WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON!! SERIOUS?...sorry for my outburst.
spoiler alert: i linked this
WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON!! SERIOUS?...sorry for my outburst.
Would the coaches even accept a commitment from him at this point, given that Treadwell and Green are the primary targets for the final two spots in the class?
This is going to be interesting for the coaches! I mean I guess you don't say no to him right?
That's ship has passed.
Was about to post this. Apparently his dad has said he's going to take an official to Michigan this fall. Not sure if we'll end up having the spots, but if it does open up, it sounds like it will be between Michigan, FSU, and Oklahoma.
Scroll to the bottom.
We pulled out. Nothing to see here.
Didn't the coaches say they would hold a spot for him until the end? Doesn't that spot disapear if you commit to another school? Someone help. I am excited and confused at the same time.
Meh. I want Treadwell and Green.
And there's a decent chance we get neither. Take the talent you can get.
I agree. However, I'd still listen if he truly is planning a visit in the fall. You never know what may happen between now and then.
I want McQuay. Beast.
Even if he de-commits, do we still have room? I would think we would hold a place for a 4-star or higher WR (LT), and I don't think we'd turn away Green. I know those two are not locked in, but is LB a position of need at this point? If we get neither, absolutely we take him, but I'm not sure how the coaches would handle this.
My quesition is whether we have the ability to back-date any of these recruits if they can enroll early... Aren't we still under the 85 total scholarship limit, or am I taking crazy pills?
If we can't count any towards our 2012 class, and there aren't any decommits, I just can't see us taking another LB, but signing day is a long way off.
The 85 total is the problem, not the 25 per year, so backdating won't help.
Got it. For some reason I thought we were still sitting at 82-83, but that makes perfect sense.
I'd rather keep our commitments we have now, not piss anyone off by turning them down after decision, and avoid hoping some kids leave. Not worth getting one player if that's the price.
I don't think that's true. Let's say we don't offer any of our to-be-5th-year guys that last scholarship year. (Obviously, we'll invite some back, but stick with me.) We'd be well below 85 then, right, even with a 25-player class? I think the question about whether we can include any early enrolling 2013 guys with the 2012 class is a good one. I don't think we can, but does anyone know for sure?
Yes, we can backdate three players from the next class. We had 25 in 2012, but three of them were backdated, so officially that class is three under the limit. 85 is no problem if we don't invite anyone back for their fifth year, but since that would be completely insane, the 85 limit may come into play. At this point no one knows how much attrition we'll have. Some of it is predictable, but it seems like we always get some surprises too.
We're at a 21 man class right now, with no more attrition. There are 4 to-be fifth year guys - Mike Jones, Brendan Gibbons, Cam Gordon and Quinton Washington. If all 4 weren't given fifth years, we'd be up to 25 (without other attrition). That's highly doubtful, since Cam is a good player who backs up the SAM, and no one else is proven there, Gibbons was our starting PK last year and Q is one of only a few DTs with experience once BWC leaves. It's possible more than just Jones gets the handshake, but probably not more than one.
Now, if a couple other guys leave, we could get into that territory, but we already need Mike Jones plus-3 to get to 25.
Gallon, Fitz, Schofield, Jones, Gibbons, c. Gordon, Washington, t. Gordon, Lewan
Sorry, I should have said 4 who were possibilities. I left out current non-specialist starters. I didn't need to mention why we keep Fitz or Lewan, for example.
As long as Lewan keeps doing what he's doing, he'll be a projected 1st round pick and thus a likely candidate to leave early. If Fitz puts out per carry averages like last year with a heavier workload, it's also likely he'd leave early (RB's having short careers and all).
Not sure if there are any other possible early entries, but those 2 definitely come to mind.
have 77/85 scholarships allocated right now. Leaving 8. There are 13 RS SR and SR. Leaving 21 open spots for the 2013 class and putting us up against the 85 limit (back dating wont help). We currently have 23 commits in 2013 so we already have to plan on 2 of 9 RS JRs not getting a 5th year or some other attrition.
IIRC, EJ all but made it clear it was us vs. FSU, with the Criminal Justice major available at FSU as being the deciding factor (something I fully respected). I'm interested to hear why he's re-opening up, but with the class we have right now and the positions of need, I'd rather wait it out on Tread and Green then have him take a spot. Obviously attrition caveats apply. But something seems fishy here. Maybe Jimbo's ban on using Twitter is going to drive away some recruits. I know, sounds absolutely ridiculous, but that's what them kids are doing these days, loving that Twitter. That said, if a third available spot were to open up, he'd be a great grab.
The only rumor I've seen on Twitter was that the coaches haven't contacted him at all since he committed. No idea of that's true or not, but it's the only thing I've seen thus far.
According to EJ's dad theres some kind of 'communication' going on between the LBs coach and the LB commits EJ is not aware of. Something is brewing there and FSU better reassert themselves.
I don't see that on twitter ... source?
Again, total rumor, no idea who these guys are, all of the disclaimers, but:
Brian just sent this cryptic Tweet:
EJ Levenberry. If you can read that, read it. Normally I wouldn't give much credence to it given M's class but EJ's dad is... blunt.
I assume he's referring to the paywalled Rivals article about this, which apparently contains some eye-opening quotes from Levenberry's dad about his situation and Michigan's class.
Maybe just a summation of Levenberry's dad and his thoughts about said situation as to not upset the paywall police?
I don't have a Rivals subscription, I was just trying to decipher Brian's tweet.
If his Dad says that he is going to take an official this fall, it probably means they have maintained some form of contact with the coaches, no? If the coaches weren't interested in him any longer, I think they would tell him.
I don't have access to the story on Rivals but someone on Twitter said that his dad was awfully blunt about some stuff
Just let him attend Michigan free of charge, but don't call it a scholarship.
you can't, uh, do that.
He certainly would fit the bill for best player availible, regardless of position. Hard to argue for it considering the way the depth chart currently pans out.
Yea we dont really need another LB, or RB really. WR on the other hand, is a position of great need. As long as Treadwell commits, I'm happy with Green or Levenberry for that remaining spot.
We could definitely use an every-down RB like Green in this class. If we can't address that need until the 2014 class, then Fitz's replacement would come in as a true freshman. If we get Green, he'll at least have a year under his belt before being put into full-time service. Wyatt Shallman and Justice Hayes may or may not evolve into every-down backs, but Green is tailor-made.
Levenberry would be a pure luxury at this point.
Deveon Smith is our every down back in this class. Thomas Rawls is also an every down back and will be a Soph.
Oh yeah, totally forgot about Rawls. He looks to be overachieving relative his modest recruiting profile.
So I guess this means that even if we strike out on both Treadwell and Green and don't bring in anyone to replace them, we'll be just fine. Wow. Life is good.
Well no immediate Levenberry commitment, so time for pictures of cats
Maybe I should have worded it better, AN ELITE WR IS OF GREAT NEED.
BPA? You might have to provide something to back that up. His rating have done nothing but slide since he was first ranked. He's good, but with the LBs we've got and the number of spots left, I have to question whether he's BPA material.
He's one of the best linebackers in this class as far as making a big impact upon hitting the ball carrier, and he's very active in coverage. Im not interested in linebacking prospects who live on arm tackles, and there's more than a few out there. EJ is in a class behind Reuben Foster as far as being a factor on defense from what I can see on YouTube. I'm not all that concerned with what his rating has done between one point of him not playing football to another.
It is very possible that we have some attrition this year once the season gets rolling. Please don't take this the wrong way, that is not what I am hoping for, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone buried on the depth chart opted to transfer for more play time.
Yeah but we can't sign players in excess of the scholarship limit. IF the coaches have been leaving a spot open for Levenberry all this time while continuing to recruit Treadwell and Green, then there may be some attrition coming that hasn't been made public yet.
but you're thinking about it wrong.
Our latest projected class # is 25 players. We don't even have room for that right now. We need (I think) 4 more guys to leave the program to sign 25. So, when someone leaves, and then we say 'oh thats one more scholly', no its not. Thats one less player that needed to depart to even have room for our current commitments.
So for these "dream scenarios" of taking Green, LT, and Levenberry/Priest Willis/McQuay, we'd need 26 spots and for 5+ guys to leave the program.
We don't have commitments from either LT or Green. Hey I hope we land both, but how can you hold two spots when the kids haven't said they are coming? Do we take the chance of getting caught with our pants down and hold out schollys and possibly lose one or both, and also lose out on a top LB? Did they not say you better move quick to McQuay? Why not tell both the EJ is coming so you better pick your spot if you want it?
The coaches must like our chances. I think Treadwell is an absolute lock.
This. Those two guys havent told YOU they are coming. Is it so outrageous to think they might tell Hoke things they dont tell us?
I think that Green and Treadwell are far from locks, and everyone else is a longshot (except of Mathis who is an enigma) so closing the door on EJL seems dubious.
Nevertheless, I have a feeling we havent heard the end of this.
EDIT: Mods have priority posting. I fail.
Green and Treadwell at this point. EJ is a great player, but the other 2 fill bigger needs.
Treadwell coming out and saying he wants to take more and more visits. Or maybe he has a gut feeling he's going to be booting Clark off the team?
Ugh this sucks. Dammit Levenberry why couldn't you just commit back in the spring when you were supposed to, and then we wouldn't be in this situation?
I want this kid badly, but I just don't think we'll have room for him unless we have some attrition during the year, which I'm not hoping for unless someone legitimately wants out. Other than that, the only way I see him committing is if either Treadwell and/or Green commit elsewhere, and then a spot opens up.
This does not suck. Michigan has choices and is in a good position.
Seems like FSU is really screwing it up.
Does he not feel like he's wanted anymore? His committment is relatively fresh.
It has been over 3 months now.
say that EJ and his parents aren't happy with the FSU coaches for reasons somewhat along the line of what you suggested.
Am I the only one who is starting to think that EJ's dad is one of those overzealous dad's who is a royal pain in the ass?
Can you give us hints, in pig latin? Or would the holier-than-thou Beaver and Balas take offense?
I have pay access and there is a something about how EJ has a better relationship with a certain D coach up North than one down South.
Was that vague enough for the mods?
I heard his name is similar to Shgreg Shmattison.
Hmm..can I have another hint?
...not following you..
........ Zeg Zattison? Dregg Drattidon?
Dammt! I could be at this ALL DAY before I figure this out.
Is it bad that I root for attrition because the prospect of getting another blue chip is so exciting?
Well, when you put it the way you did, it doesn't sound bad as much as it does dumb. I'm not calling you dumb, but losing a current player for some excitement isn't very smart for winning.
Now, if you said you hoped for current roster players who most likely weren't going to play to move on so that we could fill his roster spot with a highly touted prospect, then that's different. Maybe that's what you meant though, in which case it's not that bad.
I guess hoping for Michigan football players to leave is a bad thing, but you can be OK with guys who make a decision to find PT elsewhere.
This is new to us, having a full class of 5*s and 4*s by July, and having even more 5*s and 4*s lined up who want to join. We're not used to it.
We need guidance from the Master: What would Nick do?
Cut the longsnapper?
Start handing out the greyshirts.
That Nick create mysterious injuries and the likes and sends young men who have worked their entire lives for scholarships to Southwestern Alabama State Institute of Technology. I like how well coached his defense is, but that's about it.
Be careful, RDT's dad went to SWASIT.
we would call it here, Michigan State University.
That thought of this Nick
before this one when you asked what would Nick do?
Not to also be a dick, but I didn't even think it looked good then, let alone now.
I really can't see any rationalization of the LS scholarship that doesn't sound silly at the end of the day. No offense to the young man, but the only conclusion I can come to is that Hoke apparently has a long-snap lizard brain that may end costing us a four-star recruit.
Mind, as lizard brains go it's a pretty innocuous one.
Maybe one of you geniuses can step in and tell them how it's done. Obviously, Hoke hasn't played as much NCAA 13 as you guys or he'd realize his mistake.
Can't we just stop with the LS whining?!
I was originally vehemently opposed to offering a long snapper a scholarship. I'll back off that a little now, but I am vehemently opposed to offering a long snapper a scholarship eight damn months before Signing Day.
Ask this question again when a game comes down to a critical fg. Or when we are protecting a narrow lead with seconds to go and have to punt.
There was no question... WHAT DO I ASK MYSELF!!!!!
Except that scholarship specialists screw up too (Gibbons and Hagerup). The difference between a scholarship snapper and whoever is the best of your 4 walk-on snappers just isn't that great.
it is no guarantee that he will perform any better than a walk on. In addition, there is no gaurantee that a LS you offer in June will be any better or even any different than a LS you offer in January.
So the real question should be which has more value:
a) a LS scholarship in June vs
b) leaving a scholly open in case a 5 star LB or any other elite athlete has interest in your program and if they don't then still having that scholly available to offer that same LS or a similarly skilled LS.
I would choose option B every time.
My qeustion is what if we strike out on both LT and Green? What if we lose a recruit or two (did last year, 2 to be exact), what if say Furman or T. Carter leave (just off my head), that opens up spots.
Seems silly they wouldn't even consider it.
If those things happen, then there will be open spots. At this moment in time there are no more spots for LBs. I'm pretty sure the coaches have back up plans.
If we get no more commits at all we will still have one of the top recruiting classes in the country and all our positions of need filled.
Does Jimbo have a degree from Michigan? You realize he went to Michigan right?
What makes you think he went to Michigan? According to Wikipedia he went to Salem College and Samford.
Farrell's latest tweet:
And just like that
#Michigan pulls out of the Levenberry race unless they lose a commit per levenberry's father
Doesn't look like it will happen. But I suppose the more positive way to spin it is that the coaches must feel pretty confident in their chances at landing both Treadwell and Green.
That was an exciting 15 minutes. That is about the most action we can see on the board these days- the (untrue) rumor that maybe some player is maybe decommitting and maybe going to visit us.
He'll tell EJ we're full. I don't buy it from Farrell.
Michigan pulls out per Rivals Mike
No, you were right the first time...
Great double post
when you aren't properly protected, yes it is the right move
There isn't another slot open?
is the rythm method in action!
Regardless where he ends up, it's refreshing to see more kids "getting it" about UM. Top notch degree, awesome tradition, awesome facilities, awesome coaching staff, plethora of rivalries, etc.
If I was a top high school football prospect, my top choices would be schools like USC, UM, ND and Texas strictly on combined academics, tradition and football excellence alone. It's fun to play ball for four years, but any kid with a half decent support network and family should understand the high probability he'll never earn a paycheck playing ball, and should thus go for a very good degree that opens doors after school. Levenberry appears to get that. FSU > community college, but it's no Florida, and certainly not a Michigan academically. Whether he ends up with us or not, this is good to see.
at the time was that he chose FSU because it had a better criminal justice program than Michigan. He was making his choice on academics and non-football future.
It couldn't have been made purely on academics or his relationship with his coach wouldn't be this big of a deal. I'm not saying academics didn't play a role, but if he committed because of academics, why would he decommit because of football?
Who knows what goes on in the heads of 17 or 18 year old kids? Something's changed obviously...
Academics was solely the reason. UM did NOT have the program that EJ wanted. However, once committed, FSU staff pretty much neglected (his position coach) him. IMO he felt left out. He MISSED that bond that UM staff was showing.
Secondly, it was a while back but a mogoblogger posted the steps EJ can take at UM for his field of interest.
Just saying Academics was a significant factor at the time for EJ.
Wait, wait. Could you go back to the part again where ND is excellent at football?
if we didn't offer channel stribbling we'd still have a spot for him
maybe we would have went out and found a different CB....
How do you know Stribling isn't the next Charles Woodson?
Stribling is a non-dwarf CB whom the coaches saw in person at camp. That's a reasonable case in which to say 'I'll trust the coaches on that one.'
It doesn't take D1 coaching acumen to question the value of a scholarship long snapper, however.
Hey Joshisablowhard - if you're gonna bitch about a recruit, at least make the effort to spell his first name correctly. It's not all that hard.
But as to your point - do you know better than the coaches how good Stribbling is? The kid impressed in person in front of the coaches.
Maybe you should spell his last name correctly.
I wish we were the sec. "hey, 5th year senior who never plays. How would you like to enter the grad assistant program a year early?". Come on, you all were thinking it.
that's not what the SEC does. They make up injuries to underclassmen. Even Michigan sometimes doesn't bring 5th years back.
The sec has numerous other practices when it comes to that. Anyways, it was a joke. Lighten up, guy, go get a drink.
wait until Friday for a drink. I'm trying to avoid the whole week night drinking so that I can get in better shape lol. But yes, the SEC does have lots of practices to get rid of kids. I'm just saying, I'm not going to rag on them for the 5th year thing when it's something we've done. Not to mention, I don't really think it's all that un-ethical. A 5th year kid has already had 4 years in which to go to school and earn a free degree. That's not like getting rid of a 1st or 2nd year guy who has had virtually no shot to complete a degree.
It is very possible we lose a commit between now and NSD. I hope we don't, but its a good thing to have a back-up plan
I don't know... this recruiting class seems pretty tight. It seems like the two we hear the least about are Kugler and Poggi
Eh, I wouldn't worry about those two. Both come from coaching families with brothers at big time programs already, so I think they know what they're doing. Poggi knew for a while where he was going, but held out to get more coaches to come out to his practices to check out his teammates. Hopefully he likes it so much he brings Troy Vincent Jr along and whatever other talent comes out of the Gilman school.
Pointing the finger in a particular direction is difficult, which is why I can't sign on about Kugler and Poggi, but the numbers and time until National Signing Day makes this seem more likely.
If Levenberry is still a possibility, that's good enough. Though the Michigan recruiting strategy these days seems to minimize kids bailing, Levenberry would be a wonderful card to play if the need arises.
stressing over EJ months ago. So to save the tears, I will not read any further.
so much they come off looking really indecisive. I may be wrong, but it seems like Brandon and Hoke much prefer athletes who really want to come here and won't fool around too much with guys who want to "play the field". That's what worries me about Treadwell's recruitment. I don't blame kids for wanting to check out ALL their options. The stakes are high on all accounts.
Is there a way to take Treadwell, Green, and EJ and still not go over the scholarship limit?
As long as you know Nick Saban.
attrition. seems like the only plausible scenario besides hoke pulling a nick saban. i'd be willing to be someone transfers in the middle of the season. someone who gets buried on the depth chart. at that point, a spot for levenberry would open up.
It's awful tough to wait around on a maybe though...
lose the long snapper
We don't pull scholarships without cause. Stop with the LS hate, it's old and makes you look like a bitter ex-girlfriend.
Needing to add new prospects to the board down the road as we have no sure things at this point. Can't we continue to recruit him but make the offer non-commitable?
He wanted FSU over Mich..I wouldnt give him shit.. He's wasting our time and we need to focus on LT and Green.. Also, his dad reminds me of a man that killed 5 hookers while at SMU
It's a good thing there's no room. Kids will think twice about choosing another school.
Curious timing right after the BBQ. Maybe he saw how close all the '13 guys were? Does fsu have something similar or is it all hookers all the time?
Did anyone else read that Zeke Pike just got cut from Auburn for ANOTHER disciplinary problem?
Gotta be a false rumor. Brian would post it on the front page if that were true
- - AUBURN -- Quarterback Zeke Pike, who signed with the Tigers last winter as a three-star prospect, has been dismissed from the team for a violation of team rules.
The native of suburban Cincinnati was arrested on June 24 for public intoxication. That wasn't his first brush with trouble - Pike was suspended twice during his senior season at Dixie Heights (Ky.) High for disciplinary reasons.
"I'll be better because of all this," Pike told AuburnSports.com.
Pike, 19, was 4-of-8 for 42 yards in the A-Day game earlier this year. He enrolled in January and earned time with the first-team offense during spring practice when Clint Moseley went down with a shoulder problem.
Sophomore Kiehl Frazier and Moseley, now a junior, are expected to challenge for the starting job throughout fall camp. Auburn also has a true freshman, Jonathan Wallace, on scholarship at quarterback.
--Senior Recruiting Analyst Justin Hokanson contributed to this report.
Too noob to initiate new thread, but Scout has a free video with the director of scouting (Kennedy) and 1 of the 3 subjects he talks about is recruit most likely to make an impact, and Kennedy not only selected Green, but stated he would move up to at minumum the #2 RB on scouts rankings.
Looks like Rivals will not be alone at naming him a 5* and having him ranked blue-chip elite.
No matter where EJL ends up, this serves Ann Arbor.
How Michigan handles this situation speaks VOLUMES about Hoke & Company. There is much to be gained by gently closing the door as it appears to have happened.
(1) It illustrates to other recruits that people who decline U of M may very well regret the decision, the more they consider it.
(2) It illustrates that invitations to play in Michigan do not last forever, even if you are very, very, VERY good at football. And those invitations disappear early with this staff.
(3) Michigan will NOT sell recruits out to displace someone for the flavor of the month. Unlike other schools/conferences. So if you come to the party late, no matter how good you are, if there is no room, the room will not be made for you at someone else's expense.
But then again, if you commit to Michigan, Michigan commits to you.
Saying no to Lewenberry (unless a spot legitimately opens up) brings us closer to Treadwell/Green/ any other current and future fence-sitters, by making our program look stronger, stabler, and more honorable.
If an LB spot does legitimately open up, Lewenberry commits here before Hoke even completes his sentence inviting him to the program.
But the news here is not whether we have room for Lewenberry.
The news is that Treadwell and Green must consider whether we shall have room for THEM for much longer. And it's not because Michigan is strongarming ANYONE: it's all courtesy of EJL's dad.
Thank you, EJL's dad!
It's somehow appropriate that my #100 is a "D'oh!"-type of post.
(But my point still stands.)
it would be nice to use the last few spot on some skill position recruits
You don't tell your own commits the meaning of "commitment" includes no visits to other schools, then turn around and let a kid who reaffirmed his commitment to another school come for a visit.
Unless you're Urban Meyer.
Also, we had room for two LBs and we now have two. I'd like to have E.J., too, but we have plenty of good, young talent at LB. E.J. made his bed, now he had to lie in it. Welcome to southern football, son.
I really think an analysis of integrity's impact on a football program--especially recruiting--would be an awesome idea.
There are a bunch of things that complicate the issue (having a successful NFL-caliber coach being one of them), but for once, it seems like 'doing the right thing' is paying off.
...you lost your place in line. Hoke should still have interest in the kid given that he's an elite talent. But our primary targets are Green and Treadwell and we need to play our cards to ensure both their commitments first. If it turns out we lose one (or both), THEN we can turn to Levenberry if he's still available. This may go all the way to NSD before it resolves.
Good problem to have btw.
The decommitment makes a lot more sense in light of this:
a t-shirt that says "HOLLA ACHA BOY" but written with a shoelace. It would sell well not only in Ann Arbor, but in the section of Florida between Lake Okeechobee and Pompano Beach. This is the area known affectionately as the Pahokee-Deerfield region.
Wow, that rapper is terrible, just terrible.