Michigan-Belleville problems cost us 5 star Damon Payne
According to Sam on the Inside Michigan Recruiting podcast latest episode, the tension between the coaches from Michigan and Belleville “for sure” has had a negative effect on Damon Payne’s recruitment and is why he is leaving MI to play college football.
Payne is a 5 star #1 DT nationally, #1 player in MI. Consensus seems to be that he’s heading down South but OSU is listed as warm on his 247 profile.
Thee old double post. Sorry.
Give yourself credit - it was a triple post!
Lots of you are sleeping on the St Thomas Aquinas inroads the staff is making in Florida. Give me a time-tested consistent program in the most talent-rich state over a lake town Detroit suburb with a vain PSL staff that's battling the Pinckneys, Livonias and South Lyons of the world. (I love all you in Kensington/Western Lakes league country).
Thank you! Michigan has bigger fish to fry than Belleville. It doesn't mean you ignore Belleville/in-state recruits, but you need the talented guys from other states to succeed. Ultimately, there's very little top-end talent within the state. It's sad but true.
There are 10(!) 247 four stars from the state of Michigan. Not one was poached by OSU. I think you could at least acknowledge there is legitimate cause for frustration when there is an opportunity to have a foundation of top talent, in-state recruits.
It doesn't fit the narrative that Harbaugh is an angel/god who has decided Michigan talent is not that good, and it doesn't squeeze into the narrow window of "he got money to go to X"
Clearly there is no discernible strategy with Harbaugh and recruiting, but you know, give him another 5-10 years and LOOK OUT!
I will acknowledge no such thing.
Here's who was drafted in 2020 from the top 25 in-state prospects over the past five years:
Khalid Kareem (5th round)
Michael Onwenu (6th round)
Donovan Peoples-Jones (6th round)
Given roughly equal rankings, I would take a kid from Florida over a kid from Michigan.
Michigan's last 1st round pick from the State of Michigan was Brandon Graham in 2010.
We've missed out on players to OSU, PSU, Wisconsin, Kentucky, LSU and Georgia in the last few years but there's "very little top end talent" here?
What has that top end talent done at those places. Hamler was a miss and Weber was supposed to sign, but other than that........
Well Logan Brown, Lance Dixon, Anthony Bradford, and D'wan Mathis were all freshman last year.
Justin Rogers, Enzo Jennings, and Cam Martinez just got on campus.
I'd say it's a bit early to tell but to say the state doesnt have talent is pretty ridiculous.
...and some of them will bomb. They all sound good when they're 5- and 4-star recruits, but they don't look so hot when they're 5th or 6th round picks. Not that being picked in the 6th round isn't an accomplishment, but 6th rounders aren't difference makers.
Here are the top 5 in-state guys from 2016, for a random sampling:
1. Michael Onwenu (6th round)
2. Lavert Hill (UDFA)
3. Donnie Corley (kicked out of MSU)
4. Daelin Hayes (headed for 5th year at ND)
5. Trishton Jackson (UDFA)
Oh, maybe that was an off year. Let's look at 2015:
1. Brian Cole (7th round)
2. Mike Weber (UDFA)
3. Kyonta Stallworth (transferred out of MSU)
4. Alex Malzone (transferred to Miami-OH)
5. John Kelly (6th round)
Well, crap. Maybe 2014 is better:
1. Malik McDowell (2nd round)
2. Damon Webb (UDFA)
3. Drake Harris (transferred to WMU)
4. Lawrence Marshall (undrafted)
5. Byron Bullough (undrafted)
There. Your one shining example is Malik McDowell, who basically went to Seattle and decided he didn't want to be rich and famous anymore if he couldn't ride 4-wheelers. That's 15 top prospects, and there's a wacky 2nd rounder, two 6th-rounders, and one 7th.
Let me go check out Florida's #48-52 recruits from 2014, since Jaydon Hood is #48 in Florida.
48. Nigel Bethel (transferred, never did much)
49. Quincy Wilson (2nd round)
50. Isaiah Ford (7th round)
51. Brandon Powell (UDFA)
52. Mike Smith (undrafted)
Hmph. Well, I guess that supports my point. Michigan can go to Florida, stumble into some mid-level recruits, and come back with just as much production as if they stayed in the state and got the top 5 guys.
You're saying kids from the state of Michigan aren't getting drafted high right here and aren't worth pursuing as much, but on the first page of this thread are touting Michigan's defensive line draft picks (with a lot of them in later rounds)?
This comparison is so asinine I almost can't fathom it. The fact that you mention it as if it somehow counter acts his point, when it really just highlights your inability to comprehend what people are saying, is the comical cherry on top.
Magnus is talking about Michigan HS players in this comment chain.
On the first page, he is talking about players who attend the University of Michigan that come from any state.
How are these two comparable?
Because you can't use the argument that we as a program put a bunch of players in the draft (in later rounds) as such a plus, but then say players from the state of Michigan aren't difference makers because they go in later rounds. That contradicts itself.
LOL. It’s actually kind of the opposite.
There are clear reasons to go to Michigan. Period.
There are also clear reasons why Michigan shouldn’t recruit a ton of in-state players.
I should date Kate Upton if I have a chance, but that doesn’t mean she should date me.
Give me 5 star Damon Payne or a few three stars from Florida.
Or maybe Payne just wanna leave Michigan. If I was a 5 star recruit and I lived in Detroit for pretty much my whole life, I'd wanna leave too.
Supposedly his relationship with OSU has improved a little. It's been said he doesn't like spending a lot of time talking with recruiters,so it's been difficult to get a read on him. I would really be surprised if UM wouldn't put on the full court press to get him. Maybe that's the problem,Harbaugh is already tired of dealing with the prima donnas in recruiting. Payne may not be a prima donna just not a real talkative person or simply very guarded. OSU lost the #1 rated player in Ohio 2 years in a row or for the #1 OT to ND and Clemson under Warinner @ the time it really hurt because OL depth was a problem.
Did Sam say if they still had a chance of getting back in with him or a lost cause and moving on? Seeing how a in-state 5* and #1 DT in the country is never good losing out on so close. Couldn't seem them giving up on such a great prospect.
Shuan Nua was put on Belleville not too long ago. He was making efforts there despite knowing that Payne was a "lost cause". Meaning the relationship was so bad there was no way Payne was going to reconsider and go to Michigan. He made the efforts there anyway. This was supposedly "noticed" by the Belleville staff, meaning they appreciated it.
Then all the recent nonsense with Buddin happened. Webb's said Michigan is now pulling out (phrasing). So no, probably never was a chance and now there is zero chance.
I'll continue to say that the Belleville coach is doing a serious disservice to his players. Michigan is one of the best academic schools in the country. Now if Payne goes to Kentucky and football doesn't work out? He'll be fine, it's a decent enough school. Would he be much, much better off with a Michigan degree? Yep. Both if we wanted to stay in-state with his career or go national.
I hope he decides to attend Alabama or Clemson and not OSU.
I love you but that’s a lot of surmising about what’s going on in a high school kids brain
Payne was a lock to come to Michigan until the Belleville-Michigan problem made him completely change his mind
I am a very serious and informed internet analyst
Fire Harbaugh, this is unacceptable!!!!11
This will go well.
Too, funny. Feelings.
This feud is getting annoying. Jermain Crowell seems like Jason Brown from last chance u. Brings in lots of talent but thinks he’s bigger than he is and acts childish. He probably talks a lot about his cadillacs and beach house.
Ah, buying into the bullshit read on a Michigan message board and making a "really informed" decision to trash a coach and program.
THEE Michigan difference.
Whats the real story then board member?
Harbaugh trashed him. boo hoo. Michigan is one of the best schools in the country, period. You don't let your ego get in the way of student athletes.
Yeah I mean go ahead and let us know what really happened. I've said before that I think Harbaugh and Zordich could change how they handle kids with injuries. And that it takes 2 people to create issues and solve them.
But I mean, Crowell decided to pick a fight with the best in-state school with a lot of alumni and a rabid fanbase. Should we all give him the benefit of the doubt? I really dont see why. Do we give Urban Meyer the benefit of the doubt? No we dont. Seems to me Crowell made his bed, and if he/you are so thin skinned you cant take shit from Michigan fans on a message board then my comment is more spot on than I thought.
and he wasn't a great WR for the lions either.
Jim pissing off people everywhere he goes what's new.
Kinda like looking in the mirror huh?
We won't know if it cost us anything for another 3-4 years. Count me in the crowd that will be happy with a lower ranked recruit who plays better competition in high school, than one who is highly rated against lower competition.
This is such a sensational title. The body is at least more reasonable saying that it had a negative effect on Payne, but let's not act like he was gift wrapped to Michigan at some point in his recruitment. The Belleville stuff started with Dobbs and Barnett in 2019, so this rift didn't suddenly come in and interrupt Payne's recruitment with Michigan.
Meh. Truth is always somewhere in the middle. All I want to know is ....when do we beat OSU.
Not for a LONG time. Until we start recruiting more talent to Match what OSU brings in things look very bleak. But we can become the 2nd best team in the B1G ahead of PSU. It is like the chicken and egg scenario! We need to upset OSU to get the talent or we need to get the talent to beat OSU. What will happen first?
if only 2016. . .
I’m not going to say that Michigan beating Ohio St is bleak.You can clearly see Jim making changes and tweaking the team every off season to get better. Hence the change to a spread offense, the hiring of Warnier the season before last and bringing in Gattis last season. You can also see the change in scouting of players after the 2017 class, I think they did great job scouting on the 18 & 19 classes, you can also look at the lower rated recruits and their contributions to team recently and Michigan is doing well. They brought in new coaches on defense and they are tweaking things. I trust the coaching staff.
Not sure one high school is going to tip the balance....
Coach is building a recruiting class of 20 to 30 athletes a year, out of the entire country, why worry about one school with a coach willing to limit HIS athlete's choices due to personal feelings? I mean Bellville isn't IMG.
I don't know, you just might want to be known and respected in your own back yard
They do have the #1 prospect
Remember the days when we all used to yell "THE best players in Michigan go to Michigan" and not try to justify the coach's failure by downplaying the kids?
Donovan Edwards should be #1.
That was back when we at least beat OSU half the time we played them. Kids who are playing HS football grew up with Michigan being so/so and not elite with no B1G championship, except for a fluke one that Hoke won in 2011.
As much as I’d like to argue against this it is sadly a fact. These current recruits were in diapers when we last won the B1G.
At least to me that will always be the legacy of Lloyd Carr. Walking out of the building when it’s burning down and getting out just in time before it collapsed. We would’ve been bad in 2008 even if Les Miles came. Would’ve been in the Motor City Bowl at 6-6.
We haven't beat OSU half the time in 20 years, it hasn't been that long since we could at least count on getting the best players in the state.
We haven't beat OSU half the time in 20 years, it hasn't been that long since we could at least count on getting the best players in the state.
The best players in Michigan go to Michigan if they stay in Michigan.
I fixed it for ya.
Life goes on .... even if you miss on a Top in-state recruit.
Payne has been going south for months. Neither us nor MSU were ever in contention for him