Meta: Chill out
It appears that many of you spend enough time on this board that your 'moon cycles' have synched up.
We just covered the spread against a team that many people thought we would lose to (if I recall correctly, we have covered the spread each game this year). Our defense held a good-to-great offense in check (with a little help with said offense). Our QB ran for 200 yards and 3 TDs.
He may not have shown us much with his arm, but then again he never has. Before all you yay-hoos start creeping towards the ledge, let me say this - he's not AS bad as you think. I mean, damn guys, Denard has been put on a pedestal. It's ridiculous to come down this hard on a kid because we are starting to see he has flaws.
I'd ask the mods to declare martial law and lock down the site, but that would be a ridiculous thing to do after a blowout win against an above average team. Besides, most of the people complaining have enough points to circumvent a lock down. What boggles my mind, is that just yesterday I saw multiple people post that they would be extremely happy just to get a win; good, bad, or ugly. Liars.
It's great to have standards as a fanbase. It shows that we still expect Michigan to be an elite football school; that we have not sunk to a Notre Dame 'return to glory' mentality. But chill out a bit on here, okay?
Bunch of Brian Kelly's we've got here...
September 24th, 2011 at 9:28 PM ^
Gosh, have you tried that line with women yet? "Your feelings are asinine.". Chicks dig that. Really. Try it out tonight...oh wait, you can't because you are alone. If people want to share their concerns (feelings), what's wrong with that? Take an empathy pill. It's called sharing.
September 24th, 2011 at 10:06 PM ^
The feeling concern is asinine. It's silly, it's dumb. That's the definition of asinine. I didn't say that all feelings are asnine you dolt, or that sharing your feelings is always bad, but if you want to create a straw man to burn down, then by all means.
So you're concerned, in other words you're mildly bothered by something, but you're not going to do anything about it. That is the feeling of concern. "Hmmmm, this concerns me, so I think I'll furrow my brow at it for a moment and then go about my day as I normally would."
Also, LOL, at your post. It was a treat. You forgot to tell me to get a life, and about how you are 6'4'' 256 pounds, have a rawkin' hawt chick, train UFC, own a successful business and vacation in the Hamptons.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:36 PM ^
OK Dad....
September 24th, 2011 at 5:37 PM ^
Lindley didn't have a good day, bu I'm not ready to sign on to the notion that they played poorly. He had a lot of pressure. He had to throw early and typically they were uncatchable throws, often to no one.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:52 PM ^
To get hit. Every time anyone put pressure on him, which was often, he threw the ball away. It may have been in the direction of a WR but his throws were pitiful. He even three some into the line to avoid being hit. He was not taking a sack because he didn't want to take the punishment. The pro scouts saw something today that will drop his stock in the draft. He did not look good. No courage.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:38 PM ^
Did someone say Martian Law?
September 24th, 2011 at 5:38 PM ^
At least it should not be.One can still be a fan AND be critical. I found your post to be akin to the "America: Love it or Leave" phrase jingoists grunt whenever someone criticizes American foreign policy.
The guy is a subpar passer. That is a legitimate concern, particularly give how he performed last year vs OSU and MSU. Granted, that was his first year as a starter and so he deserves a significant break for that.
However, this is a new year. A year in which we hope the losing streaks to the Buckeyes and Spartans come to an end. That means people are going to fret over potentially fatal flaws.
Some have gone too far. I'll admit that. But his throwing ability is a legitimate concern. I don't think it is "whining" to mention a concern over his poor performance thjrowing the ball today.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:51 PM ^
I agree with you completely. There is a concern that Denard is not progressing well as a passer. I posted this as a reaction to the chorus of users that decided he should be relegated to slot duty and kickoffs.
I fully agree that people should voice their opinion. Mine is that people should settle down. Maybe the title was a bit incendiary. Let me fix that really quick, as I do agree that all opinions are valid, if not overstated.
September 24th, 2011 at 9:17 PM ^
That Denard isn't a great aerial wizard shouldn't be a new issue, cuz it's not new. A serious concern for thoughtful but surely supportive critics is that he seems to have regressed significantly. If he is below 50% completion against not great defenses, what happens against the BiG upper division? The flip side of all this was the D. Roh's stuff to close out SD's first offensive series was as heartening as DR's INT's were deflating.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:40 PM ^
Yes we won. Yet even if DRob is better than Tom Brady, people are still entitled to discuss his weakness.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:40 PM ^
Right on nigga
September 24th, 2011 at 5:51 PM ^
I hope you're black
September 24th, 2011 at 5:43 PM ^
Denard should not be a QB. He cannot throw. He was only 6th in the Heisman voting last year as a QB, which is not good enough for Michigan. He should transfer so we can use that scholarship.
Also, derp.
September 24th, 2011 at 7:40 PM ^
was All America... at Tailback, not QB... which is the main reason he was 6th in Heisman voting. Look Denard is a great kid. However, some people are ignoring what they are seeing. It won't be long before teams stack the box, and say, "Come on Denard, beat us through the air". We have already seen this movie, and we know how it turns out.
Those who are saying, "It's a new offense, Denard needs more time"... this argument is flawed. What we are seeing is not an issue of bad reads... but woeful accuracy. I don't see how that's going to get better any time soon. Changes need to be made to the offense. Let Denard make throws on the move. Give him throws that he can make. It's up to Borges to give Denard a chance to be successful. If Borges is as good as people say he is, he'll come up with a way to make it work. Otherwise... derp.
September 24th, 2011 at 5:48 PM ^
we did not cover against eastern, the bellhop in Vegas who saw my mich shirt was eager to inform me of that
September 24th, 2011 at 5:55 PM ^
How have we gotten to the point that one player is so revered that pointing out that player's most obvious flaw (Denard can not throw accurate passes), which threatens to endanger the team's success, no less, is deemed "creeping toward the ledge?" It seems to me that the people closest to the edge right now are those that are afraid of having to admit to themselves that Denard can't throw.
Step away from the ledge, take a deep breath, then another deep breath. Now, repeat after me: "Denard Robinson can not accurately throw a football. Perhaps we should try playing Devin Gardner at quarterback." Very good. Feel better now?
September 24th, 2011 at 6:01 PM ^
I'm with you 50%. Denard does have some problems throwing the ball. Where we split is on your opinion that this offense is a failed experiment. I'm of the mind that Denard can progress to a serviceable (though not excellent) passer, and that Borges can find a way to hide Denard's deficiencies. I have never thought Denard had A+ accuracy, but he is WAY TOO TALENTED to not touch the ball every down.
They will figure it out. I've taken my two deep breaths... have you?
September 24th, 2011 at 8:02 PM ^
you couldn't have been this level-headed in your OP.
Who gives a shit if blog message board posters (easily the most analytical AND fanatical group of fans) want to spend 1% of their time celebrating a win, and 99% of their time bitching because our most important player is showing some significant issues in an important phase of the game?
We've had fast (Heisman-like even) starts before, only to see them crumble once the B1G season starts.
I certainly don't %100 blame Denard; he's stuggling sure, buts it's also on the coaches (specifically Borges) to put him in a position to succeed. They are currently failing to due that in the passing game. I'm very confident that Denard and the coaches will fix this problem. How fast and by how much remain in question.
By the way, there have been a ridiculous amount of semi-clueless new posters lately, combine that with the Veteran's fear of repeat season meltdowns and you have a toxic soup of reactionary message board dysfunction.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:28 PM ^
GTFO
I bet you also wanted Ryan Mallett to start over Chad Henne too.
You seriously want to bench Denard for the upcoming Big Ten season, and start a QB who is a RS Freshman, learning a new offense, and who has taken 0 meaningful snaps in his career? Are you really that fucking dumb, or are you trolling? Please tell me that you're trolling so that I don't have to kill myself, because I now have to walk around with the knowledge people like you exist and actually believe they know what they are talking about.
Just once I would like to be able to act as czar of Michigan football, and grant you the ability to coach one game so that you could get your ass booed out of the stadium, and subsequently mocked on every sports related talk show and in every sports column in the country for the astronomically stupid idea of benching Denard for Devin Gardner.
September 24th, 2011 at 8:31 PM ^
You have anger issues.
September 24th, 2011 at 8:44 PM ^
When I typed that I was straight faced and cool as a cucumber.
I simply have zero tolerance for dumb.
September 24th, 2011 at 9:22 PM ^
Which means you have zero tolerance for the vast majority of humanity. You have anger issues. ;)
September 24th, 2011 at 10:11 PM ^
Welcome to MGoBlog.
I see your first few posts have been largely unintelligible flamebaits that have added nothing to the discussion.
I have a feeling your time here will be short.
September 25th, 2011 at 12:42 AM ^
Anger. Issues.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:13 PM ^
OP, get a life.
All Michigan fans are thrilled to be starting 4-0. Same scenario as last year, except at this time Denard was completing about 70 percent of his passes. The we ran into teams that actually knew how to play defense. If some of us are concerned, we have a right to be. We all love Denard and we all see improvement with our defense, but the part of our schedule that really matters starts next week, and if we need our passing game to win games, based on what I'm seeing, the Michigan fan base has cause for concern.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:27 PM ^
Now how the fuck was my response trolling? Some of the attitude around this place really needs to go. Someone posts that we shouldn't have an opinion, then you tell him why you should and that's trolling? I don't get it.
There ought to be a rule aound here that if you are going to call someone a troll, be man enough to put your name to a response.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:41 PM ^
"Now how the fuck was my response trolling?"
Usually when you tell someone to get a life, it's trolling. It's fine to have a different opinion, but you were a dick about, hence the trolling tag.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:42 PM ^
But probably the "Get a life" line. Ad hominem attacks like that are always frowned upon here. And ultimately, it's a bit hyprocritical of you to make such a statement.
The OP wasn't addressing people who have concerns - because we all share those concerns. It's the timing (dude, we just WON, in convincing fashion), coupled with the people who are still -STILL - saying that DG should be the QB and Denard should be the RB.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:50 PM ^
I sure wasn't trying to be a dick, so if I was out of line I apologize. I live and die by Michigan football, and I have real concerns as do many of us. Our passing game is a problem right now and will be a subject that will probably be the most salient topic of conversation around here this week.
September 24th, 2011 at 10:13 PM ^
Sorry, but that excuse for dickishness doesn't cut it. Everyone on this board (unless they are a member of an opposing team) "lives and dies" by Michigan football. It does not confer a licence to launch ad hominem attacks in the direction of those with whom we disagree.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:45 PM ^
I didn't like what you said, so I clicked a button.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:51 PM ^
When you click a button it would be helpful to attach the reason why you dinged someone.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:57 PM ^
I didn't like what you said. That's a reason.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:48 PM ^
Name yourself you surreptitious scoundrel! Now, be a man and fight me over the internet!
September 24th, 2011 at 6:22 PM ^
When we are negative about what we are seeing it isn't something personal about Denard. I love Denard and he is an extremely talented runner. But, I also have to be realistic with his abilities and admit to myself that it will be difficult to beat a team with a strong defense when your QB can't move the ball through the air. I personally can't see us beating the likes of OSU, MSU, or Neb and that's frustrating. I think we expected him to improve his throwing abilities and it looks like he's regressed so far. Love the kid, but that doesn't make it any less frustrating to see such glaring deficiencies. I would love to be wrong here.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:30 PM ^
I was wondering what would happen once we couldn't bitch about Ezeh and GERG. I never thought it would be to bitch about Denard and then yell at each other about it. I guess this is better?
About moving Denard into the slot - Look, we got pleanty of slots running around. Just because he is fast doesn't mean he can play reciever or even catch a football. No thanks, I would rather have him touch the ball every offensive play.
About Devin starting - I am sorry, but this is one of dumbest things I have ever heard. People are entitled to their opions, but this is almost enough to make me learn to embedd stuff so i could get one of those "Not sure if serious" pictures that all the kids love so much. Look, if Devin could move the offense better than Denard, don't you think that the coaching staff would have him playing? If you say "No," then explain to me why they are sticking with Denard.
Denard is not, repeat not, going to win the Heisman this year. He is a flawed passer. He may always be. He is also the best QB on the roster right now. Tom Brady is not walking through those doors and we will not go 12-0. We have to accept that for this year. 8-4 looks seriously realistic, maybe even 9-3. That is not too bad for this year given all the history and the change in style and coaches.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:34 PM ^
but you can see that the coaches and the players are getting it together. Denard and the offense had their problems, but they did put 28 on the scoreboard which should be enough to win. I'm glad to see that we have a real defense emerging as they learn the system and learn how to play with each other. What an improvement over the "down the field escort service" we provide the last two years. Defense needed to step up at times and they did it. The seniors are very aware how good starts turned into less than stellar finishes the last 2 years. They don't want a repeat experience and this coaching staff is going to tell them to work hard, keep improving, and never be satisfied. Give the team and Denard some space to do that.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:48 PM ^
Everyone does need to step off a ledge. We handly beat a team a lot of people thought would upset us. Our defense is miles better than last year's, and at this point is decent, which is incredible considering where we were last year. Our RBs are also seemingly much more producitve this year.
Yes, we have put Denard on a pedestal. All the people saying he needs to be taken out as QB are ridiculous. He has struggled passing, but so far he has more for made up for it running the ball. If we take him out, Devin might throw more effectively, but he won't run as well, and the option reads won't work nearly as well. The reason our RBs get the holes they do is because everyone flocks to Denard, leaving the RBs lanes to run. That won't happen with Devin in.
HOWEVA. Denard's passing is a big concern to me. No matter how you slice it, 8-16 with 2 INTs is just plain bad. Once we get to the meet of our B1G schedule, if Denard can't tear up a team running like he has, I don't feel confident putting it on his arm at all. Improvements must be made, and quick.
September 24th, 2011 at 7:03 PM ^
The past two years started in similar fashion -- what da ya know, SDSU was just like Western 2009, and UConn 2010 -- and any little hickup is sending convulsions through our system based on what we've been through in the past.
We'll feel a lot better once we've done in Sparty, brought Paul Bunyon home, kept the Brown Jug home, and knocked off everyone else leading into the Nebraska game.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:50 PM ^
I was somewhat worried about WMU, flat-out expected Michigan to lose to ND, and was worried about SDSU. I'll take 4-0. I also think it's interesting that people (apparently) take it for granted that Michigan's QB will run for 200 yards.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:58 PM ^
To think that going 4-0 is a double-edged sword, simply because we all went through two years of starting 4-0 and ending 5-7 and 7-6. So, as a result, rather than relishing the early victories we look beyond and think "how will we collapse this year"?
Screw the last two years. This team is different. The coaches are different. The sky is still the limits. There are issues of course, but damnit I believe this team can beat anybody right now. We just handily beat a team many picked as upset-special-of-the-week. We held a darn good offense to 7(!!!) points. We beat ND with the same passing attack that needs so much work. Through all this talk of concerns with Denard's passing, what gets lost is how awesome our D was today, how much they've already improved over last year. Even there, obviously still concerns. But this team has shown through 4 games the ability to will a victory, to win despite deficiencies and at times ugly play, and all witha coach who basically says "we suck...lots of practice to do" after a 3-touchdown victory (which is good imo)
Sky's the limit.
September 24th, 2011 at 9:03 PM ^
In 1997 too. Doesn't mean we're any more likely to do the same as that year than the previous two years, but there you go. It seems like people would be happier if we were 3-1. At least with this win we won be going 3-9.
September 24th, 2011 at 6:59 PM ^
I agree with this guy. I don't think the fanbase will ever be happy with a performance. Denard had a shitty day throwing (again) but we won by three touchdowns! Yet, people will focus on everything that wasn't good and start having a panic attack over it.
WE GOT A WIN. And it wasn't in a 67-65 3OT fashion. It was a sound win. Ryan Lindley couldn't buy time to find a receiver and we kept Ronnie Hillman out of the endzone.
What more do you want?
September 24th, 2011 at 7:46 PM ^
....at least I am not one of the folks that goes to meet-ups for this show (my sister does that), but the kids like it, and we sit down and watch it with them. It's actually pretty funny once in a while. I think they throw the pop culture into the show to draw in the parents though.
September 24th, 2011 at 7:46 PM ^
I was getting bored of this ledge anyway.