Email Response from Bruce Madej Regarding Michigan-OSU Rivalry
First, my original email (short and to the point):
And now the response:
Dear Me,
Thank you for your note on the importance of Michigan-Ohio State football game. President Coleman and other university leaders have asked me to respond on their behalf.
I want to assure you that no one understands the tradition of this Big Ten football rivalry more than Athletic Director David Brandon. He has experienced this legendary rivalry first hand as a player, as a fan and supporter of the athletic program and as a U-M regent.
Expansion of the Big Ten is certain to bring some changes. We know there will be a conference championship game in 2011 and we expect to soon learn the details of the divisional alignment. Clearly we would like to have Michigan and Ohio State play the last game of the season for the Conference Championship (as has happened so many times in the past). However, based on a 12 Team - two division conference with a championship game format, in order for this to happen in the future both teams will have to play their way into the championship game. Which, we hope happens many times!
Certainly one of the priorities of the Big Ten commissioner and the Big Ten athletic directors is preserving the traditional rivalries, like Michigan-Ohio State and Michigan-Michigan State. This will continue to be a driving principle...as will creating competitive balance between the two divisions.
Just like the renovations to the Big House, we believe the Big Ten can move forward and make improvements while maintaining the traditions that are so important to fans.
Go Blue,
BRUCE MADEJ
This does not sound good IMHO. I told him we wanted to have Michigan-OSU be the last game of the regular season. And he responded by saying they are hoping Michigan-OSU can play in the title game every year, but change is inevitable. Maybe I didn't explain myself well enough, or maybe this is just not going to end well. Anyways, I suggest you guys keep flooding the AD with emails, and when you do make it clear that Michigan-OSU need to be on the same side and play the last weekend of the regular season. No excuses!
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:17 PM ^
I couldn't agree more with you. But apparently money is more important than anything else now; tradition, history, everything that is right with college football.
I'm not that old but I still never thought I would see the day where we would even talk about Ohio State not being the last regular season game. (Trips to Hawaii in 86 and 98 excluded.)
This just sucks.
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:24 PM ^
i was and still am pro-expansion (as long as it's capped at 14) even though i knew that it could affect The Game. however, it can still be protected. the decision makers just have to look at it with just a speckle of tradition. they couldn't possibly be able to ignore the outcry from the public regarding the notion that The Game could be moved or played twice in a season, could they?
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:43 PM ^
i just wanted to thank you for all of your videos wolverinehistorian. i'm new to this board and this is my first chance to say thanks.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:35 PM ^
Well, you're very welcome. I'm happy to do it. And I want to thank you for your screen name of that most famous quote...which still cracks me up.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:29 PM ^
agree- it is a holiday - and not just for us, but for the nation. moving it will certainly take it off the national radar and i believe belittle even for m fans.
as has been said we can be in separate divisions and still play it last- i care a lot less if we end up repating the game in a championship shortly thereafter than i do about having the game at the end of the season to look forward to.
our rivalries are balanced throughout our schedule with nd at the front, msu towards the middle and osu at the end. shifting osu and msu is putting lipstick on a pig!!!!
August 23rd, 2010 at 2:26 PM ^
I have the same feeling the morning of The Game as I did when I was a kid at Christmas. It is something special. It's one of those few days that marks the year. I enjoy watching Michigan play ND in September, but it's nowhere near the same thing.
What's next, Harvard-Yale in August?
August 23rd, 2010 at 11:54 AM ^
I'm an Industrial Engineer so I spent the better part of my early career helping companies accept and embrace change. However, on this issue, I just don't like changing The Game from the last regular season position to some other date. Many have had better rationale/discussion than I could hope to articulate, but I just don't like how it feels. I always work from the old adage, "if something doesn't feel right, then it probably isn't.". This is one of those times for me.
I love Michigan football and I feel the date change will diminish the significance of The Game. Having said that, I know of no one in the Michigan Athletic Department that better understands the significance of this game than David Brandon. So I leave it to him and his colleagues to make the best decision for the future, but I'm disappointed that it looks like The Game will be changing.
August 23rd, 2010 at 11:56 AM ^
Ya this is crazy to me that this could happen.
I wrote him a response explaining myself further and asking what is preventing Michigan-OSU from being in the same division. I also referenced Nebraska-Oklahoma.
I will post his response when/if I get one that is at all useful.
My hope is that when this becomes public the outcry from Michigan fans/alumni/donors, combined with OSU's and any other schools that got screwed, will be enough to get it fixed in the next 5 years.
Sure TV money is super important to the conference, but if the individual schools big money donors start throwing their money around at some point it could get the ship righted.
Thats my hope at least.
August 23rd, 2010 at 10:03 PM ^
I personally can't wait for the first late November, last regular season clash with Purdue.
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:03 PM ^
What's so bad about playing in back-to-back weeks? If we both play again in the title game, then near-certainly there will be a divisional championship on the line to get the Big Ten Championship. The odds of both teams having they're divisions locked up going into The Game is incredibly unlikely, and I'd consider the importance of keeping The Game as the last game of the season as much greater than the unlikelyhood of having a game that would have no meaning in the standings.
We nealry all agree we want to keep it the last game of the season. Would you rather play Ohio State twice in a row or play Purdue the next week?
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:15 PM ^
Maybe I'm just paranoid, but wouldn't playing a team two weeks in a row really tempt kids to aim to injure opponents? If you can knock someone out for two weeks, you've made your rematch that much easier.
The same might be said for playing a team earlier in the season and meeting in the championship game, but to a lesser extent. At that point you don't know that you'll be playing them again.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:10 PM ^
I think with The Game they're pretty much trying to do their worst/best already.
August 23rd, 2010 at 3:18 PM ^
It's kinda hard to hype up "The Game" of the year, only to have it happen again in 2 weeks. "The Game(s)" just doesn't have the same ring to it. Plus what happens if we beat OSU by 3 td's but Denard twists his ankle in celebration, and then we lose by a missed extra point in the Conf Champ game?
August 23rd, 2010 at 3:32 PM ^
What happens in that scenario is that OSU gets bragging rights, because their win cancels out our win. It's ridiculous, but that's how it will go.
Put us in the same division. One game a year, at the end of the regular season. Settle the score in Ann Arbor or Columbus, not Lucas Oil Stadium.
August 23rd, 2010 at 4:16 PM ^
I definitely agree, I think the Red River Shootout got it right by keeping Texas and Oklahoma in the same division. Just look at how the Nebraska-Oklahoma rivalry ended when they went into seperate divisions of the Big 12.
August 23rd, 2010 at 8:26 PM ^
if we go in seperate divisions and do manage to meet in the B10 championship game, it won't be settled in A2 or Columbus.
It will be in some passionless netural site dome, overshadowed by some fan from the stands trying to win a million dollars by throwing a football through a giant can of soda pop..
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:10 PM ^
I am sure he has sent this to about 1,000 other people. It would take a very high-ranking regent or donor to get anything other than this formulaic response.
Obviously, what he is saying is the preferred outcome among those who support this idea—namely, that UM and OSU win their respective divisions regularly, setting up a showdown in the championship game. In their minds, the only thing better than an annual UM-OSU game is to have TWO annual UM-OSU games.
The trouble is, I don't think it will happen as often as they think. As a number of folks have noted, the odds are against both teams making it to the championship game. The loser of the regular-season contest ALREADY would have a conference loss, and would probably have almost no margin for error in its remaining games. In order to get UM-OSU in Indianapolis once every 8-10 years, they are sacrificing UM-OSU on the last week of the season in all of the other years. Brilliant!
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:16 PM ^
But but but, the ACC aligned their divisions specifically to get the TV-friendly Miami/FSU match up in the championship game, and look how well that worked out!
I can't believe the people in charge want to copy the model that led to this.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:34 PM ^
You win this whole argument.
This is not a theoretical discussion. A "Competitive Balance" alignment with an eye toward a preferred marquee matchup in the championship game has been tried already by the ACC. (See picture above for how that turned out.)
Now let's look at a successful example of a 12 team/championship game example . . . the SEC.
How dumb would it have been for the SEC to go away from geography when it looked like the SEC east was overly dominant and fiddle with "Competitive Balance" and rigged championship games. These things run in cycles, now the SEC west looks stronger.
But it really doesn't matter for the SEC. In their current geographical alignment, the passion of traditional rivalries has been maintained and the SEC championship produces an interesting cross-sectional matchup every year.
August 23rd, 2010 at 3:41 PM ^
Michigan, OSU, PSU, MSU, IU and Purdue in the East Division.
Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin. Illinois, Northwestern and Minnesota in the West Division.
All serious rivalry games are preserved. (I love the Little Brown Jug, but come on.) No need for protected interdivisional games. No worries about archrivals playing twice. No big travel headaches. And if it turns out that the East is stronger than the West, so what? Then the winner of UM-OSU will get a victory lap the next week. No biggie.
August 23rd, 2010 at 8:32 PM ^
Just like it does for the SEC.
BTW, why does everyone keep underestimating the West? Nebraska, Wisconsin, Iowa, and an periodically hot Illinois and Northwestern is a division that is no slouch.
August 23rd, 2010 at 6:48 PM ^
/thread
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:16 PM ^
with your question and, after paying lip service to the rivalry, his answer is essentially "Too bad." I would like to see The Game stay where it is and, in years where Ohio State and Michigan are both good enough, it would basically be a semi-final to see who gets to go to the Big Ten championship game. (Even in years where they both aren't good enough, the beauty of this rivalry is one ruining the chance of the other!) But the decision-makers are too greedy for this likely and consistent annual scenario and instead want to go for broke to have an OSU-UM rematch in the championship game. How often will that really occur? Once every five years, maybe? I'm sure Penn State, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan State and others from time to time will have something to say about it.
Bottom line, he is using flawed logic in his response. OSU-UM on the last Saturday of the regular season has very often been for the Big Ten championship and virtually always has Big Ten championship implications. Now the HOPE is that they will play in the Big Ten championship game. The former always occurred, the latter might occur. Reason enough for me to say keep it as is.
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:26 PM ^
What was great about some of the victories in the 90's was that we were able to ruin OSU's season. Thats why the 1995 Biakabatuka game is one of my favorites. If we play that game earlier in the season it takes something away; OSU could have several games left to work their way back up the rankings.
For this reason I have no problem playing them twice in a row verse playing them in the middle of the B10 schedule.
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:30 PM ^
We can send all the e-mails we want, but in the end, this is ultimately up to the Big Ten to decide. Michigan and OSU can raise all the fuss they want, but we neither of us are in a position to pull a Yost and leave the conference or try to overrule the consensus of the other 10 conference members.
Here's to hoping the other people deciding this make better decisions than the one that seems inevitable with the responses from the athletic department. We can at least make our AD know that we want him to fight for The Game to the bitter end instead of letting it slide and compromising for the watering down of the greatest rivalry in sports.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:40 PM ^
if we don't get our way.
I understand that the Big 12 has a couple of slots open.
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:33 PM ^
Is anyone planning on creating signs to hold up at the UCONN game to let the AD know how fans feel about moving "The Game"?
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:37 PM ^
UCONN not be serious about moving The Game!
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:45 PM ^
I'm all for "outrage" and petitions and what not, but shouldn't these letters be sent to the Big 10 office, rather than to Michigan? Meaning, Brandon didn't make the decision, he is just preparing the fanbase for the decision that was made.
Are you hoping to cause enough "outrage" that Michigan threatens to leave the Big 10? What other recourse is there?
August 23rd, 2010 at 12:57 PM ^
I'd contact both the U of M and Big Ten offices. I'm sending another to Illinois (where I went to law school) to cover as many bases as possible.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:33 PM ^
Michigan and Ohio State have enough power to keep things the way they are. If both schools threatened to leave the conference i'm sure the Big 10 would change its decision.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:03 PM ^
Holy shit, this shouldn't even be a question. The Michigan-OSU game is the last scheduled game of Michigan's season, period. If there is a championship game after, then so be it. It's a necessary evil so perhaps UM and OSU can play for the division title or play each other again a week later. But holy shit, you do not break up the biggest rivalry in sports just because of conference realignment when neither school has left the conference. OSU is the biggest rival goddammit, not MSU.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:27 PM ^
This is exactly why i didn't want expansion or a stupid championship game.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:38 PM ^
I don't think the athletic department gets nearly as much feedback as some might imagine and I do think it can have an impact...like with the Halo or the SBC sponsorship in 2004.
August 23rd, 2010 at 5:49 PM ^
They seem to have been moved by the outcry on the water-bottle ban, too, with the announcement that there will be free water bottles vs. UConn.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:44 PM ^
I found this on the Big Ten website:
Big Ten Conference
James E. Delany
Commissioner
1500 West Higgins Road
Park Ridge, IL 60068-6300
(847) 696-1010
Fax numbers:
Admin. (847) 696-1150
Comm. (847) 696-1110
...and on mgoblue.com the UM AD correspondence addy:
|
Address for correspondence (Office/Person) Athletic Department University of Michigan 1000 South State Street Ann Arbor, MI 48109-2201 |
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:48 PM ^
Me and the fellas at the retirement home are soooo going to fax the fuck out of Jim Delany.
August 23rd, 2010 at 9:17 PM ^
I'm actually going to write a letter to Delany and send it tomorrow.
Does anyone have his email address?
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:53 PM ^
F***'d up the epic Nebraska-Oklahoma rivalry.
They split the teams into 2 different divisions, made the scheduling unpredictable, and buried the game in the middle of the season when it did occur.
When it was all said and done, Nebraska and Oklahoma played only ONE TIME in the B12 championship game.
August 23rd, 2010 at 1:54 PM ^
This is very different. It would be like the Florida-LSU game. Obviously, they aren't on the same scale, but they play every year as a protected rival. MIchigan would play OSU every year.
August 23rd, 2010 at 2:04 PM ^
Nebraska-Oklahoma went from determining who whould be the conference champion to not even determining who would play for the conference championship. It became just a "good" game in the middle of the season.
Playing it every year as a protected rivalry in the middle of the season does not make a game special on the level of The Game. FL-LSU is a great middle of the season game, but it is not a special rivalry game just because it is played every year at around the same time.
August 26th, 2010 at 4:52 PM ^
in TPTB discussions on this. He hated the BXII bteaking the NU-OK game up. Don't think he has a vote yet, but he'd be listened to given his stature and first hand experience. And he has no particular axe to grind on the divisional choices.
Michigan fans, why is this happening? Is it the media and $$ men? Are the other AD's ganging up on your two programs? Is the league just stirring the pot to get more hype for the conference by dominating CF's preseason discussion? As an "outsider" I'm ASTOUNDED this is even being seriously considered.
Wonder why ESPN doesn't do one of those fan polls on this topic, I'd bet those in support would be in the 90%+ range.
For what its worth, I hope this tradition stays unchanged.
August 23rd, 2010 at 2:08 PM ^
is to threaten to leave the Big Ten like Yost did. This is really a disaster if we're in separate divisions, especially if we do the stupid thing where only division games matter.
August 23rd, 2010 at 2:12 PM ^
They think the problem is going to be public/alumni outrage. It will be an intense firestorm, but that's the least of their problems. The main problem is the idea is not going to work.
- OSU, PSU, Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern
- Michigan, MSU, Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin
All this will do is increase Ohio State and Penn State's dominance. You're taking the two programs without in-state Big Ten rivals in the richest recruiting states that exist within the conference and isolating them in a division with a bunch of also-rans. The winner of OSU-PSU will play the "Western Division" (like having the lyrics to The Victors make sense again will somehow make everything okay) champion every year. Sure, if Michigan is good it will win the division two or three times a decade, but winning a division that includes all of the best Big Ten football programs other than OSU and PSU is not going to be easy, especially while playing OSU every year.
It's insane, but it's also reality, it would seem.
August 23rd, 2010 at 2:10 PM ^
and lost their season-ending game with their traditional rival Pitt. Instead they were assigned a faux season ending rivalry game with MSU.
Now it looks like those tables will be turned on us. Land Grant trophy anyone?
August 23rd, 2010 at 3:06 PM ^
I just reposted this further up the thread. Sorry for any confusion.
August 23rd, 2010 at 4:28 PM ^
Well, at least you received a response. I emailed him on Friday, being as polite as possible (I thanked him for his long service to the school) and got nothing.
EDIT: I did get a response from Gene Smith, OSU's AD, though:
"Dear Mr. jmblue
Thank you for your comments. I appreciate your concerns.
Sincerely,
Gene Smith
August 23rd, 2010 at 4:37 PM ^
Even more interesting, every word is spelled correctly.
August 23rd, 2010 at 8:37 PM ^
We're going to really miss this.
August 23rd, 2010 at 5:06 PM ^