Ticket Watch is Going to Disneyland Comment Count

Seth December 15th, 2023 at 1:27 PM

Sponsor Note: Thank TicketIQ, our longtime ticket sponsors, and specifically Greg Cohen, who's the reader there who's been like "I am throwing money at you; please write a Ticket Watch." Greg is also throwing money at YOU: if you use the code MGO50 through the end of this month you'll get $50 off your purchase at TicketIQ.

The thing about TicketIQ is the price they say is the price you pay. This makes a big difference for an expensive game like this, because the fees get jacked. For example the get-in at Stubhub says "$539" right now but when you get to checkout that ticket is $732, whereas it's $702 at TicketIQ. Section 6 Row 75 on Seatgeek is $1041 at checkout, $954 on IQ. Section 2 Row 57 is $933 on Vivid, six rows down is $819 on IQ.

Anyway if you're going to buy a ticket on the secondary market, always try our friends first. Greg even said you can reach out to him personally at [email protected] if you find a better deal on the same seats.

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THE GRANDADDY

bhl_bl008887_full_3504_1361__0_native

[UM Bentley Historical Library]

This is my first Rose Bowl. It apparently is for a lot of other people too; Greg mentioned 75% of their buyers are Michigan fans. Bama fans travel well, but they've been to a lot of games, and Michigan hasn't been to Pasadena in a long time, so we are why the prices are historically high for this one.

Via Greg, we've already passed the price peak. The market gets wild when the game is announced, and this one got particularly wild because Michigan fans got a head start and then Alabama fans were all unleashed at once. Prices shot up by 68% in the first few days after the game was announced, and peaked a few days ago as people rushed to secure seats to the game before seats on a plane. Greg:

The last 48 hours have seen the first drop in price this month. The get-in price for a single ticket dropped from $711 to $673 (-5%), the get-in price for two tickets dropped from $717 to $664 (-7%) The average list price dropped from $1,506 to $1,317 (-13%).

[After THE JUMP: Let's talk strategy, Championship, next year's season tickets, and what's up with ticket price inflation?]

There are still at least 6,000 seats left, which is good news for those willing to be patient. Also the prices are starting to come down, following a trend we saw when Michigan faced an SEC team in the Playoff two years ago.

The bad news is most of these are in the hands of ticket brokers. These are professionals who accumulate seats then jack up the market to turn a profit on fans who will convince themselves they have to bite the bullet to feel secure. They are better at this game than you are, and expect to lose money on seats sold later in order to jack up the get-in price today. They list their tickets in groups of 4 and 2 and drop and raise prices by increments of one at the top of the stadium while holding back the middle seats to artificially inflate the average ticket price. The only way to beat them is patience.

Mixed in with the brokers are season ticket holders who put in expecting to be able to sell them if they couldn't go. As the game gets closer, some people who said they could go are going to not be able to, and they are the people you'd most like to buy from. You can find them on message boards, Craigslist, and by refreshing the online sites a lot in the latter days of December. You can tell they're re-entering the market because singles start to go on sale.

People preferring to sit with with the Michigan allotment will want to be on the WEST (under the boxes) and NORTH sections.

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But you'll get a mix everywhere.

THE CHAMPIONSHIP

If you're thinking you'd like to go, and you're going to be using the secondary market, the tickets are probably not going to be cheaper. Michigan fans are the most likely to be booking those early, meaning there won't be a lot of sell-offs.

NEXT YEAR

I'm not usually in favor of this, but next year's home schedule is so jam-packed with interesting games that you might as well get in line for season tickets. If you miss out and still attend every game using the secondary market, you're probably still paying about the same, but then you're getting worse seats and don't get the rewards/access/points with them. I don't think we'll see another year where season tickets are actually worth what you have to pay for them, but MSU with a new coach smell will be a big draw, USC and Texas will be big affairs, and even Oregon is likely to be a huge draw, since the Ducks are a title contender.

WHY DON'T YOU TICKET WATCH WHEN GREG ISN'T FORCING YOU TO?

Because the market has been Ticketmastered and it's depressing. Since tickets have moved to paperless, the schools and the resellers are able to control almost the entire secondary market. They use that control to inflate the market to an incredible degree, with fees on both ends that account for more than half of actual transactions. Say I wanted to sell my lower bowl seats to the EMU game tomorrow:

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Note the promise to "optimize the listing price." That means they can change the resale price to more as well as less. Now that they're listed, let's see what I can buy seats from that row for (I can't be sure they're my specific seats because others in the row are probably on here too):

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The fees they charged are more than what I listed the tickets for! Now imagine how much they're making off these Section 18 tickets for Texas next year:

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Their actual overhead to "process" this digital transaction is minimal. The bulk of that money goes to kickbacks to the venues (read: Michigan's payment for the exclusive), and the political clout to keep fans from using their republican system of government to get between them and unfair business practices. To keep the market high they cater to brokers who artificially inflate the prices of most tickets while letting a few drip out at a time. The latest trick is this promise to "optimize" prices so they can sell your ticket for more than you listed it for and pocket the difference.

There are a few interlopers (e.g. our sponsor) who've been maintaining more democratic exchanges, but politically and systemically the ticketing industry is very good at suppressing these markets on the supply end (mostly with ticket security), and generate so many legal headaches for them that they couldn't operate closer to the market if they wanted. I find the whole thing unethical, hate that my school is a prime practioner of it (their deal with SeatGeek gouges their fans even more than their old deal with StubHub), and lament the unlikelihood of a remedy anytime soon. Since I don't want to talk about this every week, and have picked up plenty else to talk about, I've mostly dropped this column except for bowl games.

Comments

Nickel

December 15th, 2023 at 1:52 PM ^

Appreciate the writeup! My first Rose Bowl was Jan 1, 1998, I was a freshman so I and a buddy had tickets but we had to pick them up physically out in Pasadena back then. I think as soon as we got out of line some brokers were offering us $500 for the pair. Obviously we didn't take it and I still have that paper ticket to this day.

Ticketmaster (and most of the industry) sucks with the way they've become such vampires on the system.

Ferg0dsakes

December 15th, 2023 at 2:34 PM ^

I was a sophomore.   I remember when my friends and I took our paid-for, student-ticket vouchers and exchanged them for paper tickets on site, the scalpers where there waiting.  A guy approached us and said, "holy shit are those SEVEN together?  I'll give you a thousand dollars each."  No deal.  Can't put a price on the best day of my life. 

philthy66

December 15th, 2023 at 2:02 PM ^

Yes I remember the year the secondary ticket market took over. Trying to buy Tigers opening Day tickets. They went on sale at a specific time. I was hitting refresh on my computer over and over until the Buy Tickers icon appeared. I was fast, man. Like, probably 10 seconds after they went on sale I was in there. Sold out. Sold out 10 seconds in. Never tried again cause the average consumer no longer stands a chance. 

Perkis-Size Me

December 15th, 2023 at 2:04 PM ^

If I recall correctly, we paid near $500 in fees alone to get into the Orange Bowl against Georgia two years ago. And that was sitting in the nosebleeds about ten rows from the top. 

Going to these games is like taking the family to Disney World for a weekend. You're breaking the bank just to get in the freaking door, and that's before food, merch, and whatever other incidentals you incur along the way. Instead of this being your vacation for the year, its your vacation for the next 2-3 years.....

But they know that people are going to still keep paying for it, so why not continue to keep hiking up the prices, I guess. 

MichiganAggie

December 15th, 2023 at 2:23 PM ^

Is there a forum where Michigan fans can sell directly to Michigan fans and not have to pay these asinine fees? I've come across a couple Facebook groups but they are locked down

gbdub

December 15th, 2023 at 2:29 PM ^

Thanks for this feature Seth!

A couple questions:

1) I got seats in Section 24, since it’s on the “Michigan” side. But per your map I’m in the “wrong” end zone. Am I doomed to be surrounded by obnoxious Saban slappies?

2) I understand you have to shill for the sponsor, but as a buyer I’ve honestly been a little underwhelmed by TicketIQ. While the prices can be a bit lower, your own example shows that the difference is much less than the StubHub fee - i.e. TicketIQ is still charging most of the fee somewhere, you just don’t see it listed as a separate line item at checkout.

Don’t get me wrong, the fees do seem a little cheaper (maybe 10% of the ticket price max, which is not nothing on a $700 ticket) but calling this a “more democratic” seller is laying it on a bit thick.

And on top of all that you can search with fees included on StubHub with just a couple extra clicks.

Bottom line: when I shopped for the Fiesta Bowl last year, I tried to support the blog sponsor but I still was seeing a better “out the door” price on equivalent tickets (not the *exact* seats, but same section and row) to the tune of $50 per seat. I ended up getting a great deal from an MGoBlogger and didn’t use either site, but if I had it would have been StubHub. 

That said I think that was largely driven by  inventory on TicketIQ being lower (not everyone lists on both sites) and this year, at least as of today, TicketIQ has the best prices and inventory numbers closer to StubHub. 

Seth

December 15th, 2023 at 2:35 PM ^

The problem is supply. The more people who list on TicketIQ the better the market will be for people buying on there. They're aware. They also gave readers a $50 discount code and said "If you find this seat elsewhere for less email me" and let me share his email address above. Don't know if they can show more good faith than that.

gbdub

December 15th, 2023 at 3:02 PM ^

To be clear I’m not saying they are a bad seller. They seem reliable, a bit cheaper, and have good taste in sponsorships. Just that:

1) Their site tagline “Fee-free event tickets” is misleading. They still charge a significant markup (well over $100 a ticket) vs. what the seller ever sees. 

2) Price matching on the “same” seats might be a weak promise if they don’t have the inventory to match. 

pz

December 15th, 2023 at 4:35 PM ^

Just FYI I was looking to make sure I shopped the right place yesterday and the "$upport (lol)" link still just contains a StubHub affiliate link. May want to update to TicketIQ?

This homepage post is probably more relevant, but figured just in case I wasn't the only person searching for it on the Support page.

rob f

December 15th, 2023 at 2:32 PM ^

Wow.  Thanks for the lowdown, Seth.

Online ticketing is even far dirtier than I ever imagined.  I'm now more opposed than ever to dealing with that den of thieves that controls the athletic ticket secondary markets.

BlueDad2022

December 15th, 2023 at 2:42 PM ^

Thanks Seth!   Did it the other way.   Already prepaid the CY Pasadena (very very expensive), and airfare from East Coast (very expensive), so pretty much locked in to buying tickets eventually but have just been watching so far.   Appreciate the advice and another option v StubHub.

LAmichigan

December 15th, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^

Prices on all entertainment is up, up, up since the pandemic.  Concert tickets?  Get ready to drop $500-$1,000 per seat for a good act.   If your city has the Theatre you'll pay hundreds.  Lions are what now, minimum $250 get-in price.  

What was get-in price for the Ohio State game?  $1,000?

We, the people who want to go to these events, are the ones driving up these costs.  We came out of the pandemic so ANGRY to spend all the money we could.

Bottom line these days folks, if you wanna go, you gotta make some dough.

NittanyFan

December 15th, 2023 at 3:59 PM ^

It may be too late (sounds like you sold the Rose Bowl tix already) and maybe you did check this one --- but Bakersfield (BFL) is much closer to Pasadena (120 miles) than either Phoenix or Vegas, and almost always has relatively reasonable prices.  It's off most people's radars as a "SoCal" airport.  Fresno is more of a drive, but worth a check IMO too.

Flexie94

December 15th, 2023 at 2:54 PM ^

My history:

  • 2021: Amateur hour. Bought Orange Bowl tickets at literally peak time, 1:33 pm on Selection Sunday.
  • 2022: Was pretty confident about Fiesta, so I bought them Wednesday before Sunday. As a result, these were the best value tickets I bought during this three year run.
  • 2023: Was reasonably confident about the Rose, though all the talking heads and Reddit CFB posters had be concerned that Washington would get the top seed. It took a while longer to get the family aligned this year, so I didn't get around to getting tickets until Saturday afternoon. However, I forgot that Washington would be playing on Friday, so prices I paid for the Rose Bowl were higher than earlier in the week. Prices still went up 50% after the selection show.

I am not clear what to do in the future if it is not clear which bowl Michigan will be going to. All these crazy fees make it financially punitive to buy speculatively and resell, but it also is a bit anxiety-producing to plan the trip but not get the game tickets until weeks later.

gbdub

December 15th, 2023 at 4:16 PM ^

I bought 4 seats together at the other blog sponsor (OnLocation) - which is a ticket broker with basically secondary pricing - on the evening of selection Sunday and they were substantially cheaper than they are now. 

I waited longer for the Fiesta Bowl last year and you could definitely see a peak about a week after the selection. Not sure why - I think it’s that once you get to <2 weeks to game time people start pricing to move. 

bluesong

December 15th, 2023 at 3:05 PM ^

I love these as they are always super helpful. I know you mentioned the Championship game a bit, but will you do another write-up WHEN we beat Alabama?

If not, do you anticipate ticket prices being cheapest on game day?

Rams

December 15th, 2023 at 3:24 PM ^

It'll be my second Rose Bowl.  Got lucky with tickets and was able to attend Jan 1, 1998.  I remember a TON of Washington State fans traveled that year, and many were not able to get tickets once there.

Looks like I'm in the MIchigan section again, but right on the edge.  Same endzone as 1998.  So hopefully we get the same Rose Bowl result, and same National Champion 

echoWhiskey

December 15th, 2023 at 4:37 PM ^

Anyone have a chart like the one in the post that extends out to gameday?  I wish I had jumped on the ~$300 tickets before the official announcement, but now it seems like waiting as long as possible is probably the smart play.  Just wondering how close to the game they bottomed out the past couple of years.

OG Killa Bobby…

December 15th, 2023 at 4:58 PM ^

I live in Orange County, my kids (11 year old twins) live and die for Michigan athletics.  In 2019 Michigan played Texas Tech in the Sweet 16 at the Honda Center.  

Tickets were similarly priced to the Rose Bowl but I said its for my kids and it's a once in a lifetime thing and they are right here!  


Michigan proceeded to score the least amount of points in the first half of a game in tournament history (16 points) and my kids were heart broken and I was out a few thousand dollars. 

I want to take my kids to the Rose Bowl but I'm terrified the same thing is going to happen and also $2,000 + .... 

 

Man ... do I pull the trigger?

ca_prophet

December 15th, 2023 at 6:18 PM ^

I've been to two Rose Bowls: the Give It To Wheatley 1993 Rose Bowl, and the 2003 Rose Bowl against USC.

The first one, I flew to Pasadena and stayed with a coworker, and then we picked up tickets the day of the game.  There were plenty floating around, and so while we still shelled out, we didn't pay through the nose.  Then we got to watch Wheatley :<)

The second game we got tickets through an alumni friend who got a good deal by buying early. This one was not as enjoyable, but we did get to see Reggie Bush before he was famous.  My big memories from that game:
- watching this freshman RB and thinking "That guy is really good"; he popped even on a loaded USC team.
- watching USC absolutely shred what was to that point a top-flight OL.  Kenechi Udeze spent seemingly the whole day in M's backfield.  I was sure he was going to be a top DE in the NFL for years, but his leukemia diagnosis derailed that.

Gulo Gulo Luscus

December 15th, 2023 at 8:03 PM ^

Never used TicketIQ so no shade to the sponsor but I've had good experience with TickPick (ironically the site Seth pulled the stadium seating chart from) and it's $613 each for a pair to get in the door.

gbdub

December 16th, 2023 at 12:06 PM ^

Look in the end zones in the graphic - it says TickPick. It also literally has the TickPick logo at midfield  

It would appear TicketIQ pulled their diagram from TickPick. 

Unless they are the same company? Their interfaces look identical.

But the prices are different. (TickPick is a little lower). 

Seems weird. 

RobGoBlue

December 15th, 2023 at 10:44 PM ^

Three tickets to the Rose Bowl, plus flights/hotel and various other expenses for a three-day stay in Pasadena. I turn 45 this year, this may be the last sporting event I pay to attend until I'm 50. 

OneEyedMooseSm…

December 15th, 2023 at 11:18 PM ^

I live 90 minutes away from Pasadena and initially had thought about going and have the means to, but I’m not going to.  It’s just not worth it to me.

Instead, my Texas grad friend and I are going to hang out all day and grill some lobsters and drink some beer and if the games suck, then whatever.

Goggles Paisano

December 16th, 2023 at 6:43 AM ^

I also find this ticket stuff fascinating.  Seth, you are far more knowledgeable about this than most and I appreciate being able to learn more about how we the fans continue to have to grab our ankles to see a game in person.  

As a side note, I think I paid $15 or $20 to see Van Halen back in 1986 on their 5150 tour.  I recently paid $600 for a ticket (so much of that is fees and taxes) for an upcoming show (Hagar, Satriani, Michael Anthony & Jason Bonham) in July in Tampa.  The shit is out of control.

AirBnB is no different.  Whatever the per night price is for a home, you darn need to double it to get the out of door price after tacking on the highly inflated cleaning fee, AirBnB fee, and taxes which are near 20% in most places.   

TicketiQ - I will use them going forward.  I really appreciate transparency and upfront pricing. No one likes the surprise at the end when your $100 ticket costs $190.   

MGoBud

December 17th, 2023 at 2:13 PM ^

If anyone is looking for an extra ticket, I had a buddy back out so I have 1 extra with my group of 8. Seats are Section 15 Row 38. I'm happy to sell to someone in the Mgoblog community and avoid the fees for both of us. If you are interested feel free to comment below or reach me at the following:

email: [email protected]

Twitter/X: @MGoBud

Rufus X

December 19th, 2023 at 12:44 PM ^

For anyone following market pricing here, I JUST sold two tickets in second row (Section 14, row B) in the corner of the endzone near the UM bench for $890each + ticketmaster fees.  These were GREAT seats so I really would have liked to use them but I just couldn't make it happen.  Go Blue!