Interesting convo I had with a prominant Chicago HS basketball coach

Submitted by WindyCityBlue on

So, I had the opportunity to speak with a Chicago HS basketball luminary in a casual situation earlier today.  I won't drop his name at this point, but he coached some of Chicago's best talent over the past 30 years at a couple well known Chicago high schools.  He apparently just retired this year.  I asked some very pointed questions about basketball topics, specifically regarding college recruiting, and he (thankfully) did not hold back on giving me some very candid and real answers.  Thought I would share with the board:

1. College bball recruiting is extremely dirty (duh!)

2. While he thinks the NCAA does their best to monitor this, he seems to believe that college coaches are much smarter and can "stay ahead" of the NCAA.  He says there are very sophisticated ways to pay players and their families without suspicion.

3. Coach K - dirty as hell (I was kinda surprised by this)

4. Coach Cal - dirty as hell (duh!)

5. Coach Pitino - dirty as hell (duh!)

5. Izzo - sends his assitants to do his dirty work.  He says he was offered money from Dwayne Stephens on several recent occasions for particular recruits (although I don't know if he actually accepted the money).  He thinks that Izzo is not as bad as others though.  Izzo has a lot of respect in Chicago and is not normally known for playing dirty.  However, his people told him that Izzo's recent recruting success is no doubt from some "below the belt" tactics.

6. The Jabari Parker recruitment was surprising clean on a relative scale.

7. As for Michigan/JB - clean, very clean, but too clean.  Most promimant Chicago HS coaches stay away from Michigan because Michigan won't be part of the "recruiting machine" in Chicago.  They think JB is a good coach but teaches "white boy" basketball.  He basically says Michigan/JB has no respect in Chicago anymore.

I mentioned I was a Michigan fan and talked some more about our program.  He has tons of respect for us becasue he had lots of interaction with Michigan many years ago.  Back in the 90s, Michigan was THE school for Chicago's best talent.  He says we were not a clean program then, but he says that no one was and Michigan was no different than any other major program.  He seems to think we have little to no chance with big time recruits in any major city without getting a little dirty. 

He had some funny things to say about Amaker, but I'll save for later.

Anyway, thought I would share with the board.  What are your thoughts?  Would you be OK with getting a little dirty to get better recruits?  Are you OK with being a super clean program now that can't consistent compete on the big stage?

 

 

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WindyCityBlue

December 27th, 2015 at 9:46 PM ^

Apparently Amaker was the "whitest" coach in recrutiing.  A lot of Chicago recruits were drawn to him because of his race, but when meeting him, he was "whiter" than most white coaches.   I don't know what exactly that meant, but it became a small joke for a period of time.  There was a recruiting visit where Amaker tried to act "black" but he apparently couldn't do it even though he was black.   

He did say that Amaker was a clean coach, but didn't have a lot of respect in Chicago.

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Lampuki

December 27th, 2015 at 9:33 PM ^

Interesting but not surprised at all. I love JB and hope he stays on at Michigan for a long time but I don't think he can compete on the recruiting trail in this day and age. I think our administration just decided to get a clean coach in and stay out of the troubles we had in the nineties. If we have success it just makes what he does all that much more special. I also think Izzo basically admitted earlier this year or last that he was going to change his tactics after losing Jabari Parker.



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M-Dog

December 27th, 2015 at 9:34 PM ^

I always thought we needed to recruit more Detroit, less Indiana.  Maybe this explains why we don't . . . we can't.

As far as I'm concerned, we can't move to a model where the players get paid fast enough.  It will help level the playing field at least a little for programs that don't cheat.

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MLaw06

December 27th, 2015 at 9:36 PM ^

This is another reason that paying players legitimately (i.e., stipends or whatever the NCAA wants to call it) is GOOD for a school like Michigan.  We have the resources to pay the players (2nd or 3rd highest profit for an athletic department), but we want to do it the clean way and not pay under the books.  If we were to pay on the books, then lower level schools wouldn't be able to keep up with us (top notch facilities, education, and ability to pay large sums on the books, etc.) and that would even the playing field.

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WBALLZ

December 27th, 2015 at 9:37 PM ^

I'm sure I'm being naive but don't you think that if it was really this bad that someone would slip up once in a while? How could a pile of teenagers getting handed cash, cars, rent etc... Not be caught on a regular basis just by someone in the know or in the game opening their mouth?



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MLaw06

December 27th, 2015 at 9:43 PM ^

Cash is easy.  Ask any restaurant owner how they move cash around.  It is too easy in this country, that's why the government scrutinizes bank deposits (i.e., anything over $10k needs to be accompanied with filling out a treasury form).  Also, if you pay for things in cash, you can receive cash and never go through a bank.

Cars are even easier since they never transfer title.  They basically just let them use a car, but they don't actually transfer title or add them to the insurance.  The way they get caught is if they get into a major car accident and the cops realize the car doesn't belong to them.  Then the common excuse is, I just was driving it around the block for a friend, etc.

Rent is easy as well.  No cash transfers hands.  Guy lives in the place and no rent is collected.

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MLaw06

December 27th, 2015 at 10:36 PM ^

If the kid talks, then he loses his eligibility.  Zero incentive for him to kill his one chance at a free education, potential pro career, etc. If he's not happy, he'll likely just transfer and keep his mouth shut.  He might talk ten years down the road when he's moved on, but at that point, no one's going to care what he says. 

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snarling wolverine

December 27th, 2015 at 10:59 PM ^

It's more complicated than that.  Programs have been trying to denounce their rivals since the beginning of the NCAA.  A simple accusation isn't going to be enough for the NCAA to deliver sanctions.  They need concrete proof.  But the problem is they have no legal authority to compel anyone to come forward and testify.  Basically, it's only when someone illegal happens (like in the Ed Martin scandal) that they can actually get the evidence they need.  

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recklessaBrandon

December 27th, 2015 at 11:09 PM ^

This is a huge enforcement problem for the NCAA. IMO, they should let prospects who took money dish on what went on during their recruitment without threatening their eligibility. They should also recruit a few high caliber prospects to ask for cash, etc. and report back to the NCAA. You wouldn't need any subpeona power or big budget investigations and could clean up the game pretty easily. 

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Wolverine Devotee

December 27th, 2015 at 9:37 PM ^

Got the to Final Four and won two B1G Championships with zero inner-city kids from Chicago, will continue to do so. "white boy basketball" has kicked the ass of whatever other cute brand names are with B1G teams save the year that everyone and their brother was injured. (note: MSU gets a pass by talking about injuries in 2013-14). Chicken little will say otherwise, though, as they can't accept that Michigan doesn't want to sink to the slimy depths that many others do. Chicken little will continue to scream about recruiting starz, forgetting both recent Michigan B1G Players of the Year and lottery picks weren't McDonald's All-Americans in HS.

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Jack Harbaugh

December 27th, 2015 at 9:40 PM ^

Good points, but the players that we got in the 2011-2012 classes flying under the radar and coming to UofM like they did is a once in a lifetime situation. You NEED some top 10 players to be consistently good. JB portrays the Coach K clean program persona so maybe it's time to get a little dirty on the recruiting trail.

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Jack Harbaugh

December 27th, 2015 at 9:52 PM ^

Dude, we missed the NIT last year and will be lucky to make it this year. JB can develop good players into great players. We don't have very many GOOD players on this team. Walton and Levert are going to be mid-late 2nd round picks. Spike had a good national championship game. He isn't a world beater.

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