Blau

January 28th, 2024 at 4:19 PM ^

I think this is a rare occasion where an OP is exactly right about JH's intentions. Whether his relationship with Warde was considered best of friends or worst of enemies, he wants him that Lombardi Trophy and I believe he would've taken any NFL HC position that he was offered this year. Turns out he got the one he wanted and was the best fit for but his relationship with Warde was likely not his deciding factor.

Let's fucking move past this, ok? It'll all work out in the end.

SeaWolv

January 29th, 2024 at 7:56 AM ^

My issue is we’ll never know now whether things could have continued another year or two. Most of us knew this was likely inevitable at some point. What makes it harder to swallow is hearing that perhaps not everything was done to retain him. 

MaizeBlueA2

January 28th, 2024 at 4:26 PM ^

I think it's hilarious that so many of you think Warde Manuel has enough power and/or influence on Jim Harbaugh's like that he could force Jim to the NFL.

If Jim Harbaugh wanted to be at Michigan, he'd be at Michigan. Warde Manuel, the guy so many claim has no power, isn't changing that.

Jim does what he wants...he always has. But this time, the all-powerful Warde Manuel drove him out?

Come on, it's time to let this narrative die.

1VaBlue1

January 28th, 2024 at 4:59 PM ^

This is my take.  Warde doesn't have the horsepower to challenge Harbaugh, but he does have the power to make the job more intolerable that it otherwise should have been.  Everything Jim got to do with NIL was a fight through the AD to fight the Regents for it.  He gave up his (awesome) Twitter account because he kept getting crapped on by Warde for defending himself and his program.  He had to apologize (and pay money) to the B1G in 2016 for the officiating bullshit.

I could go on with this, but nothing in here made him leave.  He left for another shot at a Super Bowl.  But leaving sure was easier than it could have been...

Blau

January 28th, 2024 at 5:08 PM ^

Would you really consider Warde Harbaugh's boss outside of a administrative standpoint? As others have said, Harbaugh probably had the upper hand in the power struggle and if he really wanted something, I'm sure Warde wasn't going to get in the way. The late-in-the-game contract compromises seem to back that up.

Now, if you want to deliberate Warde's purpose as an AD, sure. I just don't think the boss-employee dynamic applied in this situation.

jmblue

January 28th, 2024 at 4:53 PM ^

People (on both sides of this) are reducing this to simplistic logic: either he wanted to be at Michigan, or he wanted to be in pros.

I think his actions over the past three years suggest on the contrary that he was torn, between on one hand wanting to keep working at his alma mater and giving his children the same childhood experience he got to have, and on the other hand, wanting another shot at the Lombardi trophy, which he lost by the slimmest of margins in 2012.  

His close friend Todd Anson has tweeted that in his opinion, Harbaugh would still be here if Michigan had handled things differently.  We have no particular reason to doubt him on this, given that he personally knows the man.

Not all of this is necessarily on Manuel himself.  The University's legal counsel may have made some of the key calls, like deciding to suspend Harbaugh in September, dropping its objection to the Big Ten-imposed suspension, and then stalling on giving him protection from a firing over these investigations.  But either way, Michigan made the decision not to fully support Harbaugh when he 1) wanted to fight the NCAA over Burgergate; 2) wanted to fight the Petitti suspension and 3) wanted to make sure these two things wouldn't cost him his job.

Should he have stayed, Harbaugh potentially faced the risk of further suspension and his employer wouldn't guarantee that he'd still have his job.

...and that probably made his decision for him.  Yes, at that point, given all the above, he probably didn't want to be here anymore.  I think a lot of coaches would probably want to leave under those circumstances.

But to say that Michigan never had a chance to keep him around, I don't think that's clear.

Wendyk5

January 28th, 2024 at 5:10 PM ^

I think him saying he only has so many "sands left in the hourglass" is pretty compelling. He's a year older than me, and so I totally get that. You start prioritizing what's left that you really want to do. Other things become less important. He may have been torn between staying and leaving, but if he didn't leave, he'd never know if he could do it (win that trophy). Trying for the trophy is the priority. 

SlickNick

January 28th, 2024 at 5:44 PM ^

Haven't seen 1 person say Warde has the power to force Harbaugh's hand. Of coure JH was going to take the high road as always. He may not have been forced out but what message does it send when your boss lowered your salary, then in the midst of the best 3 year run in modern MI football history  is no where to be found. Was not even involved in contract discussions. Had more face to face meetings with Jim Stapleton than Jim Harbaugh. JH comments about wanting the bear hug are pretty obvious. With a more supportive AD I would bet we get one final 5yr contract for JH. Happy for Jim, excited for the future with Sherrone but it is forever fuck warde manuel.

 

Ghost of Fritz…

January 29th, 2024 at 12:46 AM ^

You have missed the main point.  Manuel's error was cutting JH's pay back in 2020.  Another error was not fully having his back with Petitti and hamburger gate.  But the big errors was cutting his pay. JH never had flirted with the NFL before that.  And he did so three times after that.   

JH himself said that is was a difficult decision and that he was torn.  This is not so black and white as "Harbaugh just wanted to go back to the NFL."  It was a hard decision with lots of grey areas.  But, by cutting his pay back in 2020 Manuel , sowed resentment and made it more likely that JH would leave for the NFL.  

Back in 2020 Manuel had two valid options.  Either fire JH, or keep him but with 100% full support.  Manuel chose the only irrational option--keep him but do so in a way that sowed resentment by publicly and drastically cutting his pay.  JH won big thereafter, and that resentment made it more likely that he would return to the NFL.  Manuel played his hand in the only bad way possible back in 2020.  Three options.  He chose the only totally irrational one.   

He faces a similar choice with Juwan Howard.  He can fire him.  Or he can keep him with full support.  The only irrational choice would be to keep him but with an embarrassing pay cut.  If he does that, and Howard turns it around, he will have sowed resentment and will make it more likely that Howard will jump to the NBA if he starts to win at Michigan.  

 

UMxWolverines

January 28th, 2024 at 3:59 PM ^

He wasnt staying no matter what after winning the national title. And Warde isnt doing a good job overall. Both things can be true. People need to stop looking at it like a jaded spouse like Michigan isnt good enough for him. 

Thanks for coming back coach, this is a season we'll all be talking about for the rest of our lives. I hope you get your Lombardi! 

truferblue22

January 28th, 2024 at 4:00 PM ^

No. 

 

It's not black and white. Jim was probably always going to the NFL, and I don't blame him. But most of us are mad at Warde because he flat-out didn't do enough to even try to keep him, based on the intel we have.

That's what's inexcusable.

stephenrjking

January 28th, 2024 at 4:17 PM ^

1. He offered to make him the highest-paid coach in college football.

2. Technicalities about immunity were negotiated and an equitable agreement would have been (and was) found in time if Jim wanted to stay.

3. People want to believe Warde didn't do enough because they want an excuse to hate him, and for no other reason. 

JonnyHintz

January 28th, 2024 at 4:27 PM ^

Harbaugh specifically hires someone to handle contract negotiations for him. He doesn’t retain an agent or a lawyer until it’s time for those conversations to take place. It’s always been that way for Harbaugh, so it’s not surprising that Warde wasn’t negotiating directly with Jim. 
 

It allows Jim to maintain his focus on running whatever team he’s currently coaching and not have to be on the phone or in the office of whatever GM/AD he works under.

stephenrjking

January 28th, 2024 at 4:27 PM ^

What's bizarre about that? Even where relationships are amicable, representatives generally do a lot of the nitty-gritty legal work. In Warde and Jim's case, the anecdotes tell us that they didn't interact a lot when they could avoid it, but even then, you negotiate with reps. This is particularly true with Harbaugh, who by his own profession has tunnel vision during the season and doesn't want to deal with that stuff until things are over. That's how it was when we got him, too.

People apparently have the mistaken impression that Jim Harbaugh is great buddies with most of his management superiors, chatting regularly over golf and text messages; his history suggests that this is not how he works. 

Bluesince89

January 28th, 2024 at 4:29 PM ^

I negotiate high level executive contracts all the time. The amount of times where I represent a company and negotiate directly with an executive is like zero. That’s not how it works. Harbaugh has representation and even when you guys think he didn’t have an agent, he still had a sports lawyer representing him. Enough. 

newtopos

January 28th, 2024 at 4:29 PM ^

Even after 2021, he didn't return Harbaugh to his pre-cut salary.  Warde completely bungled that, and we would have lost him to Minnesota, but we got lucky.

Offering a deal on Burgergate when Harbaugh was already in Los Angeles about to sign wasn't "in time."  Again, Warde fails on Negotiation 101 repeatedly.  (Notice how the DC we are apparently looking at now had a two year show cause and was the actual bagman for Miami?)

So, why did Warde not do anything about the Pearson report for months?  Why couldn't he bothered to even try to retain Bakich?  Maybe, instead of this Panglossian nonsense, Warde really doesn't do enough to retain great coaches, to get ahead of issues like NIL, etc.  Of course, we are going to get long, condescending proclamations on this subject from his apologists, so I do not know why I bother reading, but like all Michigan fans, I must enjoy misery.   

JonnyHintz

January 28th, 2024 at 4:39 PM ^

Nobody is being a Warde apologist. That’s what you’re not understanding. Warde is deserving of plenty of criticism for how his tenure has gone, but at this point you’re just looking for shit to complain about that he either had zero control over or there was nothing he could do to obtain the desired outcome. 

 

We’re really sitting here talking about Warde not being able to retain a coach who has said MULTIPLE times in his career that he still feels a pull to the NFL, who JUST said “there’s no Lombardi Trophy in college,” and has accomplished everything you could possibly accomplish as a college coach. As much as you want to shit on Warde for anything that doesn’t go our way, he’s pretty clear from blame in this instance. That’s not a defense of Warde, that’s calling for people to keep their criticisms where they’re deserved. 

GoBlueZ06

January 29th, 2024 at 12:40 AM ^

Let's allow for some nuance. I can understand that Coach Harbaugh wanted to chase a Super Bowl and simultaneously believe/observe that how Warde and the Regents handled his tenure here was lacking in many areas, not the least of which was recognizing what they had and doing everything within their control to make this a job one that would be agonizingly difficult to walk away from. 

To address your points:

1. When? Pretty clearly at the absolute last second, the answer should've been in 2021. NOT simply for $$$ but for what that meant in terms of support, etc. We allowed James Franklin and Ryan Day to have better deals than Jim Harbaugh... patently ridiculous. 

2. The fact that there was negotiation in any way about this was idiotic from a Warde/M perspective. Response should've been "absolutely", but then again these are the same folks that backed out of the TRO at the 11th hour as well.

3. People believe Warde didn't do enough because there is an entire career's worth of evidence, both anecdotal and objective, that demonstrates he didn't / hasn't / won't. I want an AD in place who is going to give Coach Moore all of the support they possibly can as we transition into a new era of college football, I have absolutely no confidence in Warde Manuel to provide that leadership and vision.
 

 

JonnyHintz

January 29th, 2024 at 5:37 AM ^

these are the same folks that backed out of the TRO at the 11th hour as well.

Pretty sure it came out that it was Harbaugh’s choice. The B1G challenged immediately challenged Michigan’s TRO, meaning it didn’t go in place before game 1 of the 3 game suspension. The hearing wasn’t scheduled until the day before game 2 of the suspension, and the decision wouldn’t have been made until the following week. So 2 of the 3 games would have been missed regardless and we would have spent part of the 3rd week dealing with the distraction and Harbaugh wanted them to be able to focus on OSU.

JonnyHintz

January 28th, 2024 at 4:21 PM ^

If reports are to be believed, he offered (or was close to) multiple contracts throughout the year which would have made Jim one of, if not the, highest paid coaches in college football. Jim and his agent/lawyer wanted certain guarantees and clauses put into the deal that Warde wouldn’t have had the authority to grant on his own. 
 

I really don’t know what more you expected Warde to do in this instance. It seems like people are mad Warde didn’t succeed in keeping a guy who was adamant that he was leaving for the NFL if offered… 

JonnyHintz

January 28th, 2024 at 4:41 PM ^

They weren’t Warde’s immunities to offer. That’s well above his pay grade. If you want to know why, you have to go above Warde to ask these questions. It’s foolish to think negotiations of this magnitude fell solely on the plate of Warde. 
 

But that’s the problem. Warde is the scapegoat for something he played only a portion of a part in, and something that wouldn’t have changed the outcome in the end anyway. 

LVaught89

January 28th, 2024 at 4:36 PM ^

Exactly. He gave us 9 years, 3 conference titles, and a natty. This wild gnashing of teeth seems insane to me. He did want he wanted to do. 21/22/23 were all dalinaces with the NFL. He had nothing left to prove in Ann Arbor. Let the guy ride off in the sunset and support Sherrone moving forward. Go Blue!

The Sea Was Angry

January 28th, 2024 at 4:16 PM ^

Thanks, Blue. I am still laughing as I respond. Perfect response to a seemingly endless stream of nausea. 

Is there a way to condense all of these posts into one "Coaching in LA / Warde = Hitler" snowflake thread? That would save many posters an incredible amount of time, no longer having to make the same comments over and over.