OT: Why would Scott Frost go to Nebraska?
Scott Frost is being wooed for both the Nebraska and U Florida jobs; meanwhile, UCF donors are ponying up big bucks for facilities at that university.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/ucf-knights/os-sp-ucf-uconn-mike-…
The indoor player facility that Frost is getting is something that Jimbo Fisher has been poor-mouthing about his school's need for all season long, as fans look with increasing ambivalence on his team.
It's not so widely known, but UCF is the biggest public university in the U.S., in a rapidly growing and increasingly pleasant big, cosmopolitan city, with a lot of wealthy donors intent on pushing it past FSU and UF as the state's major program and school--well-situated to do so.
Does Scott go "home" to cold, recruit-limited Nebraska, a place he is known to be ambivalent about, or build something enduring at UCF? I don't know. But the landscape of football in Florida is in flux.
EDIT: A few posters taking it for granted that the guy would want to return to NB, but I don't think that this is a Harbaugh story. Just going to add this piece about Frost's ambivalence to his alma mater because I realized that it had influenced my thinking about him going back:
http://www.omaha.com/huskers/the-story-of-scott-frost-s-love-hate-relat…
November 14th, 2017 at 1:05 AM ^
Take any of the top ten programs of all time - NE is one of them - and each has had a down period and each has gotten up again. ND sucked big, TN the same, UM the same, TX still is. History and tradition are what make the ten the most attractive and will continue to do so. All have had great players, huge numbers of AAs, most have had Heisman winners. And the same reason they all have had bad periods, bad coaching, is reversed during their good and great runs, good to excellent coaching.
If one is able to take a program with no history of greatness and make it a top ten program in, of all places, Idaho, NE, with its rich history, can do so by nothing more than making the correct hire. They were recruiting just as good and better than OU when both schools were perenially top 5-10 schools w/NCs. A HC now with OSU put UT which certainly has no greater appeal than NE in the top ten, a new year's day date with Alabama, where they proved to the nation they were real and they've been decent to good since that time. The same coach took a moribund UF and surpassed all that Spurrier had accomplished before him, while spurning ND not just once but twice.
Good coaching can make almost any program good. Good coaching can restore almost any formerly great program back to or exceeding that level.
November 13th, 2017 at 10:48 AM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 10:49 AM ^
Lol at the landscape in football is in flux. UCF isn't becoming the premier program or school in Florida no matter how much donors want to make it so. Oklahoma state isn't the premier school or program in oklahoma despite t. boone pickens either.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:20 AM ^
UF or FSU in rep immediately, but it already has a number of programs that are more highly ranked. My wife teaches at FSU and--believe me--there is understanding that UCF is strongly position, mid-state and in the biggest, healthiest city, for tons of growth. And it has a huge and wealthy donor base.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:29 AM ^
I don't place complete faith in the U.S. News and World Report rankings of national universities, but here's where those schools are:
UF: #42
FSU: #81
UCF: #171
USF is ranked higher than UCF. So, too, is Florida Tech something-or-other in Melbourne. And Illinois State (no one's idea of an academic powerhouse where I live).
I like its upside from a distance, but it seems to be a long way from the state's flagship schools.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:41 AM ^
being a directional state univerity is not going to make it happen.
Change its name to University of Florida at Orlando would do the magic.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:13 PM ^
Then how you explain the success West Virgina and North Carolina have had?
/s (hopefully not needed, but who knows)
November 13th, 2017 at 12:49 PM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 11:41 AM ^
UCF might be strongly positioned for "someday."
But that day is not today. Frost has a limited number of years to coach, is in demand now, and (like everyone) wants to win.
To seriously compete for a national title, a school needs to be in a Power 5 conference. UCF is not. They won't be any time in the immediate future. 10 years down the road? Sure, if another major realignment happens, they can be on the short list of schools (with teams like Houston, BYU, USF, Boise State, etc--though note that thus far only Utah and sort of TCU have made such a jump despite dozens of schools clamoring to do so) that could be a candidate to round out a conference's stable of markets. But that's 10 or so years from now, maybe.
Frost can compete at the top level next year. He can either rebuild Nebraska into a nationally relevant program again and basically be coach-for-life in a place that would adore him, or he can go to a place like Florida that can start netting top 10 recruiting classes almost literally overnight and compete for a national title within a couple of years.
None of these things are true at UCF. And they're not going to be true for a long time. He isn't going to stay there, any more than Tom Herman stayed at Houston or even ultra-loyal Chris Peterson stayed at Bolse State. He's going to leave. The only question is whether the chance to be a Harbaugh-type hero at Nebraska is enough pull to get him to turn down better opportunities.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:03 PM ^
otherwise Vanderbilt would be good at things. UCF has to be good enough at sports for long enough to pull themselves out of the AAC and get into the SEC or ACC. UCF might get to a good P5 level eventually like Miami did, but they have a number of years of good football to go before they reach that level. Certainly long enough that Frost isn't going to wait around to see that day, but may be UCF's future in 10-20 years
November 13th, 2017 at 2:43 PM ^
Sport Vandy does well. Great point otherwise.
November 13th, 2017 at 3:46 PM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 10:51 AM ^
I wouldn't if I were him. The things you need to be successful in this day and age in college football he has in spades at UCF, and are largely lacking at Nebraska. Biggest problem is he's not in a P5 conference, but that's about it. UF would check pretty much every box for having what you need to be a top program (outside of maybe unrealistic fan base at times).
Meanwhile Nebraska is a complete cluster from floor to ceiling as a program and would be an insane rebuilding project that I'm not sure can be rebuilt anymore.
November 13th, 2017 at 10:58 AM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 11:09 AM ^
I'm not really familiar with Schefter as I don't watch ESPN outside of football games. I do however live in Nebraska so I spend a lot of time around their fans and have become quite familiar with their program and history. Just stating things from my experience and vantage point.
November 13th, 2017 at 3:17 PM ^
about Michigan. And Michigan proved that, like every school in the country (except maybe, sigh, OSU), it is only as good as it's coach. If Nebraska lands an elite coach, no reason they can't be elite again.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:00 AM ^
too have questions regarding your last point. Michigan at least stayed relevant from a recruiting angle during the ten years of suck and the brand still retained some program prestige by beating Notre Dame all the time and the 2011 Sugar Bowl. We were never out of the public's consciousness and our stadium and facilities were being upgraded at the same time. At this point, who is Nebraska? What is the model for them out of their current morass? I don't know if there is one.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:19 AM ^
How many really good coaches ever say, "gosh, rebuilding that program is just too hard for me and I don't want to try?" I mean, I guess we'll never actually know, but I suspect the answer is "almost none." Especially when one's alma mater is involved.
You don't really "need" anything to be successful in college football, honestly - there are certainly things that help, but other than money and coaching skill, not much else is really needed. Every coach believes he has the latter, and being in the B1G gives Nebraska the former.
Florida might certainly be a more attractive job than Nebraska, that much is true, but, despite the weather, not UCF.
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November 13th, 2017 at 10:51 AM ^
Why do we care where Scott Frost goes or what he does?
November 13th, 2017 at 11:06 AM ^
As a central Florida resident and UF business school alum I have an interest in what happens..
That said, it is a compelling college football storyline for a once storied program in UF and a hot up and coming coach just a couple hours down the road. Personally, I think college football is better when the traditional powers are good, except Notre Dame.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:20 AM ^
In that area? I have contemplated a move a lot.
November 14th, 2017 at 12:03 PM ^
I love it here. I grew up in upstate NY (Rochester) then lived in the midwest (OH/IN) for most of my life and always wanted to live in Florida, or somewhere it didnt' snow and was nice year-round.
I do miss fall though. But we can drive up to GA if we really wanted to get some cooler weather and leaves changing colors.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:33 AM ^
"Personally, I think college football is better when the traditional powers are good, except Notre Dame."
Why? I'm a fan of a traditional power, I guess, so I'd like it to prosper, but I've enjoyed seeing schools like TCU do well. If I didn't live in the Upper Midwest I'd probably enjoy Sparty's last few years, too.
Do you also cheer for the Yankees? (Kidding ... partly.)
November 14th, 2017 at 12:00 PM ^
No, I am not a Yankees fan. Don't even like baseball... I also enjoy when teams like TCU, or any other non-traditional power, is good. I'm not saying I only want the traditional powers to be good, just that the more very good teams there are the better college football is, for me anyway.
How much better is the Big Ten East now that Michigan and PSU have 'come back' and OSU and MSU (for the most part) have been humming along nicely. The more good teams they are the more enjoyable, and more compelling match ups, college football is. And absolutely I love seeing new programs emerge, hell I even like seeing UCF come out of nowhere.
November 13th, 2017 at 2:05 PM ^
November 14th, 2017 at 12:05 PM ^
Yes, I know all that. But my point was that it's better for college football when both UGA and UF are good, or when LSU and Auburn are both good in addition to Alabama. One dominant team per division isn't as exciting as having teams like Michigan, MSU, PSU and OSU all with legit shots (well not anymore) at the conference title and the playoffs.
November 13th, 2017 at 2:00 PM ^
why it's OT, and why--amazingly--you can pass right over the post and do anything else you like with your time!!! It's almost magic.
November 13th, 2017 at 10:53 AM ^
i think any huge michigan fan should be able to relate. if michigan were as bad as nebraska and in the same situation, and you are an allstar coach who loves michigan.. then you would want to be the one to bring michigan back to glory.
so the question he has is... return his own school to glory, or increase odds of success at florida.. that is a tough choice to make
it is actually very similar to urban meyer and notre dame. supposedly notre dame was his dream job, and he still took the florida job over notre name due to the amount of talent florida had
November 13th, 2017 at 11:07 AM ^
You bring up a good point. Nebraska used to have serious branding in California and Texas that allowed them to get the caliber of players needed to win national titles. That is gone now and Nebraska is on an island by themselves unless they are winning big games. Florida has those resources now and rarely leaves the state for OOC games.
I would personally go to Nebraska because the expectations are lower and the BIGW is wide open.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:18 AM ^
...how does Wisconsin do it? How did Oregon do it?
Schools in states with poor in-state HS talent are able to have a lot of success. A poor in-state recruiting base is just one of many factors, and is not as important as it was a generation ago.
With the right coach Nebraska can recruit as well as Wisconsin. And if they have a good staff they will get back to being in the hunt for the BTCCG most years.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:37 PM ^
I don't doubt somebody can make it work at Nebraska. My point is that it's not the old model where kids commit after their senior year or only see three games on color TV each weekend. It's a different ball game with recruiting and that works okay if you have a niche (building up 2-3 star OL at Wisconsin, Kids from California looking for an alternative at Oregon).
November 13th, 2017 at 1:44 PM ^
Can Nebraska pull in classes ranked between 10-20th?
If yes, then with a good staff they can be in the conversation for the BTCCG late into November just about every year.
They still can recruit from several states/regions. They won't have top 5 classes. But so what? They are in the Big Ten West.
They just need to match Wisconsin level recruiting, and pair it with a good staff that can maximize value from 10-20th level recruiting talent.
In the last 4 cycles Nebraska has been in the 20th-30th level (per 247 composite) in recruiting. I am pretty sure that Frost can do better than that.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:19 AM ^
UN was big in Texas because of the Big 12. Had they not bolted for the B1G, they'd still be a draw for Texas players. But no kid down there remembers any of that, and none of those teams have lifted a finger to keep old rivalries going. UN lost pretty much everything when it joined the B1G for a paycheck.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:53 AM ^
They'd be wise to hit Ohio harder given OSU's and even Michigan's deemphasis of Ohio Recruiting.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:22 PM ^
Not really. They had 10 All Americans from Texas and only a couple came after Nebraska left the Big Eight.
Even then, it comes down to winning and losing. Nebraska was a top football school for like 40 years so lots of kids wanted to go there. Same with Alabama. Do you think Saban would be getting kids from all over the country to go to Tuscaloosa if they were 6-6 every year?
November 13th, 2017 at 12:27 PM ^
I would personally go to Nebraska because the expectations are lower
Their expectations are not lower. That's the problem.
If you go to Nebraska and do not win the Big Ten and go to the Playoff, you will get booted.
That's what they expect.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:39 PM ^
And at Florida McElwain won two straight division titles and was still fired. Bo Pelini went 9-4 for like a decade and only at the end did fans seem to realize it was their ceiling under him.
November 13th, 2017 at 6:03 PM ^
People continue to mention that "McElwain won 2 conseuctive SEC East titles" because - while it's noteworthy - it's also used as a way to gloss over how poor Florida's program was and how far they were from being nationally relevant.
2015 saw them win the east, but lose to LSU and then get pasted by FSU, Alabama and Michigan to end the season. 2016 saw them lose to the Champions of Life, and then again finish the season with consecutive pastings at FSU and Alabama's hands. 2017 was a disaster right from the get go. Yes, they won the East, but they were nowhere near where Florida expects to be, which is to be nationally relevant
November 13th, 2017 at 10:53 AM ^
he needs to get out of town and that is where the "vacuum repair" guy is sending him.
November 13th, 2017 at 10:54 AM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 10:54 AM ^
Florida
Tennessee
UCLA
Nebraska
Oregon State
not sure what other good P5 jobs are open - would avoid Arkansas or Texas A&M until Saban retires
November 13th, 2017 at 10:56 AM ^
To the top of that list, or at least above Tennessee.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:05 AM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 11:07 AM ^
Tennessee is a much better job than UCLA. UCLA will always be in the shadow of USC. UT has a 100+K seat stadium in a great college town in the best football conference.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:10 AM ^
with the best football team.
November 13th, 2017 at 12:28 PM ^
+1 Insightful.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:43 AM ^
Was with you until the last three words.
November 13th, 2017 at 11:00 AM ^
November 13th, 2017 at 11:47 AM ^
Oregon State is worse than both Arkansas and TAMU. TAMU should be third on that list. Sabann? Sure. But you can be a hero in College Station by beating everyone else, and everyone else is beatable. TAMU has a lot of players on the roster right now, it has a great recruiting base in Texas, and the unique position of being the only Texas school that gets to play in the SEC.
Given that Tennessee also has to play Bama every year (it's the protected crossover rivalry) I would consider them neck-and-neck with A&M for the second-best job.
Florida, of course, is one of the best opportunities in the country. So I hope they whiff on Frost and get another guy that can't get it together.