Ranking Big Ten Defenses
I was surprised to see the top of the half of Big Ten Defenses are pretty solid across the board. Here are the current Big Ten Rankings in Total Defense (with Total Defense National Ranking in ()), and AP National Rank last. I'm surprised to see the opening line against NW given that we will see two top 5 defenses going against similarly mediocre offenses. But surprised to see that a team with both total offense and total defense rakings in the bottome have of the entire FBS still ranked as high as #4.
TOTAL DEFENSE:
1. Michigan (2) #18
2. Northwestern (5) #13
3. Wisconsin (t11) NR
4. Ohio State (14) #1
5. Penn St. (15) NR
6. Iowa (19) #22
7. Illinois (21) NR
8 Minnesota (26) NR
9. MSU (61) #4 <-- what?? (ranked 86th in total offense)
10. Rutgers (78) NR
11. Purdue (96) NR
12. Nebraska (101) NR
13. Maryland (109) NR
14. Indiana (114)
October 4th, 2015 at 4:32 PM ^
MSU missing Nardawg. Not really surprising. Not to mention they don't have an NFL caliber corner/safety this year like they did prior years.
October 4th, 2015 at 7:32 PM ^
I'm sure both Meyer and Dantonio have spent a couple of long evenings looking out their windows pining for their long lost coordinators.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:44 PM ^
Same situation as last year - around week 7-8, 8 of the top 25 defenses in the country were from the Big 10. The benefit of having offenses as awesome as Minnesota, Maryland, Rutgers, Illinois, PSU, etc in the conf along with playing a lot of MAC teams.
I wrote about this during the summer
http://mgoblog.com/diaries/are-big-10-defensive-stats-inflated-bad-offe…
ACC defenses are similarly inflated by a boatload of crap QBs and offenses.
You should list the Big 10 offenses in the OP as well. We only have two in the top 25 in the country and 3 in the top 45 in the country. Only 4 in the top 65 in the country. It's a bad conf for offense.
- #18 Indiana
- #25 Nebraska
- #33 OSU
- #46 Rutgers
This is a beautiful symbiotic relationship. (I am shocked at MSU's offensive output by the way) #86
- #68 Ill
- #70 Purdue
- #72 Iowa
- #77 Michigan
- #79 NW
- #80 Wisconsin
- #86 MSU
- #112 Minn
- #114 MD
- #116 PSU
Last year the Big 10 finished with only 3 offenses in the top 50 in the country - OSU, MSU, and Wisc. These year MSU and Wisc are below par of that so we're counting on Rutgers and Nebraska I guess for explosive offenses... heh.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:05 PM ^
True, a lot of it has been built up on MAC schools. But the same goes for all those SEC teams playing FCS or Sun Belt schools. And the top two defense, us and Northwestern, have played real teams. Us with BYU and Utah and NW with Stanford and Duke. So at least at the top end, especially this early in the season, those defenses seem legit.
October 4th, 2015 at 7:24 PM ^
It is funny you say that because when I post that data in week 10 the response is "how do you know Big 10 defenses aren't just great?" (i.e. the reason for the bad offensive statistics are due to the Big 10 defenses) I post it now and we say its due to the non conf teams. So we can't have it both ways.
In week 5 we see those horrible offensive statistics without the negative effects of playing the "elite Big 10 defenses". Those bad offensive statistics are being racked up vs similarly bad opponents that the defenses are feasting upon so its difficult to say offenses that struggle vs non conf fodder are any good.
Also UM has probably played a tougher non conf than most in the Big 10 - peeps like PSU's and Iowa's are laughable.
By the way i do think generally 3-4 Big 10 defenses are pretty damn good. And 1-2 is probably elite every year (could be UM's turn to be one of those 1-2) There are a lot of other defenses once you get past defense #4 or so who are assisted a lot by the offenses.
:)
October 4th, 2015 at 7:41 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 7:53 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 5:05 PM ^
At this point though, the B1G offenses haven't tainted the rankings too much as we've just started conference play. Right now Michigan has played more Pac12 teams than B1G teams.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:07 PM ^
Still...when you compare this to almost any Big XII team, our defenses generally look superior. They just don't get stops in that league.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:10 PM ^
game and the teams at the top have played two of the toughest non-conference schedules in the country. Aren't we at #1?
October 4th, 2015 at 6:45 PM ^
Meet egg.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:37 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 6:06 PM ^
Almost 2500 tix available.
October 4th, 2015 at 7:34 PM ^
Don't think you understand...blueday is going to buy up all of the tickets on the market. He really means that no Sparty will sit in his seats.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:38 PM ^
Eh.. They beat Oregon and it put them in the top 5. Now they're being exposed and they're starting to slip. If they go undefeated, they deserve to be in the playoff. If they lose, the poll will take care of itself.
October 5th, 2015 at 9:42 AM ^
MSU started the year in the top 5, actually.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:41 PM ^
We are five game into our season and our defense looks very solid. As much as I would like to celebrate, I'm going to wait until we play NW and MSU before I allow my emotions to run wild.
I believe Harbaugh and his staff will be game changers. It is obvious that this team is well coached.
I have been guilty of premature celebrations too often since Carr left, and with the competition ramping up a lot over the next two weeks, we will know where things stand.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:43 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 4:52 PM ^
This does feel different, yes. But I'd rather wait a few more weeks to see how the D performs before getting too excited. Not that I don't love what they've done so far. Keep it up!
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
October 4th, 2015 at 7:45 PM ^
Hell, we were in deep shit after we barely survived UMass two weeks earlier. We had to hang on at home for a 42-37 win, giving up 450 yards to the Minutemen in the process. That game foretold doom.
Five years later, RR still doesn't have a defense.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:59 PM ^
Masking a terrible defense.
We have an elite defense now. And the offense, even when it seems bad...put up 31 and 28 in its last two games. In fact, 17-35-28-31-28 isn't horrible by any stretch for a prostyle offense.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:13 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 6:34 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 7:27 PM ^
It's not even an argument IMO. Elite defenses show up every week; elite offenses have their 1-2 brain fart weeks every year. In many ways this is shaping up a lot like MSU's Rose Bowl year where they started out of the polls after 7-6 2012 and then worked their way up week in and week out as they found solutions (Cook didnt grab the QB job until ND, Bullough was the RB unlike they found Langford etc). Of course they had some big wins later in the year so to continue to parallel them we need to do the NW, MSU, OSU wins etc. But thru game 5 we have the "shoulda coulda win on the road (them vs ND, us vs Utah) and then a dominating defense mixing with a ehhh offense. Their offense also took off in the last 3-4 games if I remember correctly as the OL gelled and Langford found himself and Cook took a jump.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:48 PM ^
We don't have a elite defense. We have a good defense that hasn't played anybody to expose our weaknesses which are team speed,Linebacker play and opposite corner play. The offenses we've played so far are marginal at best. I think we should hold off on words like "elite" till we actually do something. A elite defense would have won the Utah game for us. A really good defense is what I think we have.
October 4th, 2015 at 6:29 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 9:42 PM ^
What's great about this site is when we play a team with a good offense and they isolate our linebackers one on one will be exposed the same turds with smart ass replies will disappear and pretend like it didn't happen. It's year one and we do have weakness no big deal we're still a 9-10 win team with a few good bounces. We've played nobody matter of fact if you look at UNLV,Oregon State and Maryland they're some of the worst offensive football teams I have ever seen.
October 4th, 2015 at 10:21 PM ^
That's awesome, Tex. The worst you have ever seen? Only you can stop hyperbole. I predict that you will soon disappear.
October 4th, 2015 at 11:30 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 6:20 PM ^
What team are you watching? I sit and watch every game with two or three starters on the 97 team who say the same thing. So are they wrong champ? Are they off on their observation? James Ross runs a 4.8 40yd dash that is not fast for a linebacker. Watch the Utah game when our linebackers got isolated against backs. Morgan and Bolden neither one of them are playing at a high level they're just benefitting from the fact that our front guys are getting a good enough push that it's messing up teams blocking schemes. We're a slow defense if you don't think so than that says all I need to know about your football knowledge. With the exception of Peppers and Lewis we don't have any real speed. It's not miserary telling it how it easy. Watch the tape consider who we've played and than tell me you're 100percent sure we're all that and a bag of chips. I seen us overblow how good we're going to be for the last 7yrs. I don't want to see it again. Jimmy is doing miracles with the little bit of talent we have on offense and the solid players we have on defense why does it have to be any more than that?
October 4th, 2015 at 6:40 PM ^
has. The opposite side corners have been tested and look just fine. We've played a ton of dime and no one in the secondary has been exposed. Going into the season, we probably would have said secondary depth and the pass rush were the main weaknesses. This defense may not be elite, but they've played like they are since the first game. And they only gave up 17 points to a very good team on the road even then.
October 4th, 2015 at 6:45 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 7:05 PM ^
I'd call Utah marginal but point taken Michigan has not faced a truly great offense yet.
October 4th, 2015 at 7:31 PM ^
We'll see on the LBs. While I agree they have issues on the edge remember - WE PLAY IN THE BIG 10. About 2 teams left can challenge those LBs. It wont be Northwestern, Minnesota, PSU, Rutgers etc! So it might be an issue but not one that would be exploited much as in the P12 or B12.
Same for the "opposite CB" issue - only 3 teams will really test that and maybe a 4th (PSU). Minn, Rutgers, NW etc are not going to. Stribling looks good vs the big dudes of BYU - outside of Indiana, MSU, OSU I dont see a lot of WRs that are going to cause Stribling/Clark issues. PSU is the wildcard - depends which Hack shows up, PTSD or not.
October 4th, 2015 at 7:47 PM ^
October 4th, 2015 at 9:44 PM ^
Check and see were those teams are rated in total offense. None of those teams have a good offense matter of fact I don't believe any of them are rated higher than maybe 60 in total offense.
October 4th, 2015 at 10:26 PM ^
October 5th, 2015 at 11:23 AM ^
BYU - #56 Offensive S&P+
Utah - #43
Oregon St - #94
UNLV - #111
October 4th, 2015 at 5:04 PM ^
Yup, all of this. 4-0 in 2009. 5-0 in 2010. 6-0 in 2011. 6-1 in 2013, with the "1" coming in 4OT in Happy Valley (although some of the wins were also extremely jankety). Every one of these years the hype train and the "Is Michigan 'back'?" media chatter went into overdrive, before hitting a brick wall/reality check named MSU each and every time. I would think my posting history bears out that I loathe Mark Dantonio as much as anyone here, but his team is always ready to play Michigan no matter how they may have looked in the weeks leading up, so I am not counting a single chicken yet. I expect the defense to continue to do what it does both of the next two weeks. I know Northwestern's defense is also very good, but if I don't see at least some signs of offensive improvement in what should be a hard-fought game next week I will not be as confident as I'd like to be about the 17th.
October 4th, 2015 at 5:22 PM ^
I agree that we can't count our chickens before they hatch, but this time is different.
Under RR and Hoke we would often struggle in games that shouldn't have been a struggle. This defense has shut down opponents in a way that is quite remarkable.
We are also in Dantonio's head. Driving home from work I was listening to Dantonio's radio show and he was speaking about a current players dad (or grandfather) that had also played at MSU and all he mentioned about that former player's career was that he had victories over Michigan. Who does that?
I highly doubt Harbaugh would introduce a past player and the only thing he would mention is that the former player had victories against MSU. He is in full little brother complex mode.
October 4th, 2015 at 8:04 PM ^
There was hardly any "hype train" two years ago. Akron and UConn took care of that.
October 4th, 2015 at 8:59 PM ^
Those would be among the "extremely jankety" wins to which I referred, yes. But the hype train WAS full speed ahead after Notre Dame, and there were many around here who thought games like Akron were symptoms of a brief ebb, minor problems that were going to work themselves out and the team would somehow get it together in time for the games that mattered. I agree for 2013 that by the time of the State game such hope had mostly dwindled but that game would once again vaporize however much of it remained.
October 4th, 2015 at 9:48 PM ^
Our fan base is full of great people but they are also one of the most delusional groups in the country when it comes to us. We're a good team and we're better than what we were under Hoke and Rich Rod no doubt. But we really haven't played anybody yet except BYU who had a freshman Quarterback and they were traveling across the country after playing three really hard games to start with. They were do for a letdown. Problem is you can't explain that to 3/4ths of the people on message boards cause they see us beating nobodies and want to proclaim us back. When we beat MSU or OSU I will agree that we're on the way back. But till than I am still cheering each victory but I am not going to talk like we have elite talent on defense when the truth is we have a weakness and good teams will expose it.
October 4th, 2015 at 10:26 PM ^
"But we really haven't played anybody yet except BYU who had a freshman Quarterback and they were traveling across the country after playing three really hard games to start with."
We have also played highly-ranked Utah. Don't let that stop you from climbing up on your soapbox again though.
October 5th, 2015 at 9:47 AM ^
Yeah and we lost to Utah and if you watch the game if the one kid wouldn't have made two dumb personel foul penalties they would have beat us by 20 points or more. I am not on a soap box I am keeping it real. You would have thought after Rich Rod and Hoke our fan base would stay humble till we actually did something but we're right back to being arrogant.
October 5th, 2015 at 1:02 AM ^
Obviously, lots of teams perform to the level of Michigan's defense against "nobodies."
Here are all of the games so far this year where a team has held their opponent to less than 125 yards:
As of this posting, there's an Auburn / Louisville game on the list with zero plays, so we can safely throw that out. There are 15 others. Here are the teams that have done it twice:
Boston College (vs. Howard and Maine), Pittsburgh (at Akron and at Virginia Tech), and Michigan. 7 of the 9 others are against I-AA schools, and then there's San Diego St. vs. Fresno St. and Alabama vs. ULM.
Regardless of how you feel about Maryland, the best two performances on this list are Pitt (bet you know who coaches them) and Michigan.
Of course, we all know that counting stats can be misleading. Here's less than 2.5 yards per play:
We get almost all of the original list, plus a few more -- Boise State over Hawaii and Minnesota vs Kent State are the only two that involve two I-A teams. So, that pretty much reinforces the first list.
Of course, the true bread-and-butter of defense is preventing points from being scored. Here's all of the shutouts so far this season, sorted by school:
Teams that have shut out two I-A opponents: Wisconsin (Hawaii & Miami NTM) and Michigan. Northwestern (Minnesota & Eastern Illinois), Boise State (Hawaii & Idaho State) and Appalachian State (@ Old Dominion and Howard) have shut out one I-A and one I-AA opponent. (Also: Hawaii has been shut out three times. They are, however, undefeated in games in which they score).
Finally, one last comparison without a link:
Utah: 393.5 yards total offense / 337 yards against Michigan / 412.3 vs all others / -75.3 difference
Oregon St: 338.3 / 138 / 405 / -267
UNLV: 378.4 / 235 / 414.3 / -179.3
BYU: 388.2 / 105 / 459 / -354
Maryland: 332.4 / 105 / 389.3 / -284.3
So, Michigan opponents are averaging about 232 fewer yards when they play Michigan than when they play anyone else.
...
Maybe -- just maybe -- there is a qualitative difference between this year's Michigan team and those of past years.
October 5th, 2015 at 9:59 AM ^
Oregon State is 123 in total offense
BYU is number 62
UNLV is number 68
Utah is 108
Maryland is 95
On average that comes to 95. How many teams have played offenses that lowly rated.
Stats from the Utah game last year Utah had 205 passing and 81yds rushing
Stats from Utah this year 210 passing and 127yds rushing.
I can post stats to that show my point. I am not saying we're bad or not being a debbie downer. All I am trying to do is keep it real. We have a good defense but it's not been tested yet by anybody. Utah the number 108 offense in America put up 337 yards against us.Will know more about our defense when we play OSU,MSU and Indiana. All of those teams have athletes on offense.
October 5th, 2015 at 1:28 PM ^
As has been pointed out, games against Michigan are skewing their offensive stats. Remove Michigan and see where they fall (which J. has done). That will provide a truer picture of opponent strengths.
October 5th, 2015 at 10:01 AM ^
BYU has averaged 30 points and 459 yards of offense in four of their games. They got 0 points and 105 yards of offense in the one against Michigan. That's not a letdown, that's a beatdown. I take nothing away from Michigan's defense. My concern for the next two games is solely on the offense. Judging by the downvotes I guess that criticism is too harsh for some of the people here.
October 4th, 2015 at 4:43 PM ^
Michigan, Florida and Bama have the three best defenses in the country this year.
That's insane as a Michigan fan to think we're back to the point where we're equal or better than elite SEC defenses.
Numbers are numbers...it depends on who you play and what kind of offense they run. Michigan always had better defenses than they really had in the past because they played in the B1G. In the Pac 12 and Big 12, even the bad teams had solid spread offenses that would hurt your defensive numbers.
Not this year...Michigan's defense is right there with EVERY other elite defense in the country. That to me is AWESOME.