M-Dog

December 16th, 2018 at 1:41 AM ^

Not as much "LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!" denial in the comments section as I would have thought. 

There is some legitimate rational concern among the Buckeye faithful. 

Not that they won't be able to still recruit well, but that they won't be able to keep killing it at Alabama levels.  That may have been a Meyer-only thing. 

As one commenter said:  There HAS to be a falloff from Meyer. He is one of the best who has ever done it.... ever. We didn’t get the big name guy. Day can’t have Meyer’s national appeal.

LeCheezus

December 16th, 2018 at 8:51 AM ^

I know a lot of M fans can’t process OSU actually slipping, but that quote says it well.  The media circus about Meyer stacking his lies this year/offseason has made a lot of people think he’s some kind of buffoon/past his prime/replaceable guy.  He is absolutely one of the best recruiters and head coaches- there has to be a drop off.  

He took OSU from a top 10 team to a top 5 team.  Doesn’t sound like a big jump but that is the biggest and hardest jump- a tier 2 team to a tier 1 team.  Even recruiting wise, if you look at team composite scores there is usually a big drop somewhere between spots 4-8 or so, meaning that there is a significant difference between recruiting at a top 5 vs top 10 level.

People have been using Lincoln Riley as an example of how Day will keep things rolling, but IMO Stoops really was on the downslope.  In addition OU won a lot of close, high scoring games this year that could easily go the other way next year, so I think the jury is still out there.

M-Dog

December 16th, 2018 at 1:01 PM ^

He (Meyer) took OSU from a top 10 team to a top 5 team.  Doesn’t sound like a big jump but that is the biggest and hardest jump- a tier 2 team to a tier 1 team.  Even recruiting wise, if you look at team composite scores there is usually a big drop somewhere between spots 4-8 or so, meaning that there is a significant difference between recruiting at a top 5 vs top 10 level.

TING!!

Especially in recruiting.  Look at these amazing Ohio State recruiting rankings from 247:

Under Tressel:
2001: #6
2002: #4
2003: #46
2004: #55
2005: #74
2006: #25
2007: #72
2008: #10
2009: #5
2010: #18
2011: #6

Under Meyer:
2012: #5
2013: #2
2014: #3
2015: #7
2016: #4
2017: #2
2018: #2
 

Wow!  I thought these were a typo.  But I cross-checked them against other sources like Bucknuts themselves, and they are indeed accurate.  

Tressel got dinged with some small class sizes in the middle, but still, there is no comparison.

5-star recruits from Texas and Florida and the DMV were not committing to play for Ohio State.  They were committing to play for Urban Meyer.

Pre-Urban Meyer, Ohio State was a very good solid regional recruiter with some national gets here and there.  But they were not the elite Alabama-level national recruiter they are now. 

Because of Urban Meyer.

Without Urban Meyer, Ohio State will still be a very good recruiter (and Urban Meyer will still be floating around the OSU AD for at least a little while).  But they are not going to remain an Alabama-level recruiter.  The main draw is gone.

    

The Baughz

December 16th, 2018 at 9:18 AM ^

Jim Tressel was not a sell your soul type of hire. This was a let’s take a chance on a very successful D1AA coach and hope for the best. 

They obviously hit a HR with him and then sold many souls to get Urabn.

Meanwhile, Michigan sells no souls and gets RR and Hoke. The two worst coaches in UM history. 

 

Bodogblog

December 16th, 2018 at 10:29 AM ^

That's part of his point.  They obviously selected well but we're extraordinarily fortunate that a relative unknown turned into Tressel.  If a  RichRod type hire were available to them at that time, they would have run with it. 

On their merits at the time, the RichRod hire was much better than the Tressel hire, yet the results were entirely opposite. 

AMaized

December 16th, 2018 at 4:53 PM ^

There were no hires available with RR credentials?? Cmon, that is silly. tOSU chose a different, less trendy pick, the opposite of what UM chose.  After Cooper they wanted an Ohio guy and that would win Championships.  

The next coach for a big time university will be Matt Campbell sooner than later.  Would have been a good tOSU hire if Day wasn’t already on staff.   

Diagonal Blue

December 16th, 2018 at 12:46 PM ^

A good friend of Tressels during his time at YSU was Mickey Monus. Monus was the head of the board of trustees, the CEO of an up and fast-coming pharmacy chain, and was on the sidelines for all of Youngstown State's games. It was Tressel who set up the first meeting between his star player and Monus.

The record states over the years Monus gave thousands of dollars to Isaac. The record also states Isaac used cars provided by Monus.

A few years later, Monus came up on Federal fraud charges for "bookkeeping irregularities" and all of the stories of Monus' relationship with Isaac came to light. At the time the NCAA ordered and investigation in which Tressel denied any knowledge of any wrong doing.

A hundred percent of this investigation was done internally and none of the stipulations and assurances given by Tressel, School President Leslie Cochran, nor Athletic Director Joe Malsimur were ever completed. Tressel never contacted Isaac as he promised he would and Malsimur never contacted Monus.

It's really as if no internal investigation at all took place. The NCAA's follow-up on the investigation is an absolute joke.

The fact is, all of the files are closed and Youngstown refuses to release them, claiming they are part if Isaac's personal information. When Isaac was asked if he ever spoke to Tressel or anyone regarding the matter, he claims he spoke to no one.

During Monus's later trials for other offenses, more infractions in the Penguin athletic program were exposed. In the end, the NCAA took away some scholarships and cited YSU with a lack of institutional control.

The penalty was the loss of scholarships and although it was certainly warranted, the NCAA couldn't revoke YSU's 1991 National title as the statute of limitations to to so had expired.

Less than a year later, Tressel was hired by Ohio State and the rest is history.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/220143-jim-tressel-the-youngstown-state-scandal-revisited

UESWolverine

December 16th, 2018 at 10:07 AM ^

What's crazy to me is how Urban and Tressel only got 1 Natty each. Seems like with those teams and records, they underperformed in the NC category. And the year Urban won was totally unexpected with a 3rd string QB. I guess you could also say the year Tressel won could've easily been negated without that wild PI call. 

Kewaga.

December 16th, 2018 at 1:46 AM ^

Under Urban Meyer, Ohio State finished fifth, second, third, seventh, fourth, second, and second respectively in the national team recruiting rankings, and had the top class in the Big Ten every February during those seven cycles.

 

 Wow!! 

Over 7 consecutive years he has pulled in an average recruiting class ranking of 3.6 nationally.

Great article.  Michigan might have a little bit of recruiting window.  Need to make good on the field to solidify that. 

Although I don't consider myself a star gazer, looking at the rankings above it's very clear that stars do matter!!  Michigan needs to continue hitting the recruiting trail hard!

1974

December 16th, 2018 at 9:53 AM ^

"Ohio State finished fifth, second, third, seventh, fourth, second, and second respectively in the national team recruiting rankings ..."

To those who say "Harbaugh has to beat OSU this year!" take some time and think about those stats.

I think Jim has righted the ship. He's made some mistakes, but the overall arc looks good to me.

outsidethebox

December 16th, 2018 at 6:25 AM ^

I am more of a philosophical sports purist than a partisan fan-my world is not defined by Michigan playing OSU in football. However, in the real world, if OSU beats Michigan the next two times Day will have as strong if not stronger recruiting position as Meyer. 

JPC

December 16th, 2018 at 6:53 AM ^

Total nonsense. Urban was multi time national champion with a head to head over Alabama. Nationally, beating michgian is the same as beating any other typically good team. 

Do you think Saban’s replacement will have the same gravitas as Saban, if that person beats LSU twice? Of course not.