Unverified Voracity Does Not Mention Any Nuns Comment Count

Brian March 30th, 2018 at 12:49 PM

Let's all sit quietly and think about the near future. SOUNDS GOOD GUYS NOBODY'S EXPLODING KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK





"you can attack their bigs" [Patrick Barron]

A much better anon coach quote article. Yahoo's was extremely silly, but ESPN's version is on point. On Michigan:

"They've got three really good on-ball defenders," one coach said. "Most teams don't have two, or even one. They have three. [Zavier] Simpson, [Muhammad-Ali] Abdur-Rahkman, [Charles] Matthews can really guard the ball. You don't have a matchup on the perimeter you can attack. They're handsy, they're physical in all the right ways. How handsy and chippy they are, in itself is very anti-Michigan-like. They're well-schooled. They're so good at putting their hands on or getting an armbar into you and then taking it off, then beating you to the spot." …

"If you're a traditional defensive team, you've got no chance of guarding them," one opposing coach said. "The teams that have slowed them down the most are teams that are nontraditional, that can switch a lot. You've got no chance of defending them if you don't switch ball screens."

Dollar says the latter quote there is from Matt Painter.

On Loyola:

"Everybody on their team is an above-average passer and can shoot it, so they have spacing," another head coach in the league said. "They don't take bad shots. They really work together as a team to get great shots every possession. They have an inside presence, but most of their offensive attack is transition or through spacing. Offensively, that's what makes them really good." …

"They ice ball screens and try to keep Krutwig in the paint defensively," he said. "So they've got some real tough decisions to make. You can't keep Krutwig in the paint against Wagner, so how they guard those actions, the pick-and-rolls in the middle of the floor. They can bring [Aundre] Jackson off the bench, but they need Krutwig on the floor. That's a real interesting thing for me."

Much more that's interesting at the link.

Yak's got this. Of all the reasons hiring Luke Yaklich might have benefited Michigan, "he'll have lots of experience against the MVC team Michigan sees in the Final Four" is the least likely. And yet:

Prior to joining the Wolverines, the defensive maestro went 7-1 against the Ramblers in his four seasons spent at Illinois State as an assistant coach and is familiar, at least fundamentally, with coach Porter Moser’s style of play.

“Coach Moser is an unbelievable coach ... you have to be locked in on both ends of the floor,” Yaklich said. “It’s gonna be a dog fight. His teams reflect his personality. They’re prepared, they get better, tough and they have a bunch of really great kids that have been through the Missouri Valley and non-conference wars.

“Loyola is obviously gonna have our full attention all week, and we’re thrilled with the opportunity to play in the Final Four against a really good and well-coached team.”

If Michigan wins on Saturday, before the final they need to hire an assistant from a team they can beat easily. How about Dane Fife?

One and done done? Syracuse recruit Darius Bazley has decided to blow off college hoops in favor of a year in the G league, because he's a serious dude.

“I’m self-motivated because I know this is what I want to do for the rest of my life. This is how I want to make a living. This is how I want to provide for my family, and provide for my love of basketball. I’m not playing any games with this. I’m attacking this straight forward. I’m not maneuvering around this, take any side steps. I’m taking this head on. This is the decision that I made, and I know it will work. I know what I’m capable of doing, and I’m going to do just that.”

Fair enough. Is this THE END for the current regime in college basketball? Maybe, maybe not. Bazley's salary in his sole G League year is apparently going to be a comically low 26k, and while he can sign with an agent and get some shoe money he'd probably be better off in the long run with the fame an NCAA tournament run could generate. And it's not like the shoe people can't just give his family money already.

On the other hand:

Bazley won't be wasting his time perfecting a defense that's illegal in the NBA and driving wildly into the lane hoping that this heavily contested shot miraculously falls. Why Bazley—or anyone cough cough Tyus Battle—with a potential NBA future would sign up for that remains a complete mystery. How a team stacked with NBA lottery picks could lose to that team is an even greater one.

PREPARE THE NELSON MEME. Oh and also this:

Or possibly the Sideshow Bob Steps On Rakes meme.

Would the end of one and done be bad for Michigan? Or good? I lean towards good. While the Dukes and Kentuckys of the world would start picking off guys outside the top 25 and might land on a guy that Michigan would otherwise get, the relative gap between those dudes and the dozen-or-so genetic lottery winners available annually is bigger than the 25-50 cohort and the next tier down.

Meanwhile the shoe money that funnels kids towards that restrictive list of bluebloods would now just be signing the top guys outright. The guys at the next level down would be choosing lower levels of bag if they eschew being developed by Beilein. I don't think it would upset the apple cart in college basketball that much; it would kill accidental superteams like "Anthony Davis and four other guys." Since Michigan was never going to get that guy, good.

PFF on Mo Hurst. They like him.

They like him almost as much as I do.

Mid-majors: yes. 8-10 P5 teams: no. Rodger Sherman on the dwindling role of the underdog mid-major:

Twenty years ago, in 1998, the committee gave out at-large bids to Western Michigan (from the Mid-American Conference) and Illinois-Chicago and Detroit-Mercy (from the Midwestern Collegiate Conference, now called the Horizon League). When George Mason stunned the world by reaching the Final Four as a no. 11 seed in 2006, it did so thanks to an at-large bid, having failed to win the Colonial Athletic Association tournament. Same goes for 11th-seeded VCU in 2011, also an also-ran from the CAA. Between 1995 and 2005, UNC Charlotte made the tournament eight times despite winning the Conference USA tournament only twice. UNC Charlotte got six at-large bids in a span of 10 years!

If you’ll allow me to temporarily use a clumsy definition of “mid-major” for the purposes of this piece, let’s say the “mid-major” label applies any school that isn’t in one of the five football power conferences, their predecessors, or either the defunct or current versions of the Big East. In the 20 NCAA tournaments from 1995 to 2014, the selection committee extended at-large bids to an average of 8.9 schools fitting that definition, the high being 12 in 1995, 1998, and 2004. In half of those years at least 10 such teams landed at-large invitations. Since 2015, the committee has invited no more than seven such teams in a given year, bottoming out with last year’s four. You’d think this trend would be reversed, considering over that time frame the number of at-large bids has increased from 32 to 36 as the size of the tournament field has grown from 64 to 68. But no: With more available spots, the committee has rewarded fewer teams from mid-major leagues.

The NCAA should mandate no at large bids for a team that couldn't even win half its conference games. Only one good thing has ever happened because an 8-10 ACC team got in.

Lame. Michigan cancels the 2020-21 VT series, paying 400k to get out of it. In VT's place in 2020: Arkansas State. Something something it's smart because playoff, you say. And I say something something it's dumb because playoff, and we both have exactly the same amount of evidence.

Poole on JJJ. Jordan Poole and Jaren Jackson Jr played together at La Lumiere last year, and Poole thinks he knows that Jackson's out the door:

"I'm pretty sure I already know what his decision is," said Poole.

So, will the 19-year-old Jackson turn pro?

"For sure, I definitely think so, only because it’s an opportunity that not a lot of people are able to pass up. Being able to be in a situation like this, especially being in the lottery as a freshman and getting paid to play basketball, (which) is a dream, that’s definitely an opportunity that you have to take advantage of," Poole said.

You'd think this obvious since he's a top five pick who played fewer minutes in an NCAA tournament elimination than Ben Carter, but MSU people are putting it out there that Jackson is leaning towards returning. Izzo getting a lottery pick to return for more rebounding drills in football pads is almost as baffling as "anyone plays for Syracuse."

Etc.: How Villanova became VILLANOVA. KRACH tourney odds. Beilein, post-crash. Amateurism and Loyola. Title IX is no barrier to ending amateurism.



March 30th, 2018 at 1:19 PM ^

the same thing last year about people thinking Bridges was going to come back, and he did.  Izzo somehow just gets players to stay.  I can't say it's delusion because of their track record of players coming back.


March 30th, 2018 at 3:39 PM ^

I also live in the DC area. I have been to Blacksburg once, for a BC-VT night game several years ago (2009?). A good friend of mine is a Michigan undergrad and VT Phd (got a masters from Georgetown in between), so he got me to go check out a game there. I would say it was a good game experience, but I wouldn't say it's great. It certainly isn't a "must see" sort of thing.The Hokie stone campus architecture is nice, but Blacksburg itself is not much. You're in the middle of nowhere, so it most likely will be a single purpose trip with gameday representing 90% of your entertainment and a stroll through campus the other 10%. 


The surrounding area is scenic and there are great motorcycling/sports car roads, particularly as you go into WV. There are also good places to hike and go whitewater rafting within 90 minutes or so. I guess you could combine a game day with some of that. As for the game atmosphere itself, the crowd was rather boisterous, with a touch of hillbilly. They definitely do well as far as enthusiasm.



March 30th, 2018 at 1:00 PM ^

If you're talking Olympic model then yeah Title IX is not a problem, direct payments it sure as hell is. These arguments are always difficult but at some point it would be nice if those arguing actually agreed on what they were arguing about, rather than inventing the questions they want to answer and then answering them.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:02 PM ^

player with NBA ambitions would want to go to a zone school. Just doesn't make any sense.

In a related matter, why would any one-and-done want to go to MSU and spend their freshman year sitting on the bench?


March 30th, 2018 at 1:11 PM ^

Certainly, I understand not wanting to go to Cuse as a 5* because of their system. But I doubt you're going to get better coaching in the G-league than a couple handsful of college coaches though and 26k is hardly (if at all?) better than room and board and food. Sure you can get a shoe contract, but wouldn't it maybe be better to make a bigger name for yourself before locking yourself into a contract?

I respect his decision, but it seems like a poor one.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:36 PM ^

I agree with the gist of your conclusion--the path isn't better, probably, at least for most people. He may have decided that it's better for him. How much of this is because he is irrevocably committed to Syracuse? Anyone can look and determine that spending a year learning to be a cog in a 2-3 zone while playing in a terrible offense isn't good for professional development. Perhaps the issue is that he committed to the wrong school.

Because the money G League offers isn't great (though I wouldn't be surprised if they also provided housing, and there are certainly per diems), though it might be better cash value than a scholarship. But it is almost certain that a 5-star athlete has cash on the table that is better than that in college. And I'm not sure that a shoe company is that interested in a guy who will spend a year being watched by nobody in the G League.

But the coaching thing is interesting. Because G League coaching is probably not as good as the best college coaching... except that you have direct contact with an NBA franchise that can help you tune your game for the NBA. With more time to work on basketball thanks to not taking classes, a determined player can spend many hours per week not available to college players refining his game, and he has an NBA franchise offering at least some pointers to him about what to do.

I wonder how much of this is "college basketball" and how much of this is actually just Syracuse.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:42 PM ^

On the coaching, it really depends which G-league team you end up on. There's a pretty solid pipeline of coaches from the G-league to NBA benches as assistants. This list has 12-14 guys who were coaching in the G-league last year who are now on NBA benches in various roles. http://gleague.nba.com/coaching-callups/

And if you get a good coach, you're getting coached in NBA-style offenses and defenses, which are substantially different than in many colleges, which, as we've seen in this tournament, are still playing a lot of 2 big systems that just don't get played much in the NBA. I'm assuming the G-league attempts to play the same way as the NBA, though I've never really watched a game. Boeheim's only an extreme example of the way that even super well-respected college coaches aren't really preparing players for the play to play elements of NBA basketball. How much did Coach K prepare Marvin Bagley for playing defense in the NBA? Not at all, I'd suggest.

The issue, beyond the money, which is so low to make the G-league route a virtual non-starter for almost everyone, is that you can't choose your coach. That's a huge advantage for college. I'm frankly surprised that more players haven't chosen Michigan in the past 5 years because Beilein's ball screen and spacing offense is so similar to the median NBA offense.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:54 PM ^

That's a really good question. Just from looking at the list, it seems that lots of the G-league coaches that move up go into "player development" roles on NBA benches. That suggests that the NBA teams that own G-league teams look particularly to coaches that specialize in player development, and particularly to develop players for the particular way basketball gets played in the NBA. 

There are lots of college coaches paid handsomely to coach players to be good at college basketball, some of whom (cough, Izzo, cough) emphasize the development of skills that aren't particularly important in the NBA. 

I think that college is still the preferable route for almost all players, particularly given the comically low pay of the G-league (and what happens to players that blow out a knee in the G-league). But I'm not convinced that they receive better coaching in college, particularly if the goal is to develop the particular skills valued in the NBA's version of basketball.


March 30th, 2018 at 2:01 PM ^

Well Coach K was also running a zone this year. But I would gladly play for Roy Williams, Wright, Self, Calipari, Beilein, Painter, Chris Mack, Miller bros except for the feds, hell maybe even Bruce Webber, Crean, Barnes, etc. over some G-League coaches.

Importantly though, it's not just about what system they run that matters, it's about getting specialized attention and continued focus on fundamentals.

The financial part of it is mostly a wash, but also you must agree you're going to get far more exposure at UK than you are in the G-League.


March 30th, 2018 at 2:05 PM ^

No doubt on the greater exposure part. I watch a lot of basketball, both college and NBA, and can't imagine a situation where I'd watch a G-league game. Maybe I'd take my kids to one in a "we need to do something today" manner. And the greater importance of the college games themselves almost certainly allows players to make greater progress in the intangible parts of the game like playing under pressure, etc.

But I think the coaching in terms of the development of fundamentals is a wash, at best. Players play a lot more games in the G-league (about 50). They don't have limits on practice time. Coaches in the G-league aren't judged, largely on wins and losses, but on player development (those are the roles they mostly occupy when they move up to NBA benches). And I've seen enough Bill Self and Coach Cal players in the NBA who don't have a clue about how to play at that level, guys like Josh Jackson and the Morris twins who are amazing athletes but can't dribble and pass, who have no idea where to be on the floor, to think that the development of fundamentals in a lot of even high level college programs is any great shakes.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:15 PM ^

Only problem with mandating a winning conference record to make the NCAA basketball tournament is accounting for injuries. Canceling VT is good for playoff odds simply because a 2 loss team is going to be next to impossible to make the playoff, but sad because less good football.

What should be banned is teams scheduling football games more than 3-4 years in advance


March 30th, 2018 at 1:21 PM ^

The article is a little loose in its reasoning when it suggests that you wouldn't have to pay a women's volleyball player the same amount that you pay Denard Robinson.  It's true that many schools are not in compliance with Title IX, but not spending what you should be on women's sports generally does not invite a lawsuit in the way that paying a female athlete less than a male athlete would.  You have much more of an apples-to-apples comparison in the latter instance, and it will feel much more personal to the female athlete. 

I don't meant to say that we know a female athlete suing to make what a Denard-type makes would be successful, but it doesn't seem like we can assume she wouldn't be either. 

Letting players profit from their likenesses is the easiest route to compensating the players more.


Gulo Gulo Luscus

March 30th, 2018 at 1:23 PM ^

Pretty sure mods don't want board posts about selling anything but figured it's harmless to drop one in the comments.

Anyone still looking for an all sessions ticket? I have one in section 334, row 12 (upper bowl sideline). Transfer via Flash Seats.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:24 PM ^

In the article at the bottom it says, "Well, the chance that we win either of two independent events (basketball title or hockey title) is the sum of their probabilities."

This would be true if the events were mutually exclusive, but they are not.

The correct math is:

1 - [p(not hockey title) x p(not basketball title)] =

1 - [(1 - 0.14) x (1 - 0.22)] = 0.33


So, the probably we win at least either the hockey title or basketball title is 33%.


Wolverine In Exile

March 30th, 2018 at 1:25 PM ^

If the CoFoPo committee had shown one ounce of continuity in the decision process the last 3 years, then by all means schedule to that. But what little precedence we've seen is that flashy record and a blueblood name mean more than conference titles or strength of schedule. Until there's a consistent 2-3 year run of the committee using the same criteria, then just schedule as many high probability W's as possible to make sure you're still in the conversation 5-6 weeks in the season.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:25 PM ^

The problem with the G league in terms of development is that I sorta doubt the coaches there are going to want to spend much time coaching up a talented 18-year-old playing against guys in their mid-20s. College has a lot of problems with how it treats players and development, but playing for the Erie Bayhawks against 28-year-old guards trying to get back in the league is probably not good for your development either.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:45 PM ^

I think the extra time available might help make up for some of the extra attention as a 5*. But, as much as they are disliked, John Calipari is probably way better at taking a year to prepare a guy for the NBA than some guy making $75,000 to coach a G League team. 


March 30th, 2018 at 1:27 PM ^

The G League provides enough of an opportunity that a player who can't make it to school has an option that allows their career to continue. 

But, as the robust discussion on the thread yesterday bore out, I don't think it's a very good option for very many players. I'm actually not the type to say that the personal development in college is the big deal--a year spent anonymously on the road juggling finances on $26k a year is a really good character experience, too--but college basketball offers much more exposure, playing under excellent coaches, with better revenue opportunities when they're finished. 

As currently constituted, I expect the G League will continue to be an alternative to college for a few people and nothing more. Academic barriers are low for 5* prospects, and we suspect many of them make more money at places like Kentucky than they'd make in the G League anyway. It's not going to be a huge draw.

Regarding the Title IX issue: The headline makes it sound like Title IX is no barrier at all, but of course it turns out they're proposing NIL payments. The other stuff they propose is weak; there is zero chance that investing $100,000 into the women's basketball program will be considered an acceptable trade-off for investing $100,000 in an individual player.

But NIL payments that we've discussed here extensively (one wonders if that author has been reading Mgoblog) are a good way to balance the scales.


March 30th, 2018 at 1:28 PM ^

Was complete garbage outside the Olympic model which I support. The author assumes the answer that giving the same to a QB and a women’s tennis player isn’t problematic. The real issue is that the QB at Michigan will be the highest paid player at the university. That means less for the rest of the male athletes and more for their female counterparts to be Title IX compliant. This wouldn’t be a problem if it were just one player, but how much do you think the payroll for the 85-man roster would be? How much is each female rower going to receive to offset that amount? How much will the men’s gymnasts vs. the female gymnasts make? Do people really not think that’s going to be a problem on both teams? If the money doesn’t come from the school then it’s not subject to Title IX so there is no issue.

The article also talks about paying coaches less money. Good luck attracting top talent when you can’t pay for it.


March 30th, 2018 at 2:06 PM ^

If a school is dumb enough to give $3M (or whatever) to Shea Patterson or More Wagner, and that screws over other sports, then they'll be rightfully taken to task and fired. There is always this rush to the extreme, to assume that Title IX will destroy male college athletics, when in reality most schools don't really follow it and market conditions plus what is effectively a salary cap (since you have to come semi-close in terms of male and female payments) will keep teams from doing anything too radical. Instead, it likely only means that guys and gals who so generate interest in the school get a little piece of it.

But this is a debate that will never end, so whatever. I just wanted to point out that it would be silly to assume any school would go extreme paying a guy to play one position on a team where he'd, at best, be there 3-4 years.

Michigan Arrogance

March 30th, 2018 at 1:41 PM ^

I really don't see why fans would want to drop the VT game. CFB recently seems to be polarized: big time games against good teams or body bag games. Maybe it's just the way M recent seasons have played out.

I'll take a VT game anyday. IDGAF if we might lose. go back and look at the schedules from the 80s and 90s. We'll still be playing Ru and Maryland and Purdue/IU/Minn/Ill 3-4 times a year if you want a locked in win 

KC Wolve

March 30th, 2018 at 2:47 PM ^

I want to see good football games. Watching shit games like Ark St will be isn’t worth the 6000 commercials you have to sit through. I mean, I sort of get the playoff thinking but beating VT increases those odds more than playing a meaningless game. Plus, let’s be honest with ourselves. After 20 years or so, I’ll go ahead and hit the breaks on any playoff talk.


March 30th, 2018 at 4:22 PM ^

Despite the PFF love, Mo has been dropping out of the first round in recent mock drafts I've seen. I don't know if that's the heart condition or the lack of prototypical size, but as a Patriots fan, I would absolutely love it if they were able to scoop him up, especially given his lineage (son of former Pats player and cheerleader).