Just because you disagree with what someone says you don't have to make jokes about their nationality. I'm from Canada too and FYI, it's a great place. If you have a problem with someone fine, but keep focused on what the issue is and stop flinging insults about their nationality. I mean...that;s what 5 year olds do.
Lawrence Marshall is a Buckeye
You disagree with something I say and am mad that I made fun of someone but you call me a clown and say I'm a five year old? Hmmmmmm
Monte, you're full of crap. Just GTFO. It's way too early in Hoke's recruiting career here for you to prognosticate such negative gibberish. For all your gloom and doom bullshit, tell me when the last time was UM landed the nation's #1 RB... Oh, about the time UM was pounding OSU to the turf for years, but you're probably too young to remember that. Find that rock you came from under and crawl back under it.
Michigan was pounding Ohio State into the turf on a consistent basis, what, 13 years ago? 10-2 in the last twelve years is insane and all the kids who are being recruited for the future only know this. If you're entering high school it's fair to say that you think Michigan is a shitty football school.
he does have a valid point, OSU getting Webb is like us getting marcus hall or ray small,
The undefeated season including a win over Michigan doesn't hurt either. If we beat the Buckeyes next year, I think things will start turning back in our favor in the head-to-head recruiting battles.
He already has one of the better Ohio prospects in Ferns. Hoke is holding his own.
Like Ohio, not every Michigan kid will want to go to the big instate school. It's either MSU, OSU, or some other school. Marshall and Webb just happened to pick OSU. It's happened before.(See Gholston, Vernon; Washington, Taurian;Krenzel, Craig)
Calm down. UM and Ohio are recruiting at the same level.There is no distinguishable difference between the two.
You have hit the nail on the head; any in state commitment to Sparty or tOSU seems to draw this response...
At least according to the scouting services. I guess the true test will be on the field but expect Urban to get higher classes every single year
Kyle Trout too today.
That's not much of a surprise though, we're focusing on Doles/Bars/Cole when it comes to Oline.
Trout did not hold a Michigan offer...not a commitable offer, not any offer.
how many schollies does Ohio have for 2014, and how many have verballed ?
20 or something close to that. We have 5 verbals so far.
Another one? Thats two of the top 5 instate at positions of need. That Coombs guy must be one hell of a recruiter.
In all honesty let Urban win the recruiting rankings. I FULLY trust this coaching staff to develop these players to compete at the highest level. Michigan has a better staff than Ohio
I have got to give credit to Meyer's recruiting strategy. He decided to go after Michigan's homebase hard and it's worked thus far. If they had chosen to take a softer stance on these guys, I'm sure Michigan could have locked them up, but Meyer has been very aggressive and is making Hoke and Co's recruiting job a little more difficult. I expect our coaches to be up to the challenge though.
Well that makes me feel all better
Not sure if sarcastic, given your comment at the top of the thread. I just think that Hoke has shown he can recruit on the same level with not that much head-to-head competition between the two. Meyer is finally starting to try to get in there and really see what Hoke is made of. I think Hoke is up to the challenge. I think his staff is. Hoke has done a good job of drawing interest from a lot of the top national prospects. We land a few of those guys and we're not lamenting losing Webb or Marshall.
Hoke WILL have to be strong on McDowell, Doles, and Harris though.
Remember who Urban Meyer called the best recruiter in the coutnry . . .
His strategy is only successful if it ends up being a net benefit.
Damon Webb is going to be a top 100 recruit nationally, so it's a shot to us and a plus to him.
Marshall is a good prospect, but we probably can do better. Meyer can definitely do better given his historical level of recruiting. Probably not a net benefit.
He's trying to screw with us, showing us what happens when we don't stay off his lawn. Good for him, but if he keeps it up it's going to hurt him in the long run...there are only 3-4 kids in Michigan worth it this year. I'm not sure Marshall is one of them.
If we're playing the "who can steal the better player from the other team's home state" game, it's going to be almost impossible for him to win that in the long term. Ohio is too deep and Michigan is too shallow...really MSU is going to end up being the loser here. As usual.
Right, if this leads to him landing McDowell and/or Harris, then we're really talking about Urban owning the state. Meyer probably could have done better than Marshall, but that hurts Michigan only because it's close by. I'm pretty sure most of us will admit Michigan is in on more highly rated defensive ends. Marshall is a solid prospect, close to home. This is definitely going to escalate.
EDIT: You raise a good point as far as who is Meyer missing out on by going after Michigan guys.
OSU has scholarship limits too. Every kid they grab out of Michigan is one less kid that they can grab out of Ohio. Meyer aslo wants to have a significant number of kids from the south.
The net result is a de-emphasis of Ohio by OSU. You can see it when you look at their numbers.
That strategy has some risk. Over time, Meyer will lose his reputation as "that coach from Florida" and become "that coach from the Big Ten". That won't sell as well to many southern kids who will choose to go to a "rising" SEC school - Ole Miss, South Carolina, TAM, etc. - instead of Ohio State.
OSU will get some kids from the state of Michigan, but that's not always going to be a relaible source of talent for Ohio State.
Taking your eye off the Ohio ball to make Hoke's life harder may not be a good long term strategy.
Historically, when Michigan has been able to make in-roads into Ohio, they have been strong. Because of simple math and a wandering eye towards the south and Michigan, Meyer is conceding significant Ohio ground to Michigan.
Meyer may lose his luster in the south, unless of course, Ohio ends up in the NC picture. Then, I suspect he will do just fine in his old stomping grounds.
Pretty good analysis of Meyer's strategy and, yes, Ohio kids are noticing and being passed over or slow-played has hurt some feelings of players at traditionally pipeline programs (e.g. Cardinal-Mooney, Trotwood, Glenville). It's a gamble for sure. That said, this will not be a top year for Ohio talent, so look for both Meyer and Hoke to zero in on the top talent (Ferns, Dante Booker) and move on. In this sense, MSU and other B1G schools should do well, though talent will probably be more of 3*-level (for those that swear by stars). As has been said here and elsewhere, it's very early and UM will get theirs.
go IU. Go road teams.
Or you could root for Ohio State because if they win then Michigan has a better chance at the B1G regular season championship.
but I see IU fading down this tough stretch.
You guys are way too worried about one kid making a single decision on where he wants to go to college and play football. OSU will get their players, and we will get ours and sometimes they will get people we want and sometimes we will get people they want. Get over it....We expect that OSU and UM will continue to both get top 10 classes most of the time, and thinking that Meyer or Hoke will likely move that needle much from what it has historically been long term is sheer foolishness. Some kids will prefer one to the other, or one school to the other, and that will not change. Real question is likely more one of individual talent evaluation by both staffs, and the ability to find players who can be and will be coached up and developed. I trust Mattison and Borges and the entire Michigan staff more than I trust the entire OSU staff to be able to do that based on what I have seen from this staff so far, so should all of you.
When you go undefeated, people want to come to your school. It's not magic. All of this "OMG Flag Planting!" stuff is so overplayed.
Yup. Generally, a team's recruiting success for a class is based on how their season went for the year 2 years preceeding the recruiting class (i.e. 2014 recruiting is impacted by 2012 season). UM had a good 2011 season and reaped the benefits in the 2013 class. OSU's success in 2013 class (despite their sh*tty 2011 season) came from the new coach bump and the fact that the new coach in question was Urban Meyer who has 2 MNC rings.
Unfortunately, UM had a relatively disappointing 2012 season (we know that UM played an extremely difficult schedule while OSU played a much easier one but most recruits aren't going to care about that) and it might be reflected in a weaker 2014 class for UM -- relative to the 2013 class. Also unfortunately, OSU had an undefeated season (and didn't even have to play an undefeated ND or a juggernaut Bama in the MNC game and risk losing) so they are probably going to clean up again in 2014. Sucks but probably true.
The 2013 class just ended. Give me a few weeks before I need to stress out over 2014.
taking kids from Michigan. Do they not realize how much talent we pull out of Ohio?
Ya but none of those are committable offers.
Hoke stole the top recruit in Ohio last year. In 09 Michigan also got the top player in Ohio. 2011 the top 3 players in Ohio chose not to stay in the Big Ten. 2 out of 5?
I realize things are likely to change under Meyer, but Michigan will still get theirs.
Kyle Kalis was the top recruit in Ohio last year and Justin Turner was the top recruit in 09.
Edit: Sorry, meant 2010 the top three recruits in Ohio were lost to other conferences...But im sure you didnt need me to tell you that.
(Latwan Anderson, Jordan Hicks and Spencer Ware)
Can we please stop negging this guy just because he is from Ohio State?
He has not said anything that is trolling.
Rivals has Kalis at 22nd overall and Washington at 25. Shit, im still here arguing this...
And i'll agree with M-dog.
OSU will get its guys and we'll get ours.
The way I look at recruiting is that it reshapes the probability that a team wins any given game. We're recruiting at an extremely high level and so is OSU. In fact, they might be at a slightly higher level going forward. Maybe that gives them, based on talent alone, a 50-55% chance of winning a neutral site head-to-head game with us. That's fine. The talent is similar enough that other factors will generally determine the winner (coaching, execution, talent development, injuries, luck, officiating, weather, etc.).
These probabilities are getting a little out of hand, though, when you compare Michigan & OSU to the rest of the conference.
I thought urban said he wanted the b1g to start recruiting the south? Hmmmmm
The crazy thing is I'm not upset. I actually feel sorry for Lawrence Marshall that he has to go to Columbus.
This is a kick to the groin. A lot of time to flip him though.
I don't really think he's the kind of guy that you waste time trying to flip (unlike Webb). We can find an out of state guy of equal calibur. He's probably a borderline 3/4 star recruit.
Marshall jumped to OSU when our staff is heavily vested in MI and OH recruiting. Makes sense when a staff devalues the Midwest, but Hoke has made it a higher priority than Urban.
The recruiting battles will be intense for years.
recruited both fairly hard. I would understand if we were late with offers as the staff chased national guys. If a kid is indifferent, then go with the first offer or most love. But we've been after both of them from the start.
Meyer's spiel of "we'll play for nat'l championships and I'll prepare you as well as the SEC" must work with some kids.
It's not like these kids didn't have M offers. Perhaps Meyer is just more credible as a coach than Hoke is right now.
It is, theoretically at least, possible that the kid liked Columbus and wanted to attend university there...
Football is a factor in these decisions, coaching etc. but many others come into play.