2019 discussion
Yup, I’m that guy that likes to look ahead. Ron probably wouldn’t approve of this thread. Oh well. Anyway, with some young players starting to play, it got me thinking a little about next year. Quick thoughts for each position group. (Yes, a lot of hypotheticals since we don’t know who will enter draft)
QBs-Feeling very positive. Not convinced Shea will leave early, but even if he does, a RS sophomore version of McCaffrey should be ready to lead this team.
RBs- Losing Higdon is a blow, but we will have a diverse stable of backs with Evans, Charbonnet, Turner, Wilson. Plus TD sledgehammer Mason.
WRs/TEs- Loaded. Likely the strength of the team.
OL- Hopefully the group that takes the biggest step forward. Second year of Warriner, only losing JBB who is basically a placeholder until Hudson is ready anyway.
DL- Paye and Hutchinson won’t be Gary and Winovich, but they won’t be bad either. Should be strong inside with Kemp, Solomon, Dwumfour.
LBs- Bush is likely gone but we will return Ross and Gill. Question mark is whether Khaleke returns. Regardless, Don Brown is going to find some dudes, and we have recruited well at this position.
Secondary: Love the safety group with Metellus, Daxton, Hawkins, Woods, JKP. CBs could be a major strength or a huge question mark. I feel like one of the starting corners needs to return in order for us to feel comfortable. Ambry is likely going to be very good, but who would start opposite of him? It’s going to be someone very light on experience regardless. Let’s hope we get back Hill or Long and buy some time to get the young guys up to speed.
Projecting this far out is obviously not an exact science, but we will again likely have some very good talent on both sides of the ball.
Feel free to contribute, or just throw snark if thats your thing.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:43 PM ^
I don’t see Shea sticking around. The QB is not showcased in this offense so there is no reason for Shea to hang around for another year. He’s already developed and makes no sense to stay at UM to throw the ball 15 times a game.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:47 PM ^
Shea is going to throw more when we need Shea to throw more. We don’t need to have him throw 40 times when we are crushing bad teams.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:36 PM ^
We're 4 games in and Shea hasn't shown he's NFL material yet...he's calm and collected 90% of the time but that isn't gonna win you any NFL job. Not unless he starts to prove he can make difficult throws against top competition.
September 25th, 2018 at 11:20 PM ^
Jake Rudock says hi
September 26th, 2018 at 6:14 AM ^
Jake Rudock at this time in 2015 had no NFL shot. By the end he was great. We can only hope the same goes for Shea.
September 26th, 2018 at 8:37 AM ^
It's a VERY weak QB class this year, so regardless of his stats his skillset will be what is intriguing to the NFL.
September 26th, 2018 at 1:46 PM ^
Herbert is pretty attractive to a lot of teams. Haskins (ugh) is rocketing up draft boards. And Will Grier exists. It's not last year with several potential top 10 guys plus Mahomes, but guys are emerging...and pulling ahead of Patterson at this point.
September 27th, 2018 at 8:03 AM ^
Patterson has the trifecta of intelligence, physical ability and the "it" factor that the NFL values very highly. It is a most curious thing that so many Michigan fans are doubting this kid. If you do not think the NFL loves how this kid stands tough in the pocket, can extend plays and throw accurately on the run and under duress, pull the ball down and go get the first down and make all the throws...you cannot be helped. The kid is a top-shelf talent...not likely the #1 pick but high enough to make very good money for himself.
September 25th, 2018 at 11:16 PM ^
Right. Jake Ruddock went from 2nd string at Iowa to earning NFL pay because Harbaugh doesn’t know how to develop a QB in a “pro” style offense.
Shea has proven accurate with a solid arm with more to come. Are you guys serious or just fucking with us?
September 26th, 2018 at 6:23 AM ^
It's not Ruddock.
September 26th, 2018 at 10:12 AM ^
People, quit acting like Rudock was a garbage player who couldn't beat out a nobody at Iowa. First, Rudock played well at Iowa. Look up the numbers. He was already a more polished a QB than most of you ever will give credit for. Second, he got beat out by a future 3rd round NFL draft pick.
September 26th, 2018 at 2:47 AM ^
Michigan's last three games have been blowouts where Patterson is spelled sometime around the 4th quarter. So now is probably not the best time to be making this argument.
But in general, the question of being 'showcased' is not only about how many throws, but what kind of throws and decisions a QB is asked to make. The Harbaugh offense has given Patterson an opportunity to not only make the difficult throws, but to make decisive, split-second reads before he does so. If that's not showcasing talent that NFL scouts appreciate, I'm not sure what is.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:45 PM ^
And at long last a pipeline of talent in all position groups with no more major gaps from coaching transitions. We have 3 legitimate QBs even if Shea leaves. This depth is expected in Year 5 of a good program but damn it has been painful since RR and Hoke never made it that far.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:51 PM ^
Peters has a diploma after this year and has been passed by a younger player, Plan on him leaving. Gary and Bush are projected first rounders. We should get one of Hill and long back.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:59 PM ^
That is pretty much inevitable. Next year's QBs are almost certainly McCaffrey, Milton and McNamara.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:37 PM ^
Peters was injured - is he healthy and just not getting by McCaffrey? Is he still gimpy? Is he close enough to get by McCaffrey during Spring and Fall camps? What does he think about it all?
Lots of questions surrounding a player that everyone has said would be transferring for two years now. It's not fair to throw out these accusations or suggestions until we learn more later this season.
How about we just enjoy the season thats currently unfolding in front of us?
September 25th, 2018 at 11:17 PM ^
You saw a healthy Red Shirt Peters last year, Healthy Red Shirt Dylan is better. What is this "fair" crap anyway? Transfering and getting two years to start somewhere with an UM degree in pocket sounds more fair than riding pine for another year and not getting offered a RS Senior year here
the real hot take is Shea is more likely to stay than Peters
September 25th, 2018 at 9:47 PM ^
Ron approved this
September 25th, 2018 at 9:49 PM ^
Ron disproves.
September 26th, 2018 at 10:04 AM ^
Empirically
September 25th, 2018 at 9:55 PM ^
This defensive line is going to have so much depth. Don't forget about Vilain and Jeter, and there will likely be as many as three true freshmen who are good enough to contribute or even be impactful (Hinton, Smith and Ojabo, and hopefully a particular young man whose name rhymes with Jack Harrelson).
The back seven looks like it could have even more depth, judging just by the numbers. They've recruited a million DBs and lineb as clerks, and while I'm not *predicting* this, I could totally see Sims and Thomas be better starters next year than Long and Hill this year. I believe they're better athletes with higher upside.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:31 PM ^
I consider the defensive line the most important position group in college football and was actually a little worried about what we would be sending out for 2019, so the emergence of Kemp and Hutchinson has been very reassuring. It’s obviously going to be a tough adjustment losing Gary and Winovich but Paye-Kemp-Solomon-Hutchinson is a formidable starting line and there’s some good talent behind them.
I disagree on the corners though—I think we’ll be fortune to find one guy as good as Hill or Long next year if both declare, let alone two. But we may have better safeties.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:38 PM ^
My brother is on his Ojabo's football team, and said brother does not think he'll be ready for at least a year or so
September 25th, 2018 at 11:40 PM ^
Ojabo is not a first-year-starter type and Harrelson doesn't rhyme with Harrison.
September 26th, 2018 at 3:27 AM ^
He said contributor, not starter, & I'm pretty sure he was referencing Dack Squirrelbone.
September 25th, 2018 at 11:48 PM ^
The DL will theoretically be deep, but I don't think it will be amazing, if that makes any sense. I think we're fine in the interior, but I'm more worried about the DEs. Paye and Hutchinson as starters is pretty good. Besides that though, we lack experience. Villain is a huge question mark and besides that, we have a bunch of true freshmen. Unless we can pull Karlaftis, who can probably contribute immediately, the DE position worries me
September 26th, 2018 at 8:31 AM ^
I was with you until you said you think Sims and Thomas can be better than Long/Hill right away. In time, maybe. But there's a reason why Ambry doesn't play over Long/Hill right now and we haven't even seen Sims yet. Agree on their upside, just don't think we'll see them be better immediately.
September 26th, 2018 at 10:32 AM ^
I'm not predicting it, but I'm saying it's possible. And is that really that much of a stretch? Long and Hill are both Juniors right now. Thomas will be a junior next year, and he's so explosive and athletic that they've worked him into the offense despite having a boat load of weapons. And Sims is definitely a wild card but he's 6'2 and very athletic. Cornerbacks tend to reach their ceiling very early on. I don't know if it will happen but it's not out of the question.
September 26th, 2018 at 1:12 PM ^
In regards to Harrison.
I think the failure to develop Gary into a Bosa-like force at DE will hurt us in the end. It's pretty obvious that Larry Johnson is better at developing elite level talent on the defensive line and he just happens to coach at Harrison's local school. With Nick bosa certainly going in the top 5 in the next draft, they'll be able to claim early playing time too. There was a point in August that I thought we had the upper hand but as after thinking it through, I'd give OSU a 90% chance of getting him
September 25th, 2018 at 9:58 PM ^
2019 is going to come down to the offense. The defense is going to take a step back. It will probably only be good and may approach top 15 depending on how many of Hudson/Long/Hill stay.
Hence, 2019 has to be the year for the offense to be elite. It is going to have to be pass first, something we have yet to see under Harbaugh. The talent is there but we're going to need guys like DPJ/Black/Ruiz/Bredeson/Gentry/McCaffrey/ (or Patterson if he stays) to be all american level players and the tackles to be all conference in some form. It certainly could happen, but none of them are there yet.
September 26th, 2018 at 8:01 AM ^
I hate to tell you this, but you almost never see 8 all-American/all-conference quality players on a single team on a single side of the ball.
The good news is they don’t have to be that good for this offense to still be excellent.
September 25th, 2018 at 9:59 PM ^
DON'T LOOK AHEAD ... UNLESS YOU PLAN TO FAIL. STAY IN THE MOMENT AND WIN TODAY AND EVERY NEXT DAY FORWARD.
HAVE GOALS, BUT THE FUTURE WILL TAKE CARE OF ITSELF !!!
September 25th, 2018 at 10:00 PM ^
We're fans... its doesn't matter.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:02 PM ^
Other than Mineral King
September 25th, 2018 at 11:03 PM ^
Sounds like terrible advice for life, business, and anything else. Thanks, Jack Handey!
PS - were you in charge of planning for the OT position?
September 26th, 2018 at 7:35 AM ^
This is the dumbest thing I’ve read on the blog. It’s also the philosophy that guided Hoke and Borges in their QB recruiting
September 25th, 2018 at 10:05 PM ^
Don't care if Ron / others approve or disapprove, these kinds of posts are the epitome of being a fan and, assuming reasoned discourse, think this is a valid discussion giving the fact that the program has not had this amount of third-year-player talent in what, a decade? I think the bigger point is that a lot of this program's near future rides on the rest of this season, in that how this team finishes 2018 will be a catalyst for the next few years. Bush, Gary and obviously Higdon and Winovich are gone. Do Shea, Gentry, Hudson, Hill and Long all leave early? At this point, Hill seems like the best bet to leave. Shea has shown his skills and is obviously a gamer, but tough to see him getting picked in the first two rounds in April at this juncture - guys like Hebert, Lock and Haskins seem to be getting all of the hype and insert former NFL player talking head making a statement about undersized QBs here. If you're talking about Shea, Gentry, Hudson and Long all returning next year, with the kind of season and recruiting cycle that could generate, we are talking about a program 2 years from now that is much closer to reloading every year rather than the occasional rebuild ala 2017.
Having said all that, this core of Harbaugh's original recruits will always be a memorable one - the joy of seeing Devin Bush fly around the field and Rashan Gary turning the corner really are sights to behold. I thought this was a 10-2 year with losses to OSU and Wisconsin this year, with a curb-stomping of someone in a NY6 bowl - still hopeful a similar scenario plays out and very well could, OT situation will again be the albatross that sinks the season or gets remedied and that scenario happens.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:11 PM ^
Also, agree with what Brutus said above - the passing game in 2019 could and should be dynamic. Shea Patterson with those weapons, another year of Ed Warriner coaching the OL and in the same system...insert the oooh boy gif here. Probably won't reach Baker Mayfield 2017 type stats, because the Big 12 is a joke defensively, but probably won't be far off either, and the potential to rewrite quite a few Michigan passing records.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:28 PM ^
We don't throw the ball enough right now to break passing records.
September 25th, 2018 at 11:44 PM ^
Harbaugh teams are never going to be pass-first, no matter how good the passing game is.
September 26th, 2018 at 1:34 AM ^
Would say our offense with Rudock in 2015, by mid-way through the season was a pretty even split. Grbac and Henne are tied for the season TD record with 25; Navarre holds the season yardage record with 3,331...and no 2 on that list is Rudock in 2015, so yes, I would definitely say that Shea, if he returns, has a chance to break both those records in 2019
September 26th, 2018 at 1:04 AM ^
2015 had as much or more third year (by eligibility) player talent than M has this year. That's why the 2016 squad was so good and ended up getting 11 guys drafted including an absurd 7 guys in the top 4 rounds or something like that.
There are a lot of similarities between this team and the 2015 team, but the two big differences as it relates to the outlook for the following year:
1) The top end defensive talent on the 2015 team either wasn't draft eligible (Peppers) or wasn't quite projected high enough to want to leave early (Wormley, Charlton, Lewis, Glasgow, etc.) so they all returned to form an all-time defensive unit in 2016. With Gary and Bush likely gone, plus maybe Hudson and one or two of the corners, the D in 2019 won't be as good as the D in 2016 (tough to match that team).
2) The most important position on the field, QB, should be better in 2019. The second most important unit on the field, OL, should also be better than the unit in 2016. The interior should be one of the best, if not the best in the country and between senior Runyan, third year Hudson and second year Mayfield, the OTs should actually be, dare I say, a strength?
Man, just thinking about how solid the OL should be and the WR weapons he will have, I grow more confident that Shea might return. Why not come back to be a Heisman frontrunner and potential top 10 pick?
Whether the 2019 team is better than 2016 will depend on whether the better offense can make up for an inferior defense.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:06 PM ^
Jordan Anthony seems to be the early leader of the 2nd and 3rd group, on defense. He’s obviously not at Devin Bush’s level of play currently, but I think he’ll be a huge asset going forward once Bush is playing on Sundays.
September 26th, 2018 at 12:20 PM ^
Brings up an interesting Q about the LBs that I've been thinking about.
We've definitely recruited well at the position with Anthony, Singleton, and McGrone all top 100 guys waiting their turns.
I thought it was interesting then that we've been working out Haskins and VanSummeran at LB. Is that an indicator that we might have missed on some of the aforementioned guys?
I think much more likely it's that we have way too many young RBs/FBs and more on the way in 2019 such that redshirting those guys, building LB depth and then using them as potential 4th and 5th year LBs after the Anthony's and McGrone's are gone is the thinking there.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:17 PM ^
Secondary question:
If both Long and Hill left, would it be possible that Daxton could play some cb? I wouldn’t think we would pencil him in as a starting boundary corner, but maybe be the nickel guy on the field with Hawkins and Metellus?
September 25th, 2018 at 10:30 PM ^
He probably could, but watching his highlight tape I think he is definitely more leathal at safety.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:25 PM ^
Few things -
1st - I think we should just play Mich St. away again next year and just get our schedule balanced after that. This schedule is to brutal w all home or all away.
2nd - Bush is projected as a 1st or 2nd round pick so he’s leaving I would assume.
3rd - Peters is probably gone.
4th - Hudson should stay IMO, and we are gonna be thin at RB no matter how many bodies we have, Evans gets hurt and the others haven’t proved they can handle the long haul.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:28 PM ^
Offense should be good. Defense will have question marks.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:33 PM ^
Everybody come back and beat ND.
September 25th, 2018 at 10:38 PM ^
A big ace projection-
QB-
1. Patterson
2. McCaffrey
3. Milton
RB-
1. Evans
2. Turner
3. Wilson
4. Charbonnet
FB-
1. Mason
2. VanSummeren
WR1-
1. DPJ
2. Black / Bell
WR2-
1. Black
2. Collins
Slot-
1. Martin
TE-
1. Gentry
2. McKeon
3. Eubanks
LT-
1. Mayfield
2. Stueber
LG-
1. Bredeson
2. Filiaga
C-
1. Ruiz
2. Spanellis
RG-
1. Onwenu
2. Spanellis
RT-
1. Hudson
2. Honigford
Potential All Big Ten players- 7
Patterson, DPJ, Black, Gentry , Bredeson, Ruiz, Onwenu.
2019>2018 at 10 positions,all but RB .
Weakness- NONE
WDE-
1. Paye
2. Vilain
DT-
1. Kemp
2. Dwumfor
NT-
1. Solomon
2. Jeter
SDE-
1. Hutchinson
2. Hinton
WLB-
1. Singleton or
1. Gill
MLB-
1. Ross
2. Anthony
Viper/ SLB-
1. Hudson
2. Uche
3. Glasgow
CB1-
1. Long
2. Sims
CB2-
1. Thomas
2. St. Juste / Green
FS-
1. Hill
2. JKP
SS-
1. Metellus
2. Hawkins
Less big name players, but potential to be just as good as 2018. WDE depth is a little scary, all other depth is great.
A 4* in every position and two 4*s in at least 6 positions.
P-
1. Hart
2. Robbins
K-
1. Nordin
2. Moody
PR-
DPJ
KR-
Thomas
With the schedule this is Michigan's best chance for a BT championship and NC in a long long time.