OT: Should the Tigers make any moves before the trade deadline?
I just read an article this morning over on ESPN by Dave Schoenfield, and he thinks Detroit is the front-runner to land Ryan Dempster before the trade deadline. Needless to say, that got me thinking. Obviously, Detroit is far from being out of it. Chicago and Cleveland are both coming back down to earth, and we're slowly starting to get more healthy. Plus, it's June and we're only 5 games out. So, we certainly will not be sellers at the deadline.
We have some pretty apparent holes on the team, and they just might be holes that could be fixed through a trade. Namely: inconsistent starting pitching, weak infield defense, total lack of production from whoever has played second, and lack of consistent hitters outside of Cabrera and Fielder. Having Jackson back is a huge boost, and I'm looking forward to when Dirks gets healthy and we have Jackson and him hitting in front of Cabrera and Fielder.
That said, what do you think of Dempster? Who would we have to give up to get him? Would he be worth the price? Is there someone else out there who you think would be a better addition to the team (at any position)?
Personally, I like the idea of Dempster, depending on who we give up for him. I wouldn't give up Turner for him, but I would give up Porcello. I just don't think Porcello will see success in Detroit with the kind of infield defense we have right now. It hurts me to say that, since I've followed him closely since he was in the minors, but it's true. Dempster is less of a groundball pitcher, gets more Ks, and would obviously benefit from pitching in a bigger park. I don't think he's as good as his numbers appear right now, but he's been a pretty consistent pitcher over the last 4 years or so: 200+ IP, FIP in the mid-high 3s, and about 8 Ks/9IP. I think he would fit well in our rotation, especially as a replacement for Porcello. Do you think the Cubs would take that straight up, though? To you Cubs fans, what do you think of that?
Well he's only 21 and he's in Toledo, he's still on the Rick Porcello fast track to the Bigs.
He's only 21 years old.......most prospects take, you know...time to develop more. He's still a great prospect and we'd have to get something huge in return for him.
is only 23
I remain very hopefull that Porcello has a long productive MLB career...Maybe Petry-like.
Petry = Peaches. He was always a good #2/#3 starter for the Tigers.
I miss the days of Walt Terrell, a consistent 13-15 game winner who would smoke cigarettes in between innings.
He's been really good recently too. I'm a Cubs fan and having watched him pitch a lot I'd say he's a solid 2nd or 3rd starter for sure. The defense behind him has cost him this year, as has a huge lack of run support.
In terms of what the Cubs will want/take, 1 word. Plastics.
Er... Prospects. The Cubs are in full "Win in 2015 or 2016" mode right now. We've got 2.5 pieces that are in the bigs right now that will be around for the future: Castro, Garza (the half) and Samarjza (sp? who cares, to hell with ND). We need help everywhere else and Theo is doing it in the minors. We just landed the Cuban, Soler, and he's got some guys in AAA that he likes, if you have any blue chip minor leaguers, we'd take them.
I don't think you're getting any blue-chip guys for Dempster. He's 35 and pitching out of his league right now. Probably get solid prospects, but you're not getting anyone on the level of Turner and Castellanos (our top 2 prospects)
I'm not familiar with your prospects specifically, but it's going to be a seller's market. Dempster has full no-trade rights - there've been rumors that he'd move the the white sox so as not to move his family if they become buyers.
Yeah, Demp is 35, but c'mon, with all the teams that need solid SP and all the teams in contention the Cubs should get something for him. The big question is if the Cubs can package a bad contract along with him. Does anyone want a 35 year old with no knees who has more homeruns since May 15th than anybody? C'mon! You'll get Dempster too!!
I never said they wouldn't get anything for him. But I don't think you'll get any blue chippers for him (ie top 50 prospects). And if you do, joke's on the team that does it. Tigers have two blue chip prospects - Turner and Castellanos - and I wouldn't give up one of those guys to get Dempster unless I'm getting a solid prospect along with Dempster in return. And regarding Soriano - chances are you're going to have to eat that contract no matter what. Either you keep him, or trade him and still pay a majority of his salary.
But I still think it's a seller's market, and we'll see what Theo can do.
Watching Soriano play the outfield has been horrible his whole time in Chicago. First he was a miserable fielder, as he's gotten older his knees have just disintegrated. He seems to know how to play the outfield more now, but he just can't move, especially to his right. Any ball hit in the corner, watching him try to run after it is just painful. That said, he's really, really hot right now. I think an AL team that needs an injection of power at DH could take a little of that cash off our hands. I know we'll have to eat some/most of the deal, but I think he could help somebody.
They should make a deal......at the right price.
Adding a SP and a 2B that is not an automatic out 9 times out of 10 would be a ideal. BP seems to have come around.
Maybe consider one-stop shopping with Dempster and Darwin Barney, who is good defensively, dirt cheap salary-wise (not arb eligible for another year or two even), and not totally useless with the bat and seems to have improved this year over last. At 26 should be entering his prime over the next year or two. Of course, that means you'd have to give the Cubs a reason to trade him and the combo of the two might cost a better prospect than the Tigers are willing to give up.
Yeah, I don't see why the Cubs would be interested in dealing Barney unless they got something great in return. Barney is young, cheap, and decent. But I don't know if Barney+Dempster is worth Turner/Castellanos + other decent prospects.
I doubt the Tigers are in position to add Greinke or another hefty contract now. For them to be active at teh trade deadline, I would like them to put together a 10 or 15 game run where they win 3/4 or even 2/3 of their game before we go all out for this season.
Greinke is going to be a free agent; and you want to trade away Castellanos to rent him for a few months? The Brewers would definitely make that trade straight up. I wouldn't.
The Tigs currently sit at a payroll of 132mil if they add a guy like Greinke long term that would put the payroll up into Yankee, and Red Sox territory and I don't think it's realistic to assume Iliitch would do that.
I have reservations about trading Turner, he's cost controlled for quite some time. We have 3 pitchers eligible for arbitration (Max, Fister, and Porcello) so one of those guys is gone either before or during the winter meetings via trade. In Turner we have a cheap young asset that could help us.
We will truly see if Dombrowski earned that extension last year.
That would be interesting. I have to imagine the Cubs would be very reluctant to part with Barney, though. If we could get both Dempster and Barney though, I'd do that for any two of Porcello, Turner, and Crosby. A trade like that would be so clutch.
They should add a SP. The batting will get better once Martinez comes back, but we need a pitcher. That would leave us with Verlander, Fister, Dempster (if we trade for him), Porcello, and Scherzer.
I happened to watch Jacob Turner pitch against the Durham Bulls Saturday night and really didn't come away impressed. He only gave up 1 ER, however only 2 K's and gave up a lot of solid contact to a dreadful Bulls lineup. I think his ceiling is more SP 3-4 rather than 1-2.
Eh, if you knew nothing about Justin Verlander, and just happened to see his start against Boston where he gave up 5 earned runs in 6 IP, would you deduce that he was nothing more than a below-average pitcher? You can't just look at one game in isolation and make a judgment about a player. Admittedly, Turner hasn't been very sharp in AAA this year, but he's coming off an injury, and as others have said, he's only 21. Give him some time. I'll take the word of professional talent evaluators who say he's a top-20 prospect overall, compared to your evaluation from one game.
Dempster or Garza and a decent 2nd baseman are a must. Just imagine...... Verlander, fister, than Garza or Dempster... that's a pretty solid 1-2-3. Porcello and Scherzer, yet inconsistent, are pretty solid 4-5s.
where will this decent second basemen come from? Their are really no available players that are true answers. Honestly, the tigers could probably get a guy the quality of will Rhymes (although not him of course-Rays) but that might be it
Well considering our current second basemen hit about .200, any upgrade would be nice. We could always move Peralta to second and pick up a SS too.
Got to get a second baseman. Someone who can consistently hit .260 and not wield an iron glove. Maybe we could get Scutaro off the Rockies.
GP South represent!
coming from another South grad.
South grad here too, and Getz could definitely be another possibility.....but I'm not convinced he's a guaranteed upgrade over Worth at the plate. Scutaro's a better hitter even at 36. Not looking for a long-term solution, just one for this year and maybe next.
Getz is for sure better than worth at the plate. Scuturo no, but getz wouldn't be a 1 year rental player. People forget this team has a young core of players. They are not old.
Yeah, I was trying to rephrase that.....he's an upgrade but I don't think he's enough of one. And the thing is, I don't think we need anything more than a year or two rental player. Keep in mind Getz is a .250 career hitter with no power, so he's not a long-term solution. He's the classic good-field-no-hit player.
I like Scutaro. He's nothing flashy but plays decent defense and will hit .270 with 8-10 homers and a dozen bags.
He is 36...doesnt have much speed anymore and is htting .265 in the NL. I dont care what he did at 33 34 or even 35. There comes a point where a guy is too old to produce.
This might be a cop-out answer, but the answer definitely has to be yes for the right price. One issue I think we'll start seeing soon though is that there will be less sellers at the trade deadline with the extra wild-card. A team like the Cubs might be willing to sell, but with more teams looking to make a run, it's going to drive the price up for a guy like Garza or Dempster. If you can get one of those guys without giving up your top two prospects I think you do it, otherwise I think you look at acquiring a 2B and hoping Porcello and Scherzer somehow sharpen up.
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The Tigers need to get Chris Getz to play at 2nd. He could hit in the 2-hole. Solid Left handed bat with good speed. And he wouldnt garner too many prospects. This team could also use another bullpen arm.
Plus Getz went to Michigan
I was just about to say that our bullpen seems to be rounding into form... and news is out now that Octavio Dotel is headed to the 15-day DL, and they've recalled Luke Putkonen to take his place. I just hope he's less of a tire fire than he was earlier this year.
Retroactive to June 2nd so its not as long as everyone thinks. Villarreal has been a nice fit in the late innings so this isn't a huge blow.
He is a rollercoaster. I dont think the tigers can trust him in the late innings. Sidenote: Can he ever attempt to pick off a runner, without throwing the ball away. C'mon it cant be that hard.
Not a 2-hole guy. 8 or 9, really. He doesn't get on base enough. He'd be an upgrade since we are basically playing replacement-level ball at 2B, but I think we could do better.
The main reason he would work is becuase he would come cheap and would give the linup some more speed.
Yes. Trade Verlander to the Yankees to prevent him from inescapably signing with the Yanks 3 years from now when his contract is up.
You might as well put cabrera in the deal too. So he doesnt lose all of his value after another drinking incident, all becuase the Tigers cant win.
More likely, since the Tigers need a lefty, Dombrowski orchestrates a trade for CC.