Ballz Don't Lie: A Sober Discussion Of Our Crystal Ball Approach Comment Count

Ace

BBQ Visitors Update

Before I get into the actual post, a quick update from 247's Steve Lorenz on the BBQ visitors list—as is the case with any recruiting event, a handful of prospects on the early list won't end up making it:

ATH Markquese Bell 
ATH Sione Heimuli-Lund 
TE Josh Falo 
LB Jordan Anthony

Michigan still is in good shape with Bell (who just set up an official) and Anthony; we'll see how matters develop with Heimuli-Lund and Falo.

Four current commits who were slated to attend, including Dylan McCaffrey, also aren't coming this weekend. There are, at least, two high-profile additions among 2018 visitors: four-star IN RB Markese Stepp (ND commit) and four-star IN OG Emil Ekiyor. [CROOTIN EDIT: Steve just let me know Stepp and Ekiyor cancelled late, too. Ekiyor may still try to make the trip, but Stepp definitely won't be there.]

About Our Ballz


KJ Hamler's comments about Oregon to an MSU reporter led to an early CB pick.

Anyway, the point of this post—which will turn into a recurring post on our Crystal Ball picks—is to go over our methodology for making Crystal Ball selections, since people go about making those picks in very different ways. For instance, Lorenz is pretty conservative with his picks, presumably because he has to account for the reaction from his readers and make sure he's not tipping the hand of a recruit who wants to keep an air of mystery about his destination (which happens fairly often).

Brian and I (we both put picks in on my account) take a different, more speculative approach—we're more willing to put in an early pick, keeping in mind that we can always change it if new information arises. While this occasionally comes back to bite us—like with the Ademilola twins, who had Michigan out in front, then made surprising early commitments on a visit to Notre Dame—it often has a big payoff, and also helps us show where we think a recruitment stands at the current time.

For example, we put in the first Michigan pick for Dylan McCaffrey shortly following his second unofficial visit to campus. As a general rule, an out-of-state (and especially out-of-region) prospect paying his way for a second unofficial is an excellent sign; we put in a Michigan pick for Nico Collins pretty much the moment his plane landed for his second visit, and thus far that looks like the right call.

We also look at what prospects are saying (duh), and just as importantly, who they're saying it to. Back in January, MGoBlog fave-rave KJ Hamler told an MSU recruiting reporter that Oregon was his dream school; at the time, MSU had offered and Oregon hadn't, but because we thought Hamler was good enough to get that Ducks offer, we put in the pick. Oregon offered in May and are now on top for Hamler. Hamler talking up another school to a team-specific recruiting reporter was significant enough for us to put in that pick early.

Team needs are also taken into account. Even after Markquese Bell said that distance was no longer a factor in his recruitment, we kept our pick on Rutgers until we thought he was a take for Michigan, at which point we changed the pick. We've also slowed our roll on putting in picks for offensive linemen because space is getting tight and there's a distinct possibility they add at least one more OL commit this weekend.

Normally, Henry Bainivalu would get a pick for taking his second unofficial, but unless he commits this weekend—which would be an unexpected development—it's unclear if M will have room for him if he extends his recruitment too long. To be honest, neither of us are entirely sure what to do about the OL, since Michigan is at or near the top of the list for more prospects than they can possibly fit into the class; for now, we're sticking with our early picks on Wilson, Ruiz, and Slaton, but that could easily change.

Some picks are more speculative than others, since our goal is to have an opinion on the main prospects on Michigan's board. If we don't have a pick in for a Michigan target, it's a sign we really don't have an inclination as to where he could wind up. Sometimes those picks are essentially "Not Michigan" picks; we have a Rutgers pick in for NJ DT Corey Bolds because we don't expect him to be in M's class after that looked like a distinct possibility early on in his recruitment.

It's also worth keeping an eye on when we put in picks, because it's worth more points on 247 the longer you have a correct pick. We have Michigan picks in for Isaiah Wilson and Cesar Ruiz from last fall, and while the Wolverines are no longer the outright leader for either, they still have a good enough shot at each that it's not worth changing those selections until we have solid info that they won't be coming to Michigan. If a pick goes in shortly before a scheduled announcement, on the other hand, we usually have a good idea of what's going to happen.

I think that about covers it; our picks come down to a combination of heuristics (like the second unofficial and who-says-what-to-whom as signs of high interest), team need, and the occasional nugget of inside info we receive. So far it's working out pretty well; we're 29/32 on 2017 picks, good for 20th in the expert rankings, and only Steve is ahead of us among Michigan-centric experts (shakes fist at Steve).

Latest Picks

Going forward, this series will cover our latest Crystal Ball picks, which you can always find here. There's no way I'm going to cover all the CB picks we have out there, but here are a handful we've put in recently:

OH DL James Hudson to MSU: I changed this from a Michigan pick when Hudson announced he'd decide soon and it wasn't clear if he was even a take for Michigan. While the Wolverines still have ground to cover, Hudson is a take and he'll be at the BBQ tomorrow; I may have been premature in switching this one.

AL OT Toryque Bateman to Michigan: When a guy flat-out says there's a 50-50 chance he commits, it makes this easy.

NJ ATH Markquese Bell to Michigan: Covered above. The biggest obstacle for Michigan looked to be distance from home, and that's no longer a factor.

NJ DT Fred Hansard to Florida: After the top-tier Big Ten schools passed up on Hansard, Florida is showing serious interest, and we followed 247 national reporter Steve Wiltfong and 247's Florida insider in putting in this pick.

IN WR Mac Hippenhammer to Iowa: We'd had a pick in for Penn State, then Hippenhammer named Iowa his leader. Sometimes these are pretty simple.

Thus ends this week's discussion of ballz. There will be much more ball-gazing in the future.

Comments

Magnus

August 5th, 2016 at 3:06 PM ^

Mac Hippenhammer is a fun name that I am looking forward to hearing over the next several years.

I keep trying to put in Crystal Ball picks for Charles Woodson's offspring but 247 won't let me...

Snake Eyes

August 5th, 2016 at 3:25 PM ^

Too many of the pickers appear to be doing it as a pick-em contest and just pick the closest football school to the kid's hometown and then forget about it.  There are also too many homer-type pickers (Buckeye writers in particular) that simply put down their favored school for each and every top kid that has any interest in that school.  

These types of picks seem to defeat the purpose of CBs as the system is only useful if the CBs were being made when an "insider" had some solid intel on where a kid might be going.  MGoBlog seems to be doing things the right way (in general, not really sure about the use of other teams as placeholders for 'not Michigan', see below), but too many others just throw shit against the wall and hope for some hits and only revisit those picks when they see a last minute Wiltfong pick the day before the kid chooses.

I'd prefer MGoBlog use the "cloudy" status for "not Michigan" so your readers could see that you don't think UM is an option for a particular target rather than picking another team that could be his landing spot. I'd rather have MGoBlog have a very high accuracy rate, but fewer bonus points for longevity so that I'd know that whenever Ace puts in a pick, there is a high chance that guy is going Blue. 

Ace

August 5th, 2016 at 3:35 PM ^

I use the cloudy option every one in a while, but usually as a last resort—it's the one way to guarantee you won't get any points from a pick. In Bolds's case, Rutgers has made him a major priority in their class—I should've clarified that there was a reason to pick them instead of just go cloudy. We're not just selecting random teams for the "Not Michigan" picks.

I'd say 29/32 is pretty good on the accuracy side of things. We're still way more conservative about putting picks out there than most—some guys have hundreds of picks in—and when we get new info, we're usually pretty quick to change the more speculative picks (like Hippenhammer recently).

Snake Eyes

August 5th, 2016 at 4:16 PM ^

Thanks for replying.  I'm not sure why the points really matter to you guys.  You are too low volume to be way up the tote-board.  

The to-date accuracy thing is great, but most of your hits are based on picks made within a few weeks of a commitment and the misses are when you guys picked early (not just this year, but in the 78% last year and 63% 2015 classes).  It looks like you've changed your technique from years past, which is good.

Lastly, I'm curious how 247 scores the picks.  It can't be based purely on how far ahead you make the pick and that turn out to be right.  For example, your pick for Dele Harding was less than 2 weeks before his commitment and you got 31 pts.  Your pick for Antonio Shelton was 5 months before his commitment and you got 33 pts.  Michael Dwumfor's pick was also 5 months early and that got you 65 pts. ???

Ace

August 5th, 2016 at 5:03 PM ^

...is being among the first to put in a correct pick on a certain player. Not sure of the exact formula but I know that plays a big part.

As for the points aspect: yeah, we could ignore them, but you've seen how we approach stuff like Draftageddon—we're some competitive MFers.

Farnn

August 5th, 2016 at 3:55 PM ^

What I like about the Mgoblog ballz is that they are based on more than just one site or reporter's opinion.  Clearly they hold Steve Lorenz in high regard, but they also get information from the Scout and Rivals networks.

There are a lot of issues with the crystal ball system, but mgoblog seems to use it the right way.  Would be nice if the cloudy ball didn't count as being wrong, but instead was a way to withdraw a pick.  The system also hurts people who are responsible journalists and don't break news before the recruits want it out there.  Brian/Ace have an advantage there because they don't depend on recruits for access so they can put in picks if they have a good idea where a kid is leaning.

1VaBlue1

August 5th, 2016 at 4:15 PM ^

So Brian and Ace share thier ballz?  Awesome.  Do Seth and Adam also get to share?  NTTAWWT...

The real question, though:  Will MGoBallz fight a bitch with smelly ballz?  I mean, I don't wanna be like Washington, but sometimes you just have to defend your turf.

JayZ1817

August 5th, 2016 at 4:37 PM ^

I am currently on a coaching staff with a coach who coached Bell his freshman and sophomore year at Bridgeton High School in New Jersey. His former coach took him to Ohio State last weekend and he talks to Bell almost daily. I actually texted him this morning to tell him Bell would be in Ann Arbor this weekend as I'm always trying to get the lastest on his recruitment, and he responded with "Bell said no. He's in Maryland today." I felt a little behind on the times.

Anyway, the reason why I'm posting is because his former coach thinks it's a three team race between Rutgers, Ohio State, and Clemson. He said Bell likes Michigan a lot and Harbaugh is great, but Bell is very close with his grandmother. His grandmother wants him to stay close and go to Rutgers so she is able to see his games. However, Bell fell in love with Clemson on his visit a couple months ago, and he was asking if it were possible to have his grandmother be driven to a few games down there each season.

I know Ace and Brian changing their crystal ball because of some guy on the internet is highly unlikely, but I'm just trying to help out the best I can. Bell still having an offical visit set for Michigan definitely leaves the door open for us in his recruitment. If you're unfamilar with Bell as an athlete just check out his tape. The kid is just a football player as he plays multiple positions and has a gritty mentality. He will be a great additon to whatever school he chooses.

NJblue2

August 5th, 2016 at 6:33 PM ^

So if distance is still a factor for him, are Clemson and Ohio State really that much closer to New Jersey that they would make his top 3? I'm not arguing your information or anything, I just feel like those schools are pretty far to drive to also.

JLi5

August 5th, 2016 at 11:49 PM ^

Steve Wiltfong isn't Asian. Google image search says so. Is he the same guy who likes Fallout 4 and darts? Does he play Pokemon Go?

csmhowitzer

August 8th, 2016 at 7:45 AM ^

I have a "cool story bro" story that I'd like to share about one of the funniest moments in my life. There is an energy drink called "BAWLS" and its marketed towards video-gamers. It's something that my friends and I have had many times over the past decade. Anyways, one day a friend of mine and I had just picked up a bottle and went over to my parent's house and were hanging out in the basement, watching TV. My dad comes home after a long day of work and sees us drinking from this peculiar looking blue bottle. So he asks "what's that you're drinking?" Not thinking much of it, I tell him straight up "It's BAWLS, dad. It's an energy drink." Thrown off by what he just heard, my dad now has a very puzzled looking face. He wasn't sure if he heard it correctly so he asks me again to confirm his suspicion that his 20 year old son is drinking balls. So I tell him again, "It's a drink called BAWLS, dad. It's an energy drink." He doesn't know what to say in response, and is sitting down with "the thinking man" pose. After a brief moment of silence he finally says "Balls? Why are you drinking balls? You boys should be drinking pussy!" I was mid sip and every bit of my drink that was in my mouth came rushing out my nose. My buddy spit out his drink all over the TV. Now to quickly describe my dad, he's a blue collar guy. He never gave me a sex talk or talked about relationships or anything like that. So it was always odd when something "adult" came up on TV or in a movie. Honestly, he really never even swore in front of my sister or I. So when my dad said what he said. It was the single most unexpected response I could have ever imagine him saying. I don't think I laughed very hard in front of my dad as he didn't see it as a joke. I remember when I went out later that night that I couldn't stop laughing and neither could my buddy. So now when my friends and I see a bottle of BAWLS someone will always say "Why aren't you drinking pussy".

Happy Monday.