[edited] Michigan athletic department email regarding NIL updates from Warde Manuel on collectives
I am sure others got this email as well, but figured i would share. The Michigan Athletic Department just sent out an email on NIL updates from Warde Manuel on collectives.
[edited to make the link clickable ---rob f]
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:41 PM ^
The more the AD talks about NIL, the less I feel we're doing. We'll see the results when guys like Aaron Gates, Jadyn Davis and others sign up because they love all that Michigan is AND get paid. Until then, it sounds like each time we hear about Michigan and some new NIL thing, it falls short.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:46 PM ^
Davis is the real litmus test. Gates was a Florida kid committed to a Florida school.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:47 PM ^
But probably countless others we didn't know about... When we start pulling 4-5 stars again then I'll believe it's fixed
December 23rd, 2022 at 5:06 PM ^
We recruited (not including portal) 14 athletes who are 4 stars to a minimum of one recruiting site.
December 23rd, 2022 at 5:59 PM ^
But only 9 on the composite and no top 100 guys
December 23rd, 2022 at 5:47 PM ^
I'm not on any insider boards so I don't know if there's more you're alluding to here, but I'm not sure I can agree that any one kid can be a litmus test. Recruits are three dimensional humans with complex thoughts and emotions, and choose their school for all kinds of reasons. I mean, just look at JJ and how he stuck it out through the lowest lows of 2020. At the time message board logic would have assumed a different outcome.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:48 PM ^
I'm still waiting for a specific list of what we're not doing that other teams/ADs/collectives are doing. If anyone has it, I'd love to understand the specifics, and I apologize if I've missed something. But even the authors of this blog have begun complaining pretty directly about UM's lack of NIL support, and I don't really know what they read.
Reading between the lines of that email [*] and the webpage with more info, I assume that some other teams are offering pay-for-play (or signing bonuses) - though this is undocumented - and that UM refuses to do that (or to allow collectives to do that). UM instead says "earn all you want, but you'll earn all of it" - so a player must sign autographs, sell product, etc.
Does anyone know if that's right? I've ready some musings about minimum salary for all players, but I'm not sure how that's not play-for-play, so I'm not sure my characterization makes sense.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:10 PM ^
Do we want Michigan to engage in pay for play? I'm not sure. On the surface it seems unsavory. I guess if everybody's doing it... Transfer portal does seem to muss with it. Get your signing bonus, transfer to another school and get another signing bonus.
I was thinking that maybe we just need true professional minor leagues, but then I think the NFL probably loves NIL and is the more happy to stay out of it. They don't have to pay a cent and they still get to get player evaluations and development
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:26 PM ^
I would be ok with pay for play but link the signing bonus to a requirement that the player either:
1. Declares for the draft
2. Graduates
3. Suffers a career ending injury
If the player does not qualify for any of these three, they forfeit the signing bonus back.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:33 PM ^
People will just get paid under the table without conditions if that were a rule. If it were specific to Michigan then the top talent would tell us to take a hike. It's wishful thinking to say "it should be limited this way" but that's not realistic.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:50 PM ^
I will say this. In a market of 1 billion dollar TV contracts play to pay seems kind of messed up. Probably none of us here would ever play to get paid but we do this with these kids. Very strange so many cling to that belief. ADs, coaches, support staff, and all the people bringing us the games are all pay to play but the actually focus of the entire event should be above such riff raff. Its why our NIL is phucked, Too many people in charge at Michigan with the same sticks up their asses.
December 23rd, 2022 at 7:09 PM ^
No, I don't want pay for play. That was never the intent or the spirit behind NIL If there are opportunities for athletes to earn some $ through endorsements, appearances, etc., that's fine, but pay for play is on Sunday if that is what one wants.
The NFL, unfortunately, has no interest in creating a minor league. College football provides them with talent with no infrastructure costs.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:13 PM ^
Nobody fucking knows or else someone would have explained it by now.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:50 PM ^
It's a write off for them. They just write it off.
December 23rd, 2022 at 6:21 PM ^
Do you even know what a write off is?
No. But they do, and they’re the ones writing it off
December 23rd, 2022 at 7:09 PM ^
I wish I had the last 20 seconds of my life back.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:16 PM ^
It's too much fun to bitch and moan about so no one actually gets into specifics.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:21 PM ^
I think you're right, so I've resolved myself to bitch and moan in the comments of all the bitching and moaning in protest of this
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:40 PM ^
We have to be doing NIL wrong, because there has to be something to complain about.
As John U. Bacon says, “Some Michigan fans aren’t happy unless they’re unhappy.” This portion of the fanbase has had a tough time finding talking points lately. They tried to find an angle with the QB situation - Harbaugh was mismanaging it, being unfair to Cade by making him compete, JJ would fail against good competition, JJ couldn’t throw downfield, etc. - but ultimately none of those charges stuck. Michigan went 13-0. They can’t call for the coach to be fired or QB to be benched. They can’t say “We’re not allowed to be happy until we beat OSU” anymore. They can’t try to talk themselves into Mel Tucker being a threat. Dark days.
For these people, the topic of NIL is a godsend.
December 23rd, 2022 at 5:17 PM ^
Good points. I think if you gave some Michigan fans a million dollars they would bitch they don’t have 2 million.
No one ever says what UM is doing or not doing in NIL. They just bitch we aren’t doing enough. Well instead of bitching explain what they should be doing. I sure would love a better understanding
December 23rd, 2022 at 6:03 PM ^
The main thing we’re missing is a single collective through which all major NIL payments go and that uses the money to guarantee salaries to all players on the team. This is the minimum we need to get in place to be competitive
December 23rd, 2022 at 6:47 PM ^
But does this even exist at any school now? I don't think there are schools that guarantee minimum base salaries. That may be the point of these collectives . . . but, this whole pay before you play seems bad and is something I'd rather avoid. There are QBs that won't play a down and will get making more money then 95% of the people on this board. And, a lot more money than the lineman blocking for them. That isn't right or fair or useful from a team culture perspective. Maybe I'm old school but I hope Michigan can thread this needle because doing what Texas A&M doesn't work.
December 23rd, 2022 at 6:59 PM ^
Texas A&M is promising stud recruits millions to sign there. Most schools aren’t doing that but rather pooling all the collective money to be able to pay “salaries” to all players who are on the team. The latter shouldn’t create toxic locker rooms since all players are being compensated.
We’re doing neither and need to be doing the latter.
December 24th, 2022 at 12:42 AM ^
Could you please, somehow, document this promise of a million dollars to sign? Thanks.
December 24th, 2022 at 10:06 AM ^
65+ schools are pooling all the collective money to be able to pay “salaries” to all players who are on the team?
Evidence?
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:18 PM ^
I challenge all of us to donate TODAY. I just threw in 20 bucks.
Instead of complain about kids who haven’t done a thing for us why don’t people donate to one these four collectives today to reward the guys that have actually won us back to back titles?
yes we aren’t Texas a&m but I don’t want to be. If we reward true Michigan guys and our coaches continue to develop players. The players will come. Especially thru the portal.
December 23rd, 2022 at 7:11 PM ^
Paying kids to obtain things for you equals entitlement, equals the death of amateurism. And once you're viewing them through the lens of 'what has this kid obtained for ME,' then it's easy to take the next step and think of them as meat, as a collection of stats. In the meantime you have killed amateur athletics in general and Michigan as a place where kids once gloried in playing FOR Michigan, re-created it as a to-the-highest-bidder craphole like all the other crapholes.
I realize that there are any number of people here who don't give a shit, and plenty of cynics who will insist that this is the way the game is headed whether we like it or not. And I agree; the game, and the model, are broken--the old days aren't coming back. But as a kid who grew up in A2, whose whole immediate family AND grandfather went to the U of M, I'll be that person lamenting that death until the end. Don't come to me later to complain when we are the SEC. And when some people wake up and realize that they were emulating and enviying shite schools like Alabama.
And--maybe it goes without saying--we will not be winning forever. We're going to remain in that second tier of schools where we always were because the Warde Manuels and Santas will not be willing to join the crooks. In a curious way, I am going to wear that badge with pride. The people who like to complain can start planning now to go on complaining.
December 23rd, 2022 at 11:19 PM ^
“If we actually compensate them for their labor, we’re exploiting them and treating them like meat” is certainly a take.
December 24th, 2022 at 12:41 PM ^
If the issue was getting kids compensated and protected, the NCAA and universities have nicely sidestepped it, and protected their billions in revenue. Instead of compensating them adequately or evenly--steps that could have helped even the playing field--they offloaded it onto billionaires and gullible fans, who will--as gullible Americans often do--slavishly sign up to give their pennies and feel like they've got some skin in the game.
TL/DR: NIL removes the responsibility of the schools and places it on dumb fans, creating a new class system at two levels: among schools and in the locker room. Super, super insidious, and--we may yet learn--premeditated. Fans flocking to this stupid are lemmings. Predictable ones, sure. And cynical, too. NO ONE thought that this would level the playing field, only (here) 'Michigan can clean other schools' clocks!' We're already seeing that that ain't gonna work. To many forces of common decency at work at higher levels of the admin, a century and a half (thankfullly) invested in creating a worthy institution. Rarely if ever have I thought of myself as an elitest, but in this case, boyhowdy am I glad that the Santa Onos are gonna overrule the lemmings.
Equality is rarely the goal of anything in this country (only the most dubious and barren "liberty," mostly to exploit). No one is pretending anymore.
December 23rd, 2022 at 6:52 PM ^
That sounds like a narrow view of success tied directly to a few players. Champions Circle shows 4.1 million dollars brokered for 400+ athletes across 15 teams. It is probably not equal money for everyone but if it is equal every athlete received 10,000 dollars approx. Is that a success? I don't know. But it is more than what the students had before 2021. I am hoping it will be a lot more in a year or two as UM builds this up. But a few big name players getting in millions may not happen at UM, unless the collectives or the platforms are used by rich donors on their own to bring those players in on their own. But it seems number of players getting a piece of the pie may make it a successful endeavor but may not necessarily get us top players based on NIL...
December 24th, 2022 at 1:30 AM ^
Exactly, I like this middle way. Recruits like Jadyn Davis have proven they value UM and genuninely want to be here. Yet they are likely to get six figures from other programs, which no kid or his family can simply ignore. If you were in his position, or you were his parents, how would you view it, seriously! There needs to be a balance between the culture of the program (which is admirable) and the reality on the ground.
The question is not sell out or stick to your principles, it's a matter of degree. Do you do this only for QBs, or does this apply to other five stars. If you only do this with QBs, are you going to see active portal activity with proven players who are not all coming from peer academic schools (like this year), to fill the gap. Are you going to wait for results on the field to start dictating a change in direction.
Lastly, as a general point, I think you need to look at what other like-minded schools are doing. ND just lost a bunch of guys for NIL related reasons too but it would be silly to assume that they are not in the game. USC looks like they are all in on NIL and the transfer portal. It's a matter of degree, folks. We are not Stanford.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:41 PM ^
Can you tell us what it says?
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:43 PM ^
With Michigan athletic teams representing this world-class institution at the highest level of intercollegiate athletics, consistently adding to and expanding school records in competition and graduation rates, I can state unequivocally that it is Great to Be a Michigan Wolverine!
Intercollegiate athletics continues to see rapid change at all levels - from rules interpretations and eligibility to strengthening the student-athlete experience and the rights of our young people. Among the many changes, the adoption and rapid evolution of Name, Image and Likeness (NIL) rules dominate headlines and discussions with those who care deeply about our teams.
Since July 2021, student-athletes have been able to earn compensation for the use of their NIL in the context of promotional activities and endorsements, appearances, camps and lessons, autographed materials, NFTs and other digital collectibles, trading cards, and other licensed items, such as the many options available through The M Den, our official merchandise retailer.
As the first NCAA school to provide a uniform jersey licensing program for its student-athletes, the University of Michigan has leveraged numerous business relationships into innovative partnerships and educational opportunities since NIL went into effect. Michigan’s public-facing NIL business platform, the VICTORS Exchange, is the nation’s largest local exchange platform of any INFLCR partner school and achieved that standing just two days following its launch in 2021.
Read More about NIL at Michigan
Updated guidance from the NCAA national office has expanded the scope of NIL offerings to entities known as collectives, which are third-party groups external to Michigan Athletics but who combine resources and expertise to provide NIL opportunities to our students. At this time, Michigan Athletics enjoys the support of four collectives, each notable in their own ways, that are actively working to provide our student-athletes with NIL opportunities. They are:
In keeping with our values and full support of a positive student-athlete experience here at Michigan, we welcome your support of these four organizations and the continued financial support of our partners, fans and supporters in ensuring that Michigan student-athletes continue to be the Leaders and Best!
Go Blue!
Warde Manuel
Donald R. Shepherd Director of Athletics
University of Michigan
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:58 PM ^
Ok now one more time but without me having to read all that.
/s
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:45 PM ^
It tLks about how the NCAA NIL rules are evolving, the current NIL things Michigan has in place and now updated rules allow for collectives. Updated guidance from the NCAA national office has expanded the scope of NIL offerings to entities known as collectives, which are third-party groups external to Michigan Athletics but who combine resources and expertise to provide NIL opportunities to our students. Muchigan has 4 collectives in place.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:14 PM ^
It really sounds like a lot of fluff and a round-about way to plug the 4 collectives currently working to help UM athletes. More than anything, I think it is just an advertisement. Not sure how anyone could get much more about what UM is or is not doing in the NIL space based on this email/solicitation.
December 23rd, 2022 at 11:21 PM ^
Advertisement, but also an explicit endorsement of giving money to these collectives. AD has not done that previously that I’m aware of.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:43 PM ^
(deleted, email text added above!)
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:44 PM ^
Well I think that’s a positive
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:53 PM ^
Would feel a lot better if they weren't pushing crypto & NFT bullshit. Sam's been shilling for some NFT stuff as well lately. Really hope the players can avoid getting sucked into scams and actually get their money.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:09 PM ^
Assuming you're referring to MGoDAO.
I'm generally very anti-crypto (and agree that it's basically a scam/ponzi scheme in general), but from what I understand, DAOs are one of the less objectionable (current) uses of the technology. Basically think of the NFTs as member cards, rather than as tradeable "investments" with no actual value behind them (which is what most NFTs are).
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:14 PM ^
Yeah, it's less that I find the concept of a DAO to be objectionable and more that if a group is basing their NIL collective on crypto that tells me a lot about them. The players are adults, they can associate with whoever they want, but I'd be very wary of anyone promoting a DAO/governance tokens/NFTs.
December 23rd, 2022 at 3:55 PM ^
To post a link, at the top of the Comment box click the icon that looks like a link in a chain.
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:06 PM ^
Is there a collective that people prefer? Do they all compensate the players equally? Are there any that are football specific?
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:23 PM ^
i thought we were an autonomous collective
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:25 PM ^
You're foolin' yourself, we're livin' in a Dictatorship!
December 23rd, 2022 at 4:49 PM ^
A self-perpetuating autocracy
December 23rd, 2022 at 5:14 PM ^
Help, Im beimg repressed!
December 23rd, 2022 at 8:23 PM ^
Now you see the violence inherent in the system! You saw him repressing me, didn't you?