Is it too early to panic about the long-run positions of our MBB, WBB, and Hockey programs vs MSU?
Looking at the results from the last 2 weeks (lost games in all three sports to MSU) and the quality of coaches that MSU has had or recently hired makes me wonder whether UM will be looking up at MSU for the next few years.
MBB: There is no question that our program is trash at the moment. MSU has underperformed for the last few years, but if JH is still around, we will be below MSU.
WBB: KBA is good, but unfortunately, MSU has found a terrific coach. I knew Robyn Fralick because our institution considered her as our WBB coach. We hired a more experienced coach since Robyn was inexperienced back then. She is going to be great :(
Hockey: The jury is out on Brandon. His team has been inconsistent, but the roster lacks depth. However, just like WBB, the new MSU coach, Adam Nightingale, has already proven to be a good recruiter and a good coach.
February 19th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
This was always a bridge year for WBB. Next fall the cavalry arrives, as long as they live up to their billing, should make another leap.
February 19th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
WBB is in a rebuilding year = WNIT. Deal with it.
February 19th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
That means word will give Howard a raise …
February 19th, 2024 at 1:52 PM ^
Word up!
February 19th, 2024 at 12:46 PM ^
Our women's gymnastics team also lost to MSU. I believe it's the first time MSU has beaten us in a meet. It's silly to panic. As Stephen King Jr. noted, our women's basketball program is the best it's ever been under KBA. The recruiting has been great, and the team should be much better next year. I don't follow hockey, but this seems like it could just be a down year. I am worried about men's basketball and think we'll need a change there. Recruiting has dropped off, and the blue-chippers we got before under-performed big time. I'm hoping Howard is encouraged to look at NBA assistant coaching opportunities in the off-season and accepts a pro gig. Maybe coaching Jett! That would be cool, right?
February 19th, 2024 at 1:53 PM ^
They beat us last year, too (Women's Gym), but our program is in excellent hands.
February 19th, 2024 at 12:53 PM ^
Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong on this, but it's information I believe I've gotten from this board in the past regarding hockey.
MSU got their goalie, who is apparently very good, by getting him to flip from UM due to MSU's coach having been his coach with the NTDP. I'm sure this new coach of theirs would possibly get a bump in recruiting at least in the short term of potentially signing players from the program when he was there.
I would not expect it to necessarily give him any advantage once the players that were with the program when he was there are gone, as he'd be in the same situation as any other college coach at that point as to where they don't have a personal relationship with him. He may still recruit well, but the goalie is also a big reason they are where they are I believe.
Also, Naurato didn't get named permanent head coach until the team was basically in the frozen four last season. Thus I think the recruiting class for this season was difficult to put together and relied much on the transfer portal. I believe he has a tremendous class signed for next season.
February 19th, 2024 at 12:57 PM ^
It’s NEVER too early to panic! That’s part of what makes this fun!
February 19th, 2024 at 1:01 PM ^
I guess panic and long term dont go together. Either way, we're just one coaching change away from being better at basketball. No point in worry about future seasons, the current season is going badly enough.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:06 PM ^
Didn't WBB go to the Elite Eight last year and Hockey have back to back Frozen Fours?
Didn't WBB blow a second half lead yesterday and M hoops choke away the last 7 minutes Saturday night?
February 19th, 2024 at 1:06 PM ^
I'd be genuinely interested to know how many people who use this blog are actively interested in the hockey team. I have a feeling it's a small percentage relative to how much coverage it gets here. But I could absolutely be wrong. I have no issue with the fact that hockey gets a good bit of attention here, even though my interest in the team is roughly equivalent to my interest in the M baseball team -- passive at best. As an alum, I know dozens of fairly rabid M football and basketball fans. But I only know one hockey fan. I'm wondering if that's typical, and wonder if there's any data on this.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:11 PM ^
Attendance wise is #3 pretty easily, #2 when MBB sucks. If you've been to Yost you love the hockey team.
February 19th, 2024 at 7:41 PM ^
Easily the #3 sport at the school.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:23 PM ^
"I'll take Bedwetters for $400 Alex."
February 19th, 2024 at 1:28 PM ^
WBB has a very strong class coming in. Nightengale is rumored to be a priority for NHL teams looking for a coach. Michigan basketball has no chance as long as Juwan sticks around
February 19th, 2024 at 1:29 PM ^
All MSU fans believe they won the National Championship Saturday night with their basketball victory over our basketball team.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:29 PM ^
I have my towel (it's a lovely, comfy UM bath towel.) I know not to panic.
Get yourself a towel. You'll thank us later.
#GoBlue
#FordPrefect
February 19th, 2024 at 3:23 PM ^
Towels are massively useful. I wrap one around me for warmth as I bound across the cold moons of Jaglan Beta.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:33 PM ^
Hockey.....Right now MSU is ahead only because they have Augustine. If the Pearson firing didn't happen he would be playing for us. Reminds me of us self punishing hoops and Cleaves goes to MSU and jumpstarts their program. After Augustine goes pro we have to stay ahead of them. Naurato has to shore up the team defense because that is holding us down, our offense is good enough.
Hoops... MSU is ahead. If we assume Howard leaves, our next hire is so critical, because soon enough Izzo will leave and we need to get back the upper hand. I would figure that Warde will try for Cooley but I think we need a better hire. If we assume Howard stays, we might in trouble...He will likely revamp the entire assistant staff, but that might not be enough. I prefer a new coach if we can get, say, a Dusty May or Chris Beard.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:51 PM ^
Firing Pearson was just as poor a decision as firing Moeller... and made for essentially similar reasons.
February 19th, 2024 at 2:02 PM ^
I was a student when Moeller was coach. People don't realize how petrified OSU was of him. And I think he was undefeated 4-0 vs them. He brought the modern offense to Michigan and Lloyd won title with all Mo's guys. Moeller should have been suspended for awhile but allowed to come back. What went down with Pearson I'm not that aware of so won't comment on it.
February 19th, 2024 at 3:44 PM ^
4-0-1 (tie in 1992)
February 19th, 2024 at 4:27 PM ^
"and Lloyd won title with all Mo's guys"
Except for all the starters in '97 who never played a down for Moeller, which was a sizable number.
February 19th, 2024 at 5:12 PM ^
They were his recruits!!!
February 19th, 2024 at 6:23 PM ^
That's fine, but every snap that Charles Woodson took in a Michigan uniform was with Lloyd Carr as his head coach. Asserting that Carr had nothing to do with Woodson's career is ridiculous. Same with Josh Williams.
Ian Gold's freshman year was 1996, two years after Moeller was fired. Are you going to give all the credit to Moeller for his development?
Same applies to Steve Hutchinson, Jeff Backus, Tommy Hendricks, and Dhani Jones, who were all true sophomores in '97.
I'm all for giving Moeller and his staff credit for recruiting and coaching the players that they did who were on the '97 team, but claiming that Carr had nothing to do with any of the players on that squad is revisionist bullshit.
February 19th, 2024 at 6:21 PM ^
He wasn't fired he resigned. Bo begged him to take a suspension and ride it out but Mo couldn't take the negativity of the press.
February 20th, 2024 at 6:35 AM ^
If Bo was the AD, anyone think Juwan would have survived the Wisconsin slapping incident?
February 19th, 2024 at 1:36 PM ^
Depends if you live in the northern or southern hemisphere.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:36 PM ^
I'm only worried about men's basketball. And if we get a new coach I think we can start a rebuild and turn it around in time
February 19th, 2024 at 1:37 PM ^
the new MSU coach, Adam Nightingale, has already proven to be a good recruiter and a good coach
How is that not also the case for Naurato. Won the conference and made the Frozen Four as an interim coach. This year the team has dealt with a bunch of injuries and lacks depth scoring.
February 19th, 2024 at 2:02 PM ^
Our team was beyond stacked, goalie included.
February 19th, 2024 at 7:49 PM ^
Our goalie posted a .908 save percentage last year with a 3.00 GAA. Our goalie this year has a .910 with a 2.85 for reference. Last year was certainly NOT a “stacked” year in goal despite Portillo being highly regarded. He was shaky all year.
Not sure how our team being stacked is relevant. It’s Michigan hockey. Naurato is an excellent recruiter and recruited the majority of guys on the roster. We’re going to be stacked most years. He took a team facing adversity (losing their coach right before the start of the season) and won a conference championship and went to the Frozen Four. He’s a proven recruiter and has shown to be a good coach. So again, how does Nightingale get that distinction but not Naurato?
Michigan has had some trouble with injuries this year. Edwards missed the entire first half of the year. McGroarty missed a handful of games. Hamlin suffered a season ending injury. A few other guys have missed a game here or there. The Hallum injury effectively eliminated their ability to go three lines deep at forward.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:40 PM ^
Is this a real life Dr Pepper Fansville commercial?
Serious, WTF. Yes, all three teams lost to Sparty recently. But in essentially every non-football sport we are coming off historic runs of vastly outperforming little brother, and oh yeah, football won the national championship.
If you want to advocate for firing people, have at it. But to be so concerned (panic? we talking about PANIC?) about long term stuff based on so little is ridiculous.
February 19th, 2024 at 1:40 PM ^
Not worried about WBB - KBA has brought to heights that we've never had before. Still a pretty good team, just some frustrating losses. I can remember for years when women's hoops were losing close to 20 games a year. MSU's coach replaced a long-time coach who faded in later years but could still recruit. Let's check back in 2-3 years.
Hockey: MSU's been a dud for the last 15 years. Adam is in his 2nd year. Whether he's the long-term answer will be sorted out over the next 2-3 years as well. KBA in hoops has a longer grace period to me because of what's she's done in her tenure.
MBB: the most frustrating thing is MSU's been so mediocre (for Izzo) the last four years and is just +6 Ws over Ls in B1G the last four years. I've already given up any hope for Juwan but realize he will likely be back for 2024-25 because Warde isn't going to fire a guy coming off heart surgery and JH isn't going to step down. There are a number of good coaches at mid-majors that could come in here and get us to at least an NIT bid in 2025-26 with help from the portal. Then recruiting (with help hopefully from a decent NIL) kicks in.
But I'm still loving 15-0 and my NC gear!
February 19th, 2024 at 3:48 PM ^
I know NIL and admissions aren't great for basketball, but I find it hard to believe that Michigan isn't a Top 45 destination (the approximate cutoff for an at-large bid to the Big Dance).
February 19th, 2024 at 1:44 PM ^
It’s nice to have good basketball and hockey teams, but as long as the football team continues to play like it has the last three years, I am not going to get too worked up about any other sport.
February 19th, 2024 at 2:03 PM ^
I'm of the opinion that WBB and Hockey will be fine.
MBB is a pure dumpster fire. Can it be fixed? In the short term doubtful, even with a new coach.
February 19th, 2024 at 2:03 PM ^
Our pets heads are falling off!!
February 19th, 2024 at 2:28 PM ^
Hockey and WBB lost some top line players over the past couple of seasons. They are both kinda in a rebuild/reload mode right now and I think they’ll both be fine in the long run.
MBB is a completely different story, however. What started out as a promising beginning to the season has ended in a complete collapse and I’m not sure where all of the blame lies. Is it NIL? Or admissions? Or Howard himself? Or a combo of all three?
This is a completely different era of mbb than beilein had to deal with, but then again hustle and competitive play throughout the team is seriously lacking and that’s something beilein instilled in his teams from the top line talent players all the way down to the bench mob.
I think a change in HC is needed, no matter how much I like Howard. Or maybe it’s just a change needed in the assistants like Harbaugh had to do in order to help promote and instill the right culture. IDK.🤷♂️
February 19th, 2024 at 2:40 PM ^
In case you missed it, we won the National Championship in football a little over a month ago. I'm too pumped to let any other sport's lack of success bring me down.
February 19th, 2024 at 2:44 PM ^
To paraphrase Sir Alex Ferguson: “Lads, it’s Michigan State”
February 19th, 2024 at 2:47 PM ^
Too early to worry
Men's basketball will figure it out either with Howard or without Howard. Throw this year in the trash. MSU struggled to beat us. I think they are on a decline. Izzo's best day's are behind him and have been since the days he cleaned up on in-state recruits. I don't see a succession plan.
Women's basketball is on a down year. Big recruits are coming next year. MSU found its coach so this could be a battle for years to come.
FYS found its hockey coach so the feast is over but I think we will be OK. Hockey recruiting has changed in the last few years to a combination of young NHL future stars plus portal. Nightingale figured out the portal fast.
February 19th, 2024 at 3:35 PM ^
I'm sure I am in the minority, but I am fine with MSU having a solid hockey program again because I love the intensity of the rivalry when we're both very good. Nightingale has turned them around faster than I could have imagined, so that gives me hope that our next BB coach can do the same if the right guy is hired.
February 19th, 2024 at 3:13 PM ^
Please. It is always the perfect time to panic about anything. Cut loose!
February 19th, 2024 at 3:43 PM ^
A bad 2 weeks as you contemplating long term implications..
February 19th, 2024 at 3:44 PM ^
Who cares? Not these guys and football is really all that maters relative to Sparty.
February 19th, 2024 at 6:03 PM ^
The athletic gods giveth and that taketh. Seems it is the price we payeth for our National Championship! However, some theological scholars say that you can appease these gods with bags and bags of cash.