WTKA Roundtable Thoughts on McElwain

Submitted by Occam's Razor on

Brian is pretty down on the McElwain hire, which goes against what many on the MGoBoard think in the thread below. 

His points center around the fact that McElwain is another coordinator thrown into the pot rather than a specific skill position coach, awkward (shark thing and weird Florida press conferences) and poor Florida recruiting AT Florida (which is hard to do). 

The roundtable is still collectively down on Drevno and baffled regarding Michigan's Oline issues for the past 3 years. They also hope that Warinner has a big influence on the line this upcoming year. 

It feels like we're in the twilight zone when Brian is the most negative guy on the roundtable. 

Craig with the bold prediction of Newsome starting tackle next season as well with Hudson on the other side. 

Speight is looking at schools ranging from oSu to Texas Tech. 

A caller brings up a question on whether Harbaugh's odd approach to offense is hindering Michigan from hiring a bonafide offensive coach. 

http://www.wtka.com/2012/09/06/podcasts/

ijohnb

February 15th, 2018 at 12:54 PM ^

change in overall demeanor is not something that I am going to be able to provide imperical data to support.  It just is. You're right, I probably got ahead of myself with the "anybody can see it" stuff.  Perhaps you really don't.  Reasonable minds can differ.

EDIT - Blue4EverGirl mentioned above that he may be having hip replacement surgery.  If that is true, that could be the change in demeanor.  Like, I am not saying by "change" that Harbaugh doesn't care-will never care-hates his job-we are doomed.  It just seems like something about him is different than the first two years he coached here.

In reply to by ijohnb

NateVolk

February 15th, 2018 at 1:03 PM ^

people need to stop giving ANY weight to how he behaves in press conferences. Instead listen to the podcast with his dad. He's full of life there talking all things Michigan, football, and coaching.

Like Bo, he recognizes the media for what it is and it is basically nothing anymore. The internet has rendered it obsolete and they are now fully agenda driven. Trying to hang on economically. Especially Detroit and state of Michigan msm.

Prop up and protect MSU to create a foil for the more popular school. Employ writers and personalities who troll the Michigan fan base to drive page views and clicks and comment section wars.

We all have opinions about the Michigan State situation currently. But if that ESPN report aired about Michigan football, if you think the media in Detroit and Michigan wouldn't be descending on Ann Arbor in a swarm with FOIA requests by the bundle, you are crazy. It happens at MSU and all we get from local msm are stories that originate as PR releases from the school. They have no interest in getting more facts on those two coaches. 

So Harbaugh gives them what people who do their job like that exactly what they deserve: robotically delivered filler. 

People have told me who have seen it first hand: if you think he's not enthusiastic about his job or the University, watch him recruit and watch the time and energy he pours into this.  

Ignore his behavior in the media. And besides weren't many of you also complaining about the theatrics with the satellite camps and overseas trips? You should like the more buttoned down version you think you are seeing.

Bodogblog

February 17th, 2018 at 1:17 PM ^

Detroit News and Free Press have a vested interest in Izzo and Dantonio.  They look pitiful if a national reporter can come in, do a story on a completely unrelated topic, and find suspect behavior in Izzo and Dantonio.  Neither of those papers have sniffed a thing.  They want to be able to say that's because they're clean. 

They already look foolish for being nowhere when the largest case of sexual assualt in American history occurred right under their noses. 

DrMantisToboggan

February 15th, 2018 at 1:30 PM ^

They'd only be disappointed in that number if you gave them 0 context re: a 1 in a million fluke on a punt, a bad spot, a monsoon, and a 3rd string QB.

 

Jim lost most of the underdog game he had at Stanford. I think we've only been the underdog in about 4 or 5 of his games here. You don't get many opportunities to be an underdog at Michigan.

SlickNick

February 15th, 2018 at 1:52 PM ^

My god, give it a rest man...yes all these things happend but they aren't the only reason we lost.

-Had we been able to keep a drive going at the end of the game we could of ran the clock out of the MSU fluke punt game.

-The bad spot and that game in general were robbery...but if we don't turn the ball over in the redzone, and in our own end...we win that game despite all the BS.

-A monsoon? come on dude you watched that game...MSU played in the same weather and won, on the road in a hostile night game environment. If we call a semi respectable game..we win.

-Playing a 3rd string QB is part of the game. Usually it doesn't come to that but it is a part of the game that teams prepare for....check out the OSU situation from a few years back...worked out for them. 

-You don't get many chances to be an underdog at Michigan?? we were literally underdogs multiple times in the last couple years alone.  

 

Context is a funny thing when you manipulate it, to make is seem Michigan is the victim of all of these flukey situations that contribute to expectations not getting met. 

MGolem

February 15th, 2018 at 2:32 PM ^

Didn’t throw that pick against OSU, fail to run for the first down against MSU, or drop the punt. Pointing out one (ONE!) example of a third string QB working out seems like a manipulation of the situation. I mentioned this some months back but there was one team in the entire top 25 this year that played the majority of last season with a backup QB (second string, not third) and that was Georgia. Georgia also had the most productive college backfield of all time lined up behind Jake Fromm, who is without a doubt a special talent. Coaching matters (just looked at the egg the Patriots defensive staff laid against the Eagles) but players also have to make plays. Speight is nothing special. The production Harbaugh got out of him was remarkable but at the end of the day he is just a guy. We were not going to win anything major with him as our QB and that certainly goes the same for his backup, and his backup’s backup.

SlickNick

February 15th, 2018 at 3:20 PM ^

Let me be clear, I am not doom and gloom on Harbaugh...he is the man for the job. I'm only pointing out how ridiculous the Harbaugh apologists look. Even you in your response "Harbaugh didn't throw that pick" of course he didn't...coaches don't make the plays..they put players in situations to make plays. Or the MSU punt?  Had we called some more creative run plays or a play action play we probably pick up a first down...but we chose to run straight up the middle for no gain 3 times in a row. Not to mention we were in a terrible formation to block for the punter (but I'm sure you will point out thats all on Baxter, not Harbaugh). Your Georgia QB situation proves my point as well...We didn't field one QB who looked like they belonged on the field this year...meanwhile QB1 goes down for Georgia and QB2 comes in and looks ready to play(but of course it's because he is a special talent).  Their most productive backfield of all time...did that just magically happen? No, they were recruited and developed in Georgia's football program, and put in the best situation to succeed by their coaches...regardless of who was the coach at the time. 

From Speights pretty good 2016, the promise and hype surrounding O'korn, and the Andrew Luck comparisons Peters got (from Harbaugh and others)... But then after a bad year its "We were not going to win anything major with him as our QB and that certainly goes the same for his backup, and his backup's backup." I wonder if you would be as apologetic for Hoke or RR if all of our QB's regressed from 2016 to 2017 seasons. 

Given enough time I think Harbaugh will get this team to where we all expect it to be...but along the way it is infuriating to listen to so many people acting like he is immune from criticism. 

MGolem

February 15th, 2018 at 5:26 PM ^

The fact that Georgia was the ONLY team to roll along with a backup QB playing. Because they had the best collegiate RB duo of all time behind him. To suggest that is not a big deal is ridiculous. Not going to nitpick anything else you said but I will add I never liked the Rich Rod hire because it made no sense to go in a completely different direction. Miles was the hire and Martin blew it.

Fezzik

February 16th, 2018 at 12:02 AM ^

You think "context" makes anyone feel better about losing to your rivals? Come on man. Blaming a loss on a single play when 100+ plays happen per game is just ridiculous. Calling a shitty play a fluke does not make it any better. We should of had the game put away before that point anyways. And we F'ed up on the "fluke" play. 100% self-inflicted error. No one to blame but ourselves.

Blaming a questionable spot, again in a game of more than 100 plays. A game we were up 17-7 late in the 3rd quarter; threw a pick 6 and fumbled away a TD on the goal line. But yeah lets blame the refs for that loss... WE lost the game, no one else but us.

Was the monsoon only occuring when we were on offense? I didn't know the context of that. I thought weather affected both teams. Maybe the fact msu out game planned and out play called us during the monsoon had something to do with it. But context I guess.

We have twice injured osu QBs where the back up has come in and out played us. Are we not allowed to have a back up QB not look like shit, or starter for that matter? The way Speight has played since last year Iowa all the way up to Purdue this year (8 straight bad games) was underwhelming. No one has a legitimate reason to believe Speight would have saved this season based on his on field performance.

The context here is we are failing to be accountable for our own flaws and choose to place blame elswhere for peace of mind. 

goblue4321

February 15th, 2018 at 12:40 PM ^

during the podcast was annoying, it was funny when we played back in september not really anymore, its not him move on grow up be a professional give some insight to the actual hire and not talk about sharks 

 

 

skegemogpoint

February 15th, 2018 at 12:55 PM ^

Brian is a smart guy. I respect his work and appreciate this forum. But he is not all knowing. He is not the authority on all things UM.  More often than not he makes bold statements and acts like he's speaking fact when it's only his opinion. This morning he said grad transfer Calvin Anderson "is going to Texas" - like he knows...like it's a fact.  It is neither. Just one example of dozens. 

Robbie Moore

February 15th, 2018 at 1:15 PM ^

Brian has been doing this for over 10 years. Quite likely the worst 10 year stretch ever in UM football. He has seen, as we all have, innumerable recruiting losses. After much optimism. His Anderson to Texas comments are the frustration of a fan. I feel the same. I have felt that Brian has been losing his enthusiasm for some time. And I know the ever increasing negativity in social media and blog posts has really bothered him. Maybe Brian needs to make changes. Something that beings him more joy. And if that is the case it's OK. He owes us nothing. We've been able to enjoy his writing for free (unless we're into Beveled Guilt). Whatever transpires I thank Brian and wish him health and happiness.

poppinfresh

February 15th, 2018 at 11:48 AM ^

i also dont get this hire and would say why not get a younger, up and comer that is a great recruiter as a skills position coach?

This would make sense if Drev and pep left, McElwain runs the O, warriner takes over line and you bring on a skills guy

still seems like too many cooks in the kitchen

gustave ferbert

February 15th, 2018 at 12:26 PM ^

Don't pep and drevno have guaranteed money?  In my experiences it looks to me (not that I know what I am talking about) that Pep and drevno have basically been demoted in terms of responsibility.  Pep is a QB coach?  We have the QB guru as head coach.  The idea of bringing in McElwain as an offensive coordinator cements that for me.  

Bodogblog

February 15th, 2018 at 11:49 AM ^

What does the caller mean by bonafide offensive coach?  That's exactly what McElwain is.  He may not like the choice, but that's exactly what they've hired.  

There aren't many pro-style coaches climbing the ranks these days.  Fairly hard to find a guy who knows how to run this at the college level. 

evenyoubrutus

February 15th, 2018 at 11:51 AM ^

I think we are going to need to stage an intervention with Brian. He spent the first half-hour cackling about sharks and other indiscernible ramblings. I have a bad feeling that he is on the verge of a nervous breakdown and we as the Mgo Community need to do something about it. After all, he's the reason we are here.

ijohnb

February 15th, 2018 at 11:59 AM ^

reading his posts and listening to the podcasts, etc., it sounds less like he is about to have a nervous breakdown and more like he is feigning interest in something that doesn't interest him nearly as much as it once did.  It was clear, despite his rhetoric (and in some ways, because of it) that he was immensely disappointed and surprised last season, and I think he may have thrown in the towel a little bit.

I have actually found his basketball write ups to be much more engaging (and informed) than his football stuff lately.

In reply to by ijohnb

Rabbit21

February 15th, 2018 at 12:33 PM ^

That's my read on it as well.

Last season was really ugly and that bowl loss was just disgusting from a(yes, yes, feelingsball and all that) mental toughness standpoint where everything just unravelled. the moment anything went poorly.  

It's hard to maintain enthusiasm for Football when the Hoke-ian levels of incompetence that we thought had firmly been shut in the past, raise their ugly heads again.  

Brimley

February 15th, 2018 at 12:33 PM ^

You bet it is.  And it's supposed to be fun.  Once a fan gets into a DOOM mindset, then what the hell is the point?  My irrational exuberance is by definition STUPID but it's what makes following the team fun.  I mean, I used to watch and enjoy late 70s Red Wings games fercrissakes. All the gloom here for the last few months is really wearing on the fun.  I know, I know..."You can't ignore reality, old man."  Fuck reality.  The whole point of kicking back and watching young guys play a game is to have a little fun when reality has my scrotum in a vise.  I just hate losing the fun that the game brings.

Highly emotional, hard to follow, poorly worded, and stupid rant over.

LDNfan

February 15th, 2018 at 1:36 PM ^

This is where I am too. Its a game, played by college athletes who are generally speaking giving their all..but are highly likely to make mistakes..sometimes at the worst possible time. Molding these young men into champions takes great coaching and a ton of luck..unless you've got an overwhelming talent/experience advantage.

One of the things that makes College football so much fun is the change from year to year. Next year....new players, more experienced players, new coaches, new schemes, etc. A lot to look forward to as a fan.

I come here for football insights and I follow the team because I'm a crazy fanatic..but I've long stopped letting it get me down and ragging on the team.

 

Dennis

February 15th, 2018 at 4:10 PM ^

ALL great teams meet periods of demise... the cycle will come back our way, and it might be Harbaugh to do it, it might not. I was reading this article on 11 Warriors about "No sympathy for Michigan become irrelevant" and "college football will live without M"... it made me laugh... they referenced the fall of Miami as a comparison... even though Miamai had a slight resurgence this year. Take L's with your fucking head up. Even Eagles fans show more grit than a lot of you pussies on this site. Btw I agree w u100%, Brimley.

BTB grad

February 15th, 2018 at 11:50 AM ^

Does anyone know how Harbaugh's offensive gameplanning and playcalling worked in SF?

I don't remember hearing about anyone other than Greg Roman so I wonder why JH runs with the multiple inputs approach now.