The Athletic (Mandel and Wasserman) admit their wrong
While I understand why so many discredit The Athletic now, some of us still have a subscription. This morning, they published a couple of articles that, to their credit, address some wrong sentiments they've expressed in the past (all links are $. Archive.is is your friend).
https://theathletic.com/5175785/2024/01/03/mandels-mailbag-michigan-investigation-cfp/
Stewart Mandel admits that a Michigan national championship would not be tainted, because even if you believed the Signgate "garbage" (my word, not his), the team won the biggest games (Penn St., Ohio St., Iowa, Alabama) after it broke, so there would be no advantage anyways.
https://theathletic.com/5175155/2024/01/03/michigan-alabama-recruiting-rankings/
Ari Wasserman admits that he was wrong believing that Stars trumped everything. Six months ago, he would've thought this CFP final would be impossible, but Michigan beat multiple superteams, showing that scouting and development can trump Stars. He still thinks Stars are more important, but Michigan showed you can overcome that. He gives credit to Washington as well, while admitting that they did not have to beat the same caliber of teams that Michigan did.
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:45 AM ^
*They're. Doh!
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:48 AM ^
You clearly meant they admitted their wrong takes were wrong.
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:54 AM ^
False. One can own a wrong.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:56 AM ^
Only if it’s over there.
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:02 AM ^
Where?
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:43 AM ^
There, here comes Jeanie with her new boyfriend
January 3rd, 2024 at 12:41 PM ^
Pretty women out walking with gorillas down my street.
January 3rd, 2024 at 11:49 PM ^
Here, Their and Everywhere
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:49 AM ^
Interesting that the headline works either way, except that it implies Mandel/Wasserman have only have a single wrong. We know better.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:44 AM ^
Don't Hug Me I'm Scared
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:44 AM ^
It's out of my hands I'm only a clock. Don't worry I'm sure you'll be fine, but eventually everyone runs out of time
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:46 AM ^
Yep. When it was hot, they didn't take a step back and look at the big picture. They just went at it. Now, in the waning moments when no one really cares about the signgate because UM proved it on the field, they want to right the wrong. While it is admirable, it shows their enthusiasm for "hot news", but not for a fair journalism.
January 3rd, 2024 at 12:50 PM ^
I don't even think that Mandel really came down all that much. He still calls us dirty cheaters, maybe jokingly. None of these outlets have engaged with how prevalent advanced sign-stealing is. You can call Stalions's scheme "brazen" and sure I'm drinking some Kool Aid but it's hard to see how this is cheating and not procedural.
Feldman following up with coaches was great. Mandel's "admission" seems to justify the Big Ten's suspension. Sorry, if you're going to say that this mid-season action was justified with all the facts, you need to distinguish why this act is so much worse than what Illinois, Purdue, Rutgers and OSU were proven to do. If you're going to call us cheaters, you have to show why the advantage Stalions got for us is so much worse than what those 4 got. He admits that our title isn't tainted but still calls us cheaters - and so I remain disgusted by him
January 3rd, 2024 at 2:41 PM ^
A 24 hour clock is right only once a day.
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:50 AM ^
Mandel said the same thing on Sundays audible podcast. He has really changed his tune, but still he has very little credibility with me.
I do think Feldman is pretty good though.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:09 AM ^
Why do you listen to someone who has very little credibility? Im sorry not trying to be a dick but been seeing a lot of people sharing about media personalities they dont like, and i just dont get why people choose to listen to the finebaums of the world if they dont like them??
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:49 AM ^
Often, to learn and adapt more effectively to objective reality, you should seek out opposing points of view.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:56 AM ^
How often do you have to say, "I'm just asking a question" as someone gets annoyed with you?
January 3rd, 2024 at 9:04 AM ^
100% true as a statement. However, when the agenda is not to present a different point of view, but to generate clicks and revenue, there is no value to what is being said.
January 3rd, 2024 at 9:07 AM ^
I listen to opposing points of view if they're well-researched, come from a place of good faith, and are designed to incite dialogue rather than just be an attention-seeking counterpoint.
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:48 AM ^
It pays to keep an open mind, but not so open your brains fall out.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:30 AM ^
Feldman was out there tooting the "biggest scandal" horn as loud as anyone while it was generating clicks
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:51 AM ^
These people have done a lot of damage. I'll be boycotting ESPN for the rest of my life. May have to watch some games on the network, but I don't have to read or listen to the garbage.
January 3rd, 2024 at 9:50 AM ^
He was one of the mlre disappointing to me. I had thought he was close to Harbaugh/the Program because it was always mentioned U of M always sent him tons of info for his freaks list.
January 3rd, 2024 at 12:47 PM ^
Feldman did pick us to win the whole shootin' match in the beginning of the year and hasn't wavered but...the siren song of those clicks was just too much for him I think. Should've tied himself to the mast.
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:36 AM ^
Even Pete Finebaum did a complete mea culpa on the radio. Of course, it was only because Michigan beat the mighty, invincible Nick Saban, whose dick Pete has been nobbing for years.
January 3rd, 2024 at 11:17 AM ^
Right. They need Bama to be good because It Just Means More, which means Michigan has to actually be good now. Had Michigan lost (even if it was a close game they choked away on ST disasters) these chuckleheads would be all in on the “Michigan is a bunch of cheaters and the B1G is a fraud” narrative.
January 3rd, 2024 at 12:52 PM ^
Anecdotally, SEC commenters on articles/social media have been maybe 75% cool in my view. However, our Big 10 rival fans have gone full hemorrhoid, which completely fits Seth's and Brian's observations prior to the Rose Bowl.
January 3rd, 2024 at 1:23 PM ^
Meh. I was at the game and the percentage of Bama fans saying or wearing references to “cheating” or “Connor Stalions” was too damn high.
January 3rd, 2024 at 2:13 PM ^
Totally concede your anecdotal evidence is better than mine.
January 3rd, 2024 at 2:35 PM ^
Feldman has the right demeanor but I wouldn't let that fool you. The speculation from anonymous sources he indulged in during the dark times of this year was enough to make me realize he's no journalist.
That is bad practice and it did what he intended. Added fuel to the fire and got a bunch of clicks.
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:59 PM ^
I listened to Feldman the other day. He seems far more polished with a radio voice that someone bringing anything insightful to the table. Blah, blah, blah, Michigan has some good players and if they play well without making any mistakes they will win.
January 3rd, 2024 at 7:56 AM ^
I guess my question to Wasserman and others would be this then - why would you have ever believed that recruiting stars, which are subjective ratings based on what always seemed to be shallow criteria, were the primary determinant of success? Teams are an exercise in human dynamics, not just the acquisition of supposed raw talent.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:05 AM ^
Perhaps seems obvious now, but I definitely felt this way (as did others here, namely Brian) prior to this run. Looking at results, it felt impossible for a Michigan team recruiting the way they do to compete with the rosters of Alabama, Clemson, ohiost, Georgia, etc. that had dominated the CFP era. They were littered with 5 stars, we were lucky to grab 1 or 2 per class. Therefore, high 4 and 5 stars seemed like a prerequisite.
Clearly Michigan has shown another path, one defined by recruiting a type of player that needs to sit in the program a while, developing them well, and getting more college production with them vs. them having some peak pro potential.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:08 AM ^
and THIS should be the narrative for this championship game, not signs or burger adversity. 2 teams with outstanding coaching and development, running programs in a way the powerhouses do not.
For all the complaints about modern CFB with conference realignment, NIL, portal, etc. - ultimate success from the way Washington and Michigan have constructed their rosters gives the sport hope.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:31 AM ^
I don't think those Clemson teams were littered with 5 stars. That happened as a result of their success, but their recruiting classes were mostly top10-15 not type 5.
January 3rd, 2024 at 10:26 AM ^
Clemson had the one thing we now have which is elite QB play. First Watson then Lawrence and when you have a QB that good you can paper over a lot of other holes in your line up. Conversely when you do NOT have an elite QB pretty much everything else suffers.
Glancing over at OSU right now as I type this and remember not-so-fondly the John O'Korn/Shea Patterson experience.
January 3rd, 2024 at 11:16 AM ^
Elite QB and studs on the DL as well, had some great edge and interior DTs
January 3rd, 2024 at 12:22 PM ^
Elite DL and QB will win you a lot of games, like, say, 27 out of 28, maybe even 28 out of 29.
January 3rd, 2024 at 1:05 PM ^
I'm happy you call out the DL, QB is the most important position on most FB teams, but DL is one of the two most important position groups since they can stop the QB AND the run. The other most important position group is OL - which can prevent DL from stopping the QB, but also MAKES the run in a more impactful way than most QBs.
QB play is both the most important and the most overrated position. It's very hard to fill at every level, it's very hard to play - probably the hardest on the field, with all due respect to cornerback, because in addition to a skillset it has size requirements. Especially in the passing-oriented modern game, unless you're the handful of teams with MHJ, Megatron, Randy Moss or Larry Ftizgerald - it is the most critical link in the most efficient play type that allows you to score points. AND ALSO, it's still just one of eleven on one side of the ball that plays less than half the game. You can build a championship team with Cade Macnamara. Nicky Foles can win a Super Bowl. Stetson Bennett is a very good college quarterback - but no, he is not a great college quarterback. But he is a 2 time champion.
January 3rd, 2024 at 11:59 AM ^
Yeah, this is the key: you can win a championship without a 10-plus 5 stars if you have elite QB play. That's a requirement.
- Michigan doesn't win on Monday with Shea Patterson, Wilton Speight or Jake Rudock at QB.
- Washington doesn't win on Monday with Jacob Eason, Keith Price or even Jake Browning at QB.
I defy someone to find any example in the last 20 years of a team that has won it all that has not had either a) a roster stacked with NFL talent in most places b/c they have mostly 4 and 5 stars or b) an elite, top 5 college QB. Doesn't exist.
January 3rd, 2024 at 1:10 PM ^
Dear God, let Jaydn Davis be the cerebral, no mistakes guy I think he is.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:54 AM ^
It makes Harbaugh and the staff's accomplishments the past few years all the more impressive. These guys have done it the hard way. Through development. Through real talent scouting that goes beyond browsing On3. As Texas A&M has shown, it takes more than just reeling in five starts to win, but what Harbaugh and company are doing is really unprecedented in modern college football.
January 3rd, 2024 at 9:08 AM ^
I would add the caveat that our transfer portal success has been stellar. Sometimes you cannot keep a guy here for 4-5 years to matriculate properly but when you can sign them via free agency, well, here we are.
January 3rd, 2024 at 11:17 AM ^
I think fans should be really excited for all the 6'4" 220 raw athletes without a position that we've been bringing in the last few classes. These are guys who are balls of clay with ideal athleticism and frames that Herbert and staff can develop and turn into absolute chess pieces on this defense
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:09 AM ^
If the thesis were simply that at the highest level, i. e. 4 team playoff/national champion, talent is the "primary determinant" I think that Ari would still have a case. Even saying the original HS recruiting rankings are the best proxy might be valid too. The results of the playoff era have backed it up IMO.
Where Ari has gone wrong in the past was his absurd declaration that *only* talent - and talent solely determined by HS recruiting rankings for that matter - can produce a champion. He admitted last year he was in a panic when Michigan and TCU made the playoff. It's weird he didn't take that moment to soften his position. Or even watching the last 3 Michigan - OSU games should have taught him that raw recruiting rankings aren't the whole story.
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:48 AM ^
It's defensible as a maximally-lazy or minimum-effort analysis strategy. You can bet on the winner of every individual game to be the team with the better HS recruiting profile for their roster going in and be right a very substantial percentage of the time. But that would be something that any casual fan could do with a 247 subscription and 1 hour of spare time each week. If you're a professional journalist doing this stuff as a full-time job, you should have something a bit deeper than "stars and nothing else."
January 3rd, 2024 at 8:11 AM ^
Because they're scumbags. They make the recruiting stars just match which players are being recruited the hardest by georgia and alabama. Then, when alabama or georgia loses they act like it's some mystery why the players with higher star counts lost. They were higher stars because they went to alabama.