ESPN OTL: Internal NCAA, EA Emails/Memo's Released in O'Bannon Lawsuit
ESPN released an article late last night detailing internal communication within the NCAA, member institutions, and EA Sports relating to the O'Bannon lawsuit. Some of the content is pretty surprising, at least to me. One high ranking NCAA official proposed dropping the term student-athlete in an internal memo, and also called into question the notion of NCAA defined and enforced amateurism.
To me, at least, there were two big revelations: Nebraska Chancellor Harvey Perlman's view on athlete likeness, and EA's internal practices for developing games. Within the article, Texas' women's administrator disagrees with Perlman, but I'm wary of blockquoting too much.
Perlman:
This whole area of name and likeness and the NCAA is a disaster leading to catastrophe as far as I can tell," wrote Perlman, a former member of the NCAA Board of Directors and law professor specializing in intellectual property. "I'm still trying to figure out by what authority the NCAA licenses these rights to the game makers and others. I looked at what our student athletes sign by way of waiver and it doesn't come close.
As far as EA Sports goes:
Just a heads up, in case schools ask you this all of EA's latest 2008 March Madness basketball submissions have current players names on the jerseys in the game," wrote Wendy Harmon, a CLC marketing coordinator. "I have called Gina Ferranti at EA about this (she submits all of these basketball ones) and she assured me that they will not be using those in the final version. She said they have to put the players names in so it will calculate the correct stats but then they take them off. Just don't want the schools to freak out she said a few have already commented on it in their approval.
This email was sent by an official representing the NCAA in negotiations with EA Sports, the Collegiate Licensing Committee. An hour later from the same official:
Just an FYI on this in case word reaches the NCAA. This is exactly the type of thing that could submarine the game if it got into the media.
September 19th, 2012 at 7:56 AM ^
I really hope players don't get paid. I don't even want to open this pandora's box.
Goodbye fun college athletics. Might as well watch better players in a professional league if they're getting paid.
September 19th, 2012 at 8:14 AM ^
I know I'm probably in the minority around here, but I just don't see how a fan of college athletics can take the NCAA's side on this. By my estimation, they're exploiting the Denard Robinson's and Trey Burke's of the world, pretty much by definition. They're making millions of dollars by selling name and likeness of a few students while compensating them with nothing (the NCAA doesn't give out scholarships), all the while preventing them from obtaining legal counsel in the form of an agent.
If there was another industry that sold its worker's likeness (yes, I realize there is a dispute over definitions here) without compensation and then prevented them from working when they attempted to hire a lawyer specializing in that field, what would the public opinion on that industry be?
September 19th, 2012 at 8:21 AM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 11:58 AM ^
The school and the NCAA are not the same thing. A lot of people say that it's a pandoras box, with schools with more paying more for their athletes, but that's totlaly incorrect. The schools should not, and probably would not, pay a dime. They're already paying their athletes in the form of a scholarship, which for out of state players over 4-5 years could be several hundred thousand dollars. That's more than many players would make in semi-pro leagues, so that value is there.
The NCAA is the problem. They're making boatloads, and the only thing they're doing for the student-athletes is providing a structure in which the games may be played. I think factory workers would be pissed if the logistics guy that shipped what they made got all of their pay.
September 19th, 2012 at 8:31 AM ^
The NCAA is Cartman's CBAA. It's criminal that college players don't get a (reasonable) share of the wealth they create.
September 19th, 2012 at 9:36 AM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 10:10 AM ^
Having a facebook account is nothing at all like working damn near 40 hours a week, while being a college student, to be a student athlete. Not even close.
September 19th, 2012 at 9:01 AM ^
I am completely against paying any form of College Athlete. I do agree with your assessment here though. The NCAA wants to be the governing body and be able to make money at the same time. It creates an environment where the athletes are bound by an agreement to a univeristy and the NCAA basically is stepping in and saying that since they are the governing body of all sports associated at the university level that they too are allowed to use the athletes as they see fit. This is a completely bogus idea. You either are the governing body or you are a money making marketing machine. Those two things should not coexist as they have been allowed. This is why the NCAA is in such a mess right now when it comes to punishment and investigation into fraud or any other type of scandal. They know they are ultimately taking money away from themselves if they punish successful athletic programs. There needs to be a governing body and then a marketing body set up seperately by the universities that would be universal.
September 19th, 2012 at 9:23 AM ^
If I was a D-1 athlete I would be irritated by the fact that people are making money off of my $90 jersey and $60 video game, but I don't have enough money to go out for a nice dinner.
I would have a hard time arguing.
September 19th, 2012 at 9:49 AM ^
If I was a student at a D-1 school, I would be irritated by the fact that somebody with remarkably lower grades and test scores gets to go to school for free beacause they can jump a bit higher or run a bit faster. I would also be irritated by the fact that they get round the clock help with homework and test prep while I slave away in the library hoping I can memorize everything there is to know for an exam. I would also be irritated by the fact that said athletes who get free tuition also get $1000 every month to pay for "rent," when most reasonable places on campus rent for $500 or less. I would also be irritated that said athletes get to schedule their courses before me and get way more preferable schedules. I would also be irritated that said athletes get their own, private facilities for everything while I slave away in the dingy basement of the CCRB. I would also be irritated that these athletes essentially have their pick of any job they want upon graduation due to their status while I stress out over interviews and applications and resumes.
The bottom line is that being a D-I athlete, especially in a revenue sport, comes with immense perks that are immesurable beyond numbers. Are collegiate athletes really victims?
September 19th, 2012 at 10:05 AM ^
When it comes to the O'Bannon lawsuit (which this thread discusses) the question is, "does the NCAA have the right to sell player likeness and not compensate them", not "do athletes have good lives on campus". The answer to the former is completely independent to the answer of the latter.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:29 PM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 10:15 AM ^
I understand that it seems unfair. However, I think too often we point fingers at athletes being the sole abberation in an otherwise perfect meritocracy of admissions. They are not and it is not.
First, there aren't that many of them (relatively speaking). There are something like 750 athletes on U-M's campus, not all of them getting the full scholarship. Not all of them have a "remarkably" lower academic profile than the average student, either. You're talking about a pretty small number of athletes that qualify for the complaint you are lodging.
I would also point out that some number of them would qualify for financial aid if the athletic department were not paying their way, so even without their special status they would get things paid for.
Furthermore, athletes are merely the most visible of the people who get a boost (or a scholarship, or a tuition discount) for something beyond grades and test scores. It's not just those who can "run a bit faster or jump a bit higher." You've got people who can play the trumpet really well. Who have shown outstanding leadership in high school. Who missed their entire sophomore year due to life-threatening illness. Who parents are alumni. Or in the case of U-M, who had the good fortune to live in Michigan instead of being from out of state.
It's far from a perfect meritocracy, and not everyone pays the same or gets the same perks while in college. It can be pretty galling at times, I get that. But IMO athletes seem to get bitched about the most, and painted with a broad brush, it chafes at my sense of fairness.
I think the main thing to take away from this rant is that "chafe" is just a funny word regardless of context.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:03 PM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 3:30 PM ^
Can you clarify what this is in response to? I didn't mention loans, but I know response matching gets wonky if someone's post is deleted.
September 19th, 2012 at 4:34 PM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 5:04 PM ^
Ah, you mean, my "get things paid for" comment, whereas I guess I should have said "some things paid for." Financial aid typically includes loans, yeah, but I'd argue with you about whether the term "financial aid" is synonymous with loans.
MPact has been criminally under-advertised and unreported, IMO. U-M even used BTN money to help fund it, which, hey, suddenly not so tangential.
September 19th, 2012 at 10:42 AM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 10:49 AM ^
coaches' children do not get guaranteed admission nor do they get free tuition. That's the reason Mattison left in 1997 to go to ND - they promised him free tuition for his kids.
September 19th, 2012 at 10:42 AM ^
This is all irrelevant and colossaly-sized sour grapes. Its really a news flash that some people in society get preferrential treatment based on nearly arbitrary things? Is what it is man, our society rewards pretty people more than ugly people, tall people more than short people, skinny people more than fat people, and so on. Where's the news?
If there were a viable minor leage for football and (to a lesser extent) basketball then yeah, the Demar Dorseys of the world could at least take their chances. But there isn't. Moreover, a player can get cut from Alabama for no reason and not be allowed to transfer without penalty. They aren't even guaranteed an education (NCAA forbids 4 year scholarships), and so on. Moreoverer, the definition of the word education is being stretched by some of these tailored degree programs being offered by essentially all schools. Players cant even sell their own property (gold pants and bowl rings for example). I know why, I just think its a bogus reason.
The gap between athletes and the student body at large brings nothing to bear on this conversation. Revenue sports athletes, especially the elite ones, generate a whole lot of scratch for a whole lot of people and are forbidden from participating in that benefit. The people creating the value are the only one forbidden from benefiting from that value. That's bunk. Pay 'em.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:15 AM ^
September 19th, 2012 at 11:44 AM ^
And, please, you think theyre going to have an easier time in the job hunt just by being a bench warmer at michigan? You think somebody Russel Bellomy is walking into a hedge fund job without good credentials just because he played football at Michigan?
You would be amazed at the doors being a college athlete (especially football/basketball) will open. It's absolutely a huge advantage to have that on your résumé.
Also, the vast majority of college athletes represent a net loss for their athletic departments. Do not assume that because a guy has a scholarship to play tennis that he's actually bringing money in. Even football loses money at some schools. If your argument is to only compensate athletes at profitable programs, you'd probably run into Title IX issues off the bat.
September 19th, 2012 at 5:52 PM ^
Of course. And they SHOULD have an advantage. Being a Michigan football player is FAR more impressive an accomplishment than getting a 4.0 in college, and probably speaks more to work ethic than grades and tests.
It may give you an advantage, but a former player with a 2.0 GPA is still not getting a good job over a star student.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:37 AM ^
Just to fact-check you real quick:
The average cost of attending a 4-year institution of higher learning in 2010-11 was $21,657 (http://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=76)
Annual wages for someone working a minimum wage job (which is about right for most college students), at 40 hours a week, every week is $15,080 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_law#United_States)
That's a different is $6,577. So the first thrust of your argument is very wrong. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make with the rest of your statement, but your perception of how much higher education costs is very off.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:48 AM ^
because nobody ever gets Federal grants or student loans :D
/s
September 19th, 2012 at 12:01 PM ^
Student loans aren't quite as sweet a deal as college scholarships. Scholarship guys don't have a giant bill to pay when they graduate.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:53 PM ^
True, but you can also work a regular job while attending school while scholarship athletes can't. I was just saying that for those that qualify Financial aid covers the cost of school and for those that don't qualify , there is a reason they don't qualify.
September 19th, 2012 at 2:17 PM ^
Financial aid in the form of federally backed, privately-run student loans are also creating a whole world of problems in the country. There's now more student loan debt than credit card debt in the US, and it is working in tandem with the recessions to keep the youngest generation of workers from saving and spedning like their predeccsors.
September 19th, 2012 at 3:34 PM ^
And so this is a great time to plug the fact that a number of institutions have committed aid dollars to making sure that students from the lowest-income families graduate with NO loans. Some schools are even doing this for middle-class families.
So at some schools, qualified lower-income students are getting aid that is financially pretty close to what D1 athletes get
/tangent
September 19th, 2012 at 11:21 AM ^
I'm assuming you're referring to football players. I have no idea if all scholarship athletes receive the same benefits.
I can't believe you'd begrudge the athletes anything they receive. If anything, football players are woefully under-compensated. Just think of their benefits as compensation for a job they're performing for the university. A job that has skill requirements that few in the student body possess.
As a former student I appreciated all the football players did for the school. They gave the school a great team for which to cheer.
They also subsidized part of our own education costs. Having the Athletic Department being financially independent and profitable allowed the University to not pass some of the costs to the students.
As for having to stress out about interviews, applications, and resume, that's all on you. If you're smart and motivated, opportunity will be there.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:49 AM ^
I think all scholarship athletes receive the same benefits from the school (though in certain sports, the scholarships are divided up - there will be like 10 scholarships for 20 athletes). The Title IX stuff is a problem. I don't know if you can compensate football players without having to do that for everyone else.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:39 AM ^
Why not get mad at the fact that just because a kids smarter than you are he gets to goto school for free too! Maybe if you had paid a little bit more attention in school you wouldn't have to slave away in a basement. Sports programs not only rake in millions for large universitys through ticket sales, jerseys and concessions they also inspire alumni to give back millions every year.
It probably wouldn't be that big of a deal if the NCAA allowed them to work (i'm sure any regular student has a job) or the fact practice , film study, weight conditioning and anything else it takes to try and be competetive takes more time in a week than 99% of college students spend studying.
Patrick Omameh held a 4.0 GPA in high school and scored a 28 on his ACT. PFFT remarkably lower grades
Off the field, Omameh visits the U-M Mott Children's Hospital weekly and participates with numerous service groups and charitable causes, including Relay for Life, Victors Day and From the Heart. He also has visited the Ann Arbor VA Medical Center and has participated in several other fundraising events, such as the David Mealer Memorial Golf Classic and "Bowling for Camp Mitchitanki." Omameh also was selected to the Order of Angell, Class of 2012, which includes leaders from a variety of campus organizations.
What do you do in your off time to give back to your community or the university
September 19th, 2012 at 11:59 AM ^
Omameh's story is awesome and I love having him as a representative of the school, but let's be honest: he's an exception to the rule.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:12 PM ^
Having been an graduate instructor at both Michigan and now Wyoming, in my experience, many many many athletes are simply awesome in the classroom.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:21 PM ^
Oh, I don't dispute that a lot of these guys bust their butts to keep their grades up when they're here. It's just that most would not be here if they weren't good at their sport. I don't begrudge them this. I think it's a fair deal overall.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:34 PM ^
There are also a lot of regular students who attend the university who would not be there if not for some special circumstances. Most of the athletes provide a service for the university and the surrounding community. For example the football team spring game revenue goes to the Mott Chilrens hospital. How much money would the debate team be able to raise for Motts?
Omameh might be the higher end of the spectrum but, there a lot of Michigan football players who try and help out their communities. Look at Martavius odoms, Zoltan Mesko, Braylon Edwards, Lamar woodley, Charles Woodson and Dhani Jones all of them donate a lot of time and some of them donate alot of money to charity. They try to return to their communities to afford other kids a shot like they received. I pulled these names up with doing 0 research but, how many busniess graduates who became multi-millionares go back to their high schools and build librarys, donate money so their old school district can hire better teachers or anything like that. Sure those business grads donate money.... to the University of Michigan so they can add some luxery boxes and upgrade the athletic facilities.
Student athletes in most cases have to work harder than your average student. To imply anything different is ridiculous.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:15 PM ^
People are under the impression that the NCAA and the schools that play games under its banner are the same thing. If you have a problem with the student-athletes getting all that, your problem is with the schools, NOT with the NCAA. The NCAA doesn't provide any of that. Nada.
This is the problem -
Schools recruit student athletes
Student athletes play a sport for their school, and in return recieve free or discounted tuition and room and board.
School makes money by selling game tickets, merchandise and so on.
NCAA sells licencing rights for products featuring the student athletes and makes money.
The School/Student-Athlete relationship is a sound, stable relationship wherein payment (in whatever form) is provided for services rendered. If you think that payment is biased or unfair one way or the other, fine, but at least it is a two way street. (Your particular argument also fails to recognize you can earn a scholarship for applying yourself accademically, artisitcally or socially, where it benefits the world in some way, so basically it sounds like you're bitching that some people work harder than you and get free education for it.)
The Student Athlete - NCAA relationship, on the other hand, is beyond bogus. Nothing is provided for services rendered under the pretense that digital representations, numbered jerseys and other non-specific gear don't relate to a specific person, which we all know is bullshit.
Here's how it should work:
Student athletes agree to play a given sport for a given school, and recieve free or discounted education in return.
Schools make money by selling game tickets and team based merchandise. A portion of that money is paid to the NCAA to provide governance and structure for competition and the lives of student athletes.
Item manufacturers, like EA, approach individual schools about licencing fees to represent the school and its players in various merchandise. (If you're too small for a merchandise manufacturer to care about putting you in its product, that's too bad).
The school, either through a pre-set agreement in the LOI or through as-needed contracts, gets approval from the student athletes to be represented to okay that likeness or representation, in return for a portion of the licencing fees. To preserve some level of amatureism, entire teams must be licenced, not jsut individual players. You wanna make a Michigan licenced #16 shirt? Okay, but you'll be making all of the other numbers currently represented on the roster, and each player will receive the same portion of the licencing fees (football players might recive 0.25%, whereas basketball players might recieve 3%, due to the smaller number of players).
September 19th, 2012 at 1:09 PM ^
"I would also be irritated that these athletes essentially have their pick of any job they want upon graduation due to their status while I stress out over interviews and applications and resumes."
As a recent grad, I for one do not agree with this at all. Many employers couldn't care less what you used to do on Saturdays. Really depends on the job I suppose.
Also when I was a student "at a D-1 school", what irritated me A LOT more than any of those was when Michigan lost a football game.
September 19th, 2012 at 1:42 PM ^
As a recent grad, I for one do not agree with this at all. Many employers couldn't care less what you used to do on Saturdays.
Are you a former student-athlete, or otherwise qualified to make this observation?
I once worked in the HR field, and can tell you that decisions made regarding hiring can be quite irrational. The qualities that separate the successful candidates for entry-level positions from the rest often have absolutely nothing to do with what they did in the classroom.
September 19th, 2012 at 2:01 PM ^
I really just take issue with "have their pick of any job". That's a whiny exaggeration. Varies widely by employer/industry. Agree that decision criteria can be subjective/irrational or based heavily on experiences outside the classroom.
September 19th, 2012 at 3:36 PM ^
Remember that annoying smart guy we all knew who could skip class, never study, and ace the exam by cramming the night before? Do you remember that friend we all had who would always do better than you on the exam even though he studied with you and reviewed the exact same material for the exact same amount of time? Are you irritated by them as well just because they're quicker or better at memorizing, comprehending, or test taking?
September 19th, 2012 at 11:19 AM ^
If I was a D-1 athlete I would be irritated by the fact that people are making money off of my $90 jersey and $60 video game, but I don't have enough money to go out for a nice dinner.99% of athletes at U-M won't have their jerseys for sale during their careers. There's the rub. If you compensate the Denard Robinsons of the world, you've got to compensate everyone - the Jareth Glandas, the cross-country runners, the swimmers, golfers, etc. I don't know if the money is there for that.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:43 AM ^
Most of the larger schools are for paying their athletes. There most certainly is money for it there. The smaller schools who barely get by as it is are the ones that hold back this from happening. The thing is, not everybody can be a BCS AQ school.
September 19th, 2012 at 11:56 AM ^
I'm not sure about that. I read recently that only a small number of Division I schools actually make money on athletics. Even many BCS-conference schools need subsidies from their school's general fund to stay afloat.
September 19th, 2012 at 12:55 PM ^
If we are talking about a hypothetical situation in which players are getting paid for their own licensing rights, then why can't we talk about a hypothetical situation in which you don't have to compensate everyone equally and instead do something that makes actual sense?
September 19th, 2012 at 10:03 AM ^
Players at (insert bile object school) already get paid. All the NCAA has to do is stop telling players they can't take money. The schools don't have to pay the players, but the NCAA has no business telling players they can't take money from outside sources.
Under the current system, only the cheaters get paid. If your BFF runs the NCAA, you get "punishment" that has almost no effect in the long run. If you are a Coach K, the NCAA does a half-hearted investigation in cases like Corey Magette and now Lance Thomas. The current system doesn't work, so why not just get rid of 95% of the rule book and fire the incompetent and worthless "enforcement" staff?
We saw what happened when Michigan decided to "compete with the big boys" in the 1990's; I would love to see that again, but without the cheating. As it is now, Michigan is at a huge disadvantage. They are doing it right, but have to play against and be compared to schools that are cheating.
The players deserve the money and the schools that try to do it right deserve to compete on an equal playing field. The players aren't even "amateurs" in high school anymore, but we still cling to an outdated concept that has about as much place in this era as a horse and buggy.
"The rich will get richer?" They already are.
September 19th, 2012 at 10:28 AM ^
You honestly think deregulation would make an equal playing field? How could it? It would just be the boosters with the deepest pockets collecting all the best players for their school. Near total deregulation is an awful idea.
September 19th, 2012 at 4:02 PM ^
...Vonnegut's still as relevant as ever:
Every coach in the Ivy League was out to knock him down to a PE-003 again, and two losses would do it. Yale and Penn were loaded. Yale had floated a bond to buy the whole Texas A&M backfield, and Penn had bought Breslaw from Wisconsin for $43,000.Roseberry groaned. "How the hell long they think a man can play college football?" he wanted to know. Six years before, Cornell had bought him from Wabash College, and asked him to list his idea of a dream team. Then, by God they'd bought it for him.
"But what the hell they think they bought?" he asked himself. "Sumpin' made outa steel and see-ment? Supposed to last a lifetime, is it?" They hadn't bought him so much as a water boy since, and the average age of the Big Red was now close to thirty-one.
Player Piano, ch. 28
September 19th, 2012 at 12:28 PM ^
If you're the type of person that thinks college athletes are "already paid" (with scholarhips), then paying them a more fair amount won't fundamentally change that.
Further, not sure if the fact that it's fun watching kids play for free is a good enough reason to make them play for free while they generate billions upon billions of dollars.