2020 No. 1 SG Josh Christopher has Michigan in his top 5
Watched a ton of his highlights on YouTube and this kid has star written all over him. Would easily be the biggest recruit we’ve gotten in decades. Also pretty amazing that we just offered what seems like weeks ago, and already we’re in his top 5. The other teams in the top 5 are ASU, Kentucky, UCLA and Missouri. His older brother does play for ASU so that is something to overcome and he’s good friends with Shareef O’Neal whobplays at UCLA.
The Juwan Howard effect. As the kids in 1990s commercials for McDonalds would say, “I’m lovin it.”
Also, I know there had been a lot of debate on this board so far, centering on the fact that it’s one thing to be in a players top 12, but it’s another to get that player, etc. But I had a dirtball “acquaintance” in school that used to bluntly ask woman to sleep with him as soon as he met them. It sounded so crude and so extreme. I asked him the philosophy on it. He said, “most people are turned off by it, but 1/30 girls may be into that, so I just have to ask about 30 girls.” Seemed to work for him. Not sure it’s completely the same as recruiting.
That's an, ahem, interesting comparison. I'm not too sure that it's off the mark, though... I'd study this 'acquaintance' of yours' methods to perform my own comparison of 'crootin results (re: commits vs offers), but methinks the wife may not sign off on such an experiment...
You could approximate the experiment by asking your wife 30 times and tallying your success rate...
You know, this is all in the name of science, so...
What's that old saying? 50 no's and one yes means yes?
The trick is to stop talking as soon as you hear "yes"
This is my vote for post of the week. Bravo, sir.
You could approximate the experiment by asking your wife 30 times and tallying your success rate...
Interestingly, contrary to what many assume, happily married couples have lots more sex than those who are out on the hunt in bars and clubs and the like. At least on the average . . . there are always statistical outliers.
If he doesn't good data, I can ask her 30 times also. You know, for science.
Is there a Bagman in this parallel situation?
You make poor excuses for your inability to get laid too?
Trojan Bagggggg
Not sure if this transaltes to crootin', but the book Modern Romance by Aziz Ansari (yes, that Aziz -- he actually spent a lot of time with sociologists and psychologists all over the world to study the modern dating scene across the world), speaks to this theory.
In the book, they studied online dating websites to find trends and see who is "successful." One of the things they looked at was which men were more successful in receiving responses and dates: men who write a thought out, personalized message based on the profile of the person they were messaging or men who came up with a short, generic boilerplate message and just sent it to as many women as they could. Guess what? The guys who sent a short, non-personal message that they send to everyone were vastly more successful in securing dates.
Cast a wide net, single folks
Assumes quantity is the goal though......
Shotgun vs. Sniper method for the kill. Both work, just depends on your personality.
Boomhauer does it
https://youtu.be/N7FVmeJXwCY
Until Michigan starts routinely landing some of these kids, I'll take Michigan in their "top 5" as only being a place holder for them.
A small part of me wonders how my life would be different if I employed a similar philosophy.
juwan's texting recruits like "u up?"
Was 1/30 his hit rate with 5-stars or 2-stars?
Ha. He didn’t discriminate. He “recruited” all candidates.
Sounds like the Naked Man strategy in How I Met Your Mother. I'll let someone else do the research as I'm a grower not a shower and it may adversely affect results.
That technique is really just a strategy from sales/marketing 101. If you approach enough prospects with your sales pitch, the odds are that you're going to get some to say yes. If your sales pitch is very good and you have something of value to sell, you'll get more yeses. On the other hand, if you're giving a dirtbag pitch, you won't get many yeses. A few, but not many. In the case of the acquaintance, maybe he was happy with that.
Fortunately in Michigan's case, we have a lot to offer high level basketball recruits - short of bags of cash or cocaine. I'm going to guess Juwan Howard will be able to sign more 5 star players than Coach B did, if for no other reason than he's asking a lot more of them and showing much more interest.
Might as well
Josh and Nimari would make for a dominant backcourt. Plays very physical for a SG-nice to see-and he actually has good balance of skills to his game. I wonder if Juwan his selling a "Fab Five" idea to this 2020 class. Nimari, Josh, Isaiah, Walker and Hunter?
This would a really good recruiting tactic and one that could only really be pulled off by an original fab five member.
“...could only really be pulled off by an original Fab Five member.”
To your point - the original Fab Five member!
Who's Isaiah? They have a commit from one Jackson, haven't offered another one.
You're on track...another Jackson.
I obviously know who you meant. Has Michigan shown much interest in the other Jackson? I don't think Juwan has even contacted him. He has, on the other hand, recently offered 3 PFs.
If I'm putting together a dream Fab 5, it won't be 3 bigs and 2 SGs. I can't see them on the court at the same time. I'm also not kicking out Zeb Jackson.
Isaiah can play the 3 or 4...I would be glad to have a 3 with his skillset...there are other options (Scottie Barnes-for sure). Nimari is listed as a combo-he has PG skills and would be one hell of a point...Christopher would be a great running mate for him. I would be glad to try to win a game with my Fab Five.
I expected to hear more about Scottie Barnes considering he plays on Jace and Jett's high school team. I figured the back channels with JH's kids would be working overtime to get him an offer and committed. 247 has Syracuse and Oregon with crystal balls - come on Scottie you really wanna play zone at Cuse instead of learn NBA defense from JH? He also seems to be close to Josh too. Get those two guys in the door and anything can happen.
damn double post
Scratch Isiah and add our already committed top 70 player in Zeb
He does not fit the need.
How many times does the Zeb camp have to confirm that Zeb's commitment remains firm??? Reading between the lines, given these offers to Nimari and Josh, Zeb has to know that if both should come to Michigan he is out-and not of his choosing. These offers put Zeb in a difficult position-behind the proverbial 8-ball. Zeb is a nice player but Nimari and Josh are elite. This may seem cut-throat but it is the reality-and these kids (all) understand it.
Isaiah Jackson is not really being recruited by the staff, most likely because he didn't show interest. Doubt Kessler and Dickinson would want to be on the same team
You’re forgetting about Zeb Jackson
It was really hard to convey during Coach Beilein's tenure, but recruiting success is based on relationships and off-court buzz, as much as on-court success, if not more. There is no doubt in my mind that relationships with prospects will be fostered and maintained at a higher level under Coach Howard's watch. In terms of off-court buzz, it was non-existent under Coach Beilien and that hurts us on the recruiting trail. We did not engage in midnight madness, chase top 10 prospects with frequency........or just embrace the spotlight in general. Things are changing, and hopefully the on-court results will follow.
Do you think we have a legit shot with Josh?
I have zero intel on Josh's recruitment, but we presumably have a puncher's chance being in the top 5. My gut tells me he'll likely opt elsewhere, but the fact that we're in the discussion consdering the novelty of our involvement speaks volumes IMO.
I am guessing you have seen Josh-seems very similar to Nimari. Their films say they would make an incredibly dynamic duo. In your opinion, could the two play well together?
In basketball, at all levels, talent is going to win out on a consistent basis. Doesn't always hold true at the college level because of the single elimination format, but give me those two any day of the week and worry about the fit later.
I understand what you're saying, and do not believe you're attempting to trash Beilein. However, it does sort of read that way... We had a period of virtually unprecedented success in basketball under Beilein. I would be somewhat cautious about throwing the contents of a dumpster on his Michigan epitaph.
I think all you're trying to say is that, because he's no longer here, things will change. Change is change - it could be good, could be bad. Probably a little of both (like always). Beilein certainly kept a low-key profile, and spurned the 'all about me' attitudes prevalent in the game. Howard may embrace a little more, well, personality in his preferred croots. That's not necessarily good or bad - it's just different.
Grass isn't greener, it's just a different shade of green. I hate that pun because every new thing has its drawbacks. There isn't one perfect thing (job, croot, method) in the entire world.
I read it simply as recruiting will be different under Howard. Beilein is a Legend! Can’t take that away from him, but his recruiting could’ve been better. He made the absolute most of what he did bring in, however if Juwan can bring in 2 top 10-20 recruits per class with a different approach who will complain about that?
I’m all for buzz on the recruiting trail, but color me skeptical until we will land a couple of the 5 starzz. The Howard regime could go south in a hurry if we’re chasing after premier talent for his first two classes and are unable to land them.
So what if he trashed JB’s recruiting. It deserved to be trashed. For whatever reason, JB was a piss poor recruiter. Sure, he made up for it in finding late risers and squeezing every ounce of talent out of who he could get. But getting ~1 5-star recruit in 11 years at Michigan is bad.
I’m not putting down JB’s time here, just that nobody’s perfect.
I had my concerns about JB as a recruiter, particularly when we failed to capitalize on the first NC run, but come on man. He was hardly a "piss poor recruiter." He got commitments from a number of top 100 guys. Oh and also happened to be one of the best identifier's and developer's of talent in the college game. He did not play a lot of the BS recruiting games, and that likely hurt us with the occassional 5 star that was actually recruitable at Michigan, but JB had picked up his recruiting game over the last couple years and was in line for a top 10 class had he stayed.
It has been analyzed quite extensively here, but JB was pretty objectively a bad recruiter even when accounting for the dirty nature of recruiting. I don't have the time to dig through the posts with all the analysis, but:
1. As mentioned, he reeled in about 1 5-star in his entire time here
2. His average class ranking was somewhere in the 40 range
3. Per Matt D, JB's approach was antiquated (i.e. wouldn't offer unless they visited campus) and didn't resonate well with recruits
4. He couldn't capitalize on the success of the program and turn that into better recruiting
5. He was consistently out-recruited by clean coaches from programs that didn't have the cache that Michigan does
6. Yes, he was a master at finding diamonds in the rough and teaching up kids, but simply put he had no choice in the matter because he wasn't bringing in a lot of talent
I'll reiterate. This is not to downplay JB's accomplishments, just to highlight a clear objective fact about his one lone deficiency. And it was a deficiency that kept him from getting that NC (or 2).