Should the Big Ten Consider Removing Penn State From the Conference?

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November 6th, 2011 at 2:35 PM
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bryemye
Joined: 09/14/2009
MGoPoints: 2374
Should the Big Ten Consider Removing Penn State From the Conference?

Pretty simple question. This is the most heinous case I have seen come out of college sports that involved the entire chain of command up to the president of the university. The university's reaction to this has been whatever the word for appalling but a thousand times more is. A thousand times appaling. Writing this I'm getting nauseous.

Point being: this does not represent the values of the Big Ten or any conference but especially the Big Ten. I don't see a gray area here but I'm happy to have someone investigate to see if there is one. If things are as bad as they seem, then I don't want to be associated with that place in any way shape or form. I think there should at least be an investigation with the threat of removal present.

Thoughts?

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November 6th, 2011 at 2:35 PM | settle down (Score:5 Normal)
winterblue75
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Joined: 09/05/2009
MGoPoints: 5266

settle down

Sincerely,

Cpt. Ass-Hat

November 6th, 2011 at 2:38 PM | I don't think it works that (Score:5 Normal)
rockediny
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Joined: 08/14/2010
MGoPoints: 1401

I don't think it works that way.

"There will be blood on the field and it won't be mine." -KK

November 6th, 2011 at 3:37 PM | but... (Score:-1 Flamebait)
November 6th, 2011 at 3:57 PM | Yes (Score:3 Normal)
ijohnb
Joined: 09/21/2009
MGoPoints: 2795

Yes.

November 6th, 2011 at 4:22 PM | Nyet (Score:2 Normal)
profitgoblue
Joined: 09/01/2009
MGoPoints: 19415

Nyet

Disgruntled former moderator.  I got a lot of problems with you people!

November 6th, 2011 at 4:25 PM | If We're Going To Say "No" In Russian... (Score:1)
LSAClassOf2000
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Joined: 01/07/2011
MGoPoints: 8757

then, "Absolument non!". Wait, that's French....damnit. 

"Funny isn't it, how naughty dentists always make that one fatal mistake."

Follow the random tweets of a Michigan alum - http://twitter.com/#!/LorneEC3

November 6th, 2011 at 4:32 PM | Read the grand jury (Score:1)
ijohnb
Joined: 09/21/2009
MGoPoints: 2795

indictment, if you dare.  It reads like a prolonged institutional cover-up.

November 6th, 2011 at 2:41 PM | in order of preference: (Score:1 Normal)
Michigan Arrogance
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Joined: 06/30/2008
MGoPoints: 4300

1) Purdue

2) MSU

3) PSU

Harvard: The MICHIGAN of the East

We're not arrogant, we're just better.

November 6th, 2011 at 2:43 PM | If this happened to 40 kids (Score:1 Normal)
1 percent
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Joined: 09/09/2010
MGoPoints: 303

If this happened to 40 kids or whatever the insane number is and everyone knew, from coaches to president then sure think about it. Not sure it will happen though.

BEAT OHIO

November 6th, 2011 at 3:01 PM | While I don't think PSU (Score:5 Normal)
turd sandwich
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Joined: 01/05/2009
MGoPoints: 504

While I don't think PSU should be removed from the conference, you seriously need to think about your comment. You can't put a number on something like this. I don't care if it was one or 100 kids, it's absolutely beyond heinous regardless. You can't say "oh it was only a few kids." No that's not how it works. You can't say "oh wow they did this to 40 kids, that's too many." Just no. Sorry but for real the number shouldn't affect the decision in a case like this.

November 6th, 2011 at 3:31 PM | True but I think it is safe (Score:1 Overrated)
1 percent
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True but I think it is safe to assume someone faces more time in prison by molesting 40 kids than 1. I also think it is safe to assume the NCAA will come down harder on a program with 40 violations instead of one violation. 

I also never said oh wow they did this to 40 kids, thats too many. I said they did this to 40 kids because they face 40 counts, I have no idea how many and Im not downgrading kids victim 1-39 either.. 40 counts of anything is a lot and is an insane number in a case like this.. Molesting one child is wrong in every way. Molesting 40 kids in wrong in every way, as well, but the judicial system and NCAA tend to give harder punishment for 40 counts on anything as opposed to 1.

BEAT OHIO

November 6th, 2011 at 6:05 PM | I agree with your point.  The (Score:4 Normal)
SysMark
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Joined: 11/15/2008
MGoPoints: 5566

I agree with your point.  The issue with the number has nothing to do with the severity or vileness of the crime.  It may however say something about who must have known about it and for how long, and that has major implications for Paterno and Penn State.

November 6th, 2011 at 2:45 PM | Uhhhh, no but we should very seriously consider (Score:-1 Flamebait)
November 6th, 2011 at 3:45 PM | They should give Paterno life (Score:5 Normal)
jhackney
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MGoPoints: 18446

They should give Paterno life in prison. Which is like only 4-5 years.

November 6th, 2011 at 4:36 PM | For what? (Score:-1 Flamebait)
November 6th, 2011 at 4:42 PM | (No subject) (Score:4 Normal)
jhackney
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November 6th, 2011 at 4:56 PM | It's a bird! It's a plane! (Score:4 Normal)
Derek
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It's a bird! It's a plane! It's a DERP.

LSA, Class of 2009

November 6th, 2011 at 10:24 PM | What is your threshold for alerting law enforcement? (Score:1)
AFMich
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I KNOW I'd have handled this differently. I would have gone straght to the police.

November 6th, 2011 at 2:45 PM | No. (Score:5 Normal)
BlueDragon
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MGoPoints: 16726

No.

We might need to rename the Paterno-Stagg trophy though.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

November 6th, 2011 at 3:02 PM | Very good point. Either (Score:5 Normal)
jhackney
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Joined: 12/11/2008
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Very good point. Either change it to:

The Pederass-Stagg Trophy

or even more logical and unbiasedly better to me:

 

The Schembechler-Stagg Trophy

November 6th, 2011 at 3:11 PM | Awards, You Say... (Score:2 Informative)
LSAClassOf2000
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I am assuming that Tom Curley and Gary Schultz are now frontrunners for the Keating-Madoff Excellence In Ethics Award

"Funny isn't it, how naughty dentists always make that one fatal mistake."

Follow the random tweets of a Michigan alum - http://twitter.com/#!/LorneEC3

November 6th, 2011 at 3:33 PM | "What's a 'pederass', (Score:1)
jonvalk
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"What's a 'pederass', Walter?"

November 6th, 2011 at 3:38 PM | "Shut the fuck up Donny." (Score:3 Normal)
jhackney
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Joined: 12/11/2008
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"Shut the fuck up Donny."

November 6th, 2011 at 5:26 PM | 8yr olds, dude... (Score:2)
amphibious1
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8yr olds dude....

Florida Wolverines have dreadlocks...

November 6th, 2011 at 5:26 PM | 8yr olds, dude... (Score:2)
amphibious1
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Joined: 09/02/2009
MGoPoints: 2134

8yr olds dude....

Florida Wolverines have dreadlocks...

November 6th, 2011 at 3:33 PM | "What's a 'pederass', (Score:0 Redundant)
November 6th, 2011 at 3:41 PM | *quick cut* (Score:2 Funny)
LSAClassOf2000
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Back to you, Ken. 

"Funny isn't it, how naughty dentists always make that one fatal mistake."

Follow the random tweets of a Michigan alum - http://twitter.com/#!/LorneEC3

November 6th, 2011 at 2:46 PM | I Can Understand Your Outrage (Score:-1 Trolling)
November 6th, 2011 at 3:11 PM | Seriously dude?  Trying to (Score:5 Normal)
mGrowOld
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Seriously dude?  Trying to compare OSU's issues with tatgate to the PSU situation as it's being reported is ridiculous and significantly understates the magnitude of the alleged offenses at Penn State.

 

 

November 6th, 2011 at 5:00 PM | You are (Score:2 Normal)
ijohnb
Joined: 09/21/2009
MGoPoints: 2795

100% right.  Not to jump to conclusions (of perhaps maybe to do just that), if you read the GJ indictment, and the allegations are in deed true, this was not a "nobody" could have known situation, and the allegations are that of prolonged, to some degree visible, improper conduct on the athletic campus.  It makes you wonder about Sandusky's conduct toward other individuals connected with the program.  The kids in these reports are in some cases not that much older than incoming freshman football players.

Paterno will not be the coach at the end of this season, he may not be the coach by next weeks game.  You though SMU had its program "shut down."  This program may actually be shut down.  I am not sure if a lot of posters on here know how serious this is and is going to be.

November 6th, 2011 at 5:58 PM | Just to clarify, the victims (Score:2)
rtyler
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Just to clarify, the victims in this case were NOT older than incoming college freshman.  In at least one case, the abuse began when the victim was ten and continued for four years.  I don't think that this is what you meant, but sometimes when the victims are seen as older teens it can mitigate the blame put on the perpetrator.  These victims were definitely children.

November 6th, 2011 at 6:33 PM | Meant (Score:1)
ijohnb
Joined: 09/21/2009
MGoPoints: 2795

not that much younger.  Good catch.

November 6th, 2011 at 6:48 PM | You're right that it's a (Score:1)
maizenbluedevil
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MGoPoints: 2603

You're right that it's a different of magnitude, but Ohio and PSU are also categorically much different in my mind.

Ohio involves dishonesty and cheating....  the reality is what happened there was wrong, but no one's life is permanently fucked up as a result.

PSU on the other hand......  Man.  I read part of the grand jury report, and in 2002 a grad. assistant walked into the shower of the PSU locker room and saw Jerry Sandusky raping a 10 year old boy.  

The Ohio and PSU things are apples and oranges, the PSU thing being way, way, way worse.  They're not even in the same category.  PSU is something that goes beyond athletics and involves multiple individuals being scarred for life. 

JoPa knew about the 2002 incident.  How he is off the hook and the Athletic Director is not is something I don't understand.

Until now JoePa has been someone that I think has been well-liked by every college football fan (me at least and many I know).....  hearing him say "Come to Penn SHHHHTTATE!!!" on those BTN commercials was legendary and the man was an institution in college football.  

This whole situation is just sad.  At the very least it tarnishes his reputation....  and at the end of this it could be even worse for hiim, if he winds up being charged with or convicted of a crime in this.

But regardless of what happens to JoePa, about a dozen kids are now traumatized for life from sexual abuse. This is way worse, and way different, than what happened at Ohio.

 

CJK5H

November 6th, 2011 at 7:52 PM | This is a common misconception (Score:1 Normal)
wlvrine
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Joined: 09/25/2008
MGoPoints: 1464

 regarding the Catholic Church abuses....

Since the mid-1980s, insurance companies have offered sexual misconduct coverage as a rider on liability insurance, and their own studies indicate that Catholic churches are not higher risk than other congregations. Insurance companies that cover all denominations, such as Guide One Center for Risk Management, which has more than 40,000 church clients, does not charge Catholic churches higher premiums. "We don't see vast difference in the incidence rate between one denomination and another," says Sarah Buckley, assistant vice president of corporate communications. "It's pretty even across the denominations." It's been that way for decades ..

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2010/04/07/mean-men.html 

 

block quote fail, but the point is there is no greater percentage of priests who abuse children vs. any other profession in the world.  It is only that the Catholic church gets more press for its abuses than doctors or teachers or coaches.  Parents actually fall into the category of highest percentage of abusers.  But nobody thinks that it is  "common" for the average household to have abusive parents.

 

 

November 6th, 2011 at 7:56 PM | Let's leave religion out of it... (Score:1 Overrated)
SamGoBlue2
Joined: 06/03/2010
MGoPoints: 121

Molestations were by no means common within the Catholic Church. I don't think you realize how many priests there are and how many of them were ever accused of crimes.

Believe

Beilein

November 6th, 2011 at 2:49 PM | No (Score:1)
Steve in PA
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But I am 100% sure there should and will be a policy regarding this going forward.

 

 

November 6th, 2011 at 5:38 PM | Ah, yes, a policy! (Score:3 Normal)
MGoViso
Joined: 09/27/2009
MGoPoints: 321

That will solve all the problems going forward! If only there had been a policy before this!

November 7th, 2011 at 11:35 AM | Day late and dollar short (Score:1)
Steve in PA
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The B10 really has no jurisdiction in this matter, but if they had a mechanism in place before hand they would be in a position to act now.  Pa state law requires allegations be reported to law enforcement, B10 could make this apply across all schools and provide a sanction mechanism if that doesn't occur even if it is not state law.

Unfortunately, we live in a society where many have to be explicitly instructed what is the correct response for an action that has occurred.  How many times are we going to hear about sexual assaults that were handled internally, for example?  

Some things are beyond the scope of Athletic Departments.

 

 

November 6th, 2011 at 2:50 PM | No. (Score:1)
Denarded13
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MGoPoints: 18

But maybe a ban from the Rose bowl/champ game for a couple of years.

UofM '15

November 6th, 2011 at 2:58 PM | Would there be any NCAA (Score:2 Normal)
goldenmug8
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Joined: 03/23/2010
MGoPoints: 377

Would there be any NCAA penalties? I mean it's against the law for sure, but thats not against the NCAA rules persay? 

Ex. MSU players beating everyone up in a dorm, get jailtime. MSU itself doesn't face any discipline

Class of 2008 and 2009

November 6th, 2011 at 2:53 PM | Take a breather (Score:0 Normal)
November 6th, 2011 at 2:55 PM | A REALLY silly question OP. (Score:2 Normal)
wolverine1987
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MGoPoints: 2928

I mean please. Prosecute anyone that kept quiet about it, fire them if proven guilty. And that is that. Nothing further required.

"Everyone gets dumped Gabe. Let me give you some advice: a little coverup on your Adams Apple will make it appear smaller. Which will make you appear less like a transvestite." 

November 6th, 2011 at 5:10 PM | spot on wolverine1987 (Score:1)
tommyz
Joined: 05/25/2010
MGoPoints: 123

spot on wolverine1987

November 6th, 2011 at 2:55 PM | It's A Criminal Investigation, Sure... (Score:1)
LSAClassOf2000
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Joined: 01/07/2011
MGoPoints: 8757

...but, no, don't punish a whole athletic department because of a few assholes.

"Funny isn't it, how naughty dentists always make that one fatal mistake."

Follow the random tweets of a Michigan alum - http://twitter.com/#!/LorneEC3

November 6th, 2011 at 3:27 PM | It'd be punishing everyone at (Score:1)
enlightenedbum
Joined: 06/06/2009
MGoPoints: 1865

It'd be punishing everyone at the school.  Big Ten is a HUGE research alliance.  Check PSU's academic rankings in the last 20 years, dramatic improvement there as well.

November 6th, 2011 at 2:55 PM | No. (Score:2)
jhender85
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Joined: 10/25/2008
MGoPoints: 1389

This is pretty much a non-discussion. No reason to punish the rest of PSU and the rest of the B1G by removing them from the conference. In a situation like this, it's best for Delany to get completely out of the way so the NCAA can handle any and all punishments accordingly (hopefully).

November 6th, 2011 at 2:57 PM | While they're at it they (Score:-1 Flamebait)
November 6th, 2011 at 2:57 PM | What a dumb post (Score:2 Normal)
I Luv TDs
Joined: 01/03/2009
MGoPoints: 53

What a dumb post

November 6th, 2011 at 5:43 PM | Yes, but this one was (Score:1 Normal)
mgobluebraelow
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Joined: 08/20/2010
MGoPoints: 566

Yes, but this one was informative.

November 6th, 2011 at 3:06 PM | No! (Score:0 Normal)
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