OT: Untold: Johnny Football Documentary on Netflix
The "Untold:" series on Netflix has become my favorite series of sports documentaries of the past couple years. I am extremely impressed by the production of this series and the approach they seem to take. The first season was highlighted by, in my opinion, The Malice at the Palace installment, and last year I enjoyed the one on Manti Te'o.
With the upcoming release of "Swamp Kings" which I imagine will not look charitably on Urban Meyer's Florida teams, the documentary on Johnny Manziel was released this week, and I had the chance to watch it last night.
First off, I remember obviously how big Johnny Football was in college, but being that a decade has passed, I really forgot what a phenomenon the "Johnny Football"-time was, and also how incredibly spectacular he was as the QB for A&M. I feel the documentary did a good job of telling basically the entire story of Manziel from High School through his failure in the NFL. Manziel provides probably 50% of the on-screen discussion and I think he comes across as pretty honest about everything. Looking back at the amount of money he missed out on due to the restrictions of profiting off your own name, image, and likeness. Manziel would have probably pulled in $5 million dollars his last year at A&M, but instead he went rogue and made a fraction of that. The whole financial side of this story really highlights how much the NCAA was screwing over the student athletes for forever up until about 5 minutes ago. A&M's improvements in facilities, coaching salaries, and overall brand recognition would not have been possible without Manziel. Kevin Sumlin is tens of millions of dollars richer because of Manziel. While the current structure of NIL does have a "wild west" feel to it, I much prefer this to what was going on previously.
Overall thoughts on the documentary was that Manziel was (and still is) a partyer who happened to be good at football. Seeing him at 30 now, he does look better than he did 5 years ago, but he has put some hard miles on his mind and body. He seems content and in-fact happy with his current situation in life. It doesn't appear that he has any regrets about how his NFL career went. I still wonder if the guy will ever really "grow up." One fact that really stood out to me was the fact that him and his buddy concocted the whole "he came from oil money" narrative. While it is quite obvious that Manziel grew up in a nice upper-middle class community, he was not a child of immense wealth. I remember the "oil money" narrative being spoken as gospel. Definitely makes you wonder what other contrived narratives the sports media buys hook, line, and sinker.
It is worth an hour and a half watch to relive the Johnny Football phenomenon and you get to learn a little more about all that was going on in that time period at A&M, in college football, and in Manziel's personal life. What were everyone's thoughts on this installment in the Untold series? And what are your expectations for "Swamp Kings"?
August 10th, 2023 at 9:01 AM ^
Based on his type of play and what made him so successful at the position, I'm not convinced Manziel could have had a lasting NFL career even if he had been straight edge the entire time. His off-field approach was akin to his on-field - a wild ride.
His tenure at TAMU was a great one, I'll always go back and watch him beat Bama's ass every now and then.
My biggest hope for him is that he uses his clearly brilliant mind for good, utilizes some therapy, and has a great next chapter of his life. I think he'll find that his adult life has much more to offer, and he has much more to offer, than Johnny Football.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:02 AM ^
As a Cleveland Brown season ticket holder I cannot begin to tell you how insane things were here when Johnny Football was part of the team. They could make a five part mini-series on his time with the Browns and I assure you nobody would believe over half of it.
I was one of his biggest fans and was beyond pumped when the drafted him and then when he got his first start against the Bengals. I could not believe how terrible he looked in that game (we got shut out 24-0) and it was only later that we found out he didnt even know the plays! Watching film wasnt the only thing he didnt do here - he also never bothered to learn the playbook.
What a waste of talent.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:17 AM ^
I can't bring myself to watch it, I still hate him too much. I did not want to draft him, and I was at that fucking Bengals game. We left before halftime.
A friend was out of town for work to have a meeting with a counterpart who played for A&M. He said Manziel was so hungover for most games he was doing blow in the locker room. His reputation was readily available which is why most teams had him off their draft boards completely. That doesn't even factor in his obvious physical size limitations.
Only the combo of Haslam/Farmer could do something that stupid, then actually force him to start when the whole coaching staff knew the asshole didn't even know the plays. I'm surprised Joe Thomas didn't demand a trade right then and there. Kyle Shanahan was smart enough to say get me the fuck away from these people.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:28 AM ^
I think his size and style of play had a lot of people concerned with his potential in the NFL. Add the off-field stuff and most wouldn't touch him. Style of play wouldn't be as much of a concern today.
August 10th, 2023 at 2:20 PM ^
If he had Tom Brady’s brain he would likely have had a great pro career.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:34 AM ^
Now that you mention it, “do coke and play football” EXACTLY captures Manziel’s playing style!
August 10th, 2023 at 9:21 AM ^
I wonder how much he thought the backyard, sandlot, improvising football style of play that he so clearly excelled at in college would just seamlessly translate over to the NFL, and with that, learning, the playbook was (to him) essentially a waste of time.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:41 AM ^
There are a few things I always agreed with Colin Cowherd about. And his take that NFL qb's had to be the most disciplined, smartest and hardest working on the team to be the leader everyone respected was dead on. College guys with nfl talent get away with just being better. Hence, you could see Johnny Football all over the Bama film right. Just better, could make things happen and the uncanny ability to see the entire field and wing it 40yds down field, hit the rec in stride, td.
His personality was larger than life party guy we all know. His athletic ability let him be that guy and the big man on campus. I don't think for a moment he makes it as far as he did if NIL were part of the deal. We will never know but with NIL contracts comes expectations as well. NIL money would have gave him even larger access to the party life which was already destructing everything even in college. Forget the nfl crap show his life was when he actually got money.
The fact he never knew the play book and had the wild success he did tells me how good he cold be. But if he did learn the playbook and learned to operate in that would take the wrecklessness away, but would increase his accuracy. His NFL stats weren't horrible but they weren't good either. They definitely weren't leading any NFL team to the post season. Hard to say but he had an IT factor that works incredibly well in college but not the NFL.
August 10th, 2023 at 10:53 AM ^
I dont think he would have been successful in the NFL anyway, he had the best offensive line in college football in 2012 and some of the best receivers, he had all kinds of time to improvise and throw up prayers which would never happen in the NFL.
August 10th, 2023 at 11:42 AM ^
I thought at the time that maybe the CFL would be a good place for Manziel—it's always seemed to me to be a looser, more wide open, less-scripted version of the NFL.
So I did a quick search to find evidence to support this brilliant notion of mine:
LOL. What a fuckup. I'll be very surprised if he makes it to the age of 50.
August 10th, 2023 at 11:43 AM ^
never bothered to learn the playbook
My impression of him was that he loved to play schoolyard football, running around and making crazy plays, and getting all the attention because of it. Tate Forcier was a little like this as well.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:33 PM ^
I still think Tate could have been a very successful collegiate quarterback if he'd played for a school that didn't care if he went to class or not.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:05 PM ^
I wish Tate's head was screwed on a little tighter ... he could have been a helluva fun QB to watch.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:31 PM ^
I guess you'd probably know better here than anyone else would, but.... when Manziel was drafted there was famously an ESPN story quoting Haslam as saying that a random rambling homeless dude convinced him to draft Johnny Football. I always figured there that was somewhat hyperbole (even though the quote IIRC was from Haslam himself) and that people just picked up that story and ran with it for the LOLBrowns memes, but I gotta say that part of me now thinks that that is legit literally what happened only because it's Jimmy fkn Haslam.
August 10th, 2023 at 1:55 PM ^
I went to my first Browns game in 1953. I went to every home game from1956 through 1966----when I came to Ann Arbor, and went to many games in Cleveland thereafter. I remained a Browns fan--suffering--until Manziel. I was dispirited that they drafted the guy, especially after the idiotic Weeden choice. Then came Watson. I became a Lions fan and plan to never look back.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:06 AM ^
I thought it was pretty decent, He is not remorseful at all and I don't think his family is helping him from what i've seen in the documentary. Dad seems like more of a buddy than an actual father. He acted like his rise to fame was crazier than all the other college players who delt with it and came out fine. He still is making excuses at 30. "Win or Lose we booze" was pretty funny tho, Not gonna lie.
I don't have high hopes for swamps kings because they don't really get into the dirt enough, They just flirt with it. Swamp kings has the potential to be the best documentary in a while if they got the right people to interview.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:08 AM ^
Agree that he would have made a fortune in NIL if he had the opportunity along with Bush, Tebow, Vince. Definitely going to check this out.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:17 AM ^
I loved the piece. It gave an honest look into a kid that loved playing football, loved having the closeness of having a team around him, but was not the "first in, last out" guy during practice and the offseason that most guys are. The kid lived the Varsity Blues movie through his time in the NFL, and it wasn't until he was around professionals that he realized that wasn't going to fly any more.
My biggest takeaway was how quickly he wrote his buddy off that literally ran a business for him through his times at aTm. I almost felt bad for the guy, he's like here I am dedicating every waking minute to this dude and then someone probably came in and said "hey you need to distance yourself from this guy since he was so tied into the payments" and Johnny wrote him off. It was talked about briefly, then his friend didn't make an appearance in the film again. Manziel did not touch on that subject.
Either way, great film and I agree it's a great continuation of the series. Malice at the Palace definitely hooked me.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:17 AM ^
Doesn't everything die at last, and too soon?
Tell me, what is it you plan to do
With your one wild and precious life?
not spending any more of it on a fratboy douche like johnny manziel, that's for damn sure.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:19 AM ^
faked drug tests, sold autographs for money (but hamburgers right?), was going to lie about his dad being in the hospital to avoid a drug test at the combine. Never won the SEC, never won the division. Lost 9 combined games his sophomore and junior year. He fishes for sympathy the whole show even though he put in zero work and had everything handed to him from the beginning, but he couldn't stay sober.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:26 AM ^
Swamp Kings… I hope the tell the story behind the story.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:34 AM ^
I thought Mel Kiper's "do not draft in 1st round warning" was pretty spot on and how the Brown's got hoodwinked into taking him is pretty amazing.
Also, it definitely highlights how desperate Texas A&M was to have anything positive happen on the football filed. Kind of the ultimate example of how a fan base can start worshiping the Kool Aid Man when it is pretty obvious the Kool Aid is bad.
I remember at the time, as was mentioned above, constantly wondering why the nation was obsessed with a QB that lost that many games.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:45 AM ^
He was no Johnny Unitas, that's for sure
August 10th, 2023 at 12:08 PM ^
Exactly. There's only one "Johnny Football" and he played decades ago for the Baltimore Colts.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:48 PM ^
Now that’s a haircut you can set your watch to.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:55 AM ^
Pretty far off-topic, but it's in the main post, so:
On the mail-it-in scale (with 0 = full dedication and 10 = worst possible effort), how would you score Sumlin's stint at the University of Arizona? I'd give it 8 or 9 at least.
August 10th, 2023 at 1:15 PM ^
Kevin Sumlin might be the worst college football coach of all time. I'll never forget the time his team was up by 30-some points and ended up losing due to the wretched combo of a no-huddle offense and a prevent defense.
August 10th, 2023 at 9:57 AM ^
Crime in Sports did an episode on this twat as well. Well worth a listen.
August 10th, 2023 at 10:11 AM ^
I think there are similarities between him and Ryan Leaf. However, where I think Leaf was a obviously too immature to handle being a quarterback in the NFL, had some issues and made a bunch of bad decisions, even after trying to turn his life around initially, he eventually got himself together. He does a good on the Sirius College Football station. Manziel just seems like an overall douchebag though. I have not seen the documentary though.
August 10th, 2023 at 10:47 AM ^
Leaf was very obviously not mature and ready to lead an NFL franchise, and that part got to him. You can point to a lot of Leaf's issues after leaving the NFL due to his regret and anger with himself for failing. It took him a long time and a lot of bad decisions in life, but it seems he is at peace and in a good place.
Johnny doesn't seem to give 2 shits about being a flameout in the NFL. His issues were never due to being upset at himself for failing, they were with him being a perpetual child mentally and behaviorally.
August 10th, 2023 at 10:36 AM ^
I watched it last night too, and also really enjoyed it. I may have missed it, but i wonder what he is currently doing? He seemed to be living fairly well off.
Also, the oil money thing.... people taking a similar story and running with it. It reminds me of how a 'popular' person on this board can have and share a 'bad' opinion, and then 75% of this board runs with it as gospel/their own opinion moving forward. Most people, just like the media, are sheep.
August 10th, 2023 at 1:17 PM ^
Doesn't he play in a league with Twitch influencers?
August 10th, 2023 at 10:51 AM ^
My MGoWife watched it with me as well and she made some pretty good points. Her football knowledge grows every year; being married to a season ticket holder and a HS coach kind of have left her no choice. She remembers vaguely "Johnny Football" but not to any extent like all of us did. She is a big fan of Blake Corum. She thinks he is such a good athletic role model as to how to maximize the natural abilities you've been given, and give 100% to that.
She said "isn't it crazy that Blake Corum probably has like 3% body fat, probably eats drinks and sleeps football, and probably hasn't had an unhealthy food in 4 years. Meanwhile this skinny little white guy can drink a fifth of jager, do coke, and not study anything and he was the best player in football it seems?"
August 10th, 2023 at 5:24 PM ^
He definitely didn't play school at TAMU
August 10th, 2023 at 11:20 AM ^
He liked football as long as it wasn't work.
Most guys like that flame out by HS. He had enough talent to be one of the best QBs in college football without it.
... but eventually he reached a level where the guys had as much talent, and were willing to work obsessively at it.
August 10th, 2023 at 11:28 AM ^
The Manti one felt like a Norte Dame production, I lasted about 15 minutes. I wanted more shame and apology I guess. What started as him being duped then seemed to turn into an absurd plot line that ND and NBC used to further their own agendas, while a lot of people knew all along but kept quiet. I guess there wasn’t a real victim other than them making America believe the story and feeling bad for his fake loss.
August 10th, 2023 at 11:50 AM ^
The worst part about that one was the opening scene when they sit down ND’s Athletic Director, and the first thing out of his mouth is basically “let me explain to you how important Notre Dame is to college football” which was the most ND statement of all time.
August 10th, 2023 at 11:58 AM ^
Been meaning to watch it, but I dislike his public persona and behavior so much that it hasn't been a top priority. Thanks for the preview, this makes me more interested.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:04 PM ^
I thought it was an entertaining watch, but I came away with an even worse perception of Manziel than I had before. From the looks of it, he didn't have a whole lot of positive mentors or people to hold him accountable, but at some point everyone has to make the choice to grow up and at least TRY to make better decisions.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:38 PM ^
To an extent I think we are all a product of circumstance. His particular circumstance was being a kid coming from a family that never seemed to hold him to account for anything, and who also happened to be a hypertalented and dynamic athlete. That is two worlds full of enablers colliding to create an environment that never said no or questioned anything he did. I can't say I would have been much different if put in a similar situation from birth.
August 10th, 2023 at 12:49 PM ^
I don't think Manziel was ever going to work out in the pros long-term but he probably could have been a backup in the NFL. But you're absolutely right that he made A&M and co. millions of dollars and it sort of sucks he never had a chance to cash in on that. A&M has won more than 10 games exactly once in the past 25 years and that was Manziel's Heisman season. Kevin Sumlin continues to be gainfully employed because he had a really good offense with Manziel that one year. It's sort of crazy how much he accomplished in such a short time.
August 10th, 2023 at 1:00 PM ^
Really enjoyed watching him play at A&M. Never been one to care about off the field antics. I enjoy entertaining football and he certainly was that.
August 10th, 2023 at 2:11 PM ^
It was absolutely interesting. There were a couple parallels that I experienced in college that resonated with me. Untold definitely provided a different narrative for me in regards of Johnny Football. The kid was a lost puppy when he struck stardom, almost like a kid celebrity. The limelight and the fact he was getting piss poor money when he was bringing in millions and millions but didnt see any of it was ridiculous. Manziel was completely burned out with football when he got to nfl. I went from hating him to having compassion as he hasn’t grown up or become mature after all the crap.
August 11th, 2023 at 3:48 AM ^
Swamp kings should be enlightening. It was normal for players to be found drunk and passed out at the wheel on University Ave on a regular basis and no suspensions. Barely even a story in the news. Just as out of control as it gets. Gangs guns just that whole attitude in the locker room. What a cesspool.