Will Campbell...anyone?
Brian stated in the Defense v. UMass review that Will Campbell is not a useful football player right now. I have to say, if this is accurate, and "he's just not ready to play etc." is the staff's position on Campbell at this point, why is that? I get it, he is "out of shape," but is he waiting for the jaws of life to remove the roof of his apartment and airlift him to safety because he can't fit out of the door? I mean, he is at practice, correct? Running, presumably lifting weights, maybe even say, tackling people or something?
Campbell was a very highly regarded defensive linemen, one of the highest rated recruits Michigan has landed in recent years. Brian said in that post that "things really can't get any worse." Then how are they going to be worse if Campbell is put on the field for a few series, hell, it is not like we are going lockdown anytime soon, start him against Bowling Green and let him get a couple of series. I doubt all hell will break loose(r). As long as people don't play, they are never going to be "ready" to play. Campbell, Demens, Fitzgerald, at one point, somebody thought these kids could play football. Lets put em on the field and see if those people were right. It "can't get any worse," right?
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:41 AM ^
Well, Martin is simply an underrated beast right now. Sort of similar to how BG was having a "slow start" but in reality, he was handling double teams and still putting on pressure.
I think Martin really is lighting it up, he's just got to have his supporting cast playing their part.
EDIT: I mean the question back to you is, why change this? To put Martin at a different position? How do we know that's best for the overal D?
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:45 AM ^
he is at least all Big Ten first team, and perhaps an All-American, but that is not the only position on the defensive line. Campbell never plays, so it is not as though he has one position on the defensive line and cannot be utilized anywhere else on the line. Granted, he is not going to be a defensive end anytime soon, but why not just play him somewhere, for a while. Our great defensive lineman of the past were not beasts right off the bat, but they played, at least for a while, a drive here and a drive there.
And I did see the Iowa game last year, Campbell made some mistakes, but for God's sake man he was the least of our problems.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:37 AM ^
I had alot of hope that Big Will would be able to step up and help out last year. Then I saw this one play and could tell that the coaches were right that he wasn't good enough to play last year. A redshirt would have helped immensely, but sadly our depth left us with no choice.
September 23rd, 2010 at 10:50 AM ^
Big Will should watch that clip before every weighlifting session. I mean, heck, I don't think even I would have gotten blown that far off the ball on that play. (I would have been thrown down much sooner!)
September 23rd, 2010 at 11:43 AM ^
(+1) aaamichfan! That puts it in perspective.
September 23rd, 2010 at 1:36 PM ^
The kid probably wasn't ready to play yet. I am not sure that we want to grade all of his future performance getting thrown in against one of the best lines in the B10 last year.
September 23rd, 2010 at 2:49 PM ^
Hmm a true freshman getting double teamed at first and then getting held and can't get off a block against one of the better rushing teams in the Big Ten. You guys have unrealistic expectations. From someone who has coached and played football for the past 20 years I can tell you that at the division 1 level one of the hardest positions to come in and dominate in straight out of high school is defensive tackle. This is because most offensive linemen around the country are 3rd year soph's, and upperclassmen. You cannot expect Will Campbell to come in as a freshmen with the defense we had last year and get off that block where he is clearly being held (watch it again the O-lineman is grabbing and holding his chest plate on his shoulder pads preventing him from doing anything. Give the kid a break.
This year I would expect he should be able to contribute to some degree. The fact that Martin is a beast and is in the best shape of anyone on the defense is part of the reason we have not seen Big Will yet. The other reason is that his technique is lacking, it takes some people longer then others to grasp all of the technical changes from high school to college. There is a problem if we do not see Big Will through the rest of this year and we don't see any film of improvement. I wouldn't give up on the kid just yet, he has the size, strength and attitude needed for a great DT. Lets not forget what Brandon Graham said upon leaving for the draft. He was quoted saying by the time Will Campbell is a JUNIOR he will be one of the best DT's in the country. I'll take BG's word for it, and so should you all.
September 23rd, 2010 at 6:47 PM ^
I wasn't trying to say that Campbell won't eventually be a good/great player for us, but people need to understand that there is a reason he isn't trusted as a starter currently.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:05 AM ^
My point really was that people said "BG got off to a slow start" and the same has been said about Martin. He's not putting up gaudy sack numbers or anything, but he's doing a phenomenal job (which is to absorb double teams and allow for other players to make plays.) I gues you're suggesting let Campbell do this, but he would have big shoes to fill, and would it really translate to an overall better d line? Maybe, but not certain. LB play must get better. RVB can step it up a little too
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:40 AM ^
Go back and watch last year's Iowa game again. I am guessing since he can't sniff the field, nothing has changed.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:24 AM ^
Either that or there's a stud ahead of him on the depth chart. Keep in mind that Will was a true freshman last year, and most guys at his position would be a RS Freshman at this point in their careers.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:41 AM ^
I swear as the week goes on the posts get dumber and dumber
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:43 AM ^
RR has used him as a blocker on goal line situations
I think he is also a blocker for the PATs
I bet he gets some time in a 4 man front v Wisky and maybe even State
He will play some this year, maybe more next year, but he is behind an absolute beast in MM, not much he can do about that
September 23rd, 2010 at 1:19 PM ^
So at least he's not in the doghouse completely just not doing enough at DT yet to see the field. Pad level!
September 23rd, 2010 at 6:43 PM ^
I believe they used Big Will as a fullback for Stephen Hopkins in the Beefcake formation against Notre Dame.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:48 AM ^
Didn't you say something dumb last year that lit the place up a week of neg-bombs?
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:41 AM ^
Technically it could get worse, but I agree with you. I see Campbell playing some this Saturday, hopefully, because I definitely think that we need to get him in before BT play starts. We need to rotate guys in to keep them fresh. I really hope he gets in and at least plays a couple series to show that he is able to at least play.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:42 AM ^
"It can't get any worse" is mostly hyperbole... If you saw the opposite side of the ball when we played EMU in 2005, you'll understand. It can always be worse. Just trust that the coaches have a better knowledge of the players than we do, because they do.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:42 AM ^
I'm pretty sure they are still working on getting Campbell to play lower. Anyone who saw the play against Iowa last year(pushed back 7 yds from LOS) knows that he is going to need a good amount of development before becoming a regular starter.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:44 AM ^
First off, Mike Martin is doing a pretty damn good job at Will's spot. Also, maybe Will just doesn't deserve to play yet for other reasons besides his talent. We don't know because we are not coaches. I'll trust their judgment at this point. He's third string!
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:49 AM ^
I said below, I am not proposing that Campbell take time from Martin, MM is an absolute beast, but there are other positions on the defensive line in which he could rotate for some time. I understand that every position has intricacies and that you can't just throw him out there, any where, but ensure that he understands his primary responsibilities and let him hulk smash somebody, just a couple of times. Get him some consistent game reps, thats all.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:12 AM ^
Or if he is NOT ready to play this year, I dont think he should be on the FG unit or that short yardage unit. Let him continue to learn and practice while getting a red-shirt. Just my 2-cents.
September 23rd, 2010 at 11:34 AM ^
Let him continue to learn and practice while getting a red-shirt.
Will has taken snaps this year. Specifically, I remember him in there as a lead blocker for Hopkins' TD against ND. He is not going to be able to reshirt this year; just a quick clarification.
September 23rd, 2010 at 11:13 AM ^
Take him out of the position he knows and still can't play, and move him to one he does not know, that takes more of what he doesn't have. Brilliant!
For a long time I read the front page and kept to my mantra; never read the comments. I'm slowly and painfully beginning to remember why that was.
September 23rd, 2010 at 11:30 AM ^
better for everyone, including those of us who don't like those of you that simply go from post to post attempting to poke holes in simple discussion because you don't actually have any opinions to render.
September 23rd, 2010 at 12:03 PM ^
You are undoubtedly correct.
Have another round of freshmen, on me!
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:44 AM ^
The ONE THING working on the defensive side of the ball (other than Kovacs' moxie and an abundance of Gordon-ness) is Mike Martin, who has apparently found the cheat code for all-time Beast Mode. The coaches are searching for solutions in a number of spots, but NT isn't one of them.
Besides, we need him as a fullback in the Super Mega Jumbo package, along with Lewan, Q. Washington, Stephen Hopkins, Gilbert Grape, and William Howard Taft:
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:18 AM ^
looks like more than just a gimmick - nice block from that position
September 23rd, 2010 at 4:15 PM ^
Gilbert Grape getting some time. For awhile he wasn't panning out and didn't seem focused and I was starting to wonder "What's eating that guy?"
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:46 AM ^
Make it stop. Please, make it stop.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:50 AM ^
Will Campbell is obviously not ready to play. the coaches see him every day, you have likely never seen him.
What the fuck is the obsession with getting Will on the field before he is ready? It almost seems like 5 star recruits just give people an excuse to bitch about why they aren't meeting up to the lofty expectations of our numerous armchair coaches.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:55 AM ^
that right now we have two linebackers who have played and started for three years, are less than adequete most of the time, and play essentially the entire game despite it. And why? Because numerous hightly regarded linebacker recruits have not been "ready to play" for three years. Our roster is our roster, are these players not being used due to the desire that we had other players to use? Play the hand you are dealt, or you will end up with no hand at all.
Yes, I have seen him. He is very big, and he is very big. He looks like a giant person.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:00 AM ^
does not make them "ready to play" any more than pulling raw chicken off the grill and eating it makes that chicken "ready to eat."
Besides, Will Campbell would be a strikingly poor linebacker.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:03 AM ^
just using it as reference. And true, playing does not necessarily make you ready to play, but I don't think you can be ready without playing.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:09 AM ^
is what the second half of blow-outs are for. If we see Michigan up 30 on BG this weekend, you can bet that you'll see Campbell. And Demens. And Fitzgerald. And Jibreel Black. And Devin Gardner. And about 20 other young guys.
But while you are probably right that they can never be 100% ready until they play some live ball, I think the coaches would prefer that (a) that playing time not come at the expense of the teams prospects for victory, and (b) they be at least somewhat (not-a-monumental-liability) prepared before they hit the field for meaningful snaps.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:51 AM ^
I'm sorry, but you are not the coach of the University of Michigan football team. No matter how great your ideas seem in your head they simply don't translate to on the field success. DL is not the easiest transition to make from high school to the college level. It takes time to build the muscle needed to leverage massive D-1 linemen. In high school he was simply much larger than his competition. At this level almost everyone is big (lol Jeremy Ross). Hopefully he will be great, but the 5 stars next to his name mean nothing as soon as he walks on campus. Again, I'm sorry.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:56 AM ^
my understanding is that the NT position in a 3 man front is the most important position in the box, and so a successful D must have beast NT. martin is a super beast, where campbell probably isn't (we'll have to trust the coaches on this one).
it can get worse if campbell isn't ready.
September 23rd, 2010 at 8:59 AM ^
The light seemed to go on for Campbell in the OSU game last year. He made a couple of nice plays in that game. There is no UFR for it, but I don't remember Will getting flattened or pushed off the line of scrimmage. That's why I'm really surprised that he isn't even second string right now. With our defensive scheme now, he'll only get one year of significant playing time, at most, because Martin is going to get the lion's share of the snaps through 2011. I think that's a lot less than what people had in mind for him.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:05 AM ^
He probably would get a few series if the rest of the defense was good enough to get a solid lead. In the meantime...we shouldn't weaken the NT position.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:08 AM ^
I remember when we were recruiting him it seemed that he was our number one target and we were constantly asking for updates about him. It really goes to show that some of the high priority guys dont really pan out a couple years down the road. It seems that most of our talent comes from these guys that have something to prove to coaches and work their asses off for playing time. Nothing against will I really hope he can become the beast we all thought and hoped he would become.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:17 AM ^
It really just depends on the guy. There are plenty of highly rated guys who come in and do well (Brandon Graham, Jake Long, Chad Henne, Mario Manningham). Then there are some who don't (Turner, Cissoko, etc.).
Ultimately, though, recruiting rankings are a solid indicator of success. Keep in mind that on a team with any kind of depth, Campbell would be a redshirt freshman this year. He's still got plenty of time to succeed.
And by the way, Campbell might be a case for the "ARGH BURNED REDSHIRTS" crew. If he turns into a solid player and then runs out of eligibility in 2012 while having contributed very little in 2009-10, then many (including me) will be frustrated.
September 23rd, 2010 at 10:01 AM ^
The downside of a high star guy is he may come here and not be used to working hard and competing for time. The way Rich runs his practices and opens the depth chart can be a shock to them.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:18 AM ^
If Campbell is out of shape, it may make him more susceptible to getting injured if you play him in a game situation he isn't ready for.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:24 AM ^
That means he must be ready to play now! Right? Right? (crickets)
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:34 AM ^
You nailed it here (perhaps unintentionally):
"... somebody thought these kids could play football ..."
Yeah, Rivals/Scout, et al. Should I care about that to the exclusion of common sense?
Obviously the coaches signed on and pursued Will. No one forced them to recruit him.
As others have noted, recruiting stars aren't meaningless. They're positively correlated with future success (if not to the degree that the big Rivals/Scout fans believe). But, why should they mean anything once the players arrive at Michigan? In that case, Kovacs would never see the field. Kevin Grady (5-star dude and all) would have taken all of Mike Hart's carries after '04.
If JB and Demens were ready, don't you think they'd get more time? They're being held back only if RichRod is doing some elaborate sandbagging, which I highly doubt.
September 23rd, 2010 at 9:54 AM ^
Right now, maybe his 'out of shape' is translating to 'not as mobile as Martin'. I've seen Big Will trotted out on goal-line situations at least a couple times this season, at least during UMass. He's still a powerhouse, just not as quick as the D-Line that plays right now
September 23rd, 2010 at 10:02 AM ^
Who was a 3rd year starting C for them and is one of the better interior OLs in the conference. Would be first team All Big Ten if not for Wiesniewski from PSU. It wasn't like he was going against some bum. Not too mention when healthy Iowa OL are pretty damn strong.
September 23rd, 2010 at 10:02 AM ^
The only thing with that is our DLine is not the problem with this defense right now. Sure RVB could step it up a little more but Martin is in strait up beast mode. The only place Campbell could play is NT, and I doesn't make much sense to move Martin from that area, especially the way he is playing and considering how important the NT is in a 3 man front. I am not saying he does not have a shot to be a good player, as others have stated he has time. However, right now throwing him in could hurt the defense even more, in an area we are actually strong.
September 23rd, 2010 at 10:29 AM ^
he fucking dominates them, and then breaks thru for TFL's.
I think all the Campbell talk is more about getting Martin to DE so that he would possibly become a sack machine, but if I understand the 3-3-5 philosophy correctly, the problem with the D isn't the line, it's the LBs behind it (let's not mention the secondary, K?).