[Bryan Fuller]

2023 Recruiting: Jack Tuttle Comment Count

Seth March 1st, 2024 at 11:28 AM

Previously: 2022’s profiles, K Adam Samaha, K James Turner (Tr), S Brandyn Hillman, CB DJ Waller, CB Cameron Calhoun, CB Jyaire Hill, HSP/LB Jason Hewlett, LB Hayden Moore, LB Semaj Bridgeman, LB Ernest Hausmann (Tr), OLB Breeon Ishmail, DE Aymeric Koumba, DE Enow Etta, DE Josaiah Stewart (Tr), DT Brooks Bahr, DT Cameron Brandt, DT Trey Pierce, OT Evan Link, OT Myles Hinton (Tr), OT LaDarius Henderson (Tr), OG Nathan Efobi, IOL Amir Herring, OC Drake Nugent (Tr), TE Deakon Tonielli, TE Zack Marshall, TE AJ Barner (Tr), WR Semaj Morgan, WR Fredrick Moore, WR Karmello English, RB Benjamin Hall, RB Cole Cabana, ATH Kendrick Bell, QB Jack Tuttle (Tr)

 
San Marcos (Mission Hills), CA – 6'4''/210
 
image
Transfer Rankings
247 3.03*
As Fr: 4.46*
3*, 84, #57 QB
#800 Ovr
On3 2.95*
As Fr: n/a
3*, 85, #74 QB
not ranked
Rivals 3.00*
As Fr: 4.46*
3*, 5.6, #65 QB
#851 Ovr
ESPN n/a
As fr: 3.76*
n/a
H.S. Composites
247 0.9321, #167 Ovr, #8 PRO, #25 CA
On3 92.55, #163 Ovr, #14 QB, #25 CA
MGo 4.32*, #207/804 Ovr, #16/43 QBs
YMRMFSPA
Shea Patterson
 
Other Suitors: Mizzou, Rutgers
Previously on MGoBlog: Portal In by Alex, Spring game
Notes: 2018 Utah commit, IU 2019-'22
Film
My clips. HS highlights.

We're going to do this one a little differently, since Tuttle's pretty different. By rights we should be at the end of Tuttle's career right now, not writing up the piece that goes at the beginning. We'll make one-time exception here for a 7th year senior who was a backup at Indiana that transferred to be a backup at Michigan and probably wasn't expecting to get another year after that. Now eligible, Tuttle is in line to start for Michigan in 2024. So let's see what that looks like.

What's his story?

You mean how is he eligible? Here's a rundown:

  • 2018: REDSHIRT at Utah.
  • 2019: RS freshman at Indiana (5 games).
  • 2020: COVID year at Indiana (3 games, 1 start)
  • 2021: RS sophomore year at Indiana (7 games, 1 start)
  • 2022: MEDSHIRT year at Indiana (1 game)
  • 2023: RS junior year at Michigan (6 games)
  • 2024: RS senior year at Michigan.

Tuttle was a 2018 prospect on Michigan's recruiting radar because they were the school hardest after Tuttle's Mission Hills teammate Chris Olave. The Wolverines ultimately got Joe Milton (and added transfer Shea Patterson) in that class, and Tuttle went to Utah. A four-star recruit, Tuttle was immediately in the mix to start, but was still third on the depth chart behind Snoop Huntley (now the Ravens backup) and Jason Shelley, a future FCS starter. Tuttle got frustrated and left the team in early October so he could enroll in time for winter classes at Indiana and be eligible in fall.

[Hit THE JUMP for the rest]

Why IU? Well, funny story. Courtney Morgan had been with new Indiana OC Kalen DeBoer at Fresno State, and had been recruiting Tuttle (and Olave) along with Michael Penix. DeBoer invited Tuttle to come compete with Penix and returning starter Peyton Ramsey. Penix won that job but was in and out of the lineup, with Ramsey coming in to dink screens or lob bombs to a stellar receiving group when Penix was hurt. Tuttle made a few mop-up appearances, finishing the season 6/11 for 34 yards. Only one of those passes was after Sept 21st, so there's a world where Tuttle gets a medical redshirt for 2019, and has eligibility in 2025.

The 2020 season doesn't count to anyone but Indiana. Penix made it healthy through his then-customary six games, then tore his ACL late in a win against Maryland. Tuttle finished that game 5/5, game-managed a win at Wisconsin (13/22 for 130 yards and 2 TDs). Then he started against Ole Miss in the Outback. IU made it to the Civil War Losers' 35 yard line down 1 with 1:14 remaining, then took an awful sack on 2nd & 12. Tuttle's final statline: 26/45 for 201 yards and an INT in a 26-20 loss. A lot of those completions were screens.

Things fell apart at IU after that. Penix made it just five games behind the worst offensive line we've ever previewed. Tuttle finished the Penn State game, threw a bazillion screens while the refs did everything they could to save MSU from an upset, and engineered an opening drive against Ohio State, but took a hard hit on the touchdown, tried to come back, took another hit, and was injured again. But for one awful quarter against Rutgers, Donaven McCully quarterbacked IU the rest of the way.

Despite Penix's transfer to Washington, Tuttle was relegated back to backup in 2022, "losing" a foregone battle to Mizzou transfer Connor Bazelak to run Walt Bell's stupid dinky bullshit (technical term). Tuttle sat out most of the season for injury and announced his plans to transfer in mid-October, but worked out a deal with the NCAA to allow him to stay with IU through an extra quarter semester so he wouldn't have to abandon his teammates. Then Bazelak got hurt in November and Tuttle was called on to start against Penn State. He looked good, throwing 9/12 for 82 yards and a TD, before taking two hard sacks and going out for the season. This is the year the NCAA recently granted as a medshirt.

Last year Tuttle ascended to 2nd string at Michigan over Davis Warren, Alex Orji and Jayden Denegal, but took a cheap shot on his first snap against UNLV and had to miss a few weeks. "Tuttle Time" in midseason blowouts over Nebraska, Minnesota, IU, and MSU were productive—15/17 for 130 yards and a TD—but hardly more instructive than an O'Korn-ish spring game where Tuttle ran a lot, made some bad decisions, and came away looking like the clear #2 but with a much bigger gap between himself and JJ than with the other backups.

It wasn't until mid-February that the NCAA granted his waiver to play another year; Tuttle had planned on sticking around to be a grad assistant if he couldn't play.

Accuracy

Evidence from Tuttle's career thus far shows decent accuracy. His touchdown to Karmello English was on point.

His stats might be lower than he deserves too. This was on Barner's hands, and without PI this throw to Clemons was on target. This checkdown to Tyler Morris under a Tampa 2 was a good read, and deserves extra credit for arriving right in front of the receiver for a YAC opportunity.

To the bad, I thought this throw to Wilson on a waggle was a bit behind his target, and he underthrew a couple of his receivers against MSU. Brian's UFR scores equal about a game's worth of passing, and makes him look like a quintessential game-manager.

JACK TUTTLE

  Good   Neutral   Bad   Ovr   Reads
Game DO CA SCR   PR MA   BA TA IN BR   DSR GRADE!   RPOs ZRs
UNLV                         n/a -   0/0 1/1
Nebraska   3     1 2             100% +1.5      
Minnesota   2 1                   100% +2      
Indiana   4               1     80% -1      
MSU   4     1       1       80% -1.5      
TOTAL 0 13 1   2 2   0 1 1 0   88% +1      

That's thrown off by his role. There were many, many, many, many checkdowns. Granted this was his role; when you're up by many late in a game, the only way to screw up is to turn the ball over. But it's a theme of his play at Indiana (albeit with a terrible OL) as well.

Arm strength?

It's hard to find an example of Tuttle uncorking it. Here's the hardest I think we've seen him throw thus far (into the wind):

His longest in-air completion was "go-get-it" to Fryfogle against Wisconsin but I'm going to set you back to the throw before it, a zip into a hole in zone coverage, which shows a McNamara-level arm. You have to go back to his high school career to see him lob bombs at Chris Olave, but Olave was so open all that tells you is Tuttle knew not to put it too long.

In trying to asses the transfer last year, Brandon Brown thought Tuttle has "good enough velocity."

Has a pretty strong arm and feels comfortable throwing his footballs on the move — not on JJ McCarthy's level, but on a level where it works.

Reading/pocket presence?

The knock on Tuttle is despite all of the experience he's still just extremely deliberate in his reads. Key to great quarterbacking is the ability to anticipate guys coming open, a trait that differentiated JJ McCarthy from every other quarterback I've seen at Michigan save Tom Brady. That short list tells you how rare it is, so it's not a huge knock to say Tuttle doesn't have it. That said, Brandon Brown, for one, thinks Tuttle doesn't have it:

While at Indiana, appeared slow to process defenses at times, which led to the six interceptions.

Tuttle was a recruit so long ago that ESPN (!!) was still doing high school evaluations, and described the tall, intellectual type of passer who's cognitive as opposed to preternatural.

Very decisive, accurate passer. Patient and disciplined thrower who consistently finds the open man. Can fit the ball into tight windows at short and intermediate levels. …

AREAS OF IMPROVEMENT: Will need to add bulk and functional strength. Possesses a long, deliberate delivery. Tends to force throws at times. Needs to get his entire body into the throw to maximize arm. ... BOTTOM LINE: Tuttle is a solid quarterback prospect with nice upside. He will need to get stronger and polish up his throwing mechanics, but he's a guy with a lot of physical tools to develop.

They had him for a 91.29 SPARQ rating, and a power throw in the 80s—think 83 if you're doing NCAA quarterback ratings, or 73 if you're building him in Madden. Together it sounds like an Iowa quarterback: deliberate, moderate arm strength that requires a clean pocket, and the potential to grow into a mobile guy if he can see the field better.

I do get a vibe that when his first read isn't there he rushes to the checkdown, and if that's also covered his next move is to just take off.

His legs are good enough that the latter isn't a terrible idea. He converted a 3rd & 17 against Minnesota that I thought had zero chance.

You gotta wonder though if it would have gone so well against a better tackling team than Minnesota.

Dual Threat

On the other hand, we have plenty of evidence that Tuttle's ability to move is much more than an afterthought. He's gone to so many schools that wanted him to remain in the pocket that every time he does something with his legs it's another "Oh!" moment. IU treated him as such a pocket passer that Alex Drain offered Tuttle "offers nothing on the ground" as late as the 2022 preseason.

The afore mentioned ESPN 2018 eval uncovered Tuttle's hidden talent.

Deceptively athletic kid who can extend plays if he has to.

Michigan(!) ironically has been the one school to showcase Tuttle in plays designed for the QB to keep it. UNLV didn't believe.

But Harbaugh's Michigan was also the worst place to learn how to zone read. Tuttle missed a golden opportunity against Minnesota with an unathletic DE shuffling all the way inside.

When Tuttle got to Indiana this was something Tom Allen noted quickly.

Tuttle has also impressed his new coach with unexpected mobility, something Allen is always happy to have behind center.

“He’s listed as a pro-style quarterback, whatever that means, the way they categorize guys. But to me, as I would always say, it’s about, can you extend plays? To be able to make a guy miss that’s trying to pursue you in the pass rush, to be able to step out of the pocket and get a first down?” Allen said. “He can do all those things. He can pull the ball on a zone read, he can get first downs, and he can make you pay for not honoring that.”

And stood out to Alex in the Michigan spring game:

Run, Jack, Run!! Maybe the most notable element of transfer QB Jack Tuttle's game that stood out today was the willingness and inclination to run the ball. The newcomer from Indiana by way of Utah got the start for Team Blue and from the very first play of the game, Tuttle was comfortable running with it. That play was designed to give him the chance to keep it, but he was also scrambling while on the run quite often too, and looked plausible at doing it. He had a couple nice throws (one to AJ Barner down the seam) and one ugly decision (a backfoot heave under pressure that was INT'd), but for me it was the mobility that I was intrigued by the most

Injuries?

It's hard to tell whether this was just an Indiana thing—they couldn't get more than six games a year from Michael Penix—or a Tuttle thing, but one of the main reasons he's still in college is he's lost a huge chunk of his career to injuries. The Daily:

In his six years of college football, he’s been hurt “five or six times.” He’s broken his foot, his ankle, his ribs, his sternum, his collarbone, and injured his UCL and shoulder. He’s lost quarterback battles he was expected to win, and his career hasn’t turned into what he might’ve predicted seven years ago.

He took a late shove into the Gatorade table after the one run against UNLV and missed a few weeks last season.

Penix is a decent proof of concept for whether you can keep a survivor IU's offensive line healthy for at least for 14.75 games, but even that hasn't assuaged some NFL teams from telling Bruce Feldman they're not even putting Penix on their board because of it. This has to be a consideration for Michigan with Tuttle; if he wins the job, can he last an entire season? Can he last an entire season if you're using his legs to their fullest extent? And before you say "That's what we did with JJ" remember there wasn't a Texas or USC or Washington before November that forced Michigan to use anything like their complete arsenal, and that an injury while running McCarthy against Penn State hampered him afterwards. So I highly doubt they'll be inclined to use Tuttle that way.

Leadership

The book on Tuttle coming out of *high school* was that he was a high floor, team leader type. Rivals' Adam Gorney made this the focus of his analysis at the Battle at the Beach while playing down some accuracy issues attributed to playing with a much lower caliber of receiver. Utah players voted him into the captain's circle when he was still a teenager:

His natural leadership ability may explain why his Utah teammates nominated him to the Leadership Council after just two months on campus. …

“That’s unexplainable,” Olave said. “He’s one of the most complete people I know. Through all the ups and downs, even in his worst times, he kept everybody up. He always stays positive.” In fact, if Olave had to characterize Tuttle, his disposition would be how he did it. “Everything about him is positive,” Olave said. “Even off the field. Everybody just looks forward to talking to him. It’s crazy what type of person he is on and off the field.”

…and why he was a team captain at Indiana while 3rd on the depth chart. His dad says the boy was watching film at ten.

Fast forward seven years and you get the most mature college football player since they were letting 30-year-old WW2 vets enroll. Ladies and gentlemen, prepare for the first football player in the history of the sport to admit he wasn't the gods' gift to the sport at 18 while still in college:

“I mean, definitely looking back there are some decisions I would have made differently, but that’s a tough question, because I’m here,” Tuttle said. “So the path I took to get here, it’s hard to want to change.”

In fact, if you ask him, the only regret Tuttle acknowledges is rushing himself

Jack Tuttle is so old that

  • He competed against Tristan Gebbia at a 2016 7v7 tournament.
  • He was the classmate and HS quarterback of Chris Olave.
  • He's one class after Brad Hawkins.
  • He was starting kindergarten when Michigan "classmate" Jyaire Hill was born.

Etc. Has proficiency in hip hop.

Jack played a long list of sports — and even ventured into the domain of his older sister, Ally, when his mother signed him up for a hip-hop class.

“He had the time of his life,” Kathy said. “It was an all-boys hip-hop group, and we thought it would be good for him, for his coordination and in getting up and performing in front of people. It was quite funny, and we teased them all.

They didn't tease Ally, who's in a national championship-winning dance troupe.

Why Shea Patterson? Patterson was a highly rated high schooler who came to Michigan after a battered career in an RPO offense whose best trait was a mobility that wasn't used enough. His arm was fine, his delivery wonky and slow, his reads deliberate, his pocket presence frustrating, his downfield passing rare, and his best moments were running arc reads. All that said, we were delighted to have him.

Guru Reliability: n/a. We're using our own eyes on this one.

Variance: Very low. I've never heard of a 7th year renaissance. Tuttle is who he is, a solid floor.

Ceiling: Medium. You can win the Big Ten with him.

Flight Risk Level: Zero. He cannot possibly have more eligibility, and is plan after college is to stick around and become a coach.

General Excitement Level: Moderate. Baseline 5: +1 for HURRAH FOR A FLOOR, –1 for the ceiling is probably the floor.

Projection: Tuttle has a shot to be the starter this season, but it's notable that nobody declared him the starter when the NCAA declared him eligible. "Tuttle Time" last year came down to a good zone read against UNLV and a couple of good drives against Minnesota that mostly showcased his mobility, a trait Michigan underutilizes in its offense. The fact that Sam's telling us Alex Orji is the prohibitive favorite and Jayden Denegal is the most improved tells us they're not expecting Tuttle to be the bridge to Jadyn Davis.

That's not a bad thing. We know what Tuttle is, and considering the shape of the other backup QBs around the league (Ohio State's is probably true freshman Julian Sayin), we're extremely glad to have him back. Tuttle should give Michigan a McNamaran floor at the biggest positional question mark going into 2024. There's an O'Korn comp one could make, but Michigan's 2024 offensive line shouldn't in any way resemble the 2017 one that exacerbated O'Korn's issues.

Yay, we're done with the 2023 recruiting profiles!

(Meta: Hopefully by the time I start the 202 the new Drupal WYSIWYG will be ready to install and the boxes won't look like crap from the extra <br> tags the CMS is adding that it's not worth trying to fix now because we're getting ready to install a new Drupal WYSIWYG.)

Comments

lhglrkwg

March 1st, 2024 at 11:51 AM ^

I'm hyped Tuttle is back again. As noted, it sets a pretty solid floor for the QB room. Can Tuttle be as good as 2021 Cade? I really don't see why not other than that Cade did throw a pretty nice deep ball at times so maybe Tuttle can be almost as good as 2021 Cade. That's plenty enough for this to be a 9+ win team imo

Seems like it would be an upset for Tuttle to not be the starter in the fall. Orji has barely thrown the ball which should tell us something about something when the other back ups do throw it in their garbage time. I guess Sam is hearing otherwise, so maybe Orji's got a better arm than we've seen them use to this point

Lakeyale13

March 1st, 2024 at 12:37 PM ^

You may be right, but people claiming Tuttle could be as good as Cade are making that claim with little to no evidence for it.

He couldn’t become a starter at Indiana and has never been a starter. He is entering his 7th year never being a starting QB for a team. 
 

After 6 years of being nothing but a backup QB, does anyone consider there is a reason why he was a backup QB for 6 years?  I don’t think people realize how much of a concern it’s going to be if Tuttle, Origi or Denegal are the starting QB.

Lakeyale13

March 1st, 2024 at 8:45 PM ^

The only statement I am making is that anyone who is saying (and there are quite a few here on this blog) that think Tuttle is going to be a capable QB are simply making a statement based solely on hope and not actual any proof in 6 years of playing that he has the ability to be a capable QB. 
 

I hope he is one. But the chances that in year 7 he becomes something he hasn’t been in the previous 6 years is astronomically low.  
 

What he has shown, is that he is highly prone to injury. 

ca_prophet

March 1st, 2024 at 7:32 PM ^

If you have concern over Tuttle, Orji or Denegal - and it might be warranted, mind you - Davis or Warren would probably call for panic.

Michigan will not have an established, high-ceiling starter at QB next year.  The one QB who has demonstrated a useful talent is Tebow-esque, of which people are understandably leery.

On the other hand, Michigan will have many more pieces for its complex running game, and passing as a constraint with a bruising, QB-led run game would be easier to set up.

I will watch their future progress with considerable interest.

 

CityOfKlompton

March 1st, 2024 at 11:17 PM ^

Agree with this. A lot of fans seem to be very optimistic with Tuttle Time, and incredibly excited for Orji, but we haven't seen anything from either one of them.

Tuttle is entering year 7 with a substantial injury history and little else of substance. He could be our Stetson Bennett or he could be Shea Patterson 2.0, which the 1.0 version doesn't come with much fanfare these days.

Orji hasn't even thrown a single pass yet. We don't even know if he can do the "quarterback" parts of playing quarterback even remotely well yet. 

I don't say any of this as doom and gloom, but I think a lot of fans have forgotten how frustrated and negative they were just a few short years ago when this team had good-not-great quarterback play, which is what Michigan might be staring down as a ceiling next season.

jdemille9

March 1st, 2024 at 1:11 PM ^

I do get a vibe that when his first read isn't there he rushes to the checkdown

Sounds like Donovan Edwards might lead this team in receptions, and I'm 100% fine with that.

93Grad

March 1st, 2024 at 1:12 PM ^

I could obviously be wrong but Tuttle seems more in line O'kornish abilities than Cade.   I guess it's a nice floor for the program, but I hope like hell one of the other 4 can step up and give us a higher ceiling.  

MaizeBlueA2

March 1st, 2024 at 7:40 PM ^

Disagree.

That's the point of the post. If Davis beats out Tuttle, who has an obvious floor of "average B1G starter"...that is a good sign.

Orji and Denegal are unknowns, but Tuttle isn't. Davis beating out Tuttle is no different IMO than Kenneth Grant beating out Cam Goode... or Keon Sabb beating out Quinten Johnson. 

On the flipside, that's what scares the shit out of me about CB #2.

Waller and Hill couldn't beat out anyone last year. It was Walker who was getting all the hype early and when push came to shove we had to move Sainristil out to an outside CB position because we couldn't trust either of those guys for meaningful snaps. 

jdemille9

March 2nd, 2024 at 10:41 AM ^

 If Davis beats out Tuttle, who has an obvious floor of "average B1G starter"...that is a good sign.

Fair point, however, I'd still prefer the guy with (many) years of college experience and maturity vs. the 18-yr old kid. No matter how talented he is. 

If a true freshman beats everyone else out he's either Trevor Lawrence or everyone else sucks. Even freshman JJ didn't beat out Cade McNamara. Hell, even Andrew Luck sat as a true freshman.

I won't be upset if Davis wins the job, but I'd honestly feel it was more his competition was weak than he was just that good. There's a reason he fell so far in the recruiting rankings, he's not Trevor Lawrence. 

To be clear: I think Jadyn Davis is gonna be a really good QB for us. I just don't think it's gonna be in 2024. 

Seth

March 2nd, 2024 at 11:02 AM ^

Davis wants to redshirt. That's been the plan all along. They don't want to rush him and burn a year of eligibility because he's the kind of guy who could be a great college QB and make a lot of money at that without going pro until his eligibility is used up. His height limits his value to the NFL and that's not changing.

WestQuad

March 1st, 2024 at 3:51 PM ^

While Cade McNamara was a game manager, he was a pretty good game manager who played well.  To assume Tuttle can play that well just because he's a game manager type is a big assumption.  After years of mid QB play* before JJ (and McNamara) I'm a little anxious about this next year.  The good news is that our offense seems set up to minimize the need for an all-world QB. 

 

 

 

*Rudddock and pre-injury Speight were decent.  Shea was actually good, but was so hyped that he was a disappointment.

meeashagin

March 1st, 2024 at 3:56 PM ^

Gone are the days were you get 3 cupcakes to break your QB in. In today's game with the portal and NIL at a place like Michigan you should not be starting anyone without experience (preferably multiple years but at least 1) or was a blue-chip prospect. We only have 1 current QB (Davis) that fits that criteria unless we say Tuttle has experience.

I'm holding judgement until the spring game but I prefer someone that can complete a forward pass.

youn2948

March 1st, 2024 at 4:25 PM ^

So this is how we get a starting QB older than our coach without them being a mormon missionary.

Hijinks aside having veteran leadership depth is important, I suppose Orji isn't well rounded but with an OL coach as HC was sort of hoping to see more gimmick option runs.

I think it's best we try to stay balances though and stick to the prostyle the team is used to though and sets up for recruiting and draft.

Borges George

March 1st, 2024 at 9:48 PM ^

I am excited with Orji being the presumptive favorite.  Harbaugh calling him Walter Payton its like, are you serious?  If he is serious, we have something big in store I'd guess. 

Bring it on.  

Having Tuttle as the floor is definitely a great thing too.  Overall you could get worried about injuries but there seems to be decent depth and varying levels of experience, although basically no starting experience at all.

Should be an interesting year.  D is going to be just as good.  D line is insanely good at the starter position.  Same with safety.  Will Johnson best player in America next year?  We'll see about linebacker but shouldn't be terrible, just not sure how deep.  

After watching Harbaugh on Rich Eisen, I feel good about Sherrone Moore and his staff and players.  I thought Harbaugh had a great explanation and was very classy in doing so.  He understood the assignment and spoke directly to the fanbase.