Hoopsageddon: And They Shall Ride
What this is: A best of the Big Ten rundown with a draft gimmick that some people like and some people hate and which happens anyway because the internet cannot win.
RULES
Everyone drafts a team of 8 Big Ten basketball players. Standard serpentine draft. As determined by RANDOM.org the order is:
1. Ace, 2. Alex, 3. Brian, 4. Seth
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Now sans Dekker/Kaminsky [M.P. King/Madison State Journal] |
ACE: Round 1, Pick 1: Nigel Hayes, F, Wisconsin
I really didn't want the first pick, but since I have it, I'll go with the NBA prospect who'll step up to lead Wisconsin this season. I nearly chose a point guard but the league is so deep at that spot that I couldn't pass up Hayes, who's a matchup nightmare at the four. At 6'8", 235 lbs., he's got great size at the college level, and he's impressively athletic—he can hold up in the post or on the perimeter on defense. He continues to add to his skill level on offense; he averaged over a point per possession on post-ups last year and shot 40% from three after not attempting a single three-pointer as a freshman.
While there are several point guards who could play at an all-conference level this year, Hayes is a potential All-American, and the drop-off between him and the next comparable player—Maryland stretch four Jake Layman—is sizable. Hayes is a plus in just about every aspect: shooting, rebounding, passing, defending, and drawing fouls. It won't be hard to build a team around him.
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[After the JUMP we take bench players in the 2nd round. Seriously!]
ALEX: Round 1, Pick 2: Caris LeVert, SG, Michigan
[Upchurch] |
We all know Caris's game fairly well by this point: he's a jack-of-all trades on offense: spotting up off the ball, initiating the offense himself, creating shots in one-on-one situations, distributing out of the pick-and-roll, and he's capable of taking over the game offensively for stretches. His defense is average, though it's certainly easy to see the sky-high potential there. He's the perfect guy to build my theoretical team around - that versatility is nearly unmatched in the Big Ten (Denzel Valentine is the only other guy who comes close).
Something else to consider: in the last two NBA Drafts, only eight seniors were taken in the first round: Doug McDermott, Adreian Payne, Shabazz Napier, C.J. Wilcox, Frank Kaminsky, Jerian Grant, Delon Wright, and Larry Nance. Of those, six (McDermott, Payne, Napier, Kaminsky, Grant, and Wright) played at an All-American level in their senior years - a prerequisite for being rafted that high at that age. With LeVert's decision to return to school for his senior year, he could be a prime candidate to join those six as a senior college star that makes his way into the first round of the draft (where he's currently projected by many). At the very least, it's likely he'll return to his sophomore form with a more experienced supporting cast.
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BRIAN: Round 1, Pick 3: Yogi Ferrell, PG, Indiana
via 247
This isn't a hard case to make. Ferrell was a top-50 player in ORTG last year, played 35 minutes a game, and very solid (23%) usage as he drove the 9th-best offense in the country. Only one team was better in the league last year, and aside from the guy Ace grabbed at the top those guys are all gone. He's a 42% three-point shooter--something I don't have to remind Michigan fans of--and had outstanding assist and TO rates. He is the surest thing at point guard in the league.
Those are the numbers. Watching Ferrell play confirms them. He is silky smooth, lightning quick on both ends of the floor--Indiana's defensive deficiencies are more due to their total lack of post play last year than anything he did on the perimeter. Remember that game where he shut down Nik Stauskas? Yeah. Stauskas didn't let that last but the mere fact that he was enough of a pest to put Stauskas off one game is indicative enough of his ability to stay in front of opposing points and cut off penetration. That's step one in any effective defense.
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SETH: Round 1, Pick 1: A.J. Hammons, C, Purdue
Round 2, Pick 1: Diamond Stone, C, Maryland
[Upchurch] |
While I didn't envy Ace's pole position, I really wanted one of Hayes, Yogi or LeVert. Since I'm mad about that, and since I'm not a basketball expert and thus resigned to probably losing this anyway, I'm gonna be a jerk and draft two centers.
Here's the thing: I don't like either of these guys as standalone players. Hammons to date has been a half-effort dude with more potential than exploits after three years. Hammons with his ass on fire, however, is a 7-foot nightmare who can block anything and post up on anybody. His turnovers were a problem, but a lot of those could be attributed to having nowhere to go with the ball, at which point he'd travel or put up an ill-advised shot. Purdue brought in Caleb Swanigan to help; I'm hoping a golden freshman lottery pick standing over his shoulder will do the trick.
So: Diamond Stone, a top 10 national recruit this year, who is already NBA sized, and proved himself a prodigious scorer and rebounder with excellent feet against top prep competition. He can also play some 4. Draft Express has him going 10th, highest among Big Ten players (LeVert is next at 19th). Again, consistent effort is a question mark, and again I'm hoping competition minimizes that and sets me up with 40 minutes of aggregate star play at center in a conference that has none. It also sets me up for certain mockery whenever Valentine and Melo inevitably go off the board in the next two picks.
I am going on record that I don't think Hammons is anything like the 4th best player in the conference, and I think Melo is a better player than his freshman teammate. But there's plenty of point guards in the conference and nobody close to the upside of Hammons and Stone at the 1. Plus, these days your backup center plays 20-25 minutes.
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BRIAN: Round 2, Pick 2: Melo Trimble, PG/SG, Maryland
Team: Yogi Ferrell, PG, Indiana; Melo Trimble, SG, Maryland
Oooooooookay, Seth. You have apparently never watched the basketball. That's cool. For some reason you're not into a 6'3" freshman who has his own friggin' Grantland profile after shooting 41% from 3 and 86% from the line with an enormous FT rate. Trimble could have bounced into the second half of the first round of the most recent NFL draft but decided to come back.
Trimble will be Maryland's point guard this year but for college purposes he's a fine shooting guard; descriptions of his game generally describe him as a combo:
His game in 110 words: With deep range and a decent handle, Trimble is a prototypical combo guard. He leads the Terps in scoring and is a close second to senior Dez Wells in assists. Trimble can get to the foul line with impressive ease, and is leading the nation in made free throws, with 106.
At 6'3" defensive deficiencies I'm taking on are relatively minimal, and the prospect of two high-assists, 40%-from-3 guards is too much to pass up despite the slight duplication in skillsets. More open threes for either guy is death for opponents.
As a bonus, I've got this locked down:
Does he own the best name in college basketball? Undeniably. GET THAT WEAK STUFF OUTTA HERE, YOGI FERRELL.
All name team: secured.
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BiSB: There's no way Melo Trimble would have gone in the first round of the NFL draft.
/remembers the Lions and Raiders exist.
Objection withdrawn.
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ALEX: Round 2, Pick 3: Bronson Koenig, PG, Wisconsin
Alex is taking the guy on the left. [Marc Gregor] |
It's really hard to leave Valentine on the board, but I'm comfortable taking a gamble on Koenig, who could blossom into one of the Big Ten's best players with a full season of playing time. When Traevon Jackson went down with an injury last season, Koenig ably stepped into the starting point guard role and outplayed Jackson by a significant margin, eating up the majority of minutes at the one even when Jackson was available. The talent was always there for Koenig (even though he was an average four star from Wisconsin, he reported offers from Duke, North Carolina, and Kansas) and now that he's a junior, it's reasonable to expect him to take a big jump as an upperclassman.
It's easy to shoehorn him as the typically efficient Wisconsin point guard and while he did post an impressive offensive rating in conference play (120.1, tenth-best in the Big Ten), it's easy to wonder how he would perform in a less-restrained system. Koenig boasts good size for the position at a listed 6'4, shot over 40% from three last season on over 150 attempts, and - predictably - maintained a low turnover rate all season. There are a few concerns, namely his low % on two-point attempts and minuscule steal rate (which: Wisconsin), but he's still the best point guard on the board, in my opinion.
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via MSU athletics
ACE: Round 2, Pick 4: Denzel Valentine, SF, Michigan State
Round 3, Pick 1: Derrick Walton, PG, Michigan
Team: Derrick Walton (PG, UM), Denzel Valentine (SF, MSU), Nigel Hayes (PF, UW)
Well, sure, I guess I'll accept this gift. Denzel Valentine may have been entertainingly shaky as an underclassman, but he flourished last year as a point forward with range. Last year he posted a top-ten defensive rebounding rate in the Big Ten, a top-ten assist rate with a very reasonable turnover rate—something that had been a problem for him in years past—and he posted 48/42/83 (2P%/3P%/FT%) shooting splits. It's hard to find many players in the country capable of stuffing the stat sheet like Valentine. He can be the lead ballhandler if the need arises; he can also be very effective cutting off the ball. While he may not be an NBA lottery prospect, he's an extremely valuable college player, and I'm frankly shocked he dropped this far.
To add to this, I'll happily take Derrick Walton as the fourth point guard to come off the board (enjoy filling that extremely critical spot, Seth). While I can see the argument for Koenig stepping into the lead guard role under Bo Ryan, there's so much to like about a healthy Walton getting a delayed second-year breakout under the time-tested duo of Beilein and Jordan. He's a fine distributor, a shockingly good rebounder for a point, and he can run a mean pick-and-roll with Hayes or provide a dangerous spot-up shooting option when Valentine takes control. I can't definitively say I've already won this, but I think I've already won this.
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NEXT TIME ON HOOPS DRAFTAGEDDON: Everyone explains why their guys are open for threes. Brian takes a Northwestern safety.
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:37 PM ^
This will be fun to revisit come March....
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:38 PM ^
NEED MORE DRAFTAGEDDON CONTENT PLEASE
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:39 PM ^
"Let’s put this in a different context. What if a company decided to make a new product? They choose not do a marketing study, they don’t determine their cost to produce, the cost the product can be sold for, or even if there are customers that will want the product? When it is finally ready to sell, they find that no one wants to purchase it, or even when a few people do purchase it, they use it for a purpose the company had not intended?"
https://vestapartners.com/terry-wiremans-blog-series-what-if-you-produc…
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:08 PM ^
can someone please set it ablaze and destroy "Hoopsageddon" in a fiery inferno?
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:38 PM ^
Draftageddon. The main board equivalent of kale. It's not bad if you trim the stems, reduce it with a little lemon juice, salt and olive oil. Maybe add some pine nuts. Pair it with a hard cider.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:11 PM ^
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:41 PM ^
Have you thought about plugging your rosters into a Fantrax league? Might be interesting to see you "League" unfold.
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:48 PM ^
Knowing that we could actually look back and quantitatively judge the draftageddon performances would make these features so much more readable.
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:43 PM ^
Could we just have an extra Walton photo instead of that guy's annoying mug at the bottom?
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:48 PM ^
I generally loathe ad hominem attacks against players, but man Denzel Valentine's face just makes me dislike him.
EDIT: Beaten by alum96. But glad I'm not the only one.
Also, [requisite complaining about draftageddon post]
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:48 PM ^
Koenig over Valentine???!!???
What!???
Dude dropped 14.5 ppg, 4.3 apg and 6.3 rpg on 58 TS% last year. Even the biggest Wisconsin homer isn't gonna tell you that Koenig is gonna play that well, assuming Valentine doesn't improve at all!
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:50 PM ^
I hate Denzel Valentine.
November 3rd, 2015 at 1:53 PM ^
Random.org gave you alphabetical order, which is 1 out of 24 possible orderings
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:07 PM ^
WHO!?!?! Maybe 4 guys that read this site like it. And they're morons.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:17 PM ^
I am more open to Hoopageddon than Football Draftageddon. Mostly because individual players matter more. I really don't care to read paragraphs upon paragraphs upon paragraphs about Northwestern's center, Illinois' 2nd best linebacker, anyone on Purdue, etc.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:28 PM ^
posting this smack in the middle of football season -- and not even during the bye week! -- offsets any possible advantage of Hoopsageddon. If they waited until December to post this, when the football regular season is over and basketball has barely begun (and well before the B1G basketball season), would anyone have a problem with that?
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:31 PM ^
As a Michigan Engineering alum I hardly consider myself a moron.
From reading this post you can tell that the site's writers think that Caris is probably the #2 player in the B1G, Wisconsin has the best all around player in the conference - and that we might have trouble with them since our 4's aren't "bangers". And that's just with the first two "picks". Also that a lot of talent left/graduated last year from the conference as a whole.
Do you have a better way to have a collaborative conference season preview of individual players?
Or is "extra free content" not your thing?
November 3rd, 2015 at 5:26 PM ^
OK, leaving aside that existential question, there arguably is an actual concrete cost to posting this stuff in the middle of the football season. Last week's post-game column and Fee Fi Fo Films were written by Seth instead of Ace, so that Ace could spend more time doing basketball preview posts. If Hoopsageddon similarly causes any of the MGoBlog staff to divert their attention from football content during the football season, then I might actually have a problem with this (ostensibly) "extra free content," when it could just as well be provided a month from now when I might appreciate it more.
So there!
November 3rd, 2015 at 7:52 PM ^
November 3rd, 2015 at 9:59 PM ^
I've been known to blow things up -- stadiums, worlds, etc. -- if they displease me. I suppose you could consider that un-chill . . . .
November 4th, 2015 at 1:53 AM ^
Look at the join date. He doesn't remember Hockey Bear. And once the CCHA died, a piece of Hockey Bear died too.
In Memoriam:
November 4th, 2015 at 9:50 AM ^
I suppose Hockey Bear reserves the right to go nuclear re:Hoopsageddon. Now I have the "Danger Zone" song in my head, which is a definite perk.
I remember trying to explain how cool those videos were to my date at an UM/UAF game like 5 years ago. Definitely one of the jokes the doesn't get better in the retelling.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:36 PM ^
The conceit might not be nessecary, but it's interesting for me to get a preview of some of the better players in the conference. I find it a hell of a lot better than a "Preseason All Big-Ten Team," since this provides some solid snark-fuel and interesting critiques of various players.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:47 PM ^
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:15 PM ^
Nothing says "We HATE our readers" like having a second Draftageddon in the past 6 months.
I however really like these posts.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:28 PM ^
The state punt now another draftegeddon...why why why
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:31 PM ^
Completely agree with you about Valentine...Not sure if it's the Michael Strahan gap or the fact that he plays for the Shartans but man I loathe that guy...Someone get this guy braces or a retainer with another tooth....Go BLUE!!!
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:30 PM ^
denzel and hayes will probably both be first team big ten
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:42 PM ^
Agreed, that's already 2 of the probable All Big Ten first teamers and Walton. SG talent is relatively deep and there aren't too many quality Big Ten centers anyway (and maybe not college bball in general)
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:36 PM ^
Nobody would hate draftageddon if you guys would just come up with a way to actually track and declare a winner. Then it would be way more fun but I know its just a way for you guys to blow off steam while doing scouting of the big ten.
I'll be interested which guy is smart and gets one of the better 4/5's in the league in robert carter. He is at md as a transfer from gt where he averaged almost a double double as a true freshman. He had to sit out last year because of the transfer but practice buzz about how well he has been playing has been going since last year and he was a top 50 recruit. Playing with Stone he is going to put up some monster numbers and they might make a better 4/5 combo than Purdue when MD goes big.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:57 PM ^
I would probably still hate it.
My dislike has nothing to do with tracking it and everything to do with the fact that nobody wants to hear about a fantasy league in which they are not participating.
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:00 PM ^
Its a big ten basketball preview written in a different way. If they put up posts running down the best players in the big ten it would be the same thing and people wouldn't compain either.
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:05 PM ^
Yep, I agree.
But I've been down this path pretty much every draftageddon and hey, I don't pay for the site so I can either read it or not read it. Brian and the guys can do it however they want... ...I'm just hoping one year they will decide they don't like it and write up a better preview.
Like I said below, I'm only here to laugh at the comments. MGrow's is probably my favorite at the moment.
November 3rd, 2015 at 5:36 PM ^
once Brian explicitly explained this feature as a conference preview, I understand it.
But I still don't find it that much more useful compared to say, a preseason poll done by the contributing writers (Brian, Seth, Ace, the uh other guy and uh that other other guy and maybe MGoWife? IDK). In this format, maybe whoever picked 2nd just REALLY likes Levert? He may not have gone until late round 2 maybe - and I think that significantly changes the outlook for M.
anyway, not complaining, just offereing an alternative idea and explaining how this path may have a flaw
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:40 PM ^
You can already see who the top teams are (Maryland, State, Indiana, us, Wiscy)
So my 1st guess as to the teams bad enough that noone gets picked: Rutgers, Penn State, and Minnesota
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:46 PM ^
Rutgers is a definite. I could see Carlos Morris from Minnesota being taken. I don't know anyone else on Penn State after DJ Newbill graduated. I assume they will replace him like they always do. Taylor Battle, Tim Frazier and so on.
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:49 PM ^
Not familiar with Morris. Noone stood out to me on Minnesota last year besides Andre Hollins, and even that wasn't always for good reasons. You never know who's going to make a jump though.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:51 PM ^
Oh look, it's the comment section of a draftageddon article.
November 3rd, 2015 at 2:54 PM ^
I came here to complain about hoopsageddon and see others complain about hoopsageddon. Hoopsaggedon is probably worse than draftageddon.
I hate this feature so much. Ironically enough, while I hate this feature I generally think the comments complaining about draftageddon are some of my favorite comment sections (is this actual irony? I can never tell).
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:04 PM ^
I just skim the 'gedon articles and dont really like them, but man do I enjoy how much they piss off so many other readers.
November 3rd, 2015 at 3:26 PM ^
The picks so far are...strange. How did Melo Trimble and Denzel Valentine fall to the 6th and 8th pick? ESPN just rated both of those guys as top five in the country, and you guys aren't even putting them in the top five in the conference?
And Koenig? Wtf?
Edit: Just read the explanation for each pick. All of you would be fired as fantasy GMs if I owned your teams.
November 3rd, 2015 at 4:08 PM ^
I got as far as a writeup on both of them at the 4th and 5th picks. Then I realized I didn't like any big options that would make their way back to me at the turn, and didn't think Brian would take a second PG, leaving Melo to Ace and Walton finding his way to me next round. That didn't work out.
At least I don't have to spend a year being happy every time Denzel Stupidface Valentine goes off.
November 3rd, 2015 at 4:20 PM ^
For all our bitching, it's an acceptable concept and I appreciate the effort. But the draftageddon comments have become a thing of their own.
November 3rd, 2015 at 6:44 PM ^
Hmm...I'll believe Hayes is that guy when I see it. Playing off of what Decker and FK did made his life easy and not to mention Decker was also a match up nightmare that coaches seemed to worry about before Hayes.
November 4th, 2015 at 9:16 AM ^
The one thing that surprises me - why doesn't draftageddon content have a sponsor like UFR does? Hard to imagine, really...
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