind of mammal there is.
Also known as a LOLphin.
That's good enough for Sparty!
Well, if Izzo had been their coach, they wouldn't have won it all, but they'd have had a crackerjack list of excuses to explain why.
Someone help me out here, how do you inbed Youtube?
Oh, did you mean embed? Not sure.
I'm not so sure Beilein would've recruited all five of them...given the personal profile of the type of player he prefers to have on the team...
It's possible, but I bet he gets Jalen, Juwan and Webber. Jalen and Webber were the top two in-state players, and were top-10 nationally. Any coach would have recruited them. And Juwan was another top-top guy in our backyward who was high in Michigan early and committed early. I'd bet we'd have that trio.
James Young was a 2013 from Rochester (MI) was #11 overall and Michigan and MSU both stayed away from him I believe. Not suggesting Jalen and Chris are the same, but Beilein has shown that he'll pass on super-blue chips in favor of his type of players that he's scouted out himself
Beilein I whink would have landed Eric Montross the previous recruiting class, sending Chris and/or Juwann elsewhere (Webber and Howard have said as much). I suspect Webber and Rose may have been a near-package deal.
I don't think Beilein would have sacrificed his integrity to hire Perry Watson, who most people back then thought "delivered" Rose and Webber to Michigan. This would have kept Watson's "friend" Ed Martin from having a presence at Michigan.
I agree to a point because i think Coach Beilein would have them ready to play. The fab five cruised through the regular season half caring and then let their "nuts hang" every ncaa tourney. They where one of the most fun and exciting teams to watch and if you have never seen any of their games, you should really watch them.
He may be right who knows. My hope is that unlike last year we don't have to hear the fab fives thoughts on everything and what seats they will be in for every game will Webber show up can Webber show up. They were a very special team who did amazing things. But this is a special team as well who has the potential to do them one better and win the title. Thats what I want to hear about.
Your avatar makes me want beer everytime I see it. Aaaaaand now I'm drinking beer.
He right
This tastes bad to me.
Watching games, college and pro, from the 80s to early 90s, I don't recall any coaches that fully took in the import of the three point shot. It took time for that to sink in to coaching strategy and for players to develop that skill. In the old days there were a handful of three point specialists (and there are still players like that today), but now many players focus on the 3 point shot. Much of Beilein's strategy is to shoot the 3 or get a layup. He is not the only coach to approach it that way, but he is very good at it. Was he doing this 20 years ago? What was his style then, and would it have made a difference? Would he have known what to do with Chris Webber in the post? I am not sure Beilien knew what to do with a good post player 5 years ago. It is too easy to impose today's experience on 1993. Having said that, it certainly would have been interesting, but I don't believe we could have beaten that Duke team as freshman. North Carolina? Yes.
Point on Fisher. The BTN show on the 1989 team suggested that Frieder was not an x's and o's guy (explains the enormous waste of talent), and that an immediate change Fisher made was to use Terry Mills in the post. Fisher did a lot of good things.
I seem to recall Mount Saint Mary's crushing us with threes more than twenty years ago.
And I agree with you, no way that group beats Duke with any coach (except possibly Coach K), but they could run with UNC.
I think you mean Loyola Marymount.
Or Little Sisters of the Poor, whoever. I stand corrected. Didn't they put 100 on us? I'm too lazy to look it up.
404 file not found, aka These are not the droids you are looking for.
We scored 115 . . . and still lost by 30. Intervention from the great beyond.
In 1990-1991 his LeMoyne team made 198 threes on the season to their opponents' 136; in 1991-1992 it was 184-133.
http://lemoynedolphins.com/sports/mbkb/history/stats/BBalltime/1990.HTM
That was in about 30 games each year, so it's only 20-25% fewer than Michigan's hit this year. He integrated the three into his offense pretty early.
John Beilein could take his and beat yours or take yours and beat his. The elite of the elite. A no brainer for Big Ten Coach of the Year.
— Jon Rothstein (@JonRothstein) March 5, 2014