brad

February 7th, 2024 at 12:32 AM ^

Yes, please.  This is Harbaugh just being himself.  When he was here, he arranged his situation so he could and would win.  Now he's elsewhere, and he's arranging to win.  It may or may not work, but there is no reason to expect Harbaugh to cherish something at the possible expense of winning wherever he is.

Joined: 06/30/2008

MGoPoints: 15725

M-Dog

February 6th, 2024 at 5:43 PM ^

You know, I still will.

TBH, if you told me in 2020 that for the price of an 8-4 season in 2024 Michigan will:

- Beat Ohio State 3 straight times,

- Win the Big Ten Championship 3 straight times,

- Make the CFP 3 straight times, 

- Win the Rose Bowl . . . against Alabama,

- Go undefeated 15-0,

- and win the NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP in dominating fashion,

I would have jumped all over you and asked where do I sign up right now?

 

Joined: 07/06/2008

MGoPoints: 257507

Sam1863

February 7th, 2024 at 5:28 AM ^

I've got a foot in both camps here. Every accomplishment that you've listed has been fantastic, even more than I imagined. It's been a glorious three-year run. And like you, if the cost of that success is an 8-4 season, especially considering the loss of personnel and coaches and the brutal schedule, I'll sign on the dotted line right now.

On the other hand, and I've said this before: I am a Michigan fan, first and foremost. I may like certain players or coaches, but my loyalty is to the Team, the guys in maize and blue who run onto the field every Saturday. If you chose to leave the Team, for whatever reason, that's your right, and it may be what's best for you. But my support for you fades. It doesn't necessarily turn into loathing (unless you're a Boren or a Mattison), but it won't be what it once was, because you're not part of the Team.

And what Harbaugh is doing, whether it's comfortable to admit it or not, is hurting our Team. Yes, he has the right and the responsibility of doing the best job he can in San Diego. But we have the right to dislike what he's doing, and him for doing it. To use the coaching tree analogy, he's lopping off limbs and transplanting them in San Diego. All the gratitude in the world for what he accomplished doesn't change the harm he's causing to our Team.

So to make a long story short (too late!), my reaction is, Jim, for what you've done, thank you very much. For what you're doing, fuck you.

Joined: 04/27/2014

MGoPoints: 28880

daile1bm

February 7th, 2024 at 12:40 PM ^

This is 100% exactly what I've been trying to get across to people lately. Some people are just doomers and are bitching because things are changing and people don't like change, but this is beyond that IMO.

Copy/pasting from a couple of comments I made on a reddit post. (It's long, sorry)

[Some fans are] apparently happy (or at least okay with) the team they seemingly follow (UofM cfb) being gutted, which is baffling.

We can understand that the coaches leaving are adults and have agency to take offers provided to them, but also be upset and frustrated that we're much worse off as a program today than we we were a month ago before Jim left and started taking these guys with him.

There doesn't appear to be a lot of options left to replace these recent departures, especially equal or better than what we had in 2023. This is an unprecedented amount of turnover after a team just won a natty, so fans having/showing concern for the long term prospects of the program are completely justifiable IMO.

Unless Sherrone can stop the bleeding with some good hires, and soon, I think the worst is yet to come. Transfers out would be killer, and if those happen and the team doesn't win enough games to be a destination spot for recruits/transfers/coaches, we could be in trouble way sooner than would be expected for a defending champ.

While you can't necessarily fault Harbaugh for wanting to build the Chargers up, now that that's his gig, Michigan football fans shouldn't be thrilled to see him leaving (stealing/poaching) our cupboards bare, IMO. He's not our coach anymore, idk why so many people here are still loyal to him while he's, at best, doing major passive harm to Michigan football.

My only point of contention is that, if Harbaugh wanted to make his legacy outside of or beyond Michigan, then basically taking "Michigan" with him is kind of a cheap way to do it. I fully acknowledge this is a selfish and maybe even an unreasonable take.

If he "poached" those guys because they were the absolute best options available (Minter probably yes. Elston/Herbert maybe?), I wouldn't hold it against him too much. If he did it just because those were the easiest guys to get, or worse (but unlikely) an F.U. to Michigan/Warde/B1G/NCAA/etc. than my respect for Harbaugh would drop. We'll never know the real answers so I sit somewhere in the middle currently on my feelings towards Jim. Loved him while he was here, I'll think back and smile the rest of my life about what he gave us during his tenure, especially the last 3 years and finally bringing the natty home. But he is now gone by his own choosing, and selfishly I couldn't care less how he does in the NFL. Good luck, but my fandom isn't going to follow him to the Chargers.

I don't think we as Michigan fans owe him any loyalty or well wishes in his new gig, just the same as he doesn't owe us any more than what he has already given. More power to anyone that chooses to stick by NFL Harbaugh, but I won't be. Michigan is my only football team. Onward and hopefully upward with Sherrone, now.

 

Joined: 11/12/2020

MGoPoints: 123

SecretAgentMayne

February 6th, 2024 at 6:38 PM ^

JFC I mean considering the brutality of the schedule next year along with what will basically be a compete rebuild on offense along with huge coaching turnover, I’ll for sure take going “only” 8-4 this season…. Which is frankly a run-of-the-mill record for any Michigan team in my lifetime, in exchange for the last three seasons ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Joined: 07/10/2019

MGoPoints: 10661

jmblue

February 6th, 2024 at 5:45 PM ^

Suspended 6 games,

You think he deserved that, for a burger receipt and some scouting nonsense?

As for these coaches, it's on us to give them a reason to stay.  Maybe we shouldn't be surprised considering that there's been a steady stream of successful coaches leaving Ann Arbor under Manuel's watch.  

Joined: 11/07/2008

MGoPoints: 102810

GLORY

February 6th, 2024 at 6:54 PM ^

Agreed.  Jim has an obligation to his new employer to build what he believes would be in the best interest of Chargers.  It pains to see Jim gutting our staff in the process, but not his problem.  The onus is on Michigan to entice the employees to remain in Ann Arbor.   It just feels like we lack proper succession plans and competent leaders required to achieve this.

Joined: 06/12/2021

MGoPoints: 20276

Jinxed

February 6th, 2024 at 11:47 PM ^

Urban Meyer on the question of whether he'd raid the OSU staff for coaches when he accepted the Jaguars job: 

“I talked to Gene and I talked to coach Day, and you know my affection for both of those guys and the great university that we represented, and I won’t do that,” Meyer said. “Does that mean there might be one? Maybe. I’m not there yet. But I told Gene, I said, ‘Yeah, coach Marotti, Pantoni, the whole crew’s leaving,’ and they’re like ‘What?’ No, that’s the best infrastructure in college sports, so no, they will not be leaving. I'm not touching -- there might be one, I said, that will leave, but I am not gonna do that to that organization. And I’m not sure they would go. Ohio State is home to those guys now.”

 

And that's a guy this board frequently accused of being a selfish sociopath. I know it's hard to accept but Jim Harbaugh never gave a fuck about Michigan beyond anything that would benefit him. He's still the same guy that slammed Michigan academics when he was the Stanford coach. Appreciate the natty but let's just be honest, Jim won that for Jim, he didn't win that for Michigan. 

Joined: 09/15/2009

MGoPoints: 1993

UMChick77

February 7th, 2024 at 8:36 AM ^

This post is what some of the apologists need to see. Urban didn't gut OSU on his way out but look at what's happening with us. For those who keep making excuses for Jim leaving the coaching cupboard on the bare side so he can be successful and win, didn't Urban want to win too? 

There's plenty of winning talent out there and it's not only at Michigan. 

Joined: 12/16/2014

MGoPoints: 7699

poseidon7902

February 7th, 2024 at 9:19 AM ^

I got negged for posting something along these lines last week.  Harbaugh has every right in the free market economy to do what he's doing, but let's stop with the sainthood of him.  He's selfish.  Even had one poster tell me I'm the type of fan who isn't a real fan and don't deserve a national championship because I called it like I saw it.  

 

Joined: 11/09/2013

MGoPoints: 5424

JonnyHintz

February 6th, 2024 at 7:35 PM ^

I don’t think this has anything to do with Warde. 
 

For starters, the Chargers have more money to work with than Michigan. If it comes to a bidding war, NFL can outpay any college team if they wanted to. 
 

Now, let’s factor in that there is no recruiting in the NFL. These coaches actually get an off-season to vacation and spend time with their families instead of hitting the trail. Without recruiting, they’re essentially doing half the work and don’t have to spend their time wooing 17 year olds. 
 

So… same or higher pay, half the work, more free time, more prestigious position… and we’re really going to sit here and try to throw blame around as to why they’re taking a position that every coach in the NCAA would take in a heartbeat. 

Joined: 01/11/2015

MGoPoints: 48345

KungFury

February 6th, 2024 at 8:03 PM ^

I mean.. Michigan stuck with him after the terrible Covid year when people wanted him gone. He had a bad reputation in the league from his time in San Fran and was regarded as a guy who couldn’t last more than a few years in a single organization due to bumping heads with his superiors. Michigan helped him rehab that image. And he tried to leave the previous 2 years. Michigan watched him do his thing and welcomed him back with open arms. His time here will likely define his coaching legacy. To say he owes Michigan NOTHING is really just not true.  

Joined: 04/01/2015

MGoPoints: 1671